Cowboys draft board leaked

[NFLBighits]

While I acknowledge that Jerry Jones has done a better then average job as his own GM. I can even say I understand his thoughts on the matter. Why hire someone and pay them when you think you can pretty much do as good or even a better job, and your philosophies may conflict with his. After all he did learn from Jimmy Johnson and Bill Parcells.

 

This is the thing that gets me tho, the Colts owner Jim Irsay is a complete tool in my view as I can't stand him for so many reasons. Unlike his father before him, who had his hands in every aspect of the team like JJ has, the son was smart enough to recognize the talent in Bill Polian for GM and hire him to run his team. When other teams tried to hire him away Irsay made him president,and thus giving him complete immunity from losing him. 11 years of winning seasons with countless division championships and two trips to the SB, and one win.

 

I think Jerry Jones is smarter then Jim Irsay and could hire a Polian clone. My take is he is such a power hungry control freak he wants to prove he can get a team to a SB win all on his own. After all, he wanted to take all the credit for the Jimmy Johnson wins, and rubbed it in Johnson's nose when he won with Barry Switzer as head coach.

 

Like I said, I'm happy Jones thinks enough of himself to be his own GM ...I'll bet the NY Giants are happy also.

You can put 90% of his success to Peyton Maning : ) Edited June 1, 2013 by NFLBighits

[Big Turk]

@CBSSports

MT @PriscoCBS: So Cowboys had a 4th-round grade on E.J. Manuel: http://cbsprt.co/CowboysBoard

 

. Consistent with what 4 GMs told me they had for him.

 

Probably 4 GMs that did little ti no homework on QBs unlike the Bills who may have done some of the most exhaustive scouting on QBs of any team in a long long time...

[KOKBILLS]

Slightly off topic...But did anyone notice how bright red Jerry's face was during the Draft? I saw a couple interviews with him on Day 2 and he was REALLY excitable as well...So his face was bright red and he was talking gibberish...It was so funny...

[Shamrock]

18 guys with 1st Rd grades. 22 guys with 2nd Rd grades.... Is that telling of the value/ need/ reach of the draft too.

 

[truth on hold]

 

 

Almost all attributable to Jimmy Johnson's outstanding football acumen. Jerrah has done essentially squat since Jimmy Johnson left Dallas with the exception of one more ring with Jimmy's team under Switzer. I'll give Jones well deserved credit as an astute businessman, but as a GM he sucks.

Jimbo didn't do much with Miami dolphins, where he had complete control of personnel decisions.

Edited June 2, 2013 by Joe_the_6_pack

[26CornerBlitz]

Jimbo didn't do much with Miami dolphins.

 

Agreed and I'm glad he didn't.

[truth on hold]

 

 

Agreed and I'm glad he didn't.

The brilliant move there - and I'm not sure how credit is apportioned between jerrah and jumbo - was the walker trade. They recognized his capabilities as a player were way below his trade value and did what was thought of as unthinkable and moved him. That allowed them to add both stars and depth to the roster to field a super bowl winner. Neither one has done much since , and I find jimmy johnson the least insightful football analyst on TV ... Really just a waste of air time whenever he opens his mouth.

[Hotpockets28]

Lol jerry and da cowgirls didnt even have Robert woods on thier draft board...talk about horrible scouting. .R woods can easily be thee best Wr in this draft...excellent hands,good speed, with exceptional route running

[Nitro]

Jerry Jones has a habit of having poor drafts so I would ignore his board. It would make more sense if it was an AFC East foe's board to be interested. How much fun it would be to trade infront of NE, Miami or the NY Jets to steal a coveted player.

[ganesh]

@CBSSports

MT @PriscoCBS: So Cowboys had a 4th-round grade on E.J. Manuel: http://cbsprt.co/CowboysBoard

 

. Consistent with what 4 GMs told me they had for him.

Why is Mr. Prisco trying to prove himself. Let it go. In this years draft, all QBs had their strength and weakness and different teams rated them differently according to their needs/schemes etc. So what 4 GMs had him rated in the 4th round. I am sure there were 4 other GMs from the remaining 28 teams, who had rated him as a 1st round prospect and 4 other teams would have rated him as a 2nd round prospect and four or more teams may have rated him as a 3rd round prospect.

 

For the Bills sake, I hope they were right about EJ and they have a QB here for the next decade.

[truth on hold]

 

Why is Mr. Prisco trying to prove himself. Let it go. In this years draft, all QBs had their strength and weakness and different teams rated them differently according to their needs/schemes etc. So what 4 GMs had him rated in the 4th round. I am sure there were 4 other GMs from the remaining 28 teams, who had rated him as a 1st round prospect and 4 other teams would have rated him as a 2nd round prospect and four or more teams may have rated him as a 3rd round prospect.

 

For the Bills sake, I hope they were right about EJ and they have a QB here for the next decade.

Yeah really. It could also be interpreted as a compliment: bills made a good assessment of the competition, and realized they could trade down, still get the QB they wanted, and pickup a valuable 2nd rounder.

[Cash]

Well 20 games over .500 in the last 20 years is not as good as 13 games over in the last 6 years.

 

But all of that is irrelevant to me anyways. As I've butted heads with Hopeful on Bills vs Jets, we're Bills fans and we hate the team that beat us in 2 Super Bowls.

 

Furthermore, the fact of the Bills suckitude doesn't give the Cowboys immunity from our criticism. I don't understand the scoreboard thing at all.

 

Are we only allowed to criticize teams that are worse than us?

 

Of course not. But that's not how this got started. The post(s) you were responding to were not out-of-nowhere exclamations of Dallas' superiority to our team. They were responses to many other posters' initial reaction to the thread, which was roughly, "The fact that Dallas had our draftees rated lower than where we drafted them is either irrelevant or good, because Dallas/Jerry Jones is terrible at drafting." In other words, Dallas' opinion can be completely discounted because they are incompetent.

 

It's completely reasonable to respond to that sentiment with a comparison of Dallas & Buffalo's recent track records of success, not to say that Dallas is perfect or immune to criticism, but just to point out the fallacy of that logic. If Jerry Jones is so incompetent that his draft board is worthless, that means that Russ Brandon/Buddy Nix's draft board must be worthless as well, because the Bills under Russ Brandon/Buddy Nix have been less successful than the Cowboys under Jerry Jones in that same timeframe.

 

Frankly, the whole "Jerrah is stupid" reaction strikes me as an overreaction borne out of insecurity. There are a lot of legitimate reasons to doubt the Bills' 2013 draft class. (Also reasons to be hopeful about them, and one can even feel both ways, like I do.) The Cowboys' board doesn't add much to my doubt about the Bills' draft, but I don't think it should be dismissed either. There's no reason why Dallas' 2013 draft board has to be better (or worse) than Buffalo's, but it's certainly interesting to see how wildly the teams differed in player evaluations. We've long heard "insider" comments that teams have very different ratings on a given player, but I don't recall ever seeing proof before.

 

The other interesting thing, which doesn't concern us a ton as Bills fans, is that with the Cowboys' board leaked the past 2 years, fans will be able to have an unprecedented ability to evaluate the Cowboys' scouting efficacy in a few years. Obviously huge allowances will have to be made for players who wouldn't have fit the Cowboys' scheme, but if they consistently have the stars of 2012/2013 rated low and busts rated high (or the reverse), that will tell us a lot more about their scouting abilities than just the success of the guys they picked.

[ny33]

Of course not. But that's not how this got started. The post(s) you were responding to were not out-of-nowhere exclamations of Dallas' superiority to our team. They were responses to many other posters' initial reaction to the thread, which was roughly, "The fact that Dallas had our draftees rated lower than where we drafted them is either irrelevant or good, because Dallas/Jerry Jones is terrible at drafting." In other words, Dallas' opinion can be completely discounted because they are incompetent.

 

It's completely reasonable to respond to that sentiment with a comparison of Dallas & Buffalo's recent track records of success, not to say that Dallas is perfect or immune to criticism, but just to point out the fallacy of that logic. If Jerry Jones is so incompetent that his draft board is worthless, that means that Russ Brandon/Buddy Nix's draft board must be worthless as well, because the Bills under Russ Brandon/Buddy Nix have been less successful than the Cowboys under Jerry Jones in that same timeframe.

 

Frankly, the whole "Jerrah is stupid" reaction strikes me as an overreaction borne out of insecurity. There are a lot of legitimate reasons to doubt the Bills' 2013 draft class. (Also reasons to be hopeful about them, and one can even feel both ways, like I do.) The Cowboys' board doesn't add much to my doubt about the Bills' draft, but I don't think it should be dismissed either. There's no reason why Dallas' 2013 draft board has to be better (or worse) than Buffalo's, but it's certainly interesting to see how wildly the teams differed in player evaluations. We've long heard "insider" comments that teams have very different ratings on a given player, but I don't recall ever seeing proof before.

 

The other interesting thing, which doesn't concern us a ton as Bills fans, is that with the Cowboys' board leaked the past 2 years, fans will be able to have an unprecedented ability to evaluate the Cowboys' scouting efficacy in a few years. Obviously huge allowances will have to be made for players who wouldn't have fit the Cowboys' scheme, but if they consistently have the stars of 2012/2013 rated low and busts rated high (or the reverse), that will tell us a lot more about their scouting abilities than just the success of the guys they picked.

 

There is, as many have pointed out, a very good chance that this "draft board" is a ploy by Jerry Jones and the Cowboys to mislead fans and other teams.

[KD in CA]

Whoa.....so you mean a team with a locked in, high dollar QB may have put a different draft value on a QB than a team with no starting QB on the roster did?? Holy crap. Now I've seen everything!

[Cash]

There is, as many have pointed out, a very good chance that this "draft board" is a ploy by Jerry Jones and the Cowboys to mislead fans and other teams.

 

I don't buy it. The Cowboys come up with a dummy board that's different from their real board, allow it to be filmed/photographed on draft day, and hope a zealous Cowboys blog analyzes the footage/photos and posts the board online? What do they gain from this? "Exposure!" Jerry Jones doesn't need ridiculously circuitous plans to get his team media coverage.

 

If this was a "leading up to the draft" special, there might be some incentive to have a dummy board photographed in the hopes that other teams might be fooled into thinking you don't like a prospect that you really do like. But what's the point of having a fake board set up in the real war room on draft day? Especially since their actual picks fit their ratings on the leaked board pretty well. So it's a fake board, except for all of the players that Dallas ended up drafting, who were slotted at their real positions? That doesn't make sense to me.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

Of course not. But that's not how this got started. The post(s) you were responding to were not out-of-nowhere exclamations of Dallas' superiority to our team. They were responses to many other posters' initial reaction to the thread, which was roughly, "The fact that Dallas had our draftees rated lower than where we drafted them is either irrelevant or good, because Dallas/Jerry Jones is terrible at drafting." In other words, Dallas' opinion can be completely discounted because they are incompetent.

 

It's completely reasonable to respond to that sentiment with a comparison of Dallas & Buffalo's recent track records of success, not to say that Dallas is perfect or immune to criticism, but just to point out the fallacy of that logic.

 

I understand what you're saying Cash but I don't fully agree. The conversation started as below (between two of our best posters btw) and my point is that there should be no reason to criticize the Cowboys operation without automatically having to invalidate that opinion by reminding everyone of how much the Bills suck.

 

Certainly it's a natural response but maybe I'm just tired of EVERY TIME we criticize another team, we end up having to be rebutted with "the Bills suck."

 

This was my complaint to Hopeful during several recent Jets threads.

 

Can't we just simply mock the Jets/Cowboys/Dolphins, etc?

 

Wouldn't be too concerned given Jerrah's track record as GM.

 

There is the old scoreboard to consider:

 

Cowboys' record from 2007-2012 -- 55-41

 

Bills' record from 2007-2012 -- 36-60

[Cash]

I understand what you're saying Cash but I don't fully agree. The conversation started as below (between two of our best posters btw) and my point is that there should be no reason to criticize the Cowboys operation without automatically having to invalidate that opinion by reminding everyone of how much the Bills suck.

 

Certainly it's a natural response but maybe I'm just tired of EVERY TIME we criticize another team, we end up having to be rebutted with "the Bills suck."

 

This was my complaint to Hopeful during several recent Jets threads.

 

Can't we just simply mock the Jets/Cowboys/Dolphins, etc?

 

I also see what you're saying, and in most other threads, I would agree. But in the specific case of comparing the Cowboys' draft board/ratings to the Bills actual picks, one can't dismiss the Cowboys' opinions as worthless (implicitly validating the Bills' differing opinions) without considering that by that same logic, the Bills' draft opinions must be considered even worse. The Bills think Kiko Alonso was a 2nd-round prospect at worst. The Cowboys think he was a 4th-round prospect. How can we dismissively say that the Bills are right and the Cowboys are wrong without looking at their respective track records? Even if we just took the Bills out of it, the Cowboys have been a moderately successful team in recent history. Hardly infallible on draft day, but not hopeless or incompetent. If this was the draft board of a perennial doormat or famously poor drafting team, I'd gladly dismiss it out of hand as well. But unfortunately, most non-Bills fans would probably classify us as a perennial doormat or famously poor drafting team, so I don't think it's fair to so that our team's opinion is automatically better than anyone else's.

 

For the record, I wasn't enthused to see that the Cowboys had such lower grades on most of our high picks (Alonso was probably the most concerning to me, but mostly because I was already skeptical of the pick), but it doesn't mean much to me. Different schemes, different needs, etc., not to mention that for all their hype, the Cowboys aren't near the top tier of the NFL. Now, if the Ravens' board got leaked with similar results, that would really worry me.

[buffaloboyinATL]

Whoa.....so you mean a team with a locked in, high dollar QB may have put a different draft value on a QB than a team with no starting QB on the roster did?? Holy crap. Now I've seen everything!

Lol. Exactly what I was thinking. This board was based on their needs. Why would they spend much time evaluating QB's when it is, according to them, not an area of need.

[disco]

Unless I missed it, I don't think anybody posted a link to the 2010 leaked draftboard. It's on the bottom of the page here. The number in parenthisis is the round, pick they were actually made.

http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2010/4/27/1446595/consolidated-cowboys-draft-board