Meathead Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 maybe i missed something but why in the world would you go get somebody like matt moore (or any of the fa qbs out there), or trade for somebody like alex smith, when you already have fitz under contract and releasing him saves you close to nothing? moore or smith or campbell et al are no better than fitz, id rather they keep fitz (try to redo his deal) and stay to compete with whomever else they bring to camp just bc the fans have decided to focus all their blame on the qb doesnt mean he deserves to be cut in favor of someone who is no better and probably worse
OldTimer1960 Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 You miss 100% of the shots you do not take. You assume that there is no opportunity cost (ie what else you could have had using the pick otherwise) when you take shots at QB prospects. I think that there still needs to be judgement applied when considering QB prospects. A bunch of flawed QB prospects isn't any better than what the Bills currently have and there are still plenty of other holes to fill on this team (WR, TE, LB, CB, RT...)
NewEra Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 Yep. Those are the routes we can take. Which QBs do Marronix like most? That will probably determine the outcome. I think we end up restructuring fitz and drafting one in the 1st or 2nd. Although I prefer to cut fitz all together. He may seem like one of the better options, but in reality, he sucks and I prefer never to see him take another snap wearing a bills uniform.
Bronc24 Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 You assume that there is no opportunity cost (ie what else you could have had using the pick otherwise) when you take shots at QB prospects. I think that there still needs to be judgement applied when considering QB prospects. A bunch of flawed QB prospects isn't any better than what the Bills currently have and there are still plenty of other holes to fill on this team (WR, TE, LB, CB, RT...) The biggest hole IS QB. Only drafting Levi Brown in the last three years has not exactly addressed the position or, as you say, applied "judgement". And if my opportunity cost is Graham, that's something I can live with (and without).
White Linen Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 I think we should cover our bases and take a QB early and late in the draft, and sign a veteran (or in the case of Vick, a veterinarian). Here's where I have the QB class being drafted right now: 1 10 Geno Smith 1 23 Tyler Wilson 1 24 Matt Barkley 2 44 Landry Jones 2 50 Ryan Nassib 2 59 Tajh Boyd (Jr.--not yet decl) 3 68 E.J. Manuel 3 75 Tyler Bray (Jr.,decl) 3 86 Collin Klein 4 114 Matt Scott 4 121 Logan Thomas (Jr.) 5 154 Mike Glennon 6 170 Brendon Kay 7 209 Nick Florence 7 213 Seth Doege 7 217 Zach Mettenberger (Jr.-not yet decl) Geno's stock is likely going to rise at the individual workout and combine, so he's out, but Nix allowed as to that he has some interest in Nassib, and Landry'd be there in RD2. Glennon has come back to Earth, although he will be likely gone by our RD3, but taking Nassib-Jones-Glennon at RD2 and taking Florence-Doege-Mettenberger in addition to the vet gives you a minicamp with 3 QBs (4 if you keep TJax). You don't even have the Qb I think the Bills should draft in the 2nd round Zac Dysert being drafted?
Tcali Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 Sheppard and Bradham??? Are you kidding? Sheppard is lost in space out there--literally.Mediocre to average at stuffing a slow developing run and useless on coverage ,anticipation and open field tackling. Bradham--...I remeber watching some film on him that someone posted--college film--and thinking that this guy has no anticipation..that he waits to see where a play is going then reacts late to it.Yes he does hit hard. I just question his instincts out there. We need LBs all around.I agree that we shouldnt stretch on a QB in the 1st or 2nd that we could get in the 3rd anyway. And I agree that we should get an Alex Smith to run things while we fill our massive hole at LB and shore up some other stuff.
OldTimer1960 Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 My take on your options: If we go the trade route here Alex Smith and Colt McCoy and Jimmy Clausen and Kellen Moore would be options. The price for Alex will probably be high. Colt could probably be cheaper. Trade for him and let him compete with Fitz and who ever else we got. I respectfully disagree with the options listed besides Alex Smith. Clausen was given his shot and the Panthers thought so little of him that they drafted Cam Newton after one year with Clausen. Colt McCoy appears to be another Fitz - smart, try-hard guy who doesn't have the physical talent to be a good starter. While Kellen Moore looked OK in the pre-season and was great in college, he is a very long-shot to be even a decent starting QB. I'll admit that Moore seems to have a special ability to time passes, but his arm is so weak and his body so frail (for the NFL that is) that defenses would quickly catch on to him if he played more than a little bit. These are just my opinions...
reddogblitz Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 You don't even have the Qb I think the Bills should draft in the 2nd round Zac Dysert being drafted? Or Aaron Murray (who I would pick at 8) if he comes out. You have other Juniors on the list.
OldTimer1960 Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 I respectfully disagree with the options listed besides Alex Smith. Clausen was given his shot and the Panthers thought so little of him that they drafted Cam Newton after one year with Clausen. Colt McCoy appears to be another Fitz - smart, try-hard guy who doesn't have the physical talent to be a good starter. While Kellen Moore looked OK in the pre-season and was great in college, he is a very long-shot to be even a decent starting QB. I'll admit that Moore seems to have a special ability to time passes, but his arm is so weak and his body so frail (for the NFL that is) that defenses would quickly catch on to him if he played more than a little bit. If you were talking about Matt Moore instead of Kellen Moore, then *maybe*, but there weren't many teams interested in him last off-season and I don't think there will be this year, either. If he could be had for a 4th round pick or later then I would consider it. These are just my opinions... The biggest hole IS QB. Only drafting Levi Brown in the last three years has not exactly addressed the position or, as you say, applied "judgement". And if my opportunity cost is Graham, that's something I can live with (and without). Definitely in hind-sight it would have been better to take Russell Wilson instead of TJ Graham, however the book isn't written on either. Wilson has been great this year, but you never know if defenses will devise a way to neutralize him by keeping him in the pocket and letting his height work against him. Graham had a disappointing year, but he does have some physical talent. Anyway, I get your point and I don't disagree strongly. Once past the 2nd round, the "opportunity cost" of taking a flyer isn't that high so fire away.
Ozymandius Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 Every pick in every round should be a QB. I'm dead serious. Nobody disagrees anymore that finding a good QB immediately turns a franchise around, right? So why even waste a pick on another position? Instead, let's maximize our chances of finding a good QB. Let's say 6 of the 7 QBs we pick suck but the 3rd-rounder turns out to be Russell Wilson. That would be a great draft, we're going to the playoffs next year, and the franchise is in great hands for the next decade, right? So why even mess around? If we go 0-for-7 in this weak QB draft, then fine, we repeat the same strategy next year in what should be a stronger draft. What are the odds of going 0 for 14 in picking a good QB? I mean, I don't put anything past this pathetic franchise, but even for us, the odds are pretty low, right? Drafting all QBs in the next 2 drafts (and that's only assuming we don't hit in 2013) is the only path I can think of that would make me say: "I am confident the Bills will find a good QB within two years." Let's ponder the alternative. Can you honestly say with a straight face, "I am confident the Bills will find a good QB by using ONE high pick in the 2013 draft."
Tcali Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 Definitely in hind-sight it would have been better to take Russell Wilson instead of TJ Graham, however the book isn't written on either. Wilson has been great this year, but you never know if defenses will devise a way to neutralize him by keeping him in the pocket and letting his height work against him. Graham had a disappointing year, but he does have some physical talent. Anyway, I get your point and I don't disagree strongly. Once past the 2nd round, the "opportunity cost" of taking a flyer isn't that high so fire away. the book is written on wilson. he has skills besides just running the ball.he is cool out there--and always attacking. yes he has some kinks to work out. but already in the top 10 QBs
The Cincinnati Kid Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 Murry is staying at Georgia. I was really bummed to hear that.
HOUSE Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 What Quarterback problem We still have the smartest QB in football
BRAWNDO Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 Murry is staying at Georgia. I was really bummed to hear that. I am surprised with this weak of a class more juniors are not declaring. I think we should cover our bases and take a QB early and late in the draft, and sign a veteran (or in the case of Vick, a veterinarian). Here's where I have the QB class being drafted right now: 1 10 Geno Smith 1 23 Tyler Wilson 1 24 Matt Barkley 2 44 Landry Jones 2 50 Ryan Nassib 2 59 Tajh Boyd (Jr.--not yet decl) 3 68 E.J. Manuel 3 75 Tyler Bray (Jr.,decl) 3 86 Collin Klein 4 114 Matt Scott 4 121 Logan Thomas (Jr.) 5 154 Mike Glennon 6 170 Brendon Kay 7 209 Nick Florence 7 213 Seth Doege 7 217 Zach Mettenberger (Jr.-not yet decl) Geno's stock is likely going to rise at the individual workout and combine, so he's out, but Nix allowed as to that he has some interest in Nassib, and Landry'd be there in RD2. Glennon has come back to Earth, although he will be likely gone by our RD3, but taking Nassib-Jones-Glennon at RD2 and taking Florence-Doege-Mettenberger in addition to the vet gives you a minicamp with 3 QBs (4 if you keep TJax). This would work.
1billsfan Posted January 9, 2013 Posted January 9, 2013 (edited) I think we should cover our bases and take a QB early and late in the draft, and sign a veteran (or in the case of Vick, a veterinarian). Here's where I have the QB class being drafted right now: 1 10 Geno Smith 1 23 Tyler Wilson 1 24 Matt Barkley 2 44 Landry Jones 2 50 Ryan Nassib 2 59 Tajh Boyd (Jr.--not yet decl) 3 68 E.J. Manuel 3 75 Tyler Bray (Jr.,decl) 3 86 Collin Klein 4 114 Matt Scott 4 121 Logan Thomas (Jr.) 5 154 Mike Glennon 6 170 Brendon Kay 7 209 Nick Florence 7 213 Seth Doege 7 217 Zach Mettenberger (Jr.-not yet decl) Geno's stock is likely going to rise at the individual workout and combine, so he's out, but Nix allowed as to that he has some interest in Nassib, and Landry'd be there in RD2. Glennon has come back to Earth, although he will be likely gone by our RD3, but taking Nassib-Jones-Glennon at RD2 and taking Florence-Doege-Mettenberger in addition to the vet gives you a minicamp with 3 QBs (4 if you keep TJax). How in the world is Tyler Wilson considered a first round talent? I just watched two of his games (Rutgers and LSU) on youtube and he looks like a first read, college "dink and dunk" system passer in the mold of Blaine Gabbert. I just don't understand what others are seeing in him. His long (planned first read) passes looked horrible. They say he's "tough", but I wouldn't know because he doesn't seem to have the balls to wait and look for someone open down the field. Edited January 9, 2013 by 1billsfan
NewEra Posted January 9, 2013 Posted January 9, 2013 You don't even have the Qb I think the Bills should draft in the 2nd round Zac Dysert being drafted? Agreed. Love Dysert. Hope he's the pick.
Cheetahz Posted January 9, 2013 Posted January 9, 2013 Keep T jack, draft rookie, have legit competition and find a 3rd string qb. Jackson will give You more than fritz did. Plus a rookie can be groomed. I think this year with all the rookies starting was a fluke!! That trend will not continue.
Dibs Posted January 9, 2013 Posted January 9, 2013 You assume that there is no opportunity cost (ie what else you could have had using the pick otherwise) when you take shots at QB prospects. I think that there still needs to be judgement applied when considering QB prospects. A bunch of flawed QB prospects isn't any better than what the Bills currently have and there are still plenty of other holes to fill on this team (WR, TE, LB, CB, RT...) Apart from having the #1 pick in those special years where a Manning or Luck is available you are always selecting from flawed QB prospects.
rayray808 Posted January 9, 2013 Posted January 9, 2013 the answer is simple guys... the writing has been on the wall for a long time now... 1) Fitz stays 2) We are drafting Matt Barkley - we probably would have drafted him last year if he came out, and even the year before. with Geno getting all this hype, and his shoulder injury and USC's drop in the BCS, it enables us to get a "#1 pick QB" at 8. 3) They compete for the job. Fitz is our opening day starter, but Barkley is breathing down his neck. Any late picks, and collapses, and we hand the helm over to our rookie QB to develop. What decides wether this works or not is getting a DC who gambles and lights fire under our probowl loaded roster. We get our defense going, and we have a wonderful QB controversy in Buffalo (think Niners of this year)
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