chris heff Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 (edited) Hmmmm are you sure. Do you think the pats* will make it to the playoffs this season? Is that based on past history? True enough that there were big changes to the Bills. But the same big changes happened 3 years ago as well. The past 13 years don't guarantee failure this coming season. But they are cause for concern. You could have, and probably did, have the same feeling when Gailey et. al. came to town. The faces may have changed from the Bills of Old, but the rebuilding dance still continues. it might be. You are not only asking for them to make the playoffs, which they haven't done for 13 years, but you want them to qualify high enough to get a home game, AND win that game. I don't think the Pats will make the playoffs because of their history, I think they will make the playoffs because they have one of the best QBs to ever play the game. The changes that happened three years ago had Ralph's fingerprints all over them. He hired Nix to be GM because he knew him. Then they hired a retread HC in Gailey. As my brother so eloquently puts it, "one old fool hired another old fool, who hired another old fool". Maybe a bit harsh, but accurate. The events of this off season would be the complete antithesis to the Bills behavior not only for the past thirteen years but since their inception. A young up and coming GM, last and only time that happened was Polian . Polian was hired to be director of pro personnel, he became GM after Terry Bledsoe had a heart attack. The hiring of a young coach from the college ranks is a Bills first. As is the drafting of a QB with their first pick. I believe that when Gailey was hired I groaned. The Marrone hiring made me smile, not the same old Bills Edited July 15, 2013 by chris heff
Malazan Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 Hmmmm are you sure. Do you think the pats* will make it to the playoffs this season? Is that based on past history? True enough that there were big changes to the Bills. But the same big changes happened 3 years ago as well. The past 13 years don't guarantee failure this coming season. But they are cause for concern. If Brady and Belichick leave...would you consider the Pats history as strongly?
Astrobot Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 I love the way you cut right to the chase with so few words PTR. So....odds are extremely high we'll fail this year by not winning the SB. I suppose we can hope for this miracle, but it would be more realistic to hope that we're entertained by the 2013 Bills, and not end the season with that familiar sick feeling of having so far to go. That's why I wised up. I have bet on the Bills to win the AFC Championship. No really, I did. Placed the bet at Caesar's.
apuszczalowski Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 Well, for starters, to answer the OP's question, your name on here is "BAD OL Bills" so its easy to assume that your views on the team are usually not in the positive............
jumbalaya Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 Whats the difference between Kolb & Fitz? Between Barnett and Hughes? Not much. Then you lose Levitre and screw up Byrd? When your whole basis for a turnaround are rookies and free agents your team is in deep trouble.
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 I haven't seen this topic covered before. I'm glad someone had the courage to finally come out and say it. Haha. Has he ever been optimistic about anything Bills related ever? Here it goes, the Bills will suck & I will get to brag about predicting they will suck in the offseason. It's going to be so awesome.
You herd it hear last Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 All I want at this point is a home playoff victory. After a decade is that asking for too much? i think you know the answer to that question...yer a Bills fan
Marv's Neighbor Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 It's easier to expect failure. 31 teams fail every year. PTR Yes but we're tired of being number one.
BringBackFergy Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 Yes but we're tired of being number one. I don't look at it as failure...I look at it as consistent.
jester43 Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 (edited) It's easier to expect failure. 31 teams fail every year. PTR it's funny to hear one the bills' chief apologists say this. 31 teams didn't wn the super bowl last year but 14 of them finished over 500...something the bills are never capable of doing for some reason. if we eked out a 9-7 season with all the question marks on this roster (not to mention the coaching staff), i'd say most people who use this site would call that a success. in fact people would be doing backflips around here, and you'd be spotting every one of them. personally i dont know how anyone can look at this team and expect it to be any better than last year. as always, i hope i am wrong. Edited July 15, 2013 by jester43
PromoTheRobot Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 (edited) All I want at this point is a home playoff victory. After a decade is that asking for too much? Yes but we're tired of being number one. As someone who is old enough to remember the Super Bowl Bills I know for a fact that no one is ever happy with just making the playoffs. You want to win, then you want to win two, then you want two wins at home, then a Super Bowl. You have the same empty feeling at the end of every season that doesn't end with a W. And while our 0-13 playoff run sucks we have not been anywhere near the worst team for 13 years running. If we were we'd be picking in the top 3 every year. We are locked into the 8-11 range of suckitude. it's funny to hear one the bills' chief apologists say this. 31 teams didn't wn the super bowl last year but 14 of them finished over 500...something the bills are never capable of doing for some reason. if we eked out a 9-7 season with all the question marks on this roster (not to mention the coaching staff), i'd say most people who use this site would call that a success. in fact people would be doing backflips around here, and you'd be spotting every one of them. See above post. Rather than an apologist I prefer to think of myself as a realist. When I try to point out reality those busy banging their heads into walls think I am apologizing. PTR Edited July 15, 2013 by PromoTheRobot
TC in St. Louis Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 I am glad we got rid of Gailey and company. Has he signed anywhere yet? The Bills were lucky to have given away at least 3 games last year or they'd still have Gailey in charge. They'd still have Fitz, and we'd be looking toward another season of predictable crap. I don't know what to expect from Marrone as a coach, but so far he looks pretty good. I like the hurry up offense and the sudden appearance of speed in our offense. Wannstedt coached a defense that looked to be great into a bunch of guys who ran around like those players on the old fashioned electric football games. I am convinced that the same group of players could have been a top 10 defense with a different coach. Now we have one. One big problem is that we are in with the Patriots. They are always on top. Somebody needs to put some severe heat on Brady, and we'll see how that works out. I think we can win a bunch of games.
Homey D. Clown Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 I am very confident we will be only as good as our record will indicate...
Bill from NYC Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 The Bills were pro-active in addressing their QB and head coaching positions this offseason, their two primary areas of failure over the past 13 years. So why shouldn't we be optimistic? IMO an old joke about convenience stores sums it up: Open 24 hours.....but not in a row. Over the last 13 years the Bills have shown that sooner or later, they get around to addressing each of their problems........but there is such a decided lack of urgency. By the time they address one....another one or sometimes even MORE problems pop up. Turning around an organization is no longer about 5 year plans. It's not even about 3 year plans. It's about getting competitive right away. The ideal situation is bringing in a new coach and giving that coach the tools to be successful while the message is still new and before a lack of results compromises that message. Teams like San Francisco and Seattle are the standard. While strong coaching has helped those two fast turnarounds, the personnel departments of those teams have been very aggressive. IMO, the Bills personnel department was tentative this offseason. It seems like they are still working in the era of 3 year and 5 year plans. They somehow came away with a net loss of personnel this offseason, which is just not what you want your rookie head coach coming into. Marrone is confident, but ALL new head coaches are confident. I hope I am wrong and EJ Manuel is a revelation and Marrone and Hackett/Pettine take the league by storm but on paper this team looks a disfunctional mess waiting to happen. Maybe Marrone can pull it together. What I AM excited about is the tailgating. Can't wait for that! Hope is great but there is no logical reason that I can see to think that the Bills will be a playoff team this season. It can happen, but it is far from likely. My biggest complaint, as you already know, was losing Levitre. With the new CBA, salaries are going down at every position except QB. Those guys are getting rich, and the shrinkage of rookie contracts is going directly to the QBs and nobody else. That said, our QB signed for 4 years/8.9 million. This is literal pocket change today. Levitre was only guaranteed 10 million in a long term deal. They let him walk, and this can only hurt Manuel and yes, Spiller. Instead of considering the above circumstances they franchised Byrd, and things don't look so good. The truth is that they should have kept both of them. They could have signed Levitre AND tagged Byrd. The cap space was there. In a semi-related matter, I watch a lot of clips on Manuel. From where I sit he is chock full of talent. Please explain to me what prevented him from being a top 5 pick in a poor draft for QBs. What was it that scared other GMs away from him? Why did even Jax pass on him?
FluffHead Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 Whoa whoa whoa....hold on...you're all telling me we didn't re-sign the big guard Chet Rhinergardner? DOOMED
KeisterHollow Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 I think we solidified our coaching staff this year, we maybe got better in the general manager dept., and we upgraded our offense. Our defense was addressed, to an extent, the last two years. So, I'm expecting this YOUNG team to go 9-7 this year, and to have another good offseason and to be ready next year, 2014 season, to be able to compete with anyone. That timeline is in line with San Fran's and Seattle's.
thewildrabbit Posted July 15, 2013 Posted July 15, 2013 You are wrong when you make the point that there hasn't been much change over the past year. There has been dramatic change that has cleansed this contaminated franchise from the bizaare world of an inscrutable owner. Ralph Wilson is no longer involved in the operation. That in itself has allowed this suffocating franchise an opportunity to breathe. The befuddled Nix was gracefully let go and his position was taken over by a younger and more open minded GM. Hopefully, the old school restrictive mentality has been replaced by a fresher and more modern approach to running a franchise. A Doug Marrone hiring would not have happened if the old guard was still in place. I'm not prematurely declaring him a success but hiring him was a clear signal that things are changing. When Whaley finally took over the reigns he brought in some new personnel people. Although there wasn't much publicity over the new hires it signals that Whaley is adding younger and brighter staff to this very crusty organization. Without a doubt this year's draft had a different feel to it. The draft board was set up by Whaley. I can't say for sure but it seems to me that Whaley and Marrone were very influential in Buddy's last draft, moreso than Buddy himself. A number of inconsequential players were let go this year from a roster of mostly inconsequential players. It's going to take another couple of drafts to redo what Nix bungled. There was no doubt in my mind that Brandon ordered the drafting of a qb with the first or second round draft pick. Whaley and the coaching staff made the Manuel selection. How does one measure the success and failure of this year's season? For me there is only one way to do it: Determining whether Manuel can be a legitimate franchise qb. Don't get bogged down with the sideshow issue of this year's record. In this year success is measured by how the young qb performs. If he demonstrates that he is up to the task then the season is a success. If he demonstrates that he is not up to the taks then it is back to the drawing board. In the NFL of today the foundation for any franchise is the qb. Until that issue is addressed nothing else matters. For me the real issue is not about the team, it never has been. It is about the quality of the organization. If the organization is healthy then the roster will eventually be competitive. So far I am more than encouraged that things are moving in the right direction. Sorry John, I'm just not as optimistic as you are about this franchise just yet. Every regime change I keep hearing about how this franchise is now moving in the right direction. Ralph Wilson did step aside, which essentially means the new GM & HC won't be interrogated for hours every day during the season, and will be allowed to do their respective jobs under the watchful eye of Russ Brandon. Speaking of Brandon, I believe he is the one who was most instrumental in the hiring of new HC Doug Marrone. With Brandon now running the ship I can see why Wilson has the utmost confidence in him keeping the franchise "profitable" after the Toronto deal. Which seems to be the primary objective. Anyway, lets not forget that Wilson stepped aside for GM/ President Tom Donahoe, another former Pittsburgh Steeler from their front office, and look how that turned out For me, things are starting to take shape as the more things change, the more they stay the same. Meaning Byrd and levitre. I want both Doug Marrone to be a successful Bills HC and Doug Whaley to be a successful GM while bringing winning and respectability back to the organization. But then I've wanted that winning and respectability for the last decade.
JohnC Posted July 16, 2013 Posted July 16, 2013 Sorry John, I'm just not as optimistic as you are about this franchise just yet. Every regime change I keep hearing about how this franchise is now moving in the right direction. Ralph Wilson did step aside, which essentially means the new GM & HC won't be interrogated for hours every day during the season, and will be allowed to do their respective jobs under the watchful eye of Russ Brandon. Speaking of Brandon, I believe he is the one who was most instrumental in the hiring of new HC Doug Marrone. With Brandon now running the ship I can see why Wilson has the utmost confidence in him keeping the franchise "profitable" after the Toronto deal. Which seems to be the primary objective. Anyway, lets not forget that Wilson stepped aside for GM/ President Tom Donahoe, another former Pittsburgh Steeler from their front office, and look how that turned out For me, things are starting to take shape as the more things change, the more they stay the same. Meaning Byrd and levitre. I want both Doug Marrone to be a successful Bills HC and Doug Whaley to be a successful GM while bringing winning and respectability back to the organization. But then I've wanted that winning and respectability for the last decade. If you are expecting a quick fix then you are going to be disappointed. Six years under the Levy/Jauron/Brandon/Nix have put this franchise in a bind. Nothing was going to substatively change until the organization was reformed. Brandon didn't do a good job when he was involved with the football operation but in my view he has done an exceptional job in restructuring the football operation. He has basically modernized a very backwater organization. The Bills will probably not match last year's record. On the surface that sounds disasterous. But it isn't necessarily so. What is going to matter is how professionally the football operation functions. How do the new draftees perform and develop? What good value mid-level players are added to the roster? Is the coaching staff a significant upgrade over the dullard bunch that preceded it? The Bills would be continuing on their typical path to mediocrity if the old guard remained in place. The dinasaurs are gone and the organization is infused with more youth and vigor. If you are not willing to be patient then you are going to be frustrated. At least for this upcoming season focus on the developmental process more than the wins and losses. It will be the best approach to take to maintaining one's mental health.
dave mcbride Posted July 16, 2013 Posted July 16, 2013 Badol's original post is, as usual, a good one that challenges fans to think just a tiny bit. What does rebuilding mean in today's NFL? Can it be a long term process? I suspect not, given that the Bills two best draftees from the past few years - Levitre and Byrd - have either walked or want to walk. For those who prize building through the draft, I suggest looking at the Royals and the Mariners, two teams which have consistently had top-tier farm system ratings over the past decade.
billsfan714 Posted July 16, 2013 Posted July 16, 2013 Starting Kevin Kolb gives me no confidence. To me he's just another never will be who will never lead any team to anything. If EJ comes in mid-year I dont expect him to light it up. The receiving corp is young, inexperienced(other than SJ) and will take a while to develop. I dont think the OL got better. The TE crew is mediocre to poor. The D has to be better, nobody could do a worse job than Wanny did last year. However not signing Byrd, and if he holds out, seems like more of the same old Bills, constantly letting good secondary people walk(and yes I know he can be signed again next year but this doesnt seem like they're going to meet Parker's and Byrd's demands). Which is a shame because this guy has a ton of turnovers during his tenure with the Bills. So I see a ying and yang, a wash, so 6-10 plus or minus one seems about right.
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