EJ's Florida Game Lucky for Bills?

[drnykterstein]

EJ made a living off of terrible ACC defenses. He hit a brick wall when he had to play a top defense. That game was huge for FSU and he failed despite playing at home and having a ton of offensive talent. That's EJ though, he's good enough to fit in but he will never win a game by himself.

 

Do you have any other games to list as example beside the Florida game? That one game seems to be he only really bad game. Which is the point of this thread. One game does not mean "He hit a brick wall when he had to play a top defense"

[JohnC]

Considering you named Nix for the long term struggles of the franchise, the blame is higher than him. In a nutshell, how did Nix get the job he wasn't qualified for in the first place?

 

I didn't blame Nix for the franchise's long term struggles. I criticized him for his three year tenure, now entering the fourth year. The owner is now not involved with the franchise. The torch was passed to Brandon who is acting on behalf of the owner.

[Never NEVER Give-up]

Look, we need to remember this game (and others) occurred while his Mom was battling breast cancer - enough to screw with anyone's head. Here's a good story from espn:

 

http://espn.go.com/c...ollege-football

 

An excerpt:

 

On Sept. 22, in what was the highlight of his career, Florida State quarterback EJ Manuel showcased a Heisman-caliber performance in a 49-37 nationally televised win over No. 10-ranked Clemson. With over 300 yards passing and 100 yards rushing, he accomplished a stat line Florida State had seen only one other time -- in 1992, by former Heisman Trophy winner Charlie Ward.

 

On Nov. 24, before what was easily the most disastrous and emotional performance of his career, Manuel was honored on Senior Day with his mother by his side, just days after she had received another chemotherapy treatment for Stage 1 breast cancer. Manuel threw three interceptions and lost one fumble in a 37-26 loss to rival Florida, his last game in Doak Campbell Stadium.

 

The bottom line is that neither game means he'll be a star or a dud. But his head is in the right place, he has good, patient coaches and the luxury of sitting until ready behind Kolb (probably) or T.Jackson. I like his chances to be a good QB in this league.

Edited May 7, 2013 by Never NEVER Give-up

[GG]

I didn't blame Nix for the franchise's long term struggles. I criticized him for his three year tenure, now entering the fourth year. The owner is now not involved with the franchise. The torch was passed to Brandon who is acting on behalf of the owner.

 

Then isn't it a bit early to blame Nix for his performance under the Brandon era?

[ChasBB]

People seem to forget Florida was a pretty good football team last year with only one loss in the regular season. It's not like Fl. State lost to some nobody team.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

I agree with you about the play calling. Jimbo is a known control freak with his players and coaches (mass exodus). That being said, Jimbo didn't turn the ball over 4 times in the biggest game of the season at home. Jimbo didn't fail to log a single point against NCst in the second half. EJ has never been able to do it by himself. Just facts.

 

Football is a team sport. Platitude but true. No QB can do it by himself. Takes 21 other guys.

 

There are very few QB who can carry a team by themselves. Peyton Manning and who else?

[Beastly Dareus]

Stat boy ...harsh...sorry bro.

 

RG3 tooks advantage of his talent by putting unreal numbers game after game. What did EJ do? Believe me Rashard Greene, Kelvin Bejamin and Kenny Shaw will all be drafted high as WRs for FSU not to mention the ridiculous stable of backs. RG3 was unreal. EJ was good. The talent of the overall offenses severely favors FSU and it's not even close including O LIne.

 

And I would agree with you that the Big12 defenses are bad but the ACC is worse. The ACC is 1-8 against the Big 12 the last 3 years. The comp isn't close regardless of defenses. But tell me again how Va Tech's vaunted defense was good when DUke hung 40+ points on them. Sorry again for the stat boy, i get harsh sometimes.

 

Do you really want to revisit the last 4 years on this board?

 

Florida State's offensive weapons are so good that they have NOT had a WR/RB/TE drafted (in any round) since the 2007 Draft (Link to all draft picks). Right, they did have Chris Thompson get drafted in the 5th round this year (first WR/RB/TE drafted since Lorenzo Booker and Chris Davis in 2007.... both of which didn't amount to anything). You make very little sense talking about all these FSU weapons they apparently have. In addition, FSU has only had 3 offensive linemen that have been drafted in that time frame (Zebrie Sanders-5th, Andrew Datko-7th, and Rodney Hudson-2nd). Then of course Menelik Watson in the 2nd this year.

 

So NO, EJ Manuel was NOT surrounded with tons of offensive talent like you keep claiming.

 

Yet RG3 and Baylor had a pretty solid WR named Terrence Williams drafted in the 3rd round this year (many predicted him as an early 2nd). Then how about WR Kendall Wright drafted in the first round last year? And you say Florida State has lots more offensive talent? Do your research and learn CFB before making ridiculous statements.

 

In addition... Rashard Greene, Kelvin Bejamin and Kenny Shaw will all be drafted high as WRs? What are you smoking? Kenny Shaw is awful, sure he has shown some flashes, but he will not be a high draft pick. Kelvin Benjamin definitely has potential to be drafted in the 2nd-3rd round maybe the first based on his size, red zone threat, and ability to make big plays time to time. But before touting him as a "high pick" he needs to stop dropping balls and learn how to run routes. In addition he is slow of the line. Benjamin is extremely raw, he was only a freshmen last year. Rashad Greene is their best chance as a first round pick. He has good hands, speed, and body control. However, his strength is awful, he gets jammed alot at the line, and is an average route runner. I can see Benjamin and Greene as late 2nd round picks at the very highest, currently.

 

To end it, NO way is Big-12 defenses better than ACC defenses. Your hatred for EJ Manuel is ridiculous and unbelievable.

Edited May 7, 2013 by Beastly Dareus

[Maury Ballstein]

Ding ding ding...game set match.

 

Beastly D for the win!

[B Rob]

Payton Manning says it is hard to beat Florida

[billsfan89]

One thing I like about the EJ pick is how well researched it seemed. They liked the bad weather workout, the big hands, the cannon arm, the accuracy, the mobility, and his size. They seemed to know what made QB's in bad weather successful and EJ fit that mold. I don't know if EJ will be successful but I like the qualities they sought out in EJ.

[JTO]

I recently watched all FSU's offensive possessions in the infamous 2012 Florida game. Full game is here:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NCdvC9LSlg

 

It wasn't fun, but it didn't bum me out as much as I thought it would. EJ made some bad decisions, but it felt like one of those games that just didn't go well and kind of snowballed on him. Used to happen to Kelly at least once a season. Happens to almost every QB. Also, I think I read somewhere that he had hurt himself the week before, so wasn't playing at 100%.

 

On the plus side, he hung in there mentally. The team came back. EJ's late fumble that killed their chances was not actually careless IMO. He got his clock cleaned. Looked to me like he had the ball pretty securely, but when he got hit his body went limp and he just let go of it. He lay on the ground without moving for a little bit. It was a KO or something close.

 

On another board, a poster mentioned running into Bill Polian at a golf tournament on Friday. The poster said he chatted with Polian for a while about the Bills' draft, and Polian apparently said he had EJ at the top of his rankings until he watched the Florida tape. That seems like a lot of weight to give one game, especially when the guy has played well against some other good teams and in bowl games. If other NFL teams over-weighted that Florida game, and if, as I suspect, it was just one of those days and not indicative or EJ's overall ability or mental toughness, it might have been the best thing that's happened to the Bills in a long time. If EJ plays lights out in that game and they beat the number 4 team in the country, maybe he would have been wearing a KC, Oakland, Jax, or Philly jersey right now.

 

Just a thought.

 

Was wondering why they did not call a helmet to helmet hit. Aren't those hits illegal. If that call was made then perhaps FSU ends up with the ball again

[thebandit27]

Anyone who says a QB has to win games "by themselves" can be automatically discounted.

 

Indeed; along with anyone that can't wait to come back to this thread when the team he's supposedly a fan of has their hopeful franchise QB fail.

 

Recruiting rankings mean very little? Guess who's had the # 1 or 2 class nationally the 5 years. Bama.

 

Here some analysis. Man are you wrong. Don't worry though, you have company on this thread.

http://www.cbssports...otball/21641769

 

I do think there is a HUGE difference between Florida 3 stars and every other states 3 stars for sure. But come on, LSU, UF, OU, FSU and so many more are at the top of recruiting rankings and polls. It's undeniable.

 

Did you expect Jimbo to throw EJ under the bus? Actually Jimbo threw the whole team under the bus after that game.

 

Yes, recruiting rankings mean absolutely nothing. Last I checked, the BCS title is awarded to the team that wins the BCS Championship game, not the team that has the highest ranked recruiting class.

 

Now I'm convinced you're just needling folks here...no way you're serious with this stuff.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

So what I get from this thread is that EJ's receivers have a great chance to develop into excellent player but EJ doesn't.

[Wayne Cubed]

So what I get from this thread is that EJ's receivers have a great chance to develop into excellent player but EJ doesn't.

 

That's pretty much what I've gotten from this thread. Also, high school recruiting is equivalent to professional college scouting.

[Maury Ballstein]

in summary JC is an EJ hater who is a little too certain he will fail.

 

To hit on the Nix defense/offense. I gotta side with JohnC on this one, it's amazing how Nix hasn't hit on any major 2nd-7th rounders. He dropped a huge dump with the Russell Wilson/TJ Graham fail, IMO almost any shmo (except the loonies that wanted Nassib at #8) can play GM for the day and pick the 1st rounders. I see a lot of credit for that given. but even the dareus/jjwatt/ajgreen one is questionable now.

 

Nix's grade was F and is moving up to a C after this years great draft IMO. great trade down and still get pick of qb's. just gotta hope Geno doesn't crush the league and make Nix look foolish once again......guess time will shake all of this out for us.

Edited May 7, 2013 by Ryan L Billz

[Dorkington]

How can anyone honestly grade this year's draft? Shouldn't we wait until after the season?

 

I'm not convinced a single one of his picks has actually worked. Even CJ, for all his talent, isn't really living up to his draft position.

[Maury Ballstein]

i can grade the draft by saying we have at least 2 good wr's now (very positive)...............and we got our qb with an extra pick..........IMO that constitutes a good draft after ignoring WR/QB for so long.

 

Cj isn't really living up to his draft position? what are you talking about? couldn't disagree stronger with you on that one..........are you referring to the games where he has 120 yards at halftime then failin gailey stopped giving him the ball? i gotta call you out as dead wrong on this tip.....

[San Jose Bills Fan]

1 1 St. Louis Rams Sam Bradford QB Oklahoma Big 12 1 2 Detroit Lions Ndamukong Suh^†DT Nebraska Big 12 1 3 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Gerald McCoy^†DT Oklahoma Big 12 1 4 Washington Redskins Trent Williams^†OT Oklahoma Big 12 1 5 Kansas City Chiefs Eric Berry^†S Tennessee SEC 1 6 Seattle Seahawks Russell Okung^†OT Oklahoma State Big 12 1 7 Cleveland Browns Joe Haden CB Florida SEC 1 8 Oakland Raiders Rolando McClain LB Alabama SEC 1 9 Buffalo Bills C. J. Spiller^† RB Clemson ACC 1 10 Jacksonville Jaguars Tyson Alualu DT California Pac-10 1 11 San Francisco 49ers Anthony Davis OT Rutgers Big East from Chicago via Denver^{[R1 - 1]} 1 12 San Diego Chargers Ryan Mathews^†RB Fresno State WAC from Miami ^{[R1 - 2]} 1 13 Philadelphia Eagles Brandon Graham DE Michigan Big Ten from San Francisco via Denver^{[R1 - 3]} 1 14 Seattle Seahawks Earl Thomas^†S Texas Big 12 from Denver ^{[R1 - 4]} 1 15 New York Giants Jason Pierre-Paul^†DE South Florida Big East 1 16 Tennessee Titans Derrick Morgan DE Georgia Tech ACC 1 17 San Francisco 49ers Mike Iupati^†G Idaho WAC from Carolina ^{[R1 - 5]} 1 18 Pittsburgh Steelers Maurkice Pouncey^†C Florida SEC 1 19 Atlanta Falcons Sean Weatherspoon LB Missouri Big 12 1 20 Houston Texans Kareem Jackson CB Alabama SEC 1 21 Cincinnati Bengals Jermaine Gresham^†TE Oklahoma Big 12 1 22 Denver Broncos Demaryius Thomas^†WR Georgia Tech ACC from New England ^{[R1 - 6]} 1 23 Green Bay Packers Bryan Bulaga OT Iowa Big Ten 1 24 Dallas Cowboys Dez Bryant WR Oklahoma State Big 12 from Philadelphia via Denver and New England^{[R1 - 7]} 1 25 Denver Broncos Tim Tebow QB Florida SEC from Baltimore ^{[R1 - 8]} 1 26 Arizona Cardinals Dan Williams DT Tennessee SEC 1 27 New England Patriots Devin McCourty^†CB Rutgers Big East from Dallas^{[R1 - 9]} 1 28 Miami Dolphins Jared Odrick DT Penn State Big Ten from San Diego^{[R1 - 10]} 1 29 New York Jets Kyle Wilson CB Boise State WAC 1 30 Detroit Lions Jahvid Best RB California Pac-10 from Minnesota ^{[R1 - 11]} 1 31 Indianapolis Colts Jerry Hughes DE TCU MWC 1 32 New Orleans Saints Patrick Robinson

Edited May 7, 2013 by San Jose Bills Fan

[Dorkington]

i can grade the draft by saying we have at least 2 good wr's now (very positive)...............and we got our qb with an extra pick..........IMO that constitutes a good draft after ignoring WR/QB for so long.

 

Cj isn't really living up to his draft position? what are you talking about? couldn't disagree stronger with you on that one..........are you referring to the games where he has 120 yards at halftime then failin gailey stopped giving him the ball? i gotta call you out as dead wrong on this tip.....

 

But what if the QB and the WRs end up being some of the worst players ever? Hence why it's weird to grade a draft before the players actually see the field.

 

I like CJ. I think he's got some awesome talent. But he was a top RB taken when we had Lynch and FJ already. In order for him to be "worth it" he needs to be putting up HoF numbers, he needs to instill confidence in his coaching staff, and he needs to not fade away in short yardage, 4th quarter and after 20 carries. He was put into the position of needing to meet really high expectations, which isn't fair to him at all. In a vacuum, he's pretty good, but compared to where he was drafted and what we already had? He hasn't really lived up to what he's needed to, imo. Which is all on Nix.

 

Let me clarify, my judgement is on NIX, not on CJ. Nix is the one who messed up by putting CJ into an impossible position.

Edited May 7, 2013 by Dorkington

[John Cocktosten]

Florida State's offensive weapons are so good that they have NOT had a WR/RB/TE drafted (in any round) since the 2007 Draft (Link to all draft picks). Right, they did have Chris Thompson get drafted in the 5th round this year (first WR/RB/TE drafted since Lorenzo Booker and Chris Davis in 2007.... both of which didn't amount to anything). You make very little sense talking about all these FSU weapons they apparently have. In addition, FSU has only had 3 offensive linemen that have been drafted in that time frame (Zebrie Sanders-5th, Andrew Datko-7th, and Rodney Hudson-2nd). Then of course Menelik Watson in the 2nd this year.

 

So NO, EJ Manuel was NOT surrounded with tons of offensive talent like you keep claiming.

 

Yet RG3 and Baylor had a pretty solid WR named Terrence Williams drafted in the 3rd round this year (many predicted him as an early 2nd). Then how about WR Kendall Wright drafted in the first round last year? And you say Florida State has lots more offensive talent? Do your research and learn CFB before making ridiculous statements.

 

In addition... Rashard Greene, Kelvin Bejamin and Kenny Shaw will all be drafted high as WRs? What are you smoking? Kenny Shaw is awful, sure he has shown some flashes, but he will not be a high draft pick. Kelvin Benjamin definitely has potential to be drafted in the 2nd-3rd round maybe the first based on his size, red zone threat, and ability to make big plays time to time. But before touting him as a "high pick" he needs to stop dropping balls and learn how to run routes. In addition he is slow of the line. Benjamin is extremely raw, he was only a freshmen last year. Rashad Greene is their best chance as a first round pick. He has good hands, speed, and body control. However, his strength is awful, he gets jammed alot at the line, and is an average route runner. I can see Benjamin and Greene as late 2nd round picks at the very highest, currently.

 

To end it, NO way is Big-12 defenses better than ACC defenses. Your hatred for EJ Manuel is ridiculous and unbelievable.

 

You guys can keep ignoring the facts I'm sure that the sheep will say that ESPN sucks (CFB is the one thing they get right) It's hilarious to listen to the sheep mentality in this board. Trying to justify the reasons why EJ was average in college. There's always excuses with every Bills reach. Hope it makes you feel better. an't wait to bump this thread.

 

 

Ranking nation's top 10 receiving corps

 

July, 31, 2012

 

Jeff Lewis/Icon SMIThere isn't a better receiver duo in the country than USC's Robert Woods, left, and Marqise Lee, right.

 

 

 

 

7. Florida State Seminoles

Key receivers: Rashad Greene, Willie Haulstead

 

 

 

There's a lot of speed here, without question, but a lot of unrealized potential. Greene, Haulstead and Kenny Shaw, among others, have demonstrated a lot of ability. Injuries and inconsistency, however, have limited overall production.

 

 

Haulstead is a great example. The junior was forced to take a medical redshirt a year ago due to lingering effects from a concussion, and yet he is FSU's only representative on the preseason Biletnikoff watch list. At 6-3 and 233 pounds, he's a tough matchup for ACC corners -- or any league's corners, for that matter.

 

 

As a freshman, Greene led the team with 596 yards and seven touchdowns. He might turn out to be the Noles' top award candidate, depending on how he continues to mesh with QBEJ Manuel.

 

 

Even without a proven star, FSU shines with its depth. Senior Rodney Smith and sophomoreChristian Green, the second- and third-leading receivers a year ago, combined for 1,011