Lem Barney, HOFer, says football will be done in 10-20 years

[Kemp]

It's more about a Nanny State than the PC Police. This is about legislators and lawyers trying to eliminate all risk in people's lives and get rich whilest doing so. People currently make the choice to play a dangerous sport and if they are talented and dedicated enough they get rewarded handsomely for that talent and dedication. Eventually the Nanny State politicians and the get rich quick lawyers will sue and legislate the game out of existence. Not everything is safe and it's not your job or anyone else's job to eliminate choice and restrict the market that has such a demand for the sport of football. This sport will be gone or unrecognizable in the near future. You want proof? Look at proposed laws in states looking to BAN THE SPORT.

 

As I said before, the problem lies within the concussions to kids taking a longterm effect on them. I don't care what adults do to each other on the football field.

 

However, there are times I am glad when gov't does intervene. I am glad there are helmet laws for motorcylists. Personally I don't care if they die because they want to be idiots, it's the inevitable thinning of the herd, but I don't want anyone I know have to watch their brains splattered all over the pavement because they are too macho/stupid to wear a helmet.

 

I just don't get this. There simply is NO way to make this sport significantly safer. I think instead of trying to make it 'safer', the NFL needs to make it clearer that if you CHOOSE to play this sport, you are placing yourself at serious risk of injury. Make the players sign a waiver. Football is as close to the gladiator fights of old that we'll ever get. Make it clear that if you want millions of dollars and potential glory by playing this sport, you do so at your risk. These guys could stay in school, get their degrees, and do something else with their lives.

 

And do the same thing for pee wee, HS, and college football. Make all the players sign waivers. This sport simply can not be made safer, at least in a way that will really decrease risk of serious injuries.

 

A child can't legally sign a waiver and a lot of adults are too stupid to know what they are signing for their kids.

 

Lacrosse is becoming huge here in San Diego. Street luging, skateboarding are all eroding the player of pool at the high school level. Eventually it will percolate up to the NFL level. Combine that with the high cost of NFL game attendance and stupid bag rules. I hate Bin Laden for screwing up so many things in a so called free society.

 

Bin Laden destroyed the NFL? Interesting slant..

[bbb]

Youth sports is an interesting aspect to this conversation (which we've had numerous times).

 

Is it necessary to have widespread youth participation for a sport to survive?

 

From a socioeconomic standpoint will football survive in its traditional hotbeds?

 

I can foresee a day when the NFL's popularity wanes (like the big 3 sports earlier in the 20th century, boxing, horse racing, baseball) but except in a scenario where there is no youth football anymore, I think the NFL will always survive in this country, even with a limited talent pool.

 

I think you bring up a good point. As long as the football hotbeds keep up with the youth football, and it's going to take a long time for that to change in Texas, Florida, etc. - then there should be a talent pool.

 

I guess it doesn't matter if NYS' parents don't let their kids play football so much.

[yungmack]

 

I think you bring up a good point. As long as the football hotbeds keep up with the youth football, and it's going to take a long time for that to change in Texas, Florida, etc. - then there should be a talent pool.

 

I guess it doesn't matter if NYS' parents don't let their kids play football so much.

The history of violent activities shows that it moves down the socio-economic scale over time as the cost-benefit ratio changes. Warfare was once the pastime of the "nobility" but you don't see those chaps rushing into battle with a lance any longer. Boxing was once a preserve of the "better class," required at Oxford and Cambridge (not by accident were its rules codified by the Marquis of Queensbury and not Joe the Cockney). Over time, it too moved down scale. For most of the modern history of boxing, the largest ethnic group participating was usually the lowest one socio-economically at that time. As that group "moved on up to the East Side," it was replaced by a new impoverished group.

 

Football, too, was once an upper class pastime, practiced first at Yale and other Ivies by the sons of the elite. They still have football teams and, I believe, boxing teams as well. But we don't look to them for first round NFL players very often or for the next heavyweight champion. The same has happened with white kids over the last 30 years, with fewer of them playing serious football. That's now happening with many black kids as more families become solidly middle class: they put there kids into other sports. My guess is that pro football as we like it is headed to becoming a niche sport.

 

As to the hotbeds, the sport would be a whole lot thinner without Florida, Texas and California. But around LA more and more kids are not turning out to play. I can't believe that's not true of the South as well, though I have no data at hand. I do notice that the tough white guys from rough backgrounds seem to have been replaced by black guys with that sort of biography, just like happened with boxing over the last century.

[CodeMonkey]

Lol yea football is getting more popular and he thinks it will be done. Anyone that has this thought is out of their mind.

You shouldn't listen to that show it pollutes your mind which is showing by you being worried about this lol.

I think 20 years is too soon unless something catastrophic happens. But football is not getting more popular. The trend is that fewer kids are playing nationwide and that is likely to continue. As they grow to adults it is likely that football will get less popular. And it is only popular in the US to begin with. However I don't think it will ever die completely so long as there are parents willing to let their kids play (Texas and Oklahoma for example where high school football is a religion). It will probably just drop behind some of the other sports.

 

Also, I feel it is almost inevitable that the US catch up to the rest of the world when it comes to playing and being fans of soccer (real football). My prediction, FWIW, is that football (soccer) will eventually surpass tackle football for popularity in the US. For that to happen in 20 years, as I previously stated, seems unlikely without some big event happening.

Edited June 15, 2013 by CodeMonkey

[Ralph W.]

 

I think 20 years is too soon unless something catastrophic happens. But football is not getting more popular. The trend is that fewer kids are playing nationwide and that is likely to continue. As they grow to adults it is likely that football will get less popular. And it is only popular in the US to begin with. However I don't think it will ever die completely so long as there are parents willing to let their kids play (Texas and Oklahoma for example where high school football is a religion). It will probably just drop behind some of the other sports.

 

Also, I feel it is almost inevitable that the US catch up to the rest of the world when it comes to playing and being fans of soccer (real football). My prediction, FWIW, is that football (soccer) will eventually surpass tackle football for popularity in the US. For that to happen in 20 years, as I previously stated, seems unlikely without some big event happening.

Tinfoil hats for sale!

[nucci]

Well, gosh darn golly gee, if Lem freaking Barney says it, it must be so.

 

Note to self: add calendar reminder to cancel Bills season tickets in 2023.

At least he narrowed it down to between 10 and 20 years.

[seq004]

A great football player. A bad prediction. Football makes way to much money to leave any time in the future. It will only get bigger.

[Kellyto83TD]

If the Liberals keep having their way, it will be eliminated in 20 years. Thank God there are enough conservatives left to keep that from happening.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

If the Liberals keep having their way, it will be eliminated in 20 years. Thank God there are enough conservatives left to keep that from happening.

 

So all the lawyers driving the lawsuits in this country are liberals?

 

Are the NFL's lawyers and owners liberal too?

 

You sound like one of those people who let talk radio formulate your thoughts for you.

 

The history of violent activities shows that it moves down the socio-economic scale over time as the cost-benefit ratio changes. Warfare was once the pastime of the "nobility" but you don't see those chaps rushing into battle with a lance any longer. Boxing was once a preserve of the "better class," required at Oxford and Cambridge (not by accident were its rules codified by the Marquis of Queensbury and not Joe the Cockney). Over time, it too moved down scale. For most of the modern history of boxing, the largest ethnic group participating was usually the lowest one socio-economically at that time. As that group "moved on up to the East Side," it was replaced by a new impoverished group.

 

Football, too, was once an upper class pastime, practiced first at Yale and other Ivies by the sons of the elite. They still have football teams and, I believe, boxing teams as well. But we don't look to them for first round NFL players very often or for the next heavyweight champion. The same has happened with white kids over the last 30 years, with fewer of them playing serious football. That's now happening with many black kids as more families become solidly middle class: they put there kids into other sports. My guess is that pro football as we like it is headed to becoming a niche sport.

 

As to the hotbeds, the sport would be a whole lot thinner without Florida, Texas and California. But around LA more and more kids are not turning out to play. I can't believe that's not true of the South as well, though I have no data at hand. I do notice that the tough white guys from rough backgrounds seem to have been replaced by black guys with that sort of biography, just like happened with boxing over the last century.

 

Great stuff and understanding of American culture.

 

:thumbsup:

 

I think 20 years is too soon unless something catastrophic happens. But football is not getting more popular. The trend is that fewer kids are playing nationwide and that is likely to continue. As they grow to adults it is likely that football will get less popular. And it is only popular in the US to begin with. However I don't think it will ever die completely so long as there are parents willing to let their kids play (Texas and Oklahoma for example where high school football is a religion). It will probably just drop behind some of the other sports.

 

Also, I feel it is almost inevitable that the US catch up to the rest of the world when it comes to playing and being fans of soccer (real football). My prediction, FWIW, is that football (soccer) will eventually surpass tackle football for popularity in the US. For that to happen in 20 years, as I previously stated, seems unlikely without some big event happening.

 

I totally agree 20 years is off but those scoffing at the demise of NFL football aren't looking at history. Again, 2 of the 3 most popular sports from 75 years ago are no longer even close to being popular.

 

I'm sure the Romans who enjoyed Gladiator entertainment as their main entertainment for longer than this country has existed didn't think that would go away either.

 

However I'm skeptical that soccer will surpass North American football.

 

Youth soccer has been popular in this country for decades and at least to me it doesn't seem like it's much more popular as a spectator sport as it was in the days of Pele. Same with lacrosse, I don't think youth participation has a strong effect on spectator popularity.

 

JMO.

Edited June 16, 2013 by San Jose Bills Fan

[Fan in San Diego]

The history of violent activities shows that it moves down the socio-economic scale over time as the cost-benefit ratio changes. Warfare was once the pastime of the "nobility" but you don't see those chaps rushing into battle with a lance any longer. Boxing was once a preserve of the "better class," required at Oxford and Cambridge (not by accident were its rules codified by the Marquis of Queensbury and not Joe the Cockney). Over time, it too moved down scale. For most of the modern history of boxing, the largest ethnic group participating was usually the lowest one socio-economically at that time. As that group "moved on up to the East Side," it was replaced by a new impoverished group.

 

Football, too, was once an upper class pastime, practiced first at Yale and other Ivies by the sons of the elite. They still have football teams and, I believe, boxing teams as well. But we don't look to them for first round NFL players very often or for the next heavyweight champion. The same has happened with white kids over the last 30 years, with fewer of them playing serious football. That's now happening with many black kids as more families become solidly middle class: they put there kids into other sports. My guess is that pro football as we like it is headed to becoming a niche sport.

 

As to the hotbeds, the sport would be a whole lot thinner without Florida, Texas and California. But around LA more and more kids are not turning out to play. I can't believe that's not true of the South as well, though I have no data at hand. I do notice that the tough white guys from rough backgrounds seem to have been replaced by black guys with that sort of biography, just like happened with boxing over the last century.

 

Good post and probably will play out like that. What do you think will rise to the top and become the most popular sport?

 

So all the lawyers driving the lawsuits in this country are liberals?

 

Are the NFL's lawyers and owners liberal too?

 

You sound like one of those people who let talk radio formulate your thoughts for you.

 

 

 

Great stuff and understanding of American culture.

 

:thumbsup:

 

 

 

I totally agree 20 years is off but those scoffing at the demise of NFL football aren't looking at history. Again, 2 of the 3 most popular sports from 75 years ago are no longer even close to being popular.

 

I'm sure the Romans who enjoyed Gladiator entertainment as their main entertainment for longer than this country has existed didn't think that would go away either.

 

However I'm skeptical that soccer will surpass North American football.

 

Youth soccer has been popular in this country for decades and at least to me it doesn't seem like it's much more popular as a spectator sport as it was in the days of Pele. Same with lacrosse, I don't think youth participation has a strong effect on spectator popularity.

 

JMO.

 

I think lacrosse has a good chance to really become popular. Its taking off big time here in San Diego. Some High Schools have a Varsity squad, JV team and a freshman team. I saw some grade school kids the other day with lacrosse sticks.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

I think lacrosse has a good chance to really become popular. Its taking off big time here in San Diego. Some High Schools have a Varsity squad, JV team and a freshman team. I saw some grade school kids the other day with lacrosse sticks.

 

Well I don't deny the popularity of soccer and lacrosse as youth sports.

 

I just don't buy that there's a link between youth participation and acceptance as a professional spectator sport.

[Nitro]

Any sport where you make contact can result in a concussion. The Nanny state types (lawyers, insurance cos. professional hand wringers etc.) will ruin anything they get their hands on. Sports is no different. If football goes because of liability claims so will hockey, lacrosse, boxing, martial arts and auto racing among other sports. The nation is passive but will only take so much before a backlash occurs. I am not for brain trauma but the advent of head shots started in the 70s with Oakland, Chicago and Pittsburgh. It accelerated with ESPN and its endless highlights of DBs blowing up receivers. Players need to play the game smartly. They played hard nosed football in 50s and 60s. Watch some of the old game films. Those guys would wrap up a runner and drive him into the ground. Safer helmets may have caused these guys to not worry about broken noses, knocked out teeth or getting their bell rung. I hope that they keep the sport I love so much alive but they have to be intelligent about it.

[ko12010]

Good post and probably will play out like that. What do you think will rise to the top and become the most popular sport?

 

 

 

I think lacrosse has a good chance to really become popular. Its taking off big time here in San Diego. Some High Schools have a Varsity squad, JV team and a freshman team. I saw some grade school kids the other day with lacrosse sticks.

I played pretty much every sport growing up. Lacrosse was some of the most fun I ever had in a contact sport. Basically hockey and football combined. Only played one year, but it was awesome. Lacrosse needs to gain popularity as a spectator sport though before it gets a foothold as a major sport.

[Keukasmallies]

I hope 2023 isn't a drop dead date as I'd like to see the Bills at least make the playoffs before it's all over.

[CodeMonkey]

However I'm skeptical that soccer will surpass North American football.

 

Youth soccer has been popular in this country for decades and at least to me it doesn't seem like it's much more popular as a spectator sport as it was in the days of Pele. Same with lacrosse, I don't think youth participation has a strong effect on spectator popularity.

 

JMO.

I understand your point. However quality soccer in the US is about to get a boost in TV availability.

 

http://sportsillustr...bc-tv-coverage/

 

Basically NBC airing every game of the upcoming English Premier League season.

The next step is going to have to be getting quality professional soccer in the US. MLS is a joke.

 

But hey, it's a start

Edited June 16, 2013 by CodeMonkey

[ganesh]

It will be interesting.

 

But, if you have/will play the game of football...you understand it is a pyshical sport and things happen.

 

It is how it's been and always will be.

 

A majority of the NFL players play the game because that is their lifeline. If there is no NFL they are stuck in the back-streets of cities neighborhoods doing illegal stuff and even get killed. I just simply don't see the NFL going away as long as it is an avenue for a lfie-changing event for these players.

 

I hope 2023 isn't a drop dead date as I'd like to see the Bills at least make the playoffs before it's all over.

And may be even once win the big one!

[yungmack]

Good post and probably will play out like that. What do you think will rise to the top and become the most popular sport?

 

I think the days of hugely popular team sports is drawing to an end. Sports seem to reflect the attitude of the larger society, and many studies (and my own observations) suggest that kids casually play less than they used to (the streets are empty of kids on their own wherever I go), are much more into their own world, fostered by technology, so that there is less impetus to join up in person with others. The people who get them out of the house playing soccer or lacrosse or hockey or baseball inevitable are the parents. Without the parents, I think most kids would be perfectly happy to hang around the house with their iPhones, their XBox and a Netflix stream, interacting via Twitter and Facebook. As these kids become parents, I wonder if they'll be dragging their children around to participate in team sports.

 

It seems to me, and maybe you too, that the "sports" that most interest kids today are much more individualistic than team, whether its surfing, skateboarding, mountain biking, snowboarding, et al. And that they do much more on their own initiative than from adult encouragement.

 

BTW, no surprise that we have a huge Latino immigrant population in Southern California, and naturally, soccer is the big sport in those communities. For years now, lots of really fine baseball fields have been more used for soccer than baseball. To the casual observer (me), it looks just like anywhere else in the US where kids play team sports: lots of moms and dads, aunts and uncles, etc. I have also noticed that as they get older, there are far, far fewer Latino kids playing soccer. My guess is that this is tracking the decline you see in interest in team sports by the American kids. A second BTW: a lot of kids playing high school football now come from immigrant Latino families.

 

So, I guess to sum it up, my prediction is that all team sports are facing both a declining pool of American participants along with a concurrent decline in a fan base. I don't see them ever totally disappearing. But I think the days of the great "Mass Audience" are already passing away as has happened with the mass audience for individual television programs, entertainers popular across all sectors of the population, and the narrowing of the newspaper and magazine businesses from "general interest" to much more specific and exclusive readerships. As the Brad Pitt characters says in a recent movie, "If you live in America now, you're on your own."

Edited June 16, 2013 by yungmack

[San Jose Bills Fan]

^^^^^^^^^^^^

Interesting theorizing.

 

Any sport where you make contact can result in a concussion. The Nanny state types (lawyers, insurance cos. professional hand wringers etc.) will ruin anything they get their hands on. Sports is no different. If football goes because of liability claims so will hockey, lacrosse, boxing, martial arts and auto racing among other sports. The nation is passive but will only take so much before a backlash occurs. I am not for brain trauma but the advent of head shots started in the 70s with Oakland, Chicago and Pittsburgh. It accelerated with ESPN and its endless highlights of DBs blowing up receivers. Players need to play the game smartly. They played hard nosed football in 50s and 60s. Watch some of the old game films. Those guys would wrap up a runner and drive him into the ground. Safer helmets may have caused these guys to not worry about broken noses, knocked out teeth or getting their bell rung. I hope that they keep the sport I love so much alive but they have to be intelligent about it.

 

And they will. As I've said I don't need the gratuitous violence. If the players have to "settle" for playing the game as they did in the 1960's that's perfectly fine with me.

 

I don't for a second agree with the "pussification of the game" takes you often read around here.

 

If reducing kill shots is going to ruin the enjoyment of the game for an individual then that person has issues.

 

You're upset that a 300 pound man can't run 20 mph at a defenseless stationary quarterback and hit him after he releases the ball? Well there's always mixed martial arts for gratuitous violence.

[CodeMonkey]

 

You're upset that a 300 pound man can't run 20 mph at a defenseless stationary quarterback and hit him after he releases the ball? Well there's always mixed martial arts for gratuitous violence.

MMA doesn't allow free and clear shots on a defenseless competitor either.

[Kemp]

If the Liberals keep having their way, it will be eliminated in 20 years. Thank God there are enough conservatives left to keep that from happening.

 

Never knew football, or sports for that matter, is the archenemy of Liberals.

 

I'll assume your post was satirical in nature.