San Jose Bills Fan Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 I totally understand those kind of rankings, but since QBs are valued so much more than other positions and teams reach/gamble for that position so much more, a guy rated at #41 is still likely to get drafted in the teens or 20s. Not sure why you use the word "but" because it seems to me that you and Astro are basically making the same point. I would have said "and because." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Not sure why you use the word "but" because it seems to me that you and Astro are basically making the same point. I would have said "and because." You're right. My bad. I actually didn't see Nanker's second point, at the bottom of his list before I posted, I just saw his first sentence and then the list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsBytheBay Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 The ONLY thing the coaches are doing, is providing the best competition they can at the position. We as fans love penciling starters based on our opinions. I don't think this staff, who have never coached any of the players on this team, even know who the starting QB is. Bring guys in, whip to a froth, and let the cream rise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 The ONLY thing the coaches are doing, is providing the best competition they can at the position. We as fans love penciling starters based on our opinions. I don't think this staff, who have never coached any of the players on this team, even know who the starting QB is. Bring guys in, whip to a froth, and let the cream rise. Great point and it bolsters something I said earlier. It's immaterial if Kolb is better than TJax or not. One will be better than the other. We will presumably retain the better player AND the competition will make both of them better. In other words there's no chance that bringing Kolb in will make us weaker at that position. It only makes us stronger, even if TJax wins the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 bills still take a QB at #8. Kolb will be here for one season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in Chicago Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 He's helping the team because an NFL team needs two quarterbacks who can play and not one. He's helping because the guy the Bills like may need a season or a half of a season to be ready to play, if, say, EJ Manuel, is more raw than a guy like Barkley. Kelly, while I appreciate that we need to cover ourselves in the eventuality that a rookie wont be ready, rarely do NFL teams plan for two QBs flopping. I would assume a rookie and one semi-vet is all teams should carry with an emergency QB (Brad Smith) . Given the limitted resources, money is better spent elsewhere. Adding quantity only says that the FO itself is not very confident in their own evaluations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 (edited) Kelly, while I appreciate that we need to cover ourselves in the eventuality that a rookie wont be ready, rarely do NFL teams plan for two QBs flopping. I would assume a rookie and one semi-vet is all teams should carry with an emergency QB (Brad Smith) . Given the limitted resources, money is better spent elsewhere. Adding quantity only says that the FO itself is not very confident in their own evaluations. Well, what I meant is that we signed Kolb for two years. If we find a rookie that needs a season of holding a clipboard, then Kolb is our starter until then. If we find one we think can start right away, or simply beats out Kolb in training camp, we have Kolb as a good back-up for two years and he costs very little (because he won't reach incentives). If we have Kolb and then take a total flyer on a guy like Matt Scott or someone else in the third, we have Kolb as the starter, Scott as a project, and by the time 2014 rolls around we can either keep Kolb for one more year with a #1 franchise guy or cut him without much money paid out to him, and have the new guy with Scott. It's all about options. We may like a couple guys in this year's draft but we have zero idea of if they will be available when we choose 8 or 41 or who may trade with us. TJax is on a one year deal for peanuts. He is not the answer to any question other than "Do we have a decent back-up on a one year deal for peanuts?" Edited March 31, 2013 by Kelly the Dog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Yep. I think at least four are off the board by 41. If we want one of them, we have to trade up to the bottom of first or top of second, which is likely what we will do. The Kolb signing makes me believe that we will try to trade up and draft Nassib or Manuel at the last third of the first round. How do they do that without dealing away next year's #1? That scenario scares the crap out of me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 (edited) Kelly, while I appreciate that we need to cover ourselves in the eventuality that a rookie wont be ready, rarely do NFL teams plan for two QBs flopping. I would assume a rookie and one semi-vet is all teams should carry with an emergency QB (Brad Smith) . Given the limitted resources, money is better spent elsewhere. Adding quantity only says that the FO itself is not very confident in their own evaluations. The seahags carried 3 potential starters into camp last year. Then again they appear to be a competent organization with a plan. But, I agree with your thoughts. Signing Kolb shows the Bills may be panicking. And while Kolb may be the next starter. It's hard to trust anything the Bills are trying to do. The funniest thoughts are some posts elsewhere suggesting the Kolb signing is a smokescreen to their true draft intentions. The Bills just aren't that smart. Best scenario is Kolb actually is serviceable until his yearly injury, and then that forces in the next guy. Edited March 31, 2013 by Best Player Available Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koufax Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 A lot of assumptions indeed . Following just one assumption though.....and that is the assumption that Kolb will be the #2 QB behind a rookie starter.....neither his injury history nor his overall ability compared to Fitz will be relevant unless the rookie gets injured. I'm hoping that we not only get lucky and get a superstar QB in the draft......but that he also stays healthy for 15 years so we never get to see how good/bad our backups are. I like this, but we also need to be prepared that we draft someone who needs some time and need a starter for half a year or a whole year. In that case I am fine with the winner of the Kolb / Tavaris battle in camp, and think it would likely be Kolb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 How do they do that without dealing away next year's #1? That scenario scares the crap out of me. Well, for example, the Bills traded 42 and 73 to get to 26 for McCargo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 How do they do that without dealing away next year's #1? That scenario scares the crap out of me. According to the Trade Value Chart.....http://www.drafttek.com/tradechart1.asp?RequestTeam=BUF .....our #41 & #71 picks would be basically worth the same as the Texans #27 & #124. Lots of combinations could easily work without having to give up a 1st round pick next season.....or lose a pick this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Yep. I think at least four are off the board by 41. If we want one of them, we have to trade up to the bottom of first or top of second, which is likely what we will do. The Kolb signing makes me believe that we will try to trade up and draft Nassib or Manuel at the last third of the first round. That's a very plausible scenario. I wonder if it will be a 2014 pick. We're going to go into training camp with a whole bunch of undrafted rookie FAs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsBytheBay Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Great point and it bolsters something I said earlier. It's immaterial if Kolb is better than TJax or not. One will be better than the other. We will presumably retain the better player AND the competition will make both of them better. In other words there's no chance that bringing Kolb in will make us weaker at that position. It only makes us stronger, even if TJax wins the job. agreed. Some one said earlier their previous stats and records are irrelevant. What have you done for me latley. Or better yet, who looks good with OUR team in camp. I do like the idea of drafting two rookies QB's as well. Find a QB. The Hell with linebackers, wide outs, or any other position. Until we get a QB, none of that matters. When we find our QB, I think our future draft picks will look better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhitewalkerInPhilly Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Well, what I meant is that we signed Kolb for two years. If we find a rookie that needs a season of holding a clipboard, then Kolb is our starter until then. If we find one we think can start right away, or simply beats out Kolb in training camp, we have Kolb as a good back-up for two years and he costs very little (because he won't reach incentives). If we have Kolb and then take a total flyer on a guy like Matt Scott or someone else in the third, we have Kolb as the starter, Scott as a project, and by the time 2014 rolls around we can either keep Kolb for one more year with a #1 franchise guy or cut him without much money paid out to him, and have the new guy with Scott. Exactly my logic. The Bills have worked out Matt Barkley, Jeff Tuel, Matt Scott, Geno Smith, E.J. Manuel, Tyler Bray and Landry Jones. I refuse to believe that not a single one of them will available at #41, especially Scott. I'm increasingly interested in Scott, who appears to be possibly the most physically gifted, but NEEDS more polish and is a higher risk. Even if there is a run, I'm happy with our current options. Besides, if Kolb is as bad as all the naysayers seem to think, we're set a get a QB in the next draft... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Whatever people want to call him, I think Warner deserves to go to the hall of fame. You are 100% correct. He is much better than many of the QBs already in the Hall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincec Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 For all the people saying that Kolb will finally shine behind the Bills OL, I think that we are going to see a drop off from the OL this season. Gone is Gailey and his quick, short passing game. Gone is Fitz and his ability to adjust blocking schemes vs blitzes. Gone is Levitre, arguably the best pass blocker on the Bills OL. In comes Kolb, one of the most sacked QBs in the NFL. This doesn't sound like a recipe for a good season by the OL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRQ_BillsFan Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 But, the Bills are still eating $10M of cap with Fitz. There's no shrewdness here. ^. ||. This!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 For all the people saying that Kolb will finally shine behind the Bills OL, I think that we are going to see a drop off from the OL this season. Gone is Gailey and his quick, short passing game. Gone is Fitz and his ability to adjust blocking schemes vs blitzes. Gone is Levitre, arguably the best pass blocker on the Bills OL. In comes Kolb, one of the most sacked QBs in the NFL. This doesn't sound like a recipe for a good season by the OL. Except we're going to play a quick, short passing game, and Kolb is known for being pretty smart, too. He got sacked very little when he played in a quick passing offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsBytheBay Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 I don't think we should get all worked up over who the bills starter will be. By the time final cuts are made, their is no telling what QB's will be on the roster. We don't even know what kind of offense the Bills will run. We don't know what the coaches think about the players they inherited. We don't know much... And coach Doug has made a point to be like that. The most important thing is the fact that their is movment. The QB position is being addressed. We may all have different ideas on how to get the job done. But its being addressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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