dayman Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 (edited) The point of Romney's ad was that high labour costs in the US was pushing companies to go to cheaper labour markets such as China . If you think they are going to move some production there for any reason other than that, then yes you have been drinking. I personally don't give a !@#$ either way what Chrysler does but your taxpayer dollars is creating growth in a foreign market. Anyone with a brain and ears knows at the end the campaign was desperately trying to convince people in Ohio that claims of Obama successfully helping keep jobs in Ohio were false because Jeep would be moving those jobs to China. If this takes explaining beyond the his stump speech followed by ad...then a politics board isn't where you should be.... Edited January 19, 2013 by SameOldBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 (edited) Most Jeep lines have only been built in the USA and been exported. Now there will be manufacturing of all lines outside of the USA. This does not necessarily mean that there will be layoffs here, but it will take away from jobs that would be created here. Understanding that the American taxpayer bailed out Chrysler, doesn't it stand to reason there should be a little consternation over this? I know that you will see my point because you are a believer in "jobs saved and created". That dog don't hunt. What are they forever indebted? It isn't like they still owe the US gov't money. Chrysler paid everything back and with interest to the US government... Almost 3-4 years ago. Sure, America was there when they needed them... They paid us back and refinanced elsewhere. Honestly... It would be great if they would produce them here and ship them to Europe or China for those expanding markets. I guess it is cheaper to produce them within the market than shipping them halfway around the world. I really don't have heartburn. NOW, just imagine if this is like a Beth steel thing in Lackawanna when they were building Burns Harbor in the early 1960's? I would get heartburn, if they modernize elsewhere, then close the old plants here and throw the imported product back @ us... YET, I do not think that would float w/Jeep... The whole brand is built around "patriotism." It would be really hard to change that brand image without major consequences. Edited January 19, 2013 by ExiledInIllinois Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxrock Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 (edited) That dog don't hunt. What are they forever indebted? It isn't like they still owe the US gov't money. Chrysler paid everything back and with interest to the US government... Almost 3-4 years ago. Sure, America was there when they needed them... They paid us back and refinanced elsewhere. Honestly... It would be great if they would produce them here and ship them to Europe or China for those expanding markets. I guess it is cheaper to produce them within the market than shipping them halfway around the world. I really don't have heartburn. NOW, just imagine if this is like a Beth steel thing in Lackawanna when they were building Burns Harbor in the early 1960's? I would get heartburn, if they modernize elsewhere, then close the old plants here and throw the imported product back @ us... YET, I do not think that would float w/Jeep... The whole brand is built around "patriotism." It would be really hard to change that brand image without major consequences. Now that should be the lie of the year right there! Back in November of 2009, when GM announced that it would repay its government loans, it didn’t take much investigation to realize that The General was simply shuffling government money from one pocket to the other and that true “payback” was still a ways off. … And now that our government finds itself “contemplating a runaway deficit and getting rid of its 8 percent of Chrysler’s equity,” would you believe that a similar federal money-shuffle is under way? Believe it. Read more at the San Francisco Examiner: http://www.sfexamine...k#ixzz2IRA9LZG9 Edited January 19, 2013 by Oxrock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 http://coralvillecourier.typepad.com/community/2012/12/-us-taxpayers-to-lose-126-billion-on-general-motors-deal.html According to reports today, the Obama administration has outlined a plan for the U.S. Treasury to sell back taxpayers' remaining 25 percent stake in Goverment Motors, with the bankrupt company buying back shares at $27.50 a piece. That's roughly half what taxpayers were forced to invest in the company in the form of a bailout, at $53 a share. The estimated loss to taxpayers is $12.6 Billion. Had the company gone through a regular bankruptcy in the court system, it wouldn't have cost taxpayers like that. Liberals are praising this *deal* as a victory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted January 19, 2013 Author Share Posted January 19, 2013 Lies we can believe in... "I / We will not rest..." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6mfmuuxY4o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 This would be awful for Toleito. Every Jeep ever made, except the FJ, was made in the Toledo metro area. The labor, though, is extremely expensive in Ohio, but that's all they have to hang their hat on now-a-days...Owens-Illinois is about gone, Toleito Steel is gone, other then Jeep there is not crap. Even Tony Packo's has nearly sunk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 (edited) This would be awful for Toleito. Every Jeep ever made, except the FJ, was made in the Toledo metro area. The labor, though, is extremely expensive in Ohio, but that's all they have to hang their hat on now-a-days...Owens-Illinois is about gone, Toleito Steel is gone, other then Jeep there is not crap. Even Tony Packo's has nearly sunk. I thought FJ's as in FJ-40 was the old "Jeep style" Land Cruiser (before the Land Cruiser went to the "yuppie wagon" body style in the early 1980's)... And now, the FJ-Cruiser made by Toyota? Also, it is Toledo... What's w/the spelling? Joke? I see you spelled it right once... Is "Toleito" a company name? Anyway... Doesn't FJ (as in FJ Cruiser) stand for Fake Jeep or Faux Jeep? ;-) Not knocking the FJ-40 Land Cruiser... That was one beast ride... They command a good buck if you can find one not a rust bucket! Heck, even CJ's during that era came off the line already rusting! The CJ was produced from the 1950's to 1986. YJ Wrangler (square headlights) was produced from 1987 to 1994... The TJ Wrangler from 1996 (no 1995 Jeep Wrangler? I think there was a 1995 & 1/2 TJ?) to 2006... And the new JK Wrangler from 2007 to Present. FWIW... The nomenclature holds true with Toyota (as explained above) and Suzuki. The Suzuki Samurai was an SJ. Anyway... Chrysler refinanced their loan and paid the US back... What does this have to do with GM? Jeeze... You just can't please everybody... Damn if they do, damn if the don't. Edited January 20, 2013 by ExiledInIllinois Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted January 20, 2013 Author Share Posted January 20, 2013 Let's get more American companies healthy with our tax dollars so they can expand and ship jobs overseas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 I'm not sure why this is a problem. The media sucks and voters are stupid - not exactly news. We essentially require other foreign companies to at least assemble a portion of their fleet here. Why should China be different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxrock Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 I thought FJ's as in FJ-40 was the old "Jeep style" Land Cruiser (before the Land Cruiser went to the "yuppie wagon" body style in the early 1980's)... And now, the FJ-Cruiser made by Toyota? Also, it is Toledo... What's w/the spelling? Joke? I see you spelled it right once... Is "Toleito" a company name? Anyway... Doesn't FJ (as in FJ Cruiser) stand for Fake Jeep or Faux Jeep? ;-) Not knocking the FJ-40 Land Cruiser... That was one beast ride... They command a good buck if you can find one not a rust bucket! Heck, even CJ's during that era came off the line already rusting! The CJ was produced from the 1950's to 1986. YJ Wrangler (square headlights) was produced from 1987 to 1994... The TJ Wrangler from 1996 (no 1995 Jeep Wrangler? I think there was a 1995 & 1/2 TJ?) to 2006... And the new JK Wrangler from 2007 to Present. FWIW... The nomenclature holds true with Toyota (as explained above) and Suzuki. The Suzuki Samurai was an SJ. Anyway... Chrysler refinanced their loan and paid the US back... What does this have to do with GM? Jeeze... You just can't please everybody... Damn if they do, damn if the don't. No. Chrysler took more money from the Fed and paid back the loan with those dollars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 This thread re-emphasizes the core of the liberal belief system: "Obama is great because I love Obama" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 (edited) I thought FJ's as in FJ-40 was the old "Jeep style" Land Cruiser (before the Land Cruiser went to the "yuppie wagon" body style in the early 1980's)... And now, the FJ-Cruiser made by Toyota? Also, it is Toledo... What's w/the spelling? Joke? I see you spelled it right once... Is "Toleito" a company name? Anyway... Doesn't FJ (as in FJ Cruiser) stand for Fake Jeep or Faux Jeep? ;-) Not knocking the FJ-40 Land Cruiser... That was one beast ride... They command a good buck if you can find one not a rust bucket! Heck, even CJ's during that era came off the line already rusting! The CJ was produced from the 1950's to 1986. YJ Wrangler (square headlights) was produced from 1987 to 1994... The TJ Wrangler from 1996 (no 1995 Jeep Wrangler? I think there was a 1995 & 1/2 TJ?) to 2006... And the new JK Wrangler from 2007 to Present. FWIW... The nomenclature holds true with Toyota (as explained above) and Suzuki. The Suzuki Samurai was an SJ. Anyway... Chrysler refinanced their loan and paid the US back... What does this have to do with GM? Jeeze... You just can't please everybody... Damn if they do, damn if the don't. We had a class on it when I grew up in NW Ohio. Willy's became Jeep, but during the war the Gov did not see the company as big enough to make the military vehicles so they counted on Ford, making what people called the Ford Jeep. When the soldiers came home they enjoyed the Jeeps and ended up buying them up and starting a big trend. If not for Willys Overland Jeep then Champion Spark Plug might not have made it. Champion moved from Boston to Toledo after the Stranahans recommended cheaper labor, more labor and a better environment for industry. http://en.wikipedia....Frank_Stranahan - led a very interesting life. They had a very large mansion that is still there to this day - the Manor House, in a park called Wild Wood, just outside of Toledo, in Sylvania Township. oh, and it is Toleito because Toledo is a Toilet. Or, you can say Toled'oh, like Homer Simpson says... http://www.toledobla...come-sign-2.jpg http://www.toledoblade.com/local/2003/05/03/Toledo-eliminates-d-oh-uh-oh-approves-altered-welcome-sign.html Edited January 20, 2013 by jboyst62 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PearlHowardman Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 oh, and it is Toleito because Toledo is a Toilet. Or, you can say Toled'oh, like Homer Simpson says... http://www.toledobla...come-sign-2.jpg http://www.toledobla...lcome-sign.html Are you sure Toledo is that bad? Cities all across upstate New York from Niagara Falls to Newburg are pretty bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Are you sure Toledo is that bad? Cities all across upstate New York from Niagara Falls to Newburg above the Mason-Dixon Line are pretty bad. Fixed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Are you sure Toledo is that bad? Cities all across upstate New York from Niagara Falls to Newburg are pretty bad. Toleito is not awful, it has some really nice features. I grew up outside of Toledo, in Sylvania (and, no, not the Township!). Jobs in the area relied on distribution (ask EII), production and industrial services. While there is a steel industry in Toledo - Toledo Steel is Spain Toledo). One of the largest ports in the country is in Toleito. It was and may still be the largest and busiest grain port in the country. Bax closed, losing 700 jobs, Jeep has been having a hard time in Toledo and moved to the outskirts in the country, and the Industrial services are still there to support the grain, port and railway. Where there is a port there is railway. Owens-Illinois, Owens-Corning, Libbey, and Libby-Owens-Ford are not what they used to be. Dana and Champion have their headquarters there, but no one on the upper ends of those countries live in Toledo (unless the Old West End). Marathon, not sure if still, has a strong presence. Toleito has done everything it can to keep industry there, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DaimlerChrysler_Corp._v._Cuno - sort of like Winston-Salem, NC. This area as a whole, though, Winston-Salem/Greensboro/Thomasville/High Point/Lexington - well, it's not much different. Lexington and Thomasville put all their money in to the furniture business and kept other industries at bay despite the qualified labor forces that existed until the late 90's. Those industrial workers slowly retired at just the right time from the 80-90's. Most of those jobs are gone, as since their hayday, because they no longer rule the roost and goods are cheaper from overseas. There are millions of square feet from Lexington to Thomasville of empty furniture buildings. The cities even bought some trying to encourage businesses to come in - but the Industries did not keep up the buildings at wall and many are 100 years old leaving the city to foot the bill for these big empty buildings. Winston-Salem lured Dell to build desktops with huge tax breaks - you can guess how that is going as you type on your laptop, tablet or phone. Greensboro, much like the rest, have a lot of health care oriented healthcare businesses. High Point is doing better then most, but still not the big flashy place. Our joke of a Economic development guy lured a solar company to built a plant here locally. They bought up the best farmland around and promised lots of jobs for everyone, it'd be good, green industry, etc. The guy won't be happy until there is a building on every inch of this county, even though there are millions of square feet just sitting around. So, about that solar plant, last I heard there are 3 full time employees that are stationed there on a location taking hundreds of acres and each one of them was already employed with the company, so 3 jobs were brought to the company. Lexington, too, won't let other restaurants come in that may challenge their BBQ industry, for which they are world famous. The Applebees we have, IIRC was built before the forced annexation took that part of the community away - and that was when Walmart was built. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PearlHowardman Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 I've been to Cleveland, Columbus, and Cincinnati. To me they were all pretty decent cities, especially compared to what Democrats are doing to upstate New York cities. Columbus, being the Ohio state capitol is a thousand times better than Albany, the New York state capitol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 “And now comes word that Chrysler plans to start making Jeeps in -- you guessed it -- China,” a narrator says in the radio spot. “What happened to the promises made to autoworkers in Toledo and throughout Ohio -- the same hard-working men and women who were told that Obama’s auto bailout would help them?” I still don't get how this ad was false. Someone please help me out here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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