Nanker Posted July 11, 2013 Posted July 11, 2013 I agree that the lose/lose scenario is very possible. Byrd really has no leverage so he'll stay away as long as he can without missing a paycheck. Then he'll come in just before the season starts. This course of action alone could definitely end up hurting both he and the team. In this case, if he signed his franchise tender and got injured, he'd still get his money but it would further reduce his leverage for next year. I think the Bills on the other hand are prepared to move forward without Byrd anyways. As I said months ago, I expect the Bills to play hardball and simply squat on his rights indefinitely. Maybe a team comes forward with a good trade offer maybe not. If he does that, I think Pettine will keep him on the bench and play with the guys he trained in the off season. Could be a cold greeting for Byrd. I think that's what I'd do. Why play him when he doesn't know the system and isn't in playing shape and hasn't been in pads and through live contact since January? Why not see what you've got with the young ones while he sits and stews and collects no stats and his bargains chips continue to erode? Byrd's got one thing to sell - his physical services, and those don't last forever in the NFL.
jimmy10 Posted July 11, 2013 Posted July 11, 2013 What does TEMPOS dinner reservation list look like for tonight, Thursday, Friday, Saturday? The answer to JB signing anything is a direct link to that. Somebody check the flight plans for every charter jet currently sitting in Buffalo and wherever Byrd lives.
thebandit27 Posted July 11, 2013 Posted July 11, 2013 Ya but you think that they are satisfied with a former CB turned safety and a 4th and 5th round pick? Obviously if we do well enough this eyar then that will change but I cant see them passing on a top safety if one is there when we pick CBF I don't see how they could be satisfied, no. That, however, does not mean that taking a safety in the first round is certain.
26CornerBlitz Posted July 11, 2013 Posted July 11, 2013 @WGR550 The Analytics Dept. Ep. 5: The Byrd Situation http://bit.ly/14LJUMm
JohnC Posted July 11, 2013 Posted July 11, 2013 If he does that, I think Pettine will keep him on the bench and play with the guys he trained in the off season. Could be a cold greeting for Byrd. I think that's what I'd do. Why play him when he doesn't know the system and isn't in playing shape and hasn't been in pads and through live contact since January? Why not see what you've got with the young ones while he sits and stews and collects no stats and his bargains chips continue to erode? Byrd's got one thing to sell - his physical services, and those don't last forever in the NFL. Pettine has been a coach in the NFL for a long time. He is well aware that tough negotiations on both sides of the table are part of the business side of the NFL Few coaches are in any way going to interject themselves into the dispute. Pettine is well aware, as all coaches are, that there is nothing unusual about a delayed resolution of a contract. Regardless of when Byrd reports to camp or to play he will demonstrably be better than the replacement player. Not only is Byrd the best safety on this team by far, he is also one of the better safeties in the league. Assuming that he remains with the Bills and reports to the team he will make Pettine's defense better. Pettine and the organization know that. If he returns it's very unlikely that he will be a bench warmer because it wouldn't help this talent deprived team and it would make little sense.
nucci Posted July 11, 2013 Posted July 11, 2013 Pettine has been a coach in the NFL for a long time. He is well aware that tough negotiations on both sides of the table are part of the business side of the NFL Few coaches are in any way going to interject themselves into the dispute. Pettine is well aware, as all coaches are, that there is nothing unusual about a delayed resolution of a contract. Regardless of when Byrd reports to camp or to play he will demonstrably be better than the replacement player. Not only is Byrd the best safety on this team by far, he is also one of the better safeties in the league. Assuming that he remains with the Bills and reports to the team he will make Pettine's defense better. Pettine and the organization know that. If he returns it's very unlikely that he will be a bench warmer because it wouldn't help this talent deprived team and it would make little sense. Good point...Revis??
Doc Posted July 11, 2013 Posted July 11, 2013 If he does that, I think Pettine will keep him on the bench and play with the guys he trained in the off season. Could be a cold greeting for Byrd. I think that's what I'd do. Why play him when he doesn't know the system and isn't in playing shape and hasn't been in pads and through live contact since January? Why not see what you've got with the young ones while he sits and stews and collects no stats and his bargains chips continue to erode? Byrd's got one thing to sell - his physical services, and those don't last forever in the NFL. I agree completely. Everyone will need to earn his starting position, and that includes Byrd.
San Jose Bills Fan Posted July 11, 2013 Posted July 11, 2013 If he does that, I think Pettine will keep him on the bench and play with the guys he trained in the off season. Could be a cold greeting for Byrd. I think that's what I'd do. Why play him when he doesn't know the system and isn't in playing shape and hasn't been in pads and through live contact since January? Why not see what you've got with the young ones while he sits and stews and collects no stats and his bargains chips continue to erode? Byrd's got one thing to sell - his physical services, and those don't last forever in the NFL. Pettine has been a coach in the NFL for a long time. He is well aware that tough negotiations on both sides of the table are part of the business side of the NFL Few coaches are in any way going to interject themselves into the dispute. Pettine is well aware, as all coaches are, that there is nothing unusual about a delayed resolution of a contract. Regardless of when Byrd reports to camp or to play he will demonstrably be better than the replacement player. Not only is Byrd the best safety on this team by far, he is also one of the better safeties in the league. Assuming that he remains with the Bills and reports to the team he will make Pettine's defense better. Pettine and the organization know that. If he returns it's very unlikely that he will be a bench warmer because it wouldn't help this talent deprived team and it would make little sense. There's a middle ground between these two positions. That middle ground is not rushing Byrd back into action but rather making him a backup until he's proved demonstrably that he's in good shape and totally understands the defense. This gives the team the added benefit of evaluating the other safeties. On a side note, in many years of following the NFL, we've all seen how teams have occasionally taken a somewhat punitive approach to a player who has sat out in a dispute and is year to year. However for better or worse it sends a message to the other players that financial business will sometimes overlap with football decisions. Some teams will play this card. Others don't. Also, it depends on the player involved and his relationship with management and even the fans. IMO there are certainly a few scenarios out there where the Bills drag their feet in getting Byrd back on the field.
3rdand12 Posted July 11, 2013 Posted July 11, 2013 (edited) If he does that, I think Pettine will keep him on the bench and play with the guys he trained in the off season. Could be a cold greeting for Byrd. I think that's what I'd do. Why play him when he doesn't know the system and isn't in playing shape and hasn't been in pads and through live contact since January? Why not see what you've got with the young ones while he sits and stews and collects no stats and his bargains chips continue to erode? Byrd's got one thing to sell - his physical services, and those don't last forever in the NFL. I am quite surprised that we are of the same mind on this matter.I was considering M Dareus reps with the twos and 3s during ota and or minis. I am aware he missed time but was seriously considering that the coach is sending a message to him . Or Two . First might be that " you should be here if you are not having a baby like lawson and branch " meh. or it could be " you are not up to speed with reps and we have a schedule to keep " prolly that LOL ! Or my favorite "Get your sh+t together kid if you want to play NFL football". a bit of psychology 101 maybe ? i can only guess. But Byrd .. if he is being a weenie . i would like to make sure we the coaches are not happy and have made other plans. lower his stock and infururiate him to the point of firing Parker and signing a reasonable contract , hug and move on. I want Byrd on the team but i am pissed off at him and the team right now. Sure would love to know asking and selling prices Edited July 11, 2013 by 3rdand12
mitchmurraydowntown Posted July 11, 2013 Author Posted July 11, 2013 There's a middle ground between these two positions. That middle ground is not rushing Byrd back into action but rather making him a backup until he's proved demonstrably that he's in good shape and totally understands the defense. This gives the team the added benefit of evaluating the other safeties. On a side note, in many years of following the NFL, we've all seen how teams have occasionally taken a somewhat punitive approach to a player who has sat out in a dispute and is year to year. However for better or worse it sends a message to the other players that financial business will sometimes overlap with football decisions. Some teams will play this card. Others don't. Also, it depends on the player involved and his relationship with management and even the fans. IMO there are certainly a few scenarios out there where the Bills drag their feet in getting Byrd back on the field. How he fits is going to determine his value, that's why he's not going to earn anymore than the current tender this year.
3rdand12 Posted July 12, 2013 Posted July 12, 2013 (edited) How he fits is going to determine his value, that's why he's not going to earn anymore than the current tender this year. Isnt that a risk on our part ? This could be his best year ever. on paper , with this defensive coaching staff .This defense if we/ I assume even close to correctly might be the one he is well suited for. As compared to the last 3 he has suffered Edited July 12, 2013 by 3rdand12
JohnC Posted July 12, 2013 Posted July 12, 2013 (edited) There's a middle ground between these two positions. That middle ground is not rushing Byrd back into action but rather making him a backup until he's proved demonstrably that he's in good shape and totally understands the defense. This gives the team the added benefit of evaluating the other safeties. On a side note, in many years of following the NFL, we've all seen how teams have occasionally taken a somewhat punitive approach to a player who has sat out in a dispute and is year to year. However for better or worse it sends a message to the other players that financial business will sometimes overlap with football decisions. Some teams will play this card. Others don't. Also, it depends on the player involved and his relationship with management and even the fans. IMO there are certainly a few scenarios out there where the Bills drag their feet in getting Byrd back on the field. From a self-interest standpoint both the player and organization have a stake in Byrd playing at a high level when he reports to the team. Bryd is not a slacker; he is a conscientious person who understands that he has to be ready to play wihen the contract situation is settled. If there is no long term agreement then he will be playing for the tender rate. It might not be what he wants but it is still a steep price. The front office certainly doesn't want to pay him at the tender rate and then see that high priced contract (even for one year) be wasted with him not playing. They want to get as much return on their investment that they can get out of him. That won't happen if he is on the bench being more of a cheerleader than a contributing player. If Byrd signs a tender with the expectation that the Bills won't sign a long term deal with him he is going to have the incentive to play well in order to showcase his talent and increase his market value to the rest of the league. On the other side of the coin the front office wants him to play well so that if they decide to trade him they will get a better return. The Revis situatiion is probably the best example where both the player and the team want the player to maximize his value for their own individual interests. Edited July 12, 2013 by JohnC
San Jose Bills Fan Posted July 12, 2013 Posted July 12, 2013 From a self-interest standpoint both the player and organization have a stake in Byrd playing at a high level when he reports to the team. Bryd is not a slacker; he is a conscientious person who understands that he has to be ready to play wihen the contract situation is settled. If there is no long term agreement then he will be playing for the tender rate. It might not be what he wants but it is still a steep price. The front office certainly doesn't want to pay him at the tender rate and then see that high priced contract (even for one year) be wasted with him not playing. They want to get as much return on their investment that they can get out of him. That won't happen if he is on the bench being more of a cheerleader than a contributing player. If Byrd signs a tender with the expectation that the Bills won't sign a long term deal with him he is going to have the incentive to play well in order to showcase his talent and increase his market value to the rest of the league. On the other side of the coin the front office wants him to play well so that if they decide to trade him they will get a better return. The Revis situatiion is probably the best example where both the player and the team want the player to maximize his value for their own individual interests. To the bolded (actually to your entire post), I stated earlier in this topic: No one believes that the Bills want Byrd to have a poor season, do they? Regardless of what contract terms he's playing under, both parties want the player to play well. That is a given. I was pointing out that it's not beyond the realm of possibility that: 1) The Bills bring Byrd back slowly (in the scenario where he reports late). 2) Things get ugly and the team adapts a punitive attitude towards Byrd. No, Byrd is not a slacker and that's why I wrote "Also, it depends on the player involved and his relationship with management and even the fans." I'm sure in this particular case that the club has a healthy respect for Byrd and I would think that #2 is highly improbable but I would say #1 is certainly possible. Why rush Byrd into the starting lineup if he's not yet in playing shape and doesn't have a full grasp of the defense?
papazoid Posted July 12, 2013 Posted July 12, 2013 Sources: Bills' Byrd looking for Weddle, Goldson money http://www.wgr550.com/Sources--Bills--Byrd-looking-for-Weddle--Goldson-m/16801007
Dorkington Posted July 12, 2013 Posted July 12, 2013 So, I'm assuming no long term deal will get done. Where does that leave us? I'm a bit unclear on the Franchise tag... I saw some stuff about not signing it until November and still getting paid?
dave mcbride Posted July 12, 2013 Posted July 12, 2013 Sources: Bills' Byrd looking for Weddle, Goldson money http://www.wgr550.co...dson-m/16801007 Good story. Thanks. Everyone here should read it.
PromoTheRobot Posted July 12, 2013 Posted July 12, 2013 So Byrd/Parker are looking for something north of $40M/5Y/$20M guaranteed. But what is a player of that level worth in trade? A first rounder? There's the rub. Byrd is supposedly worth elite money but not elite value in trade. PTR
nucci Posted July 12, 2013 Posted July 12, 2013 So, I'm assuming no long term deal will get done. Where does that leave us? I'm a bit unclear on the Franchise tag... I saw some stuff about not signing it until November and still getting paid? Since he is not under contract he will not get paid until he signs the franchise tag. If he signs and holds out he is subject to fines. Sources: Bills' Byrd looking for Weddle, Goldson money http://www.wgr550.co...dson-m/16801007 Thanks for link. Not surprising
Dorkington Posted July 12, 2013 Posted July 12, 2013 Since he is not under contract he will not get paid until he signs the franchise tag. If he signs and holds out he is subject to fines. Thanks for link. Not surprising Ah, I thought he had some time to sign and still get paid the full season's contract. Thanks for the clarification.
NoSaint Posted July 12, 2013 Posted July 12, 2013 So Byrd/Parker are looking for something north of $40M/5Y/$20M guaranteed. But what is a player of that level worth in trade? A first rounder? There's the rub. Byrd is supposedly worth elite money but not elite value in trade. PTR I wouldnt even say north of, as much as "on par with" i still dont get the impression that hes trying to blow the market away, simply end up among the best. it might be a tiny notch over, but the 9m figure, or 10m that some mention just doesnt ring true. it sounds like were talking more in the 8 to 8.25m range depending on length, structure etc... than the 9m talks.
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