Damond Talbot's Buffalo Bills Mock Draft 2.0

[BillsFan17]

Ummmm... that is what is commonly referred to as accuracy and/or ball placement. Nothing to do with arm strength. Pretty much everyone agrees he's very accurate on those throws. His problem is his velocity on those throws, and the clips you referred to showed a noticeable lack of velocity. They will work in college but not in the pros.

 

If Barkley had the arm of any of the other top ten QB prospects he'd be the consensus #1 overall and he is not even close to that. He may not even go in the first round, although I predict he will.

Although, I agree, if Barkley has the howitzer of an arm, the Chiefs never trade for Smith, and take Barkley first overall. However, in the same regard to project what will work in the NFL and what wont is not being fair.

 

A lot of people have gone against what was projected of them. We obviously have Wilson being the most pressing example. Or how you need to be a tall QB to succeed while Brees, RG3, Romo, Dalton, etc are guys who succeed in this league against what the model is for success at the position.

 

You can't project what will be and what wont be. As much as it is fun it is opinion not fact.

[Gordio]

 

 

 

After listening to the pre draft luncheon, I came away just like the rest of you here on the message board. It is down to 2 guys in the first round (Nassib and Barkley). I really don't know which one will be the guy. I told you all before I know EJ is in their top three, and I don't believe Geno is the guy either. I am sure that our head coach has seen enough of Geno that makes him turn cheek on Geno. Here is my second Mock Draft Buffalo Bills style, what do you guys think? Please let me know

 

 

8th Pick - Buffalo will try to trade out but if they can't they don't pass on Matt Barkley.

 

I believe that Barkley is the pick. Buddy is pretty straight forward, he doesn't lie too much. He has said since Chan was here that he wanted a franchise quarterback. He even said before the season ended that this is the year you trade up to get your guy if you need too. With that being said I think they had their minds on one guy from the get go. That is Matt Barkley.

 

Doug Marrone said last year after their game with USC that he wishes Matt Barkley had went pro, and then went on to say that Barkley was the top QB along with Luck. This came from his own mouth, after Barkley lit them up for 378 yards and 4 touchdowns.

 

Not only that, Stevie was at the Hockey game with Barkley in Cali. They are already getting a bond with one another, because that is the future Kelly to Reed.

 

Both Buddy and Whaley defended the heck out of taking a QB at 8. They said they feel that there were a couple franchise guys in this draft that can get the job done. Barkley is one of those guys. They gushed about him, they defended him, they compared him to Joe Montana, and finished up their speech about him saying last year he was their number one guy. Why would that change? It doesn't, if you like what you seen a year ago that doesn't change. He would be a huge asset in the West Coast system, and it is obvious we are going to that system.

 

With the second round pick Buffalo takes Robert Woods, Barkley's favorite target at USC. He is by far the best wide out in this draft, and has more upside that Patterson, Hopkins and others. Woods is a guy that you can insert in the system right now and he will pick it up. The kid is smart, he scored a 23 on his wonderlic and has looked very good. He is a good kid and is a perfect fit for the Bills system.

 

With the third Round pick Buffalo selects Shamarko Thomas Safety from Syracuse. He is a Marrone guy and will fit the Pettine system well, he reminds me a lot of Laron Landry who is not afraid to lay the wood. Pettine always has good safeties, and this is a good back up plan in case Byrd is a long term hold out. I was going to give the Bills Pugh here but he was taken right before they picked.

 

In the fourth round Buffalo selects Ja'Gared Davis OLB, SMU. He is a good player who has a similar skill set to Nigel Bradham. He is a very solid player. I love his motor. Bills are moving Arthur Moats to inside again from what I am hearing, and if that is the case they need another outside guy. I see Davis coming in and lighting up the preseason to move up the depth charts.

 

In the fifth round Buffalo selects TE Ryan Griffin of UConn, the good pass catching tight end will come in and help Barkley and company move the chains. Griffin is a sound tight end, and could be a huge steal in this years draft.

 

In the sixth round Buffalo selects Zach Rogers WR from Tennessee, this kid will be the steal of the draft. Rogers is a solid player who if can stay healthy will be a huge asset to the Bills organization. He will come in and take over the role like David Nelson. He has similar styles but will need to stay healthy first.

 

 

 

 

Excellent analysis & reasoning my man. Well done. As many know on this board I have been on the Barkley bandwagon for awhile now. Just don't understand the hatred that posters have for this guy. 4 year starter, incredable numbers, 12K passing yards, 140 tds against only 60 some ints, leader, intangibles are off the charts. I said this before & got laughed at but I think this kid has D Brees written all over him. No he is not going to throw a football from his knees thru the goal posts from the the 50 yard line like such great QBs like Russell & Boller, but this guy will get it done when it counts most on Sundays. I do worry about the culture shock coming from So Cal to B-lo but this kid could handle it. Come on Buddy take a chance on Barkley. You won't be sorry.

[The Big Cat]

Ummmm... that is what is commonly referred to as accuracy and/or ball placement. Nothing to do with arm strength. Pretty much everyone agrees he's very accurate on those throws. His problem is his velocity on those throws, and the clips you referred to showed a noticeable lack of velocity. They will work in college but not in the pros.

 

If Barkley had the arm of any of the other top ten QB prospects he'd be the consensus #1 overall and he is not even close to that. He may not even go in the first round, although I predict he will.

 

And as I've said before, the kid is still young, and velocity can be made with conditioning and mechanics as one's career progresses--accuracy, timing and ball placement, not so much...it's surely possible, but Barkley's is a much better base to start from than a guy who can throw it through the moon.

 

Plus, the throws I highlighted show that he can hit a receiver, in stride, down the field...imagine what THAT layer would have done for last year's offense...

[KeisterHollow]

I'd love this draft - Barkley is my favorite QB. I love the Safety from Syracuse. If they go WR early, why not get a kid who is familiar with the QB - it'd knock off his learning curve, and that is the name of Marrone's game this summer. I'd like a little more impact out of the LB/TE positions - maybe in favor of going WR later - as I see that group as exceptionally deep (getting a guy like Lemon in the 6th round! looks possible), but all in all I'd like this draft.

[Kelly the Dog]

And as I've said before, the kid is still young, and velocity can be made with conditioning and mechanics as one's career progresses--accuracy, timing and ball placement, not so much...it's surely possible, but Barkley's is a much better base to start from than a guy who can throw it through the moon.

 

Plus, the throws I highlighted show that he can hit a receiver, in stride, down the field...imagine what THAT layer would have done for last year's offense...

Not usually. Very few QBs really increase their arm strength over their career. Brady is one of the few that has, but he's a freak and an aberration on a lot of levels. Getting more muscle bound could drastically affect Barkley's accuracy. A lot of guys just can't do it because they have weak arms. If they could improve it it wouldn't be the issue with players. The Kellen Moores and Colt McCoys of the world would be far more highly regarded.

 

Pennington was a guy like that and is the most comparable to Barkley. I personally never wanted Pennington or a guy like him because I thought you couldn't win a Super Bowl with him. A lot of fans thought he was a winner and anyone should be happy with Pennington. But he never won, and to me, it's because he had a rag arm, and his smarts and accuracy couldn't overcome it. He got the very most he could out of his physical skills but it wasn't enough.

[BillsFan17]

And as I've said before, the kid is still young, and velocity can be made with conditioning and mechanics as one's career progresses--accuracy, timing and ball placement, not so much...it's surely possible, but Barkley's is a much better base to start from than a guy who can throw it through the moon.

 

Plus, the throws I highlighted show that he can hit a receiver, in stride, down the field...imagine what THAT layer would have done for last year's offense...

Like I have said, you look at someone like Chad Pennington. Didn't have a huge arm but could put the ball anywhere and his placement was ideal.

 

If you factor in the offense that Marrone is going to run and Barkley fits that to a tee. Like you said, with mechanics, coaching and pro programs you can add some zip to that ball. Anticipation, football acumen, and intangibles are things that can not be taught.

[Gordio]

If he can put the ball where ONLY his guy can get it 20+ yards past the line of scrimmage, that, IMO, makes for more than ample arm strength. Doesn't have to be zinging BB's out there...

 

 

 

Basically this, too.

 

Mallet came into a game last year (his professional statline still makes me lol) and threw an 80 mph dart to a receiver running a seven yard cross pattern. Inevitably, it bounced off the receivers chest, flew 20 feet in the air, and was picked off. Sometimes arm "strength" aint what it's cracked out to be.

 

Exactly, Barkley's arm is fine. No it is not a cannon, but believe me he will get the ball where it needs to go & his understanding of the game will make up for any short comings. This isn't Fitz where talking about, Barkley could fling it 50-60 yards + in the air. His arm strength is fine.

[The Big Cat]

Not usually. Very few QBs really increase their arm strength over their career. Brady is one of the few that has, but he's a freak and an aberration on a lot of levels. Getting more muscle bound could drastically affect Barkley's accuracy. A lot of guys just can't do it because they have weak arms. If they could improve it it wouldn't be the issue with players. The Kellen Moores and Colt McCoys of the world would be far more highly regarded.

 

Pennington was a guy like that and is the most comparable to Barkley. I personally never wanted Pennington or a guy like him because I thought you couldn't win a Super Bowl with him. A lot of fans thought he was a winner and anyone should be happy with Pennington. But he never won, and to me, it's because he had a rag arm, and his smarts and accuracy couldn't overcome it. He got the very most he could out of his physical skills but it wasn't enough.

 

This is just another in a series of misconceptions about conditioning on this board. One need not bulk up to get arm strength. It could be a matter of strengthing his core and his legs. I didn't mean to suggest he has to up his bench to get more zip, that's not the way it works.

 

Also, I think the comparisons to Pennington are unfair. Pennington--particularly in his later years--struggled to throw the ball 15 yards. Just as Brady adding velocity over his career is an "aberration" so was Pennington's ability to subsist in the NFL with the weakest arm of the last three decades.

 

Barkley's arm is unquestionably stronger than Pennington's.

[Gordio]

Not usually. Very few QBs really increase their arm strength over their career. Brady is one of the few that has, but he's a freak and an aberration on a lot of levels. Getting more muscle bound could drastically affect Barkley's accuracy. A lot of guys just can't do it because they have weak arms. If they could improve it it wouldn't be the issue with players. The Kellen Moores and Colt McCoys of the world would be far more highly regarded.

 

Pennington was a guy like that and is the most comparable to Barkley. I personally never wanted Pennington or a guy like him because I thought you couldn't win a Super Bowl with him. A lot of fans thought he was a winner and anyone should be happy with Pennington. But he never won, and to me, it's because he had a rag arm, and his smarts and accuracy couldn't overcome it. He got the very most he could out of his physical skills but it wasn't enough.

 

Barkley has twice the arm that Pennington ever had. I don't what games you are watching. Comparing Barkley to a guy like Penny is ridiculous imo.

[Kelly the Dog]

This is just another in a series of misconceptions about conditioning on this board. One need not bulk up to get arm strength. It could be a matter of strengthing his core and his legs. I didn't mean to suggest he has to up his bench to get more zip, that's not the way it works.

Start naming the players who had what was considered a weak arm who in the next couple years got stronger and no longer had a weak arm?

 

I can't think of even one.

 

Brady increased his arm strength over a few years but he didn't have a rag arm, he had an NFL average arm that got a little stronger, especially the velocity on the longer passes. But he started with a stronger arm than Barkley. Please name a weak armed QB who then no longer had a weak arm.

 

Barkley has twice the arm that Pennington ever had. I don't what games you are watching. Comparing Barkley to a guy like Penny is ridiculous imo.

The Pennington of the last couple years, yes, after Pennington had arm injuries and shoulder problems. But Pennington before his injuries still had a pretty weak arm, and probably the equivalent of Barkley. There is no measurement for it, obviously.

 

Why do you think Barkley isn't the #1 guy by most accounts? Why do a lot of scouts not even think he belongs in the first round? What is his only glaring weakness? It's his arm. I don't even think it's debatable.

[K-9]

Start naming the players who had what was considered a weak arm who in the next couple years got stronger and no longer had a weak arm?

 

I can't think of even one.

 

Brady increased his arm strength over a few years but he didn't have a rag arm, he had an NFL average arm that got a little stronger, especially the velocity on the longer passes. But he started with a stronger arm than Barkley. Please name a weak armed QB who then no longer had a weak arm.

 

 

The Pennington of the last couple years, yes, after Pennington had arm injuries and shoulder problems. But Pennington before his injuries still had a pretty weak arm, and probably the equivalent of Barkley. There is no measurement for it, obviously.

 

Why do you think Barkley isn't the #1 guy by most accounts? Why do a lot of scouts not even think he belongs in the first round? What is his only glaring weakness? It's his arm. I don't even think it's debatable.

 

But there is. Long out from the far hash, on time, from 5 and 7 step drops. With a hitch, if you like. Can't do that, there is no need to see anything else.

 

Or you can just watch Sport Science on ESPN.

 

And I'd take a pre-injured Pennington any day of the week. He epitomized the difference between being a passer and being a quarterback.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Kelly the Dog]

But there is. Long out from the far hash, on time, from 5 and 7 step drops. With a hitch, if you like. Can't do that, there is no need to see anything else.

 

Or you can just watch Sport Science on ESPN.

 

And I'd take a pre-injured Pennington any day of the week. He epitomized the difference between being a passer and being a quarterback.

 

GO BILLS!!!

1] I don't think Barkley can make that throw with sufficient velocity at all.

2] I understand your feeling about Pennington and a lot of fans would agree. I just don't share it. To me, it's the Marty Ball argument; some fans think he was a very good coach and got a bum deal and would love to have him, and another faction, myself included, didn't want him because I thought his ceiling fell short of being able to win it all with him. That's how I feel about Marty, Pennington, and Barkley. We already know the first two never did it.

[The Big Cat]

Start naming the players who had what was considered a weak arm who in the next couple years got stronger and no longer had a weak arm?

 

I can't think of even one.

 

Brady increased his arm strength over a few years but he didn't have a rag arm, he had an NFL average arm that got a little stronger, especially the velocity on the longer passes. But he started with a stronger arm than Barkley. Please name a weak armed QB who then no longer had a weak arm.

 

 

The Pennington of the last couple years, yes, after Pennington had arm injuries and shoulder problems. But Pennington before his injuries still had a pretty weak arm, and probably the equivalent of Barkley. There is no measurement for it, obviously.

 

Why do you think Barkley isn't the #1 guy by most accounts? Why do a lot of scouts not even think he belongs in the first round? What is his only glaring weakness? It's his arm. I don't even think it's debatable.

 

The knock on Matt Ryan prior to the draft was his questionable arm strength, and even now he doesn't zip it around the field.

[Kelly the Dog]

The knock on Matt Ryan prior to the draft was his questionable arm strength, and even now he doesn't zip it around the field.

There is a huge difference between not having a strong arm, and having a weak arm. Matt Ryan was not thought to have a weak arm, he never would have been drafted that high. He didn't have a cannon and he didn't have a rag arm. There isn't anyone I can ever think of who had a weak arm who later didn't.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

I saw Kiper comparing Barkley to Aaron Rodgers. He said arm strength was the reason Rodgers fell in the draft. He of course sat on the bench for 4 years behind Favre before becoming the guy.

 

How likely is it that Barkley will have a stronger arm when he reaches his physical prime, said to be around age 27, than he does now? I really have no idea.

[Kelly the Dog]

I saw Kiper comparing Barkley to Aaron Rodgers. He said arm strength was the reason Rodgers fell in the draft. He of course sat on the bench for 4 years behind Favre before becoming the guy.

 

How likely is it that Barkley will have a stronger arm when he reaches his physical prime, said to be around age 27, than he does now? I really have no idea.

Rodgers was always thought to have a strong arm. Go back and google his scouting reports before the draft. They all will say he had a strong arm and one of the best in the draft class.

[K-9]

1] I don't think Barkley can make that throw with sufficient velocity at all.

2] I understand your feeling about Pennington and a lot of fans would agree. I just don't share it. To me, it's the Marty Ball argument; some fans think he was a very good coach and got a bum deal and would love to have him, and another faction, myself included, didn't want him because I thought his ceiling fell short of being able to win it all with him. That's how I feel about Marty, Pennington, and Barkley. We already know the first two never did it.

 

1.)Then it's a non-starter. If he hasn't demonstrated that, he'll be an UDFA at best. And lucky to do that.

 

2.) I'm not surprised.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Lurker]

Rodgers was always thought to have a strong arm. Go back and google his scouting reports before the draft. They all will say he had a strong arm and one of the best in the draft class.

 

Kiper profile on Rogers: "He has above average arm strength, but he can be a bit mechanical in his throws."

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/columns/story?columnist=kiper_jr_mel&id=3279488

 

 

NFL.com profile on Ryan: "Needs to do a better job of planting his feet to get more zip behind his long throws...Has inconsistent and adequate velocity when firing the ball deep..."

 

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/matt-ryan?id=310

[K-9]

Kiper profile on Rogers: "He has above average arm strength, but he can be a bit mechanical in his throws."

 

Now that's funny. Kiper can't even remember his own scouting reports apparently.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[RogerNapalm]

Who's Damond Talbot?