Bufcomments Posted June 18, 2013 Posted June 18, 2013 Since they got rid of T-Jax they must think EJ has the tools to start, it just a matter of getting him ready. I don't think they drafted him to sit the bench. Only way Kolb starts if he just has a monster preseason. Everything changes once the pads go on. This will be a good battle.
br1ju Posted June 18, 2013 Posted June 18, 2013 (edited) Does everyone understand that Kolb lost his job to John Skelton? Not because of injury. After Arizona traded for Kolb in 2011, he was beaten out of his job in camp and preseason by a guy from Fordam University. So after being the starter in 2011 he lost the job in 2012 and people think a rookie that started for two years at FSU can't beat this guy out. I kept up with Arizona last year and saw how the whole QB drama unfolded. Based on pre-season performances they were pretty much even from a statistics persepective. Unfortunately, Whisenhunt was the most incompetent and indecisive coach I have ever seen and totally mishandled QB's which eventually lead to his departure. He did the same with Leinart and Kurt Warner. Anyways, Kolb and Skelton were 2 QB's with vastly different skill sets with Skelton being more suited for what Whiz was trying to do which is why Skelton was chosen. Needless to say, he got hurt in the first game only to be replaced by Kolb who led the Cardinals to 4-0.The biggest thing about Kolb in Arizona was that his skill set did not match what Whisenhunt was trying to do. It was maddening to watch Cardinals football. At one point Kolb did a no huddle play which resulted in a TD. Whisenhunt was seen screaming down the sideline to call off the play it seems before they scored. I honestly didn't think they were on the same page. He even alluded to Whisenhunt being set in his way at one point. Kurt Warner commented that Kolb has what it takes to be a starter in Arizona over Skelton. He knew how the offense worked and admitted that Kolb needed some time to learn the offense since he came in after the strike shortened season and was injured most of his first year. In retrospect, during the hurry up offense Kolb was pretty much spot on. The cardinals employed it when they were trying to play catch up and 3 things generally happened. Kolb would make a completion, get sacked or he would run away from pressure only to get sacked due to not only having a clueless coach but having the worst o-line in the NFL. From watching the games it was easy to see he enjoyed the no-huddle and was efficient at it when he wasn't eating grass. Whether it translates here it remains to be seen. EJ is athletic and talented no doubt. He is no Cam Newton or RGIII so it will take some time for him to adjust. With those guys there was more of a consensus on their abilities. Not so much with EJ. No one will know how he will respond come game time. If he starts, the Patriots would be a good litmus test. Edited June 19, 2013 by br1ju
San Jose Bills Fan Posted June 18, 2013 Posted June 18, 2013 ^^^^^^^^ The newbie with some good info (and well-written too).
bigK14094 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 Kolb is the starter unless EJ takes it away in training camp. Not sure he can do that yet.....a year from now, I think for sure, but today, still on the steep part of the learning curve. If the Bills can't win with Kolb, or Kolb gets hurt, then EJ can start with a little less pressure....and get ready to take over in year two. Aaron Rodgers sat behind Farve 3 years, and it didn't hurt him. Yeh, I know, Kolb is not Farve. I think there is a possibility the Kolb will surprise. He was killer at the beginning of last season for Ariz. If he can stay healthy, he could very well surprise.
Doc Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 Unless Kolb is clearly superior in pre-season, EJ starts. Kolb will be 29 in 2 months and is not the long term answer, and it's the first year of a new regime.
San Jose Bills Fan Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 This I will say. Whomever starts will win the job fair and square. Last week Marrone spoke very clearly about the importance of "the players seeing separation." He knows the veterans need to be on board with the decision. This will not be a Mularkey/Losman deal.
Gugny Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 I kept up with Arizona last year and saw how the whole QB drama unfolded. Based on pre-season performances they were pretty much even from a statistics persepective. Unfortunately, Whisenhunt was the most incompetent and indecisive coach I have ever seen and totally mishandled QB's which eventually lead to his departure. He did the same with Leinart and Kurt Warner. Anyways, Kolb and Skelton were 2 QB's with vastly different skill sets with Skelton being more suited for what Whiz was trying to do which is why Skelton was chosen. Needless to say, he got hurt in the first game only to be replaced by Kolb who led the Cardinals to 4-0.The biggest thing about Kolb in Arizona was that his skill set did not match what Whisenhunt was trying to do. It was maddening to watch Cardinals football. At one point Kolb did a no huddle play which resulted in a TD. Whisenhunt was seen screaming down the sideline to call off the play it seems before they scored. I honestly didn't think they were on the same page. He even alluded to Whisenhunt being set in his way at one point. Kurt Warner commented that Kolb has what it takes to be a starter in Arizona over Skelton. He knew how the offense worked and admitted that Kolb needed some time to learn the offense since he came in after the strike shortened season and was injured most of his first year. In retrospect, during the hurry up offense Kolb was pretty much spot on. The cardinals employed it when they were trying to play catch up and 3 things generally happened. Kolb would make a completion, get sacked or he would run away from pressure only to get sacked due to not only having a clueless coach but having the worst o-line in the NFL. From watching the games it was easy to see he enjoyed the no-huddle and was efficient at it when he wasn't eating grass. Whether it translates here it remains to be seen. EJ is athletic and talented no doubt. He is no Cam Newton or RGIII so it will take some time for him to adjust. With those guys there was more of a consensus on their abilities. Not so much with EJ. No one will knows how he will respond come game time. If he starts, the Patriots would be a good litmus test. Good post. But why do I continue to see Newton and Griffin being the benchmark for greatness? Newton has played two season; one very impressive and one horrible. Griffin has played one season and - I realize I'm in the minority - I don't think he showed any true greatness. Yes, he was a rookie and shouldn't be expected to show greatness. But let's let these guys - along with Luck, Wilson, Kaepernick, etc. - actually show some consistent, high-level, football, before we start saying we want EJ to be like them. That said, EJ Manuel should be named the starter. He and Kolb should be told, simultaneously, that EJ is the starter for all 16 games unless he's injured. Let the kid take his lumps. Kolb took his and he never showed any signs that he was a long-term starter in the NFL. He had his chance. He failed.
K-9 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 This I will say. Whomever starts will win the job fair and square. Last week Marrone spoke very clearly about the importance of "the players seeing separation." He knows the veterans need to be on board with the decision. This will not be a Mularkey/Losman deal. Amen to that! Mularkey fractured that locker room with that decision and lost a ton of credibility along the way. GO BILLS!!!
KeisterHollow Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 I think the three biggest determining factors for Manuel starting will be: does he have a good enough grasp of the offense? Is he accurate on his passes, and does he go deep with accuracy? If Manuel can't do those things, then I think they let Kolb start the season. When I hear comparisons to Cam Newton, though, I get SUPER psyched for this offense - that kind of QB is a game changer (imagine how hard it'd be to defend against Spiller, our new group of WR's, if you have a big, mobile, ACCURATE passer who can just as easily run the ball 5 yards as throw it 15).
Doc Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 I think the three biggest determining factors for Manuel starting will be: does he have a good enough grasp of the offense? Is he accurate on his passes, and does he go deep with accuracy? If Manuel can't do those things, then I think they let Kolb start the season. When I hear comparisons to Cam Newton, though, I get SUPER psyched for this offense - that kind of QB is a game changer (imagine how hard it'd be to defend against Spiller, our new group of WR's, if you have a big, mobile, ACCURATE passer who can just as easily run the ball 5 yards as throw it 15). This post answers your questions regarding deep ball accuracy. As for grasp of the offense, that will take time. But they don't have to throw the kitchen sink at him and can work him in slowly.
Luxy312 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 IMO, it's EJ's job to lose and not Kolb's job to win. I think if EJ shows that he understands the playbook and gets some of his footwork issues worked out, that he will be the week 1 guy. If he doesn't or stumbles through camp and the preseason, then I think Kolb will clearly be the starter in week 1. Now this question doesn't speak to down the road of course. Let's say Kolb wins the first 4/5 games of the season. Would the coaching staff make a switch? Doubtful. EJ at that point could be holding the clip board until at least the end of the year, ala that "decent" QB in Green Bay. LOL.
simpleman Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 to start the process early, and figure out the criteria, that we can all agree on, that should determine the starter. I don't care what position they were drafted in, or what they have done before this year. I only care what they do on the field in the here and now. My criteria is whomever shows the greatest potential to win the game on the field during the regular season based on their performance between now and the NE game . Yes we all want EJ to be our savior, and most believe he has the most upside. I think few view Kolb as the future of the Bills like we hope EJ will become, but there is plenty of time for EJ to prove himself before January. But I want the QB to start the season who gives the Bills the best chance to win the games before the bye week. After bye week, if the Bills are not in the hunt for the post season, if the coaching staff feels EJ is ready and is not already starting, then it will be time to see if he is the future. Or if it is time to start evaluating the top QBs in the 2014 draft.
Gugny Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 Kolb. I don't see any evidence that EJ is ready. But we have seen plenty of evidence that Kolb sucks. I'd rather take a gamble on the unknown than to put a person who is absolutely certain to suck in. We did that for the last 3 years with the other career backup. No thanks.
eball Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 Kolb. I don't see any evidence that EJ is ready. Do you see any evidence that EJ is not ready?
Luxy312 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 Kolb. I don't see any evidence that EJ is ready. I don't see any greater evidence that Kolb is ready. He got benched in favor of a 5th round draft pick. Your argument goes in circles all by itself. LOL.
Mickey Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 Any answer is pointless. A couple of reports on OTAs and a video highlight or two isn't enough for a real opinion. Shot in the dark says ej This. This really isn't all that hard to figure out. Unless EJ rips it up in pre-season or the vet stinks it up, the vet starts until hurt or until he plays himself right off the field. Then EJ starts.
PromoTheRobot Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 EJ will be the starter, even if he is only halfway ready. Better he learn on the job. Kolb will start only if EJ is in over his head. PTR
Ralph W. Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 If you ask EJ who he resembles he will tell you Big Ben. EJ watches film of Big Ben says he plays a lot like him. He loves how Ben can escape from sacks all while looking down field the entire time to find and make the play. That is who I also think EJ is like. I don't understand the Newton/RGIII references but ask the kid himself and he says Big Ben.
Recommended Posts