Big Game Thread

[Malazan]

Lil' Donte got exposed after a season of undeserved accolades. The guy literally made no plays, which was his calling card here in Buffalo. No impact at all, despite the game really being a pinball affair with a lot of chances for him to make plays. He ate a d*ck tonight.

 

He had major impact. They targeted him early. The first drive he gave up a huge play and was not in good position on the touchdown catch.

[49er Fan]

So this is what it feels like when your team loses in the SB. Wow, it really sucks. How could 4 in a row possibly feel....jesus. Maybe there really is a curse on Randy Moss.

 

The two-pt. conversion and last offensive series for SF absolutely should have been better - I know there was a blind-side blitz but a fade pattern is a terrible play-call on 4th down - didn't go to Vernon Davis in the end-zone once... and they needed to at least try running a QB draw or run to the outside at least once.

 

Still a good game and a great year. Good to have SF back deep in the playoffs.

[John in Jax]

Got to see some game coverage on ESPN today, and Wow, the blown calls, in favor of the Ravens, were even more prevalent than I thought.

 

And in fact, they dealt with the two "subjective" fouls (Pass Interference & Holding), which have been called inconsistently FOR YEARS now in the NFL. The latter, in addition to the Bills being such a frustrating team to watch, has driven me away from being a dedicated NFL fan (have had a LOT more free time on Sundays over the past 10 years...lol), because it comes to the point of being like "pro" wrestling to me....from game to game you'll see wildly different interpretations of PI & holding, and how frequent they are called.

 

Anyways, in last night's game, of course there was the blatant hold (TWO Ravens clearly holding a Niner at the 26-30yard line as Jones goes right by them) on the KO return TD to open the 2nd half. Then on the Niners 4th down play, there was holding ON BOTH SIDES of the field (nice eye Eric Mangini), on both receivers. Of course anyone who watches the game regularly knows that they call holding and/or defensive PI for FAR LESS contact than what you saw on that 4th down play. Then on the Ravens last offensive play (the punter running around in the end zone) TWO Niners are blatantly held as they rush the punter (yes, I know it just would have been a safety anyway, but it's the point of it not being called even though it was so blatant).

 

It was a good game, but it's a shame that the officiating was so poor, and IMHO, had influence over who won the game.

 

Disclaimer: I'm not a Niners or Ravens fan....couldn't care less who won.

[NoSaint]

Got to see some game coverage on ESPN today, and Wow, the blown calls, in favor of the Ravens, were even more prevalent than I thought.

 

And in fact, they dealt with the two "subjective" fouls (Pass Interference & Holding), which have been called inconsistently FOR YEARS now in the NFL. The latter, in addition to the Bills being such a frustrating team to watch, has driven me away from being a dedicated NFL fan (have had a LOT more free time on Sundays over the past 10 years...lol), because it comes to the point of being like "pro" wrestling to me....from game to game you'll see wildly different interpretations of PI & holding, and how frequent they are called.

 

Anyways, in last night's game, of course there was the blatant hold (TWO Ravens clearly holding a Niner at the 26-30yard line as Jones goes right by them) on the KO return TD to open the 2nd half. Then on the Niners 4th down play, there was holding ON BOTH SIDES of the field (nice eye Eric Mangini), on both receivers. Of course anyone who watches the game regularly knows that they call holding and/or defensive PI for FAR LESS contact than what you saw on that 4th down play. Then on the Ravens last offensive play (the punter running around in the end zone) TWO Niners are blatantly held as they rush the punter (yes, I know it just would have been a safety anyway, but it's the point of it not being called even though it was so blatant).

 

It was a good game, but it's a shame that the officiating was so poor, and IMHO, had influence over who won the game.

 

Disclaimer: I'm not a Niners or Ravens fan....couldn't care less who won.

 

they let two physical teams play physical football. they didnt nail every call perfectly but i think that was a pretty well officiated game all around. when both teams can point to a couple of no calls and things were more or less even - thats a good night i think. they also didnt nail the niners on hitting flacco.

 

if crabtree wants that call he HAS to release outside. absolutely must get into the route properly and not into smiths chest. once there the refs will let them fight it out. crabtree needs to know that. if he took a jab inside to get smith into the slant and then broke outside his outside shoulder instead of into him he wouldve gotten the call. its not just the amount of the contact there but the context of the play. on 4th down with under 2 mins left in the super bowl the refs will not give the offense a full set of downs because the WR didnt get off the ball properly... especially with the ball no where near catchable unless he does.

 

they may not have followed the letter of the rulebook but id bet the casebook steers them this way, and every player should know it. to get that call you have to be in a position to make the play if not for the contact. crabtree blew it.

Edited February 4, 2013 by NoSaint

[dave mcbride]

they let two physical teams play physical football. they didnt nail every call perfectly but i think that was a pretty well officiated game all around. when both teams can point to a couple of no calls and things were more or less even - thats a good night i think. they also didnt nail the niners on hitting flacco.

 

if crabtree wants that call he HAS to release outside. absolutely must get into the route properly and not into smiths chest. once there the refs will let them fight it out. crabtree needs to know that. if he took a jab inside to get smith into the slant and then broke outside his outside shoulder instead of into him he wouldve gotten the call. its not just the amount of the contact there but the context of the play. on 4th down with under 2 mins left in the super bowl the refs will not give the offense a full set of downs because the WR didnt get off the ball properly... especially with the ball no where near catchable unless he does.

 

they may not have followed the letter of the rulebook but id bet the casebook steers them this way, and every player should know it. to get that call you have to be in a position to make the play if not for the contact. crabtree blew it.

 

Good post.

[Sisyphean Bills]

they let two physical teams play physical football. they didnt nail every call perfectly but i think that was a pretty well officiated game all around. when both teams can point to a couple of no calls and things were more or less even - thats a good night i think. they also didnt nail the niners on hitting flacco.

 

if crabtree wants that call he HAS to release outside. absolutely must get into the route properly and not into smiths chest. once there the refs will let them fight it out. crabtree needs to know that. if he took a jab inside to get smith into the slant and then broke outside his outside shoulder instead of into him he wouldve gotten the call. its not just the amount of the contact there but the context of the play. on 4th down with under 2 mins left in the super bowl the refs will not give the offense a full set of downs because the WR didnt get off the ball properly... especially with the ball no where near catchable unless he does.

 

they may not have followed the letter of the rulebook but id bet the casebook steers them this way, and every player should know it. to get that call you have to be in a position to make the play if not for the contact. crabtree blew it.

Teams have to know that the Super Bowl is officiated differently than any other game. That's just the way it is.

[ExiledInIllinois]

Did anybody bring up why there was no holding called on the saftey play? I count two holding penalties... The earliest @ 11 seconds... Isn't that when the play should have stopped when the saftey was scored? Is that how it works? Or would there still have been 4 seconds. Now it might not mean anything but... The 49ers may have heaved one or who knows. Why was the punter allowed to give up the safety. The holding was when the safety was scored.

 

The game is not fixed... BUT IMO were "pushing" the outcome.

 

Teams have to know that the Super Bowl is officiated differently than any other game. That's just the way it is.

 

Are you kidding me? This is a ridiculous thing to say!!! This throws integrity right out the window.

 

they let two physical teams play physical football. they didnt nail every call perfectly but i think that was a pretty well officiated game all around. when both teams can point to a couple of no calls and things were more or less even - thats a good night i think. they also didnt nail the niners on hitting flacco.

 

if crabtree wants that call he HAS to release outside. absolutely must get into the route properly and not into smiths chest. once there the refs will let them fight it out. crabtree needs to know that. if he took a jab inside to get smith into the slant and then broke outside his outside shoulder instead of into him he wouldve gotten the call. its not just the amount of the contact there but the context of the play. on 4th down with under 2 mins left in the super bowl the refs will not give the offense a full set of downs because the WR didnt get off the ball properly... especially with the ball no where near catchable unless he does.

 

they may not have followed the letter of the rulebook but id bet the casebook steers them this way, and every player should know it. to get that call you have to be in a position to make the play if not for the contact. crabtree blew it.

 

The burden is not on Crabtree. He was held from the get go. The call should have been made.

 

Note the bold part. This is where the league throws intergrity out the window.

 

There is no justifying this travesty... We as Bills fans see it happen all the time against the Pats*... Same when the refs were pushing outcomes for the Pats* against Indy and Peyton Manning all those years.

[Sisyphean Bills]

Are you kidding me? This is a ridiculous thing to say!!! This throws integrity right out the window.

It's not ridiculous in the least. It's fact.

[NoSaint]

 

The burden is not on Crabtree. He was held from the get go. The call should have been made.

 

Note the bold part. This is where the league throws intergrity out the window.

 

There is no justifying this travesty... We as Bills fans see it happen all the time against the Pats*... Same when the refs were pushing outcomes for the Pats* against Indy and Peyton Manning all those years.

 

if you are making a call that gives a 1st down there, you better be sure the penalty effected the outcome of the play. crabtree running a route that left him nowhere in the vicinity of the ball certainly put some burden on him. if the DB was grabbing because he was beat it wouldve been a different story.

 

no need to be shocked when the refs enforce the spirit of the rule on that play. that flag will rarely come out on 3rd/4th downs unless it is VERY blatant. they let the guys play last night and it went both ways.

 

i wouldnt want them to call it any other way in that situation.

[Sisyphean Bills]

if you are making a call that gives a 1st down there, you better be sure the penalty effected the outcome of the play. crabtree running a route that left him nowhere in the vicinity of the ball certainly put some burden on him. if the DB was grabbing because he was beat it wouldve been a different story.

 

no need to be shocked when the refs enforce the spirit of the rule on that play. that flag will rarely come out on 3rd/4th downs unless it is VERY blatant. they let the guys play last night and it went both ways.

 

i wouldnt want them to call it any other way in that situation.

Exactly. Nothing would be worse than to have the officials making crazy judgement calls to decide the Super Bowl. Can you imagine if the Super Bowl was decided on a total job call like the Seahawks / Packers game? They let the players play in the Super Bowl and it is not officiated as tightly as other games. This is a well understood fact.

 

I don't get why people assume the Ravens were the only team getting away with things. I saw the 49ers guilty of blatant pass interference, a face mask, holding all over the place ... and those flags weren't thrown either.

 

The way it should be. Let the players decide the game on the field.

[mannc]

Got to see some game coverage on ESPN today, and Wow, the blown calls, in favor of the Ravens, were even more prevalent than I thought.

 

And in fact, they dealt with the two "subjective" fouls (Pass Interference & Holding), which have been called inconsistently FOR YEARS now in the NFL. The latter, in addition to the Bills being such a frustrating team to watch, has driven me away from being a dedicated NFL fan (have had a LOT more free time on Sundays over the past 10 years...lol), because it comes to the point of being like "pro" wrestling to me....from game to game you'll see wildly different interpretations of PI & holding, and how frequent they are called.

 

Anyways, in last night's game, of course there was the blatant hold (TWO Ravens clearly holding a Niner at the 26-30yard line as Jones goes right by them) on the KO return TD to open the 2nd half. Then on the Niners 4th down play, there was holding ON BOTH SIDES of the field (nice eye Eric Mangini), on both receivers. Of course anyone who watches the game regularly knows that they call holding and/or defensive PI for FAR LESS contact than what you saw on that 4th down play. Then on the Ravens last offensive play (the punter running around in the end zone) TWO Niners are blatantly held as they rush the punter (yes, I know it just would have been a safety anyway, but it's the point of it not being called even though it was so blatant).

 

It was a good game, but it's a shame that the officiating was so poor, and IMHO, had influence over who won the game.

 

Disclaimer: I'm not a Niners or Ravens fan....couldn't care less who won.

I agree. These bogus PI calls (and uncalled PIs) have huge impact on the outcome of too many games and the refs consistently get them wrong. I would estimate based on my observations that under 50% of the PI or defensive holding penalties that are called in NFL games were actually penalties. It's impossible to estimate the number of missed PI calls. Someone needs to explain why PI calls are not reviewable. They are frequently no less subjective than any of the calls that are currently reviewable. I don't buy the "it will slow down the game" argument. The game could not be any slower than it already is, and under current rules, a coach can even review the placement of the ball at the end of a play.

[Rob's House]

A holding call on the 4th down play would have been an outrage. It would have handed the 49ers the SB gift wrapped on a silver platter courtesy of a questionable ticky tack call. I say good no call.

[BADOLBILZ]

So this is what it feels like when your team loses in the SB. Wow, it really sucks. How could 4 in a row possibly feel....jesus. Maybe there really is a curse on Randy Moss.

 

The two-pt. conversion and last offensive series for SF absolutely should have been better - I know there was a blind-side blitz but a fade pattern is a terrible play-call on 4th down - didn't go to Vernon Davis in the end-zone once... and they needed to at least try running a QB draw or run to the outside at least once.

 

Still a good game and a great year. Good to have SF back deep in the playoffs.

 

Losing 4 in a row just feels like losing the first one again each time. It sucks. What will be interesting will be how the Niners rebound. Nobody has rebounded from losing a SB and come back with mostly the same team and then won their next trip since the Cowboys in the 1970's. It's not like losing a championship game, those are building block losses. Losing that first one just seems to put a wicked emotional scar on a team. The Bills that lost in SBXXV were very young by the standards of that day. Had free agency not started mid-way thru their 4 year run of SB appearances they may well have made 6 or 7 straight...and they may have lost 6 or 7 straight. It just messed them up for that game.

And they may well have lost all of them. It just takes it's toll.

[Tcali]

So this is what it feels like when your team loses in the SB. Wow, it really sucks. How could 4 in a row possibly feel....jesus. Maybe there really is a curse on Randy Moss.

 

The two-pt. conversion and last offensive series for SF absolutely should have been better - I know there was a blind-side blitz but a fade pattern is a terrible play-call on 4th down - didn't go to Vernon Davis in the end-zone once... and they needed to at least try running a QB draw or run to the outside at least once.

 

Still a good game and a great year. Good to have SF back deep in the playoffs.

 

well--we were really only competitive in one SB...And probbly like you this yr -we feel we shoulda won that first SB.

The fade pass is a very low % throw--u r right--BAD CALL. I am surprised that Kaep didnt run it in.Seems that Balt was helpless against him running.

[BADOLBILZ]

He had major impact. They targeted him early. The first drive he gave up a huge play and was not in good position on the touchdown catch.

 

Yes, he had a major "negative" impact. Picked on in coverage, frustration personal foul, missed a critical chance to slow down Pierce on a run blitz that he amazingly bounced to the sideline for a long gainer. It was a nightmarish day for lil' Donte. He probably thinks he played OK but could have played better though.

[ExiledInIllinois]

A holding call on the 4th down play would have been an outrage. It would have handed the 49ers the SB gift wrapped on a silver platter courtesy of a questionable ticky tack call. I say good no call.

 

That is why they call the push off too if Crabtree was trying to pull one over. Offsetting, do over. Until the play is clean. A no-call is a "push" for Baltimore. Treat it like a 2 strike foul ball.

 

Anyway, it doesn't matter, it was a blantant hold and it needs to be called, no matter what the situation is!

 

The question is: Was it holding. Yes it was. Call it each and every time.

[Rob's House]

well--we were really only competitive in one SB...And probbly like you this yr -we feel we shoulda won that first SB.

The fade pass is a very low % throw--u r right--BAD CALL. I am surprised that Kaep didnt run it in.Seems that Balt was helpless against him running.

I thought Jim Harbaugh should have taken the delay of game penalty. With a little more field it might have been easier to sneak something in there, but jammed up at the line they just couldn't make it happen. Plus, that TO would have been real handy after failing to converge.

[ExiledInIllinois]

if you are making a call that gives a 1st down there, you better be sure the penalty effected the outcome of the play. crabtree running a route that left him nowhere in the vicinity of the ball certainly put some burden on him. if the DB was grabbing because he was beat it wouldve been a different story.

 

no need to be shocked when the refs enforce the spirit of the rule on that play. that flag will rarely come out on 3rd/4th downs unless it is VERY blatant. they let the guys play last night and it went both ways.

 

i wouldnt want them to call it any other way in that situation.

 

Doesn't matter. I brought up the No Goal and Hull's skate. That call was made all season long. Same with the hold. They pushed the outcome for Baltimore. Why no holding in the endzone on the safety... That would have added almost 10 more seconds!

[Rob's House]

That is why they call the push off too if Crabtree was trying to pull one over. Offsetting, do over. Until the play is clean. A no-call is a "push" for Baltimore. Treat it like a 2 strike foul ball.

 

Anyway, it doesn't matter, it was a blantant hold and it needs to be called, no matter what the situation is!

 

The question is: Was it holding. Yes it was. Call it each and every time.

I wouldn't say it was blatant by any stretch of the imagination. On slow-mo replay you could kind of make a case for a holding call, but even with the benefit of that I'd still call it questionable.

[ExiledInIllinois]

I agree. These bogus PI calls (and uncalled PIs) have huge impact on the outcome of too many games and the refs consistently get them wrong. I would estimate based on my observations that under 50% of the PI or defensive holding penalties that are called in NFL games were actually penalties. It's impossible to estimate the number of missed PI calls. Someone needs to explain why PI calls are not reviewable. They are frequently no less subjective than any of the calls that are currently reviewable. I don't buy the "it will slow down the game" argument. The game could not be any slower than it already is, and under current rules, a coach can even review the placement of the ball at the end of a play.

 

I agree! They "push" outcomes.

 

I wouldn't say it was blatant by any stretch of the imagination. On slow-mo replay you could kind of make a case for a holding call, but even with the benefit of that I'd still call it questionable.

 

Jimmy Smith had his jersey grabbed with a fist! Holding. Did you see the grabbing on the safety play? Same thing. Refs swallowed their flags.

 

If the refs were in doubt. Offset them and replay. That is the beauty of the offsetting penalty!

 

Simply... Certain teams get this call and certain teams do not.

 

The ones that do:

 

Baltimore

Pittsburgh

New England

 

To name a few that don't get the call:

 

Buffalo is on the tops of the list!

Arizona is another dog that doesn't get the call.

 

Just a few teams mentioned and this goes for throughout the teams mentioned history. I betcha one can put together a pretty accurate list of teams that get the call, don't get the call, and maybe get the call. I think Chicago is one team that maybe gets the call in their favor.