Jairus Byrd: Jason Peters Part II?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

The Eagles are/were a contending team?

 

Well, sportswriters thought they were at the time Peters signed there. They got Vick, yaknow?

[papazoid]

 

 

The only way to prevent things from coming to a holdout, if Parker doesn't budge, is to give in to his demands. Then what do the Bills do with the next player he represents? Parker knows the Bills will fold if we cave once.

 

Parker may be a great agent but he's a team wrecker. The big question to me is if Byrd is willing to take it as far a holdout is does he even want to be a Bill?

 

PTR

 

this is not a knock on byrd.....but he will probably let his agent do his thing. which means playing hardball.

 

in the players defense, this may be his one and only chance at a big contract. if i'm the player or agent, the biggest issue is the "guaranteed" money. most of these guys don't see the end of their 5-6 year deals.

 

I bet they are asking 5 years / $45 million with $25 million guaranteed.

 

i'd say the bills are resigned to the fact they will need to pay 5 years / $42 million.

 

 

I know this is asking for trouble, but if i'm the bills, I want Jairus playing under his 1 year only franchise tag contract. I want to see his production in Pettines defense before going long term for huge money.

[Canadian Bills Fan]

this is not a knock on byrd.....but he will probably let his agent do his thing. which means playing hardball.

 

in the players defense, this may be his one and only chance at a big contract. if i'm the player or agent, the biggest issue is the "guaranteed" money. most of these guys don't see the end of their 5-6 year deals.

 

I bet they are asking 5 years / $45 million with $25 million guaranteed.

 

i'd say the bills are resigned to the fact they will need to pay 5 years / $42 million.

 

 

I know this is asking for trouble, but if i'm the bills, I want Jairus playing under his 1 year only franchise tag contract. I want to see his production in Pettines defense before going long term for huge money.

 

That makes sense

 

CBF

[eball]

I see Sully is up to his usual tricks again...advising the Bills to cave in to Parker's demands, without having a clue as to how the discussions might be progressing.

[PromoTheRobot]

I see Sully is up to his usual tricks again...advising the Bills to cave in to Parker's demands, without having a clue as to how the discussions might be progressing.

Ha ha. Just like we should have paid Fitz, right Sully? That's a column he would like to forget.

 

Not comparing Byrd to Fitz, by the way. Just pointing out how Sully is happy to spend everyones money.

 

PTR

[Kelly the Dog]

Ha ha. Just like we should have paid Fitz, right Sully? That's a column he would like to forget.

 

Not comparing Byrd to Fitz, by the way. Just pointing out how Sully is happy to spend everyones money.

 

PTR

I thought that was a very good article. He admitted he wasn't privy to the negotiations. He stated the bar set with Goldson, and backed it up with facts and sound reasoning. And then said the Bills should pay Byrd what he deserves, which wasn't an outrageous number, just the going rate. He argued they shouldn't pay him what the top safety makes because of the circumstances surrounding that number. He didn't suggest the Bills just cave and give in to any demand that Parker or Byrd set. Sully was dead on this time.

[eball]

I thought that was a very good article. He admitted he wasn't privy to the negotiations. He stated the bar set with Goldson, and backed it up with facts and sound reasoning. And then said the Bills should pay Byrd what he deserves, which wasn't an outrageous number, just the going rate. He argued they shouldn't pay him what the top safety makes because of the circumstances surrounding that number. He didn't suggest the Bills just cave and give in to any demand that Parker or Byrd set. Sully was dead on this time.

 

I read it differently.

[Kelly the Dog]

I read it differently.

How so? He didn't at all say they should just cave to Parker's demands.

 

Byrd, IMO, "deserves" to be paid the highest contract in the league for a safety, simply based on how contracts work in the NFL.

 

1] He is very young, entering the very definition of prime years of his career.

2] He outplayed his last contract by a mile, every year.

3] He's extremely consistent producer, starting out fast and then getting a little better.

4] He's good at both the run and the pass.

5] He makes big plays and causes turnovers, both INTs and fumbles.

6] He tries hard and hits hard.

7] He's a great citizen off the field. At a position which is growing in importance around the league.

 

This is exactly the kind of guy you pay top dollar to, especially when top dollar is one of the lowest amounts compared to other positions.

[PromoTheRobot]

I thought that was a very good article. He admitted he wasn't privy to the negotiations. He stated the bar set with Goldson, and backed it up with facts and sound reasoning. And then said the Bills should pay Byrd what he deserves, which wasn't an outrageous number, just the going rate. He argued they shouldn't pay him what the top safety makes because of the circumstances surrounding that number. He didn't suggest the Bills just cave and give in to any demand that Parker or Byrd set. Sully was dead on this time.

 

But we don't know what Byrd was offered. The Bills may have put that deal on the table and Byrd/Parker said no. I'm all for keeping Byrd as long as we aren't tying our hands for the next player we have to resign.

 

PTR

Edited May 6, 2013 by PromoTheRobot

[Kelly the Dog]

But we don't know what Byrd was offered. The Bills may have put that deal on the table and Byrd/Parker said no. I'm all for keeping Byrd as long as we aren't tying our hands for the next player we have to resign.

 

PTR

But that's basically what Sully said, too. Pay him what he is worth, the going rate. Not more. The going rate is 9m. The most is 10m. He said that shouldn't count so we shouldn't pay it. Pay what Goldson made because he is every bit as good, and it's a fair point.

[eball]

How so? He didn't at all say they should just cave to Parker's demands.

 

Byrd, IMO, "deserves" to be paid the highest contract in the league for a safety, simply based on how contracts work in the NFL.

 

1] He is very young, entering the very definition of prime years of his career.

2] He outplayed his last contract by a mile, every year.

3] He's extremely consistent producer, starting out fast and then getting a little better.

4] He's good at both the run and the pass.

5] He makes big plays and causes turnovers, both INTs and fumbles.

6] He tries hard and hits hard.

7] He's a great citizen off the field. At a position which is growing in importance around the league.

 

This is exactly the kind of guy you pay top dollar to, especially when top dollar is one of the lowest amounts compared to other positions.

 

I just felt Sully was implying the Bills would undercut with their offer -- it's simply his tone. I'm not arguing with paying Byrd a salary commensurate with his production.

[uncle flap]

I mentioned this earlier in the thread: when you include signing bonuses, there are already 3 safeties making over $10 mil per year. This link lists the players sorted by base salaries, but if you click on the individual player, you'll see they are making even more money: http://www.spotrac.com/top-salaries/nfl/safety/

 

Parker likely doesn't want what is "fair," even though "fair" for Byrd would still be a huge contract; He likely wants Byrd to be THE highest paid safety.

 

The Bills, on the other hand, are probably using "analytics" and reasoning similar to this author's (making Byrd the 5th highest paid safety, commensurate with his production).

 

IMO, that won't be enough to get it done: http://www.spotrac.com/premium/research/nfl/contract-forecast-jairus-byrd-313/

[Kelly the Dog]

I mentioned this earlier in the thread: when you include signing bonuses, there are already 3 safeties making over $10 mil per year. This link lists the players sorted by base salaries, but if you click on the individual player, you'll see they are making even more money: http://www.spotrac.c...ies/nfl/safety/

 

Parker likely doesn't want what is "fair," even though "fair" for Byrd would still be a huge contract; He likely wants Byrd to be THE highest paid safety.

 

The Bills, on the other hand, are probably using "analytics" and reasoning similar to this author's (making Byrd the 5th highest paid safety, commensurate with his production).

 

IMO, that won't be enough to get it done: http://www.spotrac.c...airus-byrd-313/

You can't really count signing bonuses that way, except for the prorated amounts, unless you also want to count that guys like Troy P and Berry are making 7-8 mil.

 

I think the Bills said they really haven't started the new analytics much yet, and they probably shouldn't because Byrd would likely score extremely high on them. From analytics based PFF...

In 2011 Byrd did enough to convince us big things were in store for his future. Well, 2012 was an even bigger step forward where he put forth a season that should have earned him All-Pro honors. He finished second in our safety rankings with the highest grade of all his peers in coverage. That’s what happens when you’re targeted 21 times and manage to pick off five balls and not allow a single touchdown.

[uncle flap]

You can't really count signing bonuses that way, except for the prorated amounts, unless you also want to count that guys like Troy P and Berry are making 7-8 mil.

 

I think the Bills said they really haven't started the new analytics much yet, and they probably shouldn't because Byrd would likely score extremely high on them. From analytics based PFF...

 

I know what you mean re: signing bonuses, but they generally are prorated for cap purposes (at least for big time multi-year deals). And I was counting those guys, lol, only because I imagine Parker is to some extent.

 

That's also why I think whatever the base salary and total contract value winds up being, the guaranteed amount is going to make up a bigger chunk than the 44% that guy from Spotrac forecasts.

 

And I know Brandon said the analytics department has yet to be developed, but I imagine in their quest to determine a "fair" price, they are looking at the same things the author cites: weighing production and age vs market value.

 

I just don't think Parker sees it that way and is looking strictly at dollar signs.

[Kelly the Dog]

I know what you mean re: signing bonuses, but they generally are prorated for cap purposes (at least for big time multi-year deals). And I was counting those guys, lol, only because I imagine Parker is to some extent.

 

That's also why I think whatever the base salary and total contract value winds up being, the guaranteed amount is going to make up a bigger chunk than the 44% that guy from Spotrac forecasts.

 

And I know Brandon said the analytics department has yet to be developed, but I imagine in their quest to determine a "fair" price, they are looking at the same things the author cites: weighing production and age vs market value.

 

I just don't think Parker sees it that way and is looking strictly at dollar signs.

Sure. Agree with most all of that. People, IMO, have a completely distorted viewpoint of Parker though. He and his firm have about 50 clients at least. A lot of them are marginal players, or mid level players. Alex Carrington is one of his for instance. He doesn't try to break the bank for every player or holdout every player. For his absolute stars he plays hardball for top dollar. That's what makes him one of the best.

 

There is no real reason to believe he is going to sit Byrd out a year or ask for an exorbitant amount. He MAY but it's unlikely. He's most likely to ask for pretty much what Byrd deserves on the open market, which as I described above, because of his situation, one of the highest paid in the league. He probably should be the highest paid whether he is the best right now or not.

 

Parker didn't ask for an exorbitant amount for Jason Peters either. He asked for the going rate, and the third highest contract for LT IIRC, which was 10m. That was his going rate as evidenced by the fact Philly was willing to pay it. In fact, Philly was willing to pay WAY more than it, because they parted with a #1 and a #4 and a future #6 AND 10m a year for him.

Edited May 6, 2013 by Kelly the Dog

[uncle flap]

Sure. Agree with most all of that. People, IMO, have a completely distorted viewpoint of Parker though. He and his firm have about 50 clients at least. A lot of them are marginal players, or mid level players. Alex Carrington is one of his for instance. He doesn't try to break the bank for every player or holdout every player. For his absolute stars he plays hardball for top dollar. That's what makes him one of the best.

 

There is no real reason to believe he is going to sit Byrd out a year or ask for an exorbitant amount. He MAY but it's unlikely. He's most likely to ask for pretty much what Byrd deserves on the open market, which as I described above, because of his situation, one of the highest paid in the league. He probably should be the highest paid whether he is the best right now or not.

 

Parker didn't ask for an exorbitant amount for Jason Peters either. He asked for the going rate, and the third highest contract for LT IIRC, which was 10m. That was his going rate as evidenced by the fact Philly was willing to pay it. In fact, Philly was willing to pay WAY more than it, because they parted with a #1 and a #4 and a future #6 AND 10m a year for him.

 

I don't disagree with any of your points. I've done some digging on Parker too, and found that for his top tier clients, he does seek record-setting contracts.

 

I think the Bills are willing to make Byrd one of, if not the, highest paid safeties. But by how much?

 

With a new coaching staff and Byrd's prominent role, it pains me to think he won't be around for OTAs and perhaps even training camp, for the sake of a small percentage of what will one way or the other be an enormous contract.

 

I pin the Peters scenario more on Peters than Parker. I think Peters was the greedy/gulilty party, and Parker did his job to the best of his ability.

 

I wonder if there is too much posturing going on in these negotiations. Either the Bills knew they were going to have to pay, and offered a generous contract which led Parker to believe he has the Bills over a barrel. Or... the Bills knew that they're going to have to pay, and that Parker was going to fight tooth and nail, so they low balled him and figure paying market value will seem like a win to Parker, since he had to battle for it.

 

One thing's for sure, I've spent too much time worrying about this in April and May... when I should be spending my time fantasizing about EJ leading the Bills to multiple SBs!

[pimp 2]

Byrd was really good his first year, followed by a mediocre second and better his third year. He is far from irreplaceable. Would love to have him, but if he doesn't want to be here, then see 'ya. And how did that whole Jason Peters thing work out for Philly?

 

Why is it assumed that Byrd doesn't want to be here? These guys will play where the money is...

 

BTW, your reference to Peters holdout & subsequent contract with the Eagles actually supports Byrd's and his agents bone of contention...get the money while you can because the next play can be their last. The Bills have to decide if they're "serious" about building a competitive team. They have cap space plus the amnesty clause for previous cap room...give the guy a legit offer and move on. Bills fan have waited long enough, "Pay the man..."

[PromoTheRobot]

Parker didn't ask for an exorbitant amount for Jason Peters either. He asked for the going rate, and the third highest contract for LT IIRC, which was 10m. That was his going rate as evidenced by the fact Philly was willing to pay it. In fact, Philly was willing to pay WAY more than it, because they parted with a #1 and a #4 and a future #6 AND 10m a year for him.

 

IIRC Parker wanted $11M/yr for Peters which would have been a record amount for LT.

 

PTR

[3rdand12]

I just know i really wish we keep him for our run. He has enough years left to shine and deserves that opportunity. This year will be the test. new regime and all.

Sign the franchise tag. play ball and see what the team puts on the field. if Bills take another step backwards or seem confused hell walk away Mr Byrd. But give it one more season. Love to have you centerfielding

Edited May 7, 2013 by 3rdand12

[CardinalScotts]

They franchised him- he is paid at or near the top for his positiion. Byrd wants to break the bank and he's at a position where that isn't going to happen - nothing to do with the Bills but all having to do with the position he plays. That being said I love him playing for us and I sure want to lock him up