RuntheDamnBall Posted May 1, 2013 Posted May 1, 2013 Let's see... The Bills have converted both Ron Brooks and Aaron Williams to safety When did this happen? (I'm honestly pleading ignorance here, completely missed this news. For me that makes CB look A LOT weaker). + 1 I like BYrd also, but does the 28th, 30th, 26th ranked D in the league really need the highest paid S in the league? Doesn't logic suggest that if you want to get better, you keep your best players and add to them? At least that's what I've always thought. It's not like the 1986 Bills decided, "hey, we sucked with (insert HOFer here), does this team really need him?" I think it's pretty obvious he doesn't want to stay here. I doubt Nix is lowballing him. Byrd wants to play for a real NFL team. Because May is the same as August, and using your available leverage is the same as hating your current team and not wanting to play for them?
Dawgg Posted May 1, 2013 Author Posted May 1, 2013 When did this happen? (I'm honestly pleading ignorance here, completely missed this news. For me that makes CB look A LOT weaker). Saw it on the depth chart on bb.com, for whatever it's worth. Doesn't logic suggest that if you want to get better, you keep your best players and add to them? At least that's what I've always thought. It's not like the 1986 Bills decided, "hey, we sucked with (insert HOFer here), does this team really need him?" Agreed. Byrd is worth paying top dollar to, as he's among the top players at his position. The Bills have tended to skimp on those in the upper echelon of their respective positions while overpaying for those who are mediocre at their position. Good teams like the 49ers pay top dollar for their studs, and use the draft as a pipeline for the rest. Because May is the same as August, and using your available leverage is the same as hating your current team and not wanting to play for them? Putting all the pieces together, it does raise some eyebrows. The Bills drafted as though they know Byrd isn't coming back. I think the Bills would resign Byrd and pay him top dollar. They franchised him with that in mind. Based on the draft (2 safeties) it seems to me that Eugene Parker and his client want out of Buffalo and are willing to play hardball to make it happen. As always, this could be wrong, but it doesn't sound like a "we plan to work together to hammer out a contract" type of situation.
Dawgg Posted May 1, 2013 Author Posted May 1, 2013 He didn't show up and turned it to a lardass. Once you pull a stunt like that you aren't worth a nickel, IMO. I danced a jig when we shipped him out. Efff Peters. PTR Fair enough, but he was the most talented lineman on a team. It's hard to expect an upper echelon player to fight hard for an organization when: 1) The guy he's playing next to (Dockery) sucks and signed the richest contract in Buffalo sports history (fact). 2) The tackle playing opposite him (Langston Walker) sucks and is making significantly more. If the Bills didn't want to pay Peters, they should have built the offensive line through the draft. They didn't and it's hard to blame Peters for reacting accordingly.
uncle flap Posted May 1, 2013 Posted May 1, 2013 The Bills drafted as though they know Byrd isn't coming back. I disagree. They were already woefully thin at safety Byrd or no Byrd. They easily could've drafted that way with Byrd under contract considering: 1. If Byrd got hurt, they've got nobody. 2. Pettine likes to play with 3 safeties, and safeties that can both stack the box and play center field.
BuffaloBob Posted May 1, 2013 Posted May 1, 2013 He didn't show up and turned it to a lardass. Once you pull a stunt like that you aren't worth a nickel, IMO. I danced a jig when we shipped him out. Efff Peters. PTR ^^^^^^^^this^^^^^^^^^^^
EasternOHBillsFan Posted May 1, 2013 Posted May 1, 2013 What an incredibly stupid thing to say... So of all of those players STILL PLAYING in the league and aren't 40 years old or older, the record is dismal... that's like trying to compare the record of the Bills in 1993 to that of now. FAIL.
Dorkington Posted May 1, 2013 Posted May 1, 2013 Because May is the same as August, and using your available leverage is the same as hating your current team and not wanting to play for them? I'm a bit pessimistic about a player staying on a team if they have to franchise him. But I'm not sure how those situations actually turn out, statistically speaking. Does anyone know the odds of a player staying after getting franchised?
Kelly the Dog Posted May 1, 2013 Posted May 1, 2013 So of all of those players STILL PLAYING in the league and aren't 40 years old or older, the record is dismal... that's like trying to compare the record of the Bills in 1993 to that of now. FAIL. That's not his entire or current client list. That's a list of his famous clients, with the vast majority of them playing for most of their career with the same team and not getting worse or being out of the league. He's one of the top agents in the business. He also represents Alex Carrington and about 50 players in the nfl. He's tough. He will hold a player out, which I don't like at all (although I highly doubt he will do it here, he has no leverage). He had a client Michael Crabtree hold out half a season. He had Suh hold out a few days. But that's why the top players go to him, he gets them top dollar.
BillsVet Posted May 1, 2013 Posted May 1, 2013 (edited) Since 2009 only two position players have represented Buffalo on AP's 1st or 2nd Team All-Pro list: Jairus Byrd and Kyle Williams. Byrd was 2nd team in 2009 and 2012. Williams was a 2nd teamer in 2010. The only other non-special teamers since 2006 to be named All-Pro were Jason Peters (2007. 2008) and Aaron Schobel (2006). Schobel signed the largest deal in Bills history just before the 2007 began. Kyle Williams would sign a 6 year 39M contract extension in August 2011. Peters was dealt, in essence, for Eric Wood and we're waiting to see what happens with Byrd. Either way, Parker seems to have Russ' number and will probably get his client paid one way or another. Edited May 1, 2013 by BillsVet
Snorom Posted May 1, 2013 Posted May 1, 2013 The Bills wil easily pay Byrd a 5 year 50 mil deal, with 25 guarenteed the issue is does Parker and Byrd want more, and if they do.. then trade him. Got no choice. You have to cut off at some point, and that deal would make him a top paid S. if he has to be the top paid then &*&%$ him, Fair enough, but he was the most talented lineman on a team. It's hard to expect an upper echelon player to fight hard for an organization when: 1) The guy he's playing next to (Dockery) sucks and signed the richest contract in Buffalo sports history (fact). 2) The tackle playing opposite him (Langston Walker) sucks and is making significantly more. If the Bills didn't want to pay Peters, they should have built the offensive line through the draft. They didn't and it's hard to blame Peters for reacting accordingly. the FACT is the Bills put a $9 mil a year deal on the table and Peters stil walked away. The fact is the Bills gave Peters an extension once before and he accpeted that. I look back on the Petes deal and I fully support the Bills FO on that deal. Screw Parker and Screw Peters If Byrd does the same thng then I will support the FO over Byrd. Eugene Parker is the problem... and there is plenty of history to back that up. Byrd needs ot decide what he wants. A very solid contract that will set him up for life and he can be apart of a Bills team or he can be traded. I never support players who have to have a few million here or there when were already talking $20/$30 milion guarenteed... You either WANT ot be here or you do not, and if you have to be over paid to saty then leave.
PromoTheRobot Posted May 1, 2013 Posted May 1, 2013 (edited) Fair enough, but he was the most talented lineman on a team. It's hard to expect an upper echelon player to fight hard for an organization when: 1) The guy he's playing next to (Dockery) sucks and signed the richest contract in Buffalo sports history (fact). 2) The tackle playing opposite him (Langston Walker) sucks and is making significantly more. If the Bills didn't want to pay Peters, they should have built the offensive line through the draft. They didn't and it's hard to blame Peters for reacting accordingly. Don't care. Ask for more money but show up and do your job in the meantime. If you are willing to hurt the team I don't want you. PTR Edited May 1, 2013 by PromoTheRobot
RuntheDamnBall Posted May 1, 2013 Posted May 1, 2013 Signed, Wes Welker And we'll see how that works for them, no?
DefenseWins Posted May 1, 2013 Posted May 1, 2013 Difference is Bryd didn't recently have a pay raise like Peters did. Hopefully, Bryd won't sulk like a fat baby like Peters did and not answer phone calls or show up to work out of shape, putting teammates' health in jeopardy. But based on how Bryd carries himself, this shouldn't be a problem. And he should be the highest paid safety in football. Get it done. Peters was UNDERPAID... If you go back and check, Peters was signed to play RT and then got shifted to the LT position. On top of that the Bills you might recall brought in a pair of stupidly expensive players. (LG-Derrick Dockery at 7.5 Million/yr and RT-Langston Walker at 5 Million/yr) If it were you, how would you have liked playing next to a stiff like Dockery who was actually being paid more than you?? Hopefully, the Bills don't screw this negotiation up like they did the Peters situation...
Dawgg Posted May 2, 2013 Author Posted May 2, 2013 Peters was UNDERPAID... If you go back and check, Peters was signed to play RT and then got shifted to the LT position. On top of that the Bills you might recall brought in a pair of stupidly expensive players. (LG-Derrick Dockery at 7.5 Million/yr and RT-Langston Walker at 5 Million/yr) If it were you, how would you have liked playing next to a stiff like Dockery who was actually being paid more than you?? +1 Something few on this board would understand.
GG Posted May 2, 2013 Posted May 2, 2013 +1 Something few on this board would understand. And the ones who would understand it, also would know how to handle the situation properly. Same with Byrd. He has watched the front office sign Kyle Williams and Chris Kelsay to 2 extensions. He has watched them hand McKelvin $5M a year when he has yet to prove that he is a starting caliber CB. He watched the Bills give $100M to Mario Williams whose effort was openly questioned by his teammates. The Bills put themselves in this position and in order to keep him, they need to pay up. My hunch is that Byrd and his agent want a market value contract from another team. The Bills got the message and drafted accordingly. Difference being is that Kelsay & Williams agreed to extend with the Bills before their contracts ran out and not test the market. Similar to McKelvin, he signed before FA started. It's very likely that Bills approached Byrd & Parker to extend. They didn't agree. So you can't use the examples of the guys who extended, because they decided not to use free market leverage against the team. Can't have it both ways.
BillsBackersChicago Posted May 2, 2013 Posted May 2, 2013 Byrd basically saved/won 2 games for us last season. This is such a crock, I'm so tired of people saying that a clutch play at the end of the game "won/saved" a game for us. A game is 60 minutes and every play (other than a kneel) makes a difference. Just cause you made a clutch play at the end does not mean you were the reason the game was won or saved. If you made that play or not missde the same play earlier in the game, maybe the end of the game wouldn't have been close at the end. BBC out. (yup, I said it).
Dawgg Posted May 2, 2013 Author Posted May 2, 2013 And the ones who would understand it, also would know how to handle the situation properly. This is where we disagree. Peters handled it properly. It was the Bills, by signing inferior talents at a bloated price, that created the tenuous situation. If they had intended all along to move Jason Peters, that's fair and good. But if they expected Peters to sit tight and do nothing while 2 stiffs playing alongside him were rewarded with monster contracts, it was a rather foolish expectation. Difference being is that Kelsay & Williams agreed to extend with the Bills before their contracts ran out and not test the market. Williams' contract with the Texans had expired. With regards to Kelsay (and McKelvin for that matter), you have to factor in the value of the contracts the Bills doled out. McKelvin was never going to fetch $5M per year in the open market and his agent Hadley Englehart was right to pounce on the opportunity and forgo free agency. Likewise, Kelsay was never going to receive as lucrative a contract in free agency and his agent was correct in asking Overdorf "where/when do I sign?" Bottom line: when presented with a deal you are unlikely to receive in free agency, you sign. Byrd faces no such conundrum. He can have his cake and eat it too. It's very likely that Bills approached Byrd & Parker to extend. They didn't agree. I agree with this wholeheartedly. The Bills likely approached Byrd and Parker, but I have doubts that the discussions were substantive in nature, not because of the numbers themselves, but because Byrd and Parker had no intentions to negotiate, leaving the Bills with little choice but to utilize the franchise designation and draft accordingly.
12Kachy Posted May 2, 2013 Posted May 2, 2013 Didn't another coach like to stock pile DBs? Oh yeah, the Jaruan Guy. Really, I think they sign him after they sign all the draft picks. He is not making a big stink like Peters and Byrd is actually good. Peters really hasn't done much with the Eagles. He tears a tendon every year. I read somewhere, one of the S will move to CB (I can't remember, but I'm guessing Meeks). Brooks was just terrible last year no matter where they put him, so I guess he doesn't make the final cuts and they dumped McGee so these guys will rotate in at S and CB.
8-8 Forever? Posted May 2, 2013 Posted May 2, 2013 Let's see... The Bills have converted both Ron Brooks and Aaron Williams to safety. The team drafted two safeties in this year's draft. Byrd's agent is Eugene Parker who also represents Jason Peters. This is the same agent who advised his client to hold out and ultimately engineered his exit to a contending team. Reports suggest that there has been little to no dialogue between the two sides. Both Byrd and his agent have been radio silent. Byrd's last tweet was March 1st, which happens to be the date he was franchised. My uneducated guess (hope I'm wrong): Byrd's preference is to play/sign elsewhere and Eugene Parker is hellbent on making that happen. The Bills are making other plans. Agreed. Byrd did his 4-5 year forced service with the crap franchise and now wants a big contract with a real NFL team, the Bills are in full restart mode and who wants to play on a totally rebuilding team during the prime of his career. In Buffalo. Um,,, no one. See: Andy Levitre. One thing working against him is the fact that this was a huge draft for safeties and many teams who were probably interested in Byrd are no longer interested after having drafted safeties this year.
Dawgg Posted May 2, 2013 Author Posted May 2, 2013 Agreed. Byrd did his 4-5 year forced service with the crap franchise and now wants a big contract with a real NFL team, the Bills are in full restart mode and who wants to play on a totally rebuilding team during the prime of his career. In Buffalo. Um,,, no one. See: Andy Levitre. One thing working against him is the fact that this was a huge draft for safeties and many teams who were probably interested in Byrd are no longer interested after having drafted safeties this year. Exactly, although I'm pretty sure Levitre would have been happy to stay if the Bills offered him the same money. Byrd, on the other hand, would prefer to play elsewhere. My (wild) guess: he's resigned to playing in Buffalo for one more year. He and his agent are holding out to force the Bills to promise not to franchise him the following year (Clements did this in his last year). Hopefully the Bills don't cave.
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