Alphadawg7 Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 your fur is up . Your point is correct . Wannstadt was the worst nightmare i have stared at in years, amazed. Befuddled then amazed. I was clarifying our Coach's trends not your ability to perceive his tendencies. My bad if my reply seemed like a rebuttal or something, I was actually just echoing the very thing you just said in full agreement with you and was clarifying my original vague comments on how Pettine brings pressure and why Wanny was so bad. I just communicated poorly in a rush before I had to run an errand. I did not intend it to come back across that way, I was just clarifying on what I failed to be clear on in my first post and agreeing with your exact points about how he blitzes at opportune moments. I assure you my "fur" was not up at all and we were in full agreement on everything you said. My bad, I will reword my reply to read better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 If you think this is bad, wait until the first horrendous performance of the pre-season schedule. That is when the apologists tell everybody about how the preseason doesn't mean anything because the Super Bowl Bills lost most of their preseason games........and everyone else points out that these aren't those Bills and that poor preseason play has been followed by poor regular season play for the past 13 years. At least that is how it has gone here during the preseason for the last decade or so. That or every 8th string guy that breaks a tackle or sheds a block is a future all pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kellyto83TD Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Good. I like the fact Whaley is willing to admit some recent mistakes by the front office. Take the cap hit and move on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 The Jets have struggled to put pressure on opposing QB's under Pettine the past couple seasons. I am not saying you should worry, but perhaps look at the facts. It will be interesting to see what Pettine has in store but I think that in third and long situations you want to be able to send true pass rushers. That D has not been the same the last 2 seasons personell reasons due to injuries, losing players, and aging players. I firmly believe this D has more overall talent, youthful talent, explosive talent...and more importantly, talent that better fits his style of D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 My bad if my reply seemed like a rebuttal or something, I was actually just echoing the very thing you just said in full agreement with you and was clarifying my original vague comments on how Pettine brings pressure and why Wanny was so bad. I just communicated poorly in a rush before I had to run an errand. I did not intend it to come back across that way, I was just clarifying on what I failed to be clear on in my first post and agreeing with your exact points about how he blitzes at opportune moments. I assure you my "fur" was not up at all and we were in full agreement on everything you said. My bad, I will reword my reply to read better. on me brother as i wander a bit. Thank you for the considerations.Appreciated in full. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle flap Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 (edited) I know I'm pissing in your kool-aid here. But please explain how the Bills will be "up against the cap with a TON of contracts expiring"? Do they have a bunch of All-Stars were not aware of? Aren't those types of problems usually reserved for perennial play off/super bowl contenders. How do the lowly Bills get "up against the cap"? besides overpaying for DE's? Here is the list of players currently on the roster whose contracts will expire after the season: Jairus Byrd S Eric Wood C Alan Branch DT Alex Carrington DT Mike Caussin TE Scott Chandler TE Tashard Choice RB Dorin Dickerson FB Hutch Eckerson T Chris Hogan WR Arthur Moats LB Jay Ross DT Bryan Scott LB Chris Scott T Mickey Shuler TE Mana Silva S Frank Summers RB Torell Troup DT UFA Thomas Welch T Sam Young T Zack Chibane G Izaan Cross DE Jordan Dangerfield S Kip Edwards CB UDFA Kendall Gaskins Brandon Kaufman WR Kevin Norrell WR Keith Pough LB Nickell Robey CB Da'Rick Rogers WR Jumal Rolle CB Drew Smith RB Aaron Tipoti DE Jeff Tuel QB Ryan Turnley C Granted, many of these players won't even make the 53 man roster, but I'll leave it up to you to decide who to re-sign after the season. The projected unadjusted cap for next year is $123 million, same as this year's. The Bills rolled over $10 M in unspent cap space from last year, so their adjusted cap figure is $133 M. They have spent $107 M out of $133 M available this year. If they spend the $10 M (which they can't rollover again), they'll be at $117 M out of the unadjusted $123 M. So the most they could possibly rollover is $6 M. Therefore, at most, they'll have $129 M as an adjusted cap figure. They have already spent $112 M of next year's cap, which leaves $17 M to sign draft picks (about 5 or 6 mil). So now they're down to about $11 M left to extend Byrd, Wood, Branch, Carrington, Chandler or whomever you want out of the above list. Or you've got to sign players to replace them. Then there are positions you want to upgrade. Those contracts are gonna cost ya, too. Still following along? Now if they eat Anderson's dead money this year (and I don't see why they wouldn't), that frees up $3 M for next year. Yes, Mario Williams has far and away the highest cap hit, but on nearly every team the DEs and QBs have huge hits in comparison to the other positions. This is actually something the Bills are in line with as far as league-wide trends. Sorry if this pisses in your "the Bills suck" narrative. The Bills might "suck," but not because of whatever it is you're trying to insinuate about the cap and contracts. Edited July 24, 2013 by uncle flap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonborn10 Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Who are we saving all this cap room for? Wood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Wood CJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonborn10 Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 NFL.com reports he passed his physical with the Bills before being released...The Cheatriots will likely sign him to the vet minimum, absorb as much intel on our offence and defence and cut him late into preseason. Why would they cut him? He was very good for them as a situational pass rusher. He will probably give them 24-30 snaps a game and get 8-10 sacks. They have no pass rushers now. They will get him on the cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Truth Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 There is no silver lining. We just cut a guy who was supposed to be productive. I only read the first page but everyone seemed to be viewing the world through rose colored glasses. This sucks. Plus, Hairston on top of it. This is a blow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTBill Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 This seems like a Trevaris Jackson cut. No reason to keep him around and spend snaps/coaching on someone you'll likely cut later (injury? or not a right fit for their scheme). Players who they will keep on the roster should take the snaps during TC/Preseason and get the experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonborn10 Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 LOL at the posts in this thread...A) This is not that big of a surprise, he wasn't signed by this regime for this scheme...he was signed under the old regime to fit what they hoped to do. B) Why bring him to camp and take reps away from guys they can see playing his spot like Hughes and Carrington. C) This had NOTHING to do with money, in fact, from what I understand, this costs them actually $500k more than if they just kept him. D) People piling on Buddy over this seem to forget that the GM goes after the people the staff wants and for their scheme. At the time he was signed, it seemed to make a lot of sense. This whole board was going ape sh*t about how bad they wanted Albert Haynesworth and how cheap the Bills are for not going after him that year he was a FA and Washington signed him to a huge contract...those same fans mocked the Redskins later for signing him when Albert didnt pan out there as if they knew all along lmao. Just like when we signed Mark Anderson, it appeared to be a good signing at the time and good value, he just didn't work out due to injury last year and now we have a new scheme and new regime that wants a different type of player. Buddy did his job at the time, and when we signed him it was vastly agreed here to be a solid signing and a good move by the FO. Truth is, the vast majority of the people here might as well be clowning themselves too because most of you liked the original signing too. Bottom line, I think this D is more talented than people think and that Pettine has a plan and a style to utilize those talents finally and guys like Carrington, Bardham, and Hughes could prove to be real factors playing along side Dareus, Mario, Kyle, Kiko, and Manny (yes I included Kiko because I personally believe he is going to be a strong candidate for DROY and going to be an impact player THIS year and have thought so since draft night). I'm not sure anyone felt it was good value. Most people around here feel the Bills overpay the wrong guys and that it takes extra money to get them to come/stay in Buffalo. Stevie is not worth #1 money. Mario is not the best defender in NFL though he is paid that much. Nix messed up not signing Levitre and Byrd last year. Anderson's contract did not prevent that from happening but it didn't help. Now they have a chance to resign Wood and Spiller with plenty of cap space. They are spending pennies on the dollar at the QB position compared to other teams(exception Seattle). That money should be spent on the rising stars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 There is no silver lining. We just cut a guy who was supposed to be productive. I only read the first page but everyone seemed to be viewing the world through rose colored glasses. This sucks. Plus, Hairston on top of it. This is a blow. I think you answered your own question -- "supposed to be productive." He wasn't, because he got hurt and because the coaching was horrid. New staff, different role...there really is very little to be surprised about, other than the fact the Bills just cut a guy knowing it will cost them money. And THAT's something different. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Here is the list of players currently on the roster whose contracts will expire after the season: Jairus Byrd S Eric Wood C Alan Branch DT Alex Carrington DT Mike Caussin TE Scott Chandler TE Tashard Choice RB Dorin Dickerson FB Hutch Eckerson T Chris Hogan WR Arthur Moats LB Jay Ross DT Bryan Scott LB Chris Scott T Mickey Shuler TE Mana Silva S Frank Summers RB Torell Troup DT UFA Thomas Welch T Sam Young T Zack Chibane G Izaan Cross DE Jordan Dangerfield S Kip Edwards CB UDFA Kendall Gaskins Brandon Kaufman WR Kevin Norrell WR Keith Pough LB Nickell Robey CB Da'Rick Rogers WR Jumal Rolle CB Drew Smith RB Aaron Tipoti DE Jeff Tuel QB Ryan Turnley C Granted, many of these players won't even make the 53 man roster, but I'll leave it up to you to decide who to re-sign after the season. The projected unadjusted cap for next year is $123 million, same as this year's. The Bills rolled over $10 M in unspent cap space from last year, so their adjusted cap figure is $133 M. They have spent $107 M out of $133 M available this year. If they spend the $10 M (which they can't rollover again), they'll be at $117 M out of the unadjusted $123 M. So the most they could possibly rollover is $6 M. Therefore, at most, they'll have $129 M as an adjusted cap figure. They have already spent $112 M of next year's cap, which leaves $17 M to sign draft picks (about 5 or 6 mil). So now they're down to about $11 M left to extend Byrd, Wood, Branch, Carrington, Chandler or whomever you want out of the above list. Or you've got to sign players to replace them. Then there are positions you want to upgrade. Those contracts are gonna cost ya, too. Still following along? Now if they eat Anderson's dead money this year (and I don't see why they wouldn't), that frees up $3 M for next year. Yes, Mario Williams has far and away the highest cap hit, but on nearly every team the DEs and QBs have huge hits in comparison to the other positions. This is actually something the Bills are in line with as far as league-wide trends. Sorry if this pisses in your "the Bills suck" narrative. The Bills might "suck," but not because of whatever it is you're trying to insinuate about the cap and contracts. So what's the narrative here? Poor cap mangament on poor talent? I believe that Anderson will count close to 4 million next year. Fritz, others yea. But, paying for crap talent then discarding or letting good players walk is a apparently still a Bills tradition. The Bills suck because of poor drafting, FA acquisitions and most importantly management. Will it change or should they be there? Who knows. teams like the 49ers stacked with talent are motoring right along though how does that happen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle flap Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 (edited) So what's the narrative here? Poor cap mangament on poor talent? I believe that Anderson will count close to 4 million next year. Fritz, others yea. But, paying for crap talent then discarding or letting good players walk is a apparently still a Bills tradition. The Bills suck because of poor drafting, FA acquisitions and most importantly management. Will it change or should they be there? Who knows. teams like the 49ers stacked with talent are motoring right along though how does that happen? There is no narrative. You asked a snarky question and I answered it with facts. You're welcome. Did you even read what I wrote? Anderson will cost the Bills $4.5 million total in cap space. As it stands today, it's $1.5 M this year and $3 M next year. SInce they have the option to take the full hit this year, I don't see why they wouldn't do so. I'm not interested in discussing the many reasons the Bills have been less than competitive, nor speculate why they might continue to suck. I'd much rather look for reasons to be optimistic. Some say that makes me delusional, but I'd rather hope for the best and be disappointed than expect the worst and feel validated when the sky falls. IMO, what's delusional is falling to see that the tides are indeed turning at OBD. Deny it all you want, but this is not the same ol' Bills. I'm trying to figure out exactly what has changed. Don't strain yourself. Edited July 24, 2013 by uncle flap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griff28 Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Let's hope this marks the end of awful long(er) term contract decisions. They obviously need to identify better guys at the right time. Plain and simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardinalScotts Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Wow. And to think they cut Dwan Edwards to keep this guy. Dwan Edwards can't play anymore, one thing Anderson is not is versatile it might just be a wrong fit type thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Dwan Edwards can't play anymore, one thing Anderson is not is versatile it might just be a wrong fit type thing They... Ummm... They play completely different positions. So it's still odd to me it was framed as one or the other by the post you quoted. Let's hope this marks the end of awful long(er) term contract decisions. They obviously need to identify better guys at the right time. Plain and simple. On the brightside its still better value than meachem in San Diego! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braedenstearns Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Who are we saving all this cap room for? Possibly Byrd? CJ Agreed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 I think you answered your own question -- "supposed to be productive." He wasn't, because he got hurt and because the coaching was horrid. New staff, different role...there really is very little to be surprised about, other than the fact the Bills just cut a guy knowing it will cost them money. And THAT's something different. It's not different. We have seen this in preseason on multiple occasions. Dwan Edwards was mentioned in this thread. He was cut at the end of camp and went on to play very well in Carolina last season, putting up 6 sacks and earning praise for his performance. Edwards didn't seem like a great fit in Wannstedts upfield attack but they discounted what he brought to the run defense.....and obviously he outsacked the more heralded KW and DD. He was clearly good enough to make the team, his release was a cost/use decision. They didn't think they were going to use him that much so he wasn't worth the cost. How can we forget the Langston Walker nonsense on the eve of the 2009 season? There is no way that the guy that you just moved to left tackle the week before the season starts is suddenly not even good enough to make the roster at all. The OL was an absolute train-wreck that year. Walker wasn't great but the Bills at one point that season were starting the least experienced OL since the merger. Their struggles alone made watching the team very difficult that year. These moves were economically motivated at a time of the year when the economics should be taking a backseat to performance on the field. The Bills took a cap hit cutting Anderson, but they saved actual money by not paying him his salary this year so it's not without economic merit. I get that the team doesn't want to waste money.....but bring your damn team to camp for chrissake. Don't get there and then start thinking about who you can skate by without to save a few bucks. We deserve better than that. I mean what if Mario Williams goes down......where are you going to get a pass rusher of any pedigree for that kind of money? Dwan Edwards can't play anymore, one thing Anderson is not is versatile it might just be a wrong fit type thing Edwards outplayed Williams and Dareus last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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