Rob Johnson Interview With Rich Gaenzler

[Hsp08]

Johnson, FLutie, Losman, Edwards each had strengths. Their weaknesses ensured that they would not be a starting QB, long term, in the NFL. The Bills got suckered in on flashes of good play and bought into each being a starter. This a common problem in the NFL.

flutie came in as a free agent at minimum wage fresh from the CFL and earned his keep, not like others.

Edited January 31, 2013 by Hsp08

[RuntheDamnBall]

Johnson, FLutie, Losman, Edwards each had strengths. Their weaknesses ensured that they would not be a starting QB, long term, in the NFL. The Bills got suckered in on flashes of good play and bought into each being a starter. This a common problem in the NFL.

I think you have to factor in injuries and situation here. It's never all on the player, and it's just as much on the coach who gives them a plan they can execute with a cast that is capable of helping them do that. Tom Brady doesn't do everything perfectly - but he does a few things extremely well and they are very, very hard to stop. It seems like the Bills have rarely if ever focused on this approach in the past 20 or so years.

[mob16151]

How I feel about this thread

 

[San Jose Bills Fan]

OBVIOUSLY Flutie went 10-5 all by himself and Johnson lost the Music City Miracle all by himself.

 

I also love how it was the team holding Flutie back but it was Johnson's loss when he lost.

 

GET OVER IT. NEITHER OF THESE GUYS WERE GOOD ENOUGH. IT THEY WERE, THAT DEFENSE WOULD HAVE TAKEN THE BILLS TO THE SUPER BOWL.

 

 

For the record (yet again):

 

Flutie's record for the Bills from 1998 to 2000: 21-9

 

Johnson's record for the Bills from 1998 to 2000: 8-10

 

Perhaps neither one was good enough for the Bills although Flutie's best years were spent in the CFL where he re-wrote the record book and is one of the greatest players in league history.

 

Regardless, for rational people there's zero question who the better quarterback was.

[transient]

 

You're kidding me.

 

Flutie v. the Dolphins: 90.05 rating against a defense that was 6th in passing defense, 3rd in overall D, and first overall in points allowed.

 

Johnson v. the Titans: 64.8 rating against a defense that was 25th overall in passing defense, 17th overall in D, and 15th overall in points.

 

Seriously -- come on.

 

I've seen the season stats for the Titans D trotted out on this board in this argument a number of times. They also posted 54 sacks that year, and 40 turnovers, and IIRC the end of that season and during the playoffs, minus the Steelers game, the Titans were abusing QBs. I don't remember the defensive battle being that much of a surprise at the time, especially given the weather conditions. Only years later do people point to the weakness of the Titans D to make this point.

 

Locker room cancer is a common term for a divisive player... The Bills strong defense covered up for his shortcomings.

 

Nice. Justify the cancer reference... but just keep HAMMERING AWAY at the height thing.

[vincec]

Rob Johnson. Has he figured out which way the offense is supposed to go yet? All I remember when he was at QB was one sack after another. If all it took to play QB in the NFL was the ability to throw a ball through a tire then Rob Johnson would be in the HOF. Unfortunately, it takes a lot more than that.

[RuntheDamnBall]

Perhaps neither one was good enough for the Bills although Flutie's best years were spent in the CFL where he re-wrote the record book and is one of the greatest players in league history.

 

Regardless, for rational people there's zero question who the better quarterback was.

The team generally played better with him in there, I'll warrant that, but isn't one of the interesting takeaways from this interview that maybe the team was better suited to Flutie's style and that RJ tried to do too much with his feet?

 

In any case, the CFL is a different game. I got excited for awhile with Flutie, but after that Dolphins loss my feelings about him were tempered and I thought he often made himself look petty and hung teammates out to dry.

[Wayne Fontes]

I've seen the season stats for the Titans D trotted out on this board in this argument a number of times. They also posted 54 sacks that year, and 40 turnovers, and IIRC the end of that season and during the playoffs, minus the Steelers game, the Titans were abusing QBs. I don't remember the defensive battle being that much of a surprise at the time, especially given the weather conditions. Only years later do people point to the weakness of the Titans D to make this point.

 

Nice. Justify the cancer reference... but just keep HAMMERING AWAY at the height thing.

 

No justification is necessary. Where did I 'hammer away' on 'the height thing'?

[transient]

No justification is necessary. Where did I 'hammer away' on 'the height thing'?

 

Just goofing... I was playing with your choice of the word "shortcomings," but doing so on and iPad limits my ability to bold words or use emoticons to tip off my intent. Epic fail... sorry.

[bills44]

I agree that he had limitations. No doubt about that. But he was most definitely a 10-6 qb - a guy who could pull out a close one more often than not. The bills haven't had that since, well, him. In fact my favorite flutie performance was that game against the ravens in 1999. No one really knew just how good that ravens d was at the time, but regardless, flutie was terrible for most of the game. Bt then he really did pull out a miracle finish, pulling out play afte play on the bills final possession.

 

 

yeah, I remember that game. the offense was ineffective (again), and the defense bailed them out (again) - Gabe Northern (or maybe it was Sam Rogers?) stripped Tony Banks of the ball as the Ravens were trying to run out the clock, and the Bills recovered. Linton scored the GW TD. Pretty sure that the lil' guy threw a bunch of picks that game.

[Wayne Fontes]

Just goofing... I was playing with your choice of the word "shortcomings," but doing so on and iPad limits my ability to bold words or use emoticons to tip off my intent. Epic fail... sorry.

 

No harm done.

[Phil Hansen Forever]

I wonder what would have happened if he hadn't been on our team and Flutie was allowed to start.

 

Same here, the Music City Miracle wouldn't have happened as Flutie would have kicked their butt down the field.

[T master]

As the GR guys wasted airtime on some trivia game, I checked out a podcast on WHLD.

 

 

I can only wonder what the Bills fortunes would have been if he wouldl have stayed healthy, and the cancer midget wasn't on the team.

 

 

http://www.swing1270...d=582&is_corp=0

 

6-10 season if he had been the QB ! The only reason why he is even remembered is b/c he took the place of the rightful leader & starting QB of the team & brought the moral of a team to the dumpster.

 

If he was any good he would have proved it some where else, but he wasn't so now he is living of the millions that the Bills paid him ...

 

One of the dumbest trades the Bills ever made !!

 

It's funny the cancer midget got them to the play offs & i believe still holds some records for the Bills, what records does RJ hold in the NFL ?? For any team ???

Edited January 31, 2013 by T master

[Buftex]

My distaste for Flutie stems more from his personality... it is dumb to suggest that Rob Johnson was a better QB.

 

But, lets not over-inflate how good Flutie was either. I will admit, I despised him before he was a Bill, and was really bummed when they signed him. At that point in time, the Bills franchise was highly regarded, and signing Flutie just wreaked of a desperate publicity stunt.

 

I was fully behind Rob Johnson, and I am not entirely convinced Fluties' behind the scenes antics didn't play some role in his failure. Flutie was not a good teammate, or, moreover, not a good guy to have backing up a young QB. And, despite all the warm and fuzzies everyone gets for Flutie, there was a time when some of his teammates (Thurman, Reed) would have preferred #11.

 

Flutie seemed to have a case of "little man's syndrom", and sensed some fragile insecurities in Rob Johnson, and pounced on them. As somebody stated earlier in this thread, Flutie was at least as interested in being the starter as he was with what was best for the team.

 

I have referenced this in numerous threads over the years, on this topic, but I remember going to the last game of the 1998 season, in New Orleans. It was two days after Christmas, a "meaningless" game....the Bills (or Flutie as some would say) had already clinched a playoff spot. The morning of the game (maybe it was the day before, I was too busy on Bourbon Street to pay attention at the time), the Bill announced that Rob Johnson would start the game.

 

I was sitting about 5 rows up, behind the Bills bench. Flutie was pissed off the entire game. As you may recall, Johnson had a pretty flawless, game (maybe his best as a Bill), racked up lots of yards, big plays...it was the QB the Bills had envisioned. I still remember, Flutie sat, on his helmet, about 15 yards down field, away from his teammates, and sulked like a petulant child for the entire game. I also recall, after throwing his first TD of the game, Johnson made a point of running to Flutie first on the sideline for a high-five. Flutie gave him the cold shoulder....and so it went through the whole game.

 

There were hundreds (maybe thousands) of Bills fans at the game...it was when Flutie-Flakes were at the height of their popularity. The Bills were wrapping up a good season, on their way to the playoffs, on Christmas weekend. The Bills pulled way ahead on the scoreboard, and then had to hold off a rally by the Saints. It was kind of a Bills party in New Orleans. And most of the Bills players, late in the game, seemed to really be enjoying the revelry with the Bills fans.

 

It was a fun game for Bills fans in New Orleans....the players on the sideline were awesome...Bruce, Thurman, Reed, etc were all coming to the stands to sign autographs for the die-hard Bills fans on hand...lots of people screaming for Flutie to sign their cereal boxes...but Flutie was in his own world, and couldn't give a **** about anything, other than the fact that the coach asked him to ride the pines for a week. The only person that Flutie would acknowledge was Bruce. I remember Smith taking some of the cereal boxes from kids, and carrying them over to Flutie to sign for them. Flutie was just an ass... simple as that.

 

I was always conflicted over Flutie. I pulled for him when he was in the game, and he was fun to watch at times (the run against the Jags is an all-time Bills great moment)... and please, understand when I say this that I am not implying that Johnson was better....but even when the Bills were winning with Flutie, I always felt like the Bills were winning regular season games with smoke and mirrors, it was sort of a gimmick that was only going to take the team so far. I understand the desire the Bills had to start Johnson in that Titans game. As I recall, that last season with Flutie, the chinks were starting to show in Fluties' armor. It was surely a gamble that Wade (or was it Ralph?) took, and obviously, it didn't work out. But I am not fully convinced that Flutie would have pulled out a win that fateful day in Tennessee, just as I am not convinced that Johnsons' performance was the reason they lost.

Edited January 31, 2013 by Buftex

[eball]

RJ was the ultimate tease...moreso than ANY QB the Bills have brought in since. Great athlete, rocket arm, and ACCURACY with the football. He just didn't have that "internal clock" all successful NFL QBs possess.

 

He was a "failure" as a QB for sure (his wallet likely disagrees), but his character and intelligence take far too many hits around here from ignorant fans. Comments like "10-cent head" have no basis in fact.

 

What's really interesting is the fact that Wade's (or Ralph's) decision to bench Flutie for RJ prior to the 1999 playoffs is eerily similar to Harbaugh benching Alex Smith for Kaepernick -- except RJ actually had a track record at that point of some success.

 

Funny how things turn out.

 

That said...this thread = RJ.

[ganesh]

Neither was very good actually. The D was good back then.

And when they gutted that D (1st year of Williams), RJ went 3-13 and resulted in the trade for Bledsoe.

[cmjoyce113]

 

Pretty much what happened. Oh I'm sorry...unicorns would fart cotton candy.

 

Everyone thinks we would have won the Titans game but DF lost his playoff start in '99 against the Dolphins, not that anyone remembers.

 

 

 

PTR

 

I never understood the Flutie Johnson thing we would have won if Flutie played. I've always stood by the fact that when RobJohnson walked off the field we were winning.

[habes1280]

You're kidding me.

 

Flutie v. the Dolphins: 90.05 rating against a defense that was 6th in passing defense, 3rd in overall D, and first overall in points allowed.

 

Johnson v. the Titans: 64.8 rating against a defense that was 25th overall in passing defense, 17th overall in D, and 15th overall in points.

 

Seriously -- come on.

 

If memory serves, Flutie also threw for 360 yards against that defense, and didn't go 10 for 22 passing while taking six sacks (one in the end zone).

 

I don't have a dog in this fight. I've gotten over the QB controversies of yesteryear. But some of these revisionist histories are beyond ridiculous.

[extrahammer]

I was at that game too! Really fun game you're right. I remember the first play of the game was a fumble and Bruce Smith nearly returned it for a touchdown, he was brought down at the one. At that point, it was a party the rest of the game. There were a ton of Bills fan there.

 

I snuck into the players family room after the game with my dad and got to meet Flutie and he was nice as ever. He signed a few autographs for me and sat and talked with us about the season for over 10 minutes.

 

My distaste for Flutie stems more from his personality... it is dumb to suggest that Rob Johnson was a better QB.

 

But, lets not over-inflate how good Flutie was either. I will admit, I despised him before he was a Bill, and was really bummed when they signed him. At that point in time, the Bills franchise was highly regarded, and signing Flutie just wreaked of a desperate publicity stunt.

 

I was fully behind Rob Johnson, and I am not entirely convinced Fluties' behind the scenes antics didn't play some role in his failure. Flutie was not a good teammate, or, moreover, not a good guy to have backing up a young QB. And, despite all the warm and fuzzies everyone gets for Flutie, there was a time when some of his teammates (Thurman, Reed) would have preferred #11.

 

Flutie seemed to have a case of "little man's syndrom", and sensed some fragile insecurities in Rob Johnson, and pounced on them. As somebody stated earlier in this thread, Flutie was at least as interested in being the starter as he was with what was best for the team.

 

I have referenced this in numerous threads over the years, on this topic, but I remember going to the last game of the 1998 season, in New Orleans. It was two days after Christmas, a "meaningless" game....the Bills (or Flutie as some would say) had already clinched a playoff spot. The morning of the game (maybe it was the day before, I was too busy on Bourbon Street to pay attention at the time), the Bill announced that Rob Johnson would start the game.

 

I was sitting about 5 rows up, behind the Bills bench. Flutie was pissed off the entire game. As you may recall, Johnson had a pretty flawless, game (maybe his best as a Bill), racked up lots of yards, big plays...it was the QB the Bills had envisioned. I still remember, Flutie sat, on his helmet, about 15 yards down field, away from his teammates, and sulked like a petulant child for the entire game. I also recall, after throwing his first TD of the game, Johnson made a point of running to Flutie first on the sideline for a high-five. Flutie gave him the cold shoulder....and so it went through the whole game.

 

There were hundreds (maybe thousands) of Bills fans at the game...it was when Flutie-Flakes were at the height of their popularity. The Bills were wrapping up a good season, on their way to the playoffs, on Christmas weekend. The Bills pulled way ahead on the scoreboard, and then had to hold off a rally by the Saints. It was kind of a Bills party in New Orleans. And most of the Bills players, late in the game, seemed to really be enjoying the revelry with the Bills fans.

 

It was a fun game for Bills fans in New Orleans....the players on the sideline were awesome...Bruce, Thurman, Reed, etc were all coming to the stands to sign autographs for the die-hard Bills fans on hand...lots of people screaming for Flutie to sign their cereal boxes...but Flutie was in his own world, and couldn't give a **** about anything, other than the fact that the coach asked him to ride the pines for a week. The only person that Flutie would acknowledge was Bruce. I remember Smith taking some of the cereal boxes from kids, and carrying them over to Flutie to sign for them. Flutie was just an ass... simple as that.

 

I was always conflicted over Flutie. I pulled for him when he was in the game, and he was fun to watch at times (the run against the Jags is an all-time Bills great moment)... and please, understand when I say this that I am not implying that Johnson was better....but even when the Bills were winning with Flutie, I always felt like the Bills were winning regular season games with smoke and mirrors, it was sort of a gimmick that was only going to take the team so far. I understand the desire the Bills had to start Johnson in that Titans game. As I recall, that last season with Flutie, the chinks were starting to show in Fluties' armor. It was surely a gamble that Wade (or was it Ralph?) took, and obviously, it didn't work out. But I am not fully convinced that Flutie would have pulled out a win that fateful day in Tennessee, just as I am not convinced that Johnsons' performance was the reason they lost.

[RJ (not THAT RJ)]

My distaste for Flutie stems more from his personality... it is dumb to suggest that Rob Johnson was a better QB.

 

But, lets not over-inflate how good Flutie was either. I will admit, I despised him before he was a Bill, and was really bummed when they signed him. At that point in time, the Bills franchise was highly regarded, and signing Flutie just wreaked of a desperate publicity stunt.

 

I was fully behind Rob Johnson, and I am not entirely convinced Fluties' behind the scenes antics didn't play some role in his failure. Flutie was not a good teammate, or, moreover, not a good guy to have backing up a young QB. And, despite all the warm and fuzzies everyone gets for Flutie, there was a time when some of his teammates (Thurman, Reed) would have preferred #11.

 

Flutie seemed to have a case of "little man's syndrom", and sensed some fragile insecurities in Rob Johnson, and pounced on them. As somebody stated earlier in this thread, Flutie was at least as interested in being the starter as he was with what was best for the team.

 

I have referenced this in numerous threads over the years, on this topic, but I remember going to the last game of the 1998 season, in New Orleans. It was two days after Christmas, a "meaningless" game....the Bills (or Flutie as some would say) had already clinched a playoff spot. The morning of the game (maybe it was the day before, I was too busy on Bourbon Street to pay attention at the time), the Bill announced that Rob Johnson would start the game.

 

I was sitting about 5 rows up, behind the Bills bench. Flutie was pissed off the entire game. As you may recall, Johnson had a pretty flawless, game (maybe his best as a Bill), racked up lots of yards, big plays...it was the QB the Bills had envisioned. I still remember, Flutie sat, on his helmet, about 15 yards down field, away from his teammates, and sulked like a petulant child for the entire game. I also recall, after throwing his first TD of the game, Johnson made a point of running to Flutie first on the sideline for a high-five. Flutie gave him the cold shoulder....and so it went through the whole game.

 

There were hundreds (maybe thousands) of Bills fans at the game...it was when Flutie-Flakes were at the height of their popularity. The Bills were wrapping up a good season, on their way to the playoffs, on Christmas weekend. The Bills pulled way ahead on the scoreboard, and then had to hold off a rally by the Saints. It was kind of a Bills party in New Orleans. And most of the Bills players, late in the game, seemed to really be enjoying the revelry with the Bills fans.

 

It was a fun game for Bills fans in New Orleans....the players on the sideline were awesome...Bruce, Thurman, Reed, etc were all coming to the stands to sign autographs for the die-hard Bills fans on hand...lots of people screaming for Flutie to sign their cereal boxes...but Flutie was in his own world, and couldn't give a **** about anything, other than the fact that the coach asked him to ride the pines for a week. The only person that Flutie would acknowledge was Bruce. I remember Smith taking some of the cereal boxes from kids, and carrying them over to Flutie to sign for them. Flutie was just an ass... simple as that.

 

I was always conflicted over Flutie. I pulled for him when he was in the game, and he was fun to watch at times (the run against the Jags is an all-time Bills great moment)... and please, understand when I say this that I am not implying that Johnson was better....but even when the Bills were winning with Flutie, I always felt like the Bills were winning regular season games with smoke and mirrors, it was sort of a gimmick that was only going to take the team so far. I understand the desire the Bills had to start Johnson in that Titans game. As I recall, that last season with Flutie, the chinks were starting to show in Fluties' armor. It was surely a gamble that Wade (or was it Ralph?) took, and obviously, it didn't work out. But I am not fully convinced that Flutie would have pulled out a win that fateful day in Tennessee, just as I am not convinced that Johnsons' performance was the reason they lost.

 

 

*slowly starting to clap, standing up*

 

Bravo

 

 

 

That said...this thread = RJ.

 

Bravo to this too!