Syria

[Nanker]

Are you sure it wasn't to check naked Chinese aggression?

No. The nekkid Chinese have since morphed into Psy, who is turning the country into babbling babies.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mP1DPTY4Y7o

[dayman]

Just watched that heart eat video. !@#$ing freak show over there right now.

[truth on hold]

Turkish Spring anyone?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqIJnMN7tB4

Edited June 1, 2013 by Joe_the_6_pack

[IDBillzFan]

Turkish Spring anyone?

 

Irish Spring anyone?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjSNrg7T0Wo

[truth on hold]

Just watched that heart eat video. !@#$ing freak show over there right now.

Another real doozy we're aligned with ....

 

A prominent Sunni Muslim cleric influential in the Syrian uprising has issued a fatwa, or religious decree, calling on Muslims around the world to help Syrian rebels in the embattled town of Qusayr and labeling Hezbollah and Iran, which support the Syrian government, enemies of Islam “more infidel than Jews and Christians.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/02/world/middleeast/syria-developments.html?hp&_r=0

[dayman]

Another real doozy we're aligned with ....

 

A prominent Sunni Muslim cleric influential in the Syrian uprising has issued a fatwa, or religious decree, calling on Muslims around the world to help Syrian rebels in the embattled town of Qusayr and labeling Hezbollah and Iran, which support the Syrian government, enemies of Islam "more infidel than Jews and Christians."

http://www.nytimes.c...ts.html?hp&_r=0

 

Actually quite the silver lining if we stay out of the dispute and let radicals freak on each other.

[B-Man]

 

Middle East genocide...........We do nothing as Muslims eradicate the last vestiges of Christians and Jews from nation after nation

• By RALPH PETERS
  

 

We are witnesses to murder, and our governments are accomplices.

 

Captives of political correctness, our governments cater to radical immigrant tantrums as our leaders contort the truth to deny the existence of Islamist terrorism. Meanwhile, our Middle Eastern “allies” and foes alike eradicate thousands of years of Jewish and Christian heritage. Our diplomats treat the persecution as a minor embarrassment, best ignored.

 

he banishments and butchery aren’t new, but the breakdown of the last rotting order in the wake of the “Arab Spring” has empowered psychotic fanatics who do not even value the lives of the faithful, let alone the lives of unbelievers. This is the end-game, the final persecution of Christians clinging to lands they’ve called home for 2,000 years. Except for Israel and the rarest exceptions elsewhere, Jews are already gone from the realms that nurtured them since the early years of their faith.

 

A thousand years ago, there were more Christians in the Middle East than in Europe, and Jewish communities prospered from the Nile to the Tigris. Even a century ago, more than 20% of the region’s population was Christian, and Jews still adorned Arab cities with their talents.

 

Today, estimates put the Christian population of the region at under 5% and sinking rapidly — and only that high because of the 9 million Copts who remain, for now, in Egypt.

[DC Tom]

 

Ralph Peters is one of my more favorite authors, and he does make one think...but quite honestly, he's a little nuts.

[dayman]

Is Ralph Peters implying that it is our governments responsibility, or that that the majority of Americans think it is, to preserve Christian and Jewish culture on the opposite side of the world?

[DC Tom]

Is Ralph Peters implying that it is our governments responsibility, or that that the majority of Americans think it is, to preserve Christian and Jewish culture on the opposite side of the world?

 

Yep. Not the first time, either...like I said, a little nuts.

 

But just a little. Given that the reality of the situations he describes are that they're "ethnic cleansing," the western world not even recognizing such events are happening is more than a little silly.

[dayman]

Yep. Not the first time, either...like I said, a little nuts.

 

But just a little. Given that the reality of the situations he describes are that they're "ethnic cleansing," the western world not even recognizing such events are happening is more than a little silly.

 

Just seems like some sort of emotional appeal designed to get readers to want to take action about something that, whatever you think about it, we shouldn't take action on...

[DC Tom]

Just seems like some sort of emotional appeal designed to get readers to want to take action about something that, whatever you think about it, we shouldn't take action on...

 

Yeah, pretty much. His non-fiction writing's like that. Makes some good points that make you think, IF you can get by the rhetorical devices. There's a reason he's published in the NY Post.

[B-Man]

 

Christianity is Hard: Assad, vs Hamas, vs Hezbollah vs Al Qaeda edition

 

The Syrian Civil war is becoming very hard for me lately.

 

The very first instinct I had when the revolt began against Assad was: Good! The Syrian people like all others deserve representative government and not dictatorship, plus Assad is allied with Iran and a foe of Israel his departure is a good thing.

 

Syria being a Russian Client state the direct involvement of the US was not practical even if we were willing.

 

Then as time when on and things got interesting.

 

Al Qaeda and Islamist groups became involved in the fighting and instead of a civil war to free Syria from an oppressor it became a war to replace one murderous dictator whose primary ambition is his own power with a groups of people whose primary ambition is to spread Radical Islam.

 

To me this clinched the situation John McCain not withstanding we certainly didn’t want to get involved in aiding another group that might use our weapons against us or reward us the same way Libya did in Benghazi.

 

Then came Hezbollah’s involvement and I was torn. The fact Hezbollah was joining in meant they had to divert strength from Lebanon and also meant two of the more nasty Islamist groups were now fighting each other, but it also meant that there would not be a victor meaning the war would continue

 

Then came this:

Lebanese Shi’ite group Hezbollah has ordered Palestinian Islamist group Hamas out of Lebanon effective immediately, the Middle East Online news agency reported on Thursday.

The move, the report says, is due to Hamas support for the opposition forces fighting to oust Syrian President Bashar Assad. Both Hezbollah and Syria are allies of Iran, which provides the two with financial and military support.

 

This sets up the possibility that the greatest threats to Israel and the US will be clashing in Syria & Lebanon, in a long and bitter struggle and moreover as Iran doesn’t want to lose their clients and the Saudis and others want to bleed Iran this has the potential to become a mass killing ground for the most vile and despicable enemies the western world has faced.

 

And all of it happening without us, or Israel lifting a finger.

 

For a foe of radical Islam it’s practically a wet dream, we just have to sit back and let them slaughter each other and if one side starts to lose, we aid third parties to reenforce them enough to keep the fight going until the cream of the jihadist crop finds themselves, shot, gassed or blown up.

 

And at this point where you contemplate the solution to so many problems that pesky Christian belief comes in. The message that all men are children of God, that all lives are of value, that the suffering of the people who simply want to live their lives no matter who is in charge can’t be allowed to continue and that since none of these people are attacking you at this time the self-defense and just war argument don’t apply

 

That’s when you look at your glee at the death of your enemies and feel ashamed.

 

My human instinct, my gut instinct is to let these guys slaughter each other till there isn’t a single one left.

 

I’m no saint and I have plenty of personal sins that I need help (and your prayers) to overcome but the better angels of my nature, informed by Christian belief says we have to work diplomatically to achieve a cease-fire, to feed and shelter those who are being displaced and if we can’t get a cease-fire to put all possible pressure to deprive both sides of arms, weapons and supplies so the slaughter can cease.

 

I submit and suggest that anyone who claims the least bit of Christianity is ethnically compelled to support the same.

 

http://datechguyblog.com/2013/05/31/christianity-is-hard-assad-vs-hamas-vs-hezbollah-vs-al-qaeda-edition/

[Rob's House]

I haven't been following any of this because up until about a week or so ago I had my hands full, but from a very cursory overview it seems to me that all the to do is because two groups, both of whom hate us, are having a feud. I'm sure there's more to it, but can anyone briefly fill me in on what I'm missing and why I should care?

[truth on hold]

What a hysterical crap article. Jews emigrated out of middle east countries to move to Israel ... a mostly western agenda. And he tosses this 20% to 5% christian figure around wanting people assume its because of some pogrom giving no account of the higher organic growth rates of the comparatively larger Muslim population which would reduce the percent of Christians. You'd have to look at absolute numbers, and then examine the change factors in detail before jumping to any conclusions.

[dayman]

I haven't been following any of this because up until about a week or so ago I had my hands full, but from a very cursory overview it seems to me that all the to do is because two groups, both of whom hate us, are having a feud. I'm sure there's more to it, but can anyone briefly fill me in on what I'm missing and why I should care?

 

Obviously there are probably good people in Syria we could help if we put an end to the open warfare...and I'm sure some rebels aren't monsters and would hope to win and have a solid non-radical Syria...but for the most part (especially in terms of what would likely happen in reality)...I would agree with you. And to top it off...it's some countries civil war...this isn't even an international war (officially)...it is only b/c it some refugees are fleeing and terrorist going on and then alliances and strategy...the alliance/strategy/involvement crap...not worth it in this case. Monitor for insane weapons being sold/supplied and other than that keep out.

[Rob's House]

Obviously there are probably good people in Syria we could help if we put an end to the open warfare...and I'm sure some rebels aren't monsters and would hope to win and have a solid non-radical Syria...but for the most part (especially in terms of what would likely happen in reality)...I would agree with you. And to top it off...it's some countries civil war...this isn't even an international war (officially)...it is only b/c it some refugees are fleeing and terrorist going on and then alliances and strategy...the alliance/strategy/involvement crap...not worth it in this case. Monitor for insane weapons being sold/supplied and other than that keep out.

I wasn't trying to imply that everyone in Syria is a **** bag - I've known Syrians I thought quite highly of. I was thinking more along the lines of what you said - A civil war between two factions, both of whom (for the most part) don't like us. I don't really see why we should be involved.

[dayman]

I wasn't trying to imply that everyone in Syria is a **** bag - I've known Syrians I thought quite highly of. I was thinking more along the lines of what you said - A civil war between two factions, both of whom (for the most part) don't like us. I don't really see why we should be involved.

 

I could insert some long post here...detail the complexities of the region and our complicated and delicate involvement...the effects this could have on our allies if it goes a certain way...and then appeal to fear about possible weapons and emotion for cultural and religious point...or I could just say "you are right."

Edited June 2, 2013 by SameOldBills

[Rob's House]

I could insert some long post here...detail the complexities of the region and our complicated and delicate involvement...the effects this could have on our allies if it goes a certain way...and then appeal to fear about possible weapons and emotion for cultural and religious point...or I could just say "you are right."

I like that answer

[B-Man]

Message from the Ruins of Qusair .........Obama dithers while Russia, Iran, and Hezbollah bolster Assad.

 

By Charles Krauthammer

 

On Wednesday, Qusair fell to the Bashar Assad regime in Syria. Qusair is a strategic town that connects Damascus with Assad’s Alawite heartland on the Mediterranean, with its ports and Russian naval base. It’s a major strategic shift. Assad’s forces can now advance on rebel-dominated areas in central and northern Syria, including Aleppo.

 

For the rebels, it’s a devastating loss of territory, morale, and their supply corridor to Lebanon. No one knows if this reversal of fortune will be the last, but everyone knows that Assad now has the upper hand.

 

What altered the tide of battle was brazen outside intervention. A hardened, well-trained, well-armed Hezbollah force — from the terrorist Shiite group that dominates Lebanon and answers to Iran — crossed into Syria and drove the rebels out of Qusair, which Syrian artillery has left a smoking ruin.

 

This is a huge victory not just for Tehran but also for Moscow, which sustains Assad in power and prizes its warm-water port at Tartus, Russia’s only military base outside of the former Soviet Union. Vladimir Putin has stationed a dozen or more Russian warships offshore, further protecting his strategic outpost and his Syrian client.

 

The losers? NATO member Turkey, the major supporter of the rebels; Jordan, America’s closest Arab ally, now drowning in half a million Syrian refugees; and America’s Gulf allies, principal weapons suppliers to the rebels.

 

And the U.S., whose bystander president — having declared that Assad must go, that he has lost all legitimacy, and that his fall is just a matter of time — is looking not just feckless but clueless.

President Obama doesn’t want U.S. boots on the ground. Fine. No one does. But between nothing and invasion lie many intermediate measures: arming the rebels, helping Turkey maintain a safe zone in northern Syria, grounding Assad’s murderous air force by attacking airfields — all the way up to enforcing a no-fly zone by destroying the regime’s air-defense system.

 

Obama could have chosen any rung on the ladder. He chose none. Weeks ago, as battle fortunes began changing, the administration leaked that it was contemplating possibly, well maybe, arming the rebels. Then nothing. Obama simply does not understand that if America is completely hands-off, it invites hostile outside intervention. A superpower’s role in a regional conflict is deterrence.

 

In 1958, President Eisenhower — venerated by today’s fashionable “realists” for his strategic restraint — landed Marines in Lebanon to protect the pro-American government from threats from Syria and Egypt.

 

In the 1973 Yom Kippur War, Russia threatened to send troops on behalf of the Egyptian army. President Nixon threatened a U.S. counteraction, reinforced the Sixth Fleet, and raised the U.S. worldwide military alert level to DEFCON 3. Russia stood down.

 

That’s how the region works. Power deterring power. Obama deals instead in empty abstractions — such as “international legitimacy” — and useless conclaves, such as “Friends of Syria” conferences.

 

Assad, in contrast, has a real friend. Putin knows Obama. Having watched Obama’s retreat in Eastern Europe, his passivity at Russian obstructionism on Iran, his abject bended-knee “reset” policy, Putin knows he has nothing to fear from the American president.

 

Result? The contemptuous Putin floods Syria with weapons. Iran, equally disdainful, sends Revolutionary Guards to advise and shore up Assad’s forces. Hezbollah invades Syria and seizes Qusair.

 

Obama’s response? No warning that such balance-altering provocations would trigger even the most minimal American response.

Even Obama’s chemical-weapons red line is a farce. Its very pronouncement advertised passivity, signaling that anything short of WMD — say, massacring 80,000 innocents using conventional weapons — would draw no U.S. response.

 

And when that WMD red line was finally crossed, Obama went into lawyerly overdrive to erase it. Is it any wonder that Assad’s allies are on full offensive — Hezbollah brazenly joining the ground war, Russia sending a small armada and mountains of military materiel, Iran warning everyone to stay out.

 

Obama’s response is to send the secretary of state, hat in hand, to Moscow. And John Kerry returns actually thinking he’s achieved some great diplomatic breakthrough — a “peace” conference that Russia will dominate and use to re-legitimize Assad and marginalize the rebels.

 

Just to make sure Kerry understood his place, Putin kept him waiting outside his office for three hours. The Russians know how to send messages. And the one from Qusair is this: If you’re fighting for your life and have your choice of allies — Obama bearing “international legitimacy” or Putin bearing Russian naval protection, Iranian arms shipments, and thousands of Hezbollah fighters — which would you choose?

Edited June 7, 2013 by B-Man