4-3 Scheme: Our defensive's biggest need

[EmotionallyUnstable]

There has been much chatter on TBD about who to cut, who to sign and so on. A lot of it I seem to agree with. However, some people in certain cases rely too heavily on productivity, statistics and results. Tackles, points and rankings are good assessments for a defense, yes. But it is difficult to judge an individual player on this alone. This being said, I would like to argue that our biggest need, by far, is Outside linebacker. Positional roles in a 4-3 scheme are crucial to overall success. Frankly, many players on our defense do not play how scheme intends them to...Positionally, lets look at responsibilities of the front seven in run defense based on our 4-3 scheme.

 

-Defensive Tackles: Must penetrate LOS and keep guards/center off our linebackers leaving them free to scrape

 

-Defensive ends: Must compress and contain the football, forcing it inside to our scraping backers

 

-Mike: Usually responsible for B to B gaps, should scrape closed doors and fill open windows

 

-Sam: Meet lead blockers @ LOS, head on, keeping the flow dead in its tracks.

 

-Will: Fill, fill, fill, often unblocked in run game. Must make plays!!! **In football, the Will is the hardest player to block...he is often removed by formation, or left unaccounted for to get lost in traffic.

 

Buffalo's problem? There is no outside linebackers who can properly fill these roles. Too often is Sheppard (Mike) filling holes and eating guards. When this happens, we rely on guys like Bryan Scott and Nick Barnett to make plays. You think this is an accident? This is strategy. Teams feed off of this. i think if we acquire an outside backer who has a nose for the ball and is not afraid to blow up a 300 lb guard, our defense will greatly improve. I would love to see Kelvin Sheppard roam free in the middle. He makes good reads, is a reliable tackler and a defensive leader. Not a 3 down guy, but don't count this guy out. He does a lot more than make tackles.

 

I am not spit balling here. But I will not pretend to know it all. This is merely my take. After 4 years of a collegiate career in football, I know a fair share of the x's and o's. I'd love to hear everyone's take on this. So do we really need a MLB? or is lack of execution in our scheme camouflaging our problems...

[K-9]

Excellent post.

 

While you and I aren't in agreement on what Shep currently brings to the table physically, I can't agree more with how you've framed our defense. And you are spot on with the role of a DE in our scheme. Mario has done VERY well all year setting a corner and turning the play back to the pursuit but as good as he's been, Kyle Moore has been twice as bad. Can't set an edge to save his life and Bradham has suffered because of it.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[EmotionallyUnstable]

Thanks man. Couldn't agree more about K.Moore really limiting linebacker play. He needs to go, for sure. Curious, what do you see in Sheppard?

[jcbillsfan]

Fwiw. I listen to polian on one of the Sirius football shows and he said no line backers over rated secondary players.

 

A second strong effect d end would help a lot

[JPS]

The Bills do not have a qualified professional linebacker on the roster.

[Dragonborn10]

Why is it every fan new the LB's were awful but the GM and HC did nothing to upgrade? I know they spent a ton of money on the DL but to rely on an old Barnett a DE turned OLB in Moats was dumb.

I am sorry but Sheppard is a bust. I would rather see a new MLB and try him at OLB to see if he can give you anything there. I can't believe I am saying this but Poz probably was better.

They need at least three new bodies in camp that have legit shots at starting not just making the roster. At least one needs to come via FA.

I don't have an opinion on Bradham. I am hopeful but just don't know.

Resigning Byrd and Levitre are critical so they can focus on WR, LB, and QB.

[boyst]

I can't believe I am saying this but Poz probably was better.

Poz, Whitner and Dwan Edwards on this team would beat having Barnett, Moore, Spencer Johnson and at the time Merriman.

I like us keeping Scott and GWilson at the time, but Scott has been misused and Wilson hit his peak. I do not think keeping the previous three would have kept Mario away due to his contract.

 

Anyway, yeah, this is pretty much what I posted a while back.

[thewildrabbit]

The Bills defenses biggest need? How about a new defensive coordinator

 

Buffalo's biggest problem, is the type of scheme the DC is running whereas most of the pressure on the QB comes from only the D line. A DC who will kick some butt when the players miss tackles, miss their gaps and make mistake after mistake.

 

Plus, assistant coaches that will actually teach proper techniques in tackling, positioning to intercept and strip the ball to make turnovers

[tombstone56]

GOTTA SAY i think our first rd is either going to wind up as teeo or jarvis jones,, but i agree get a dc that knows how to use them,, my question is if gailey goes does the new hc and dc keep the 4-3?

[billsfan714]

As a fan living in Pennsylvania, I keep seeing the Bills draft corners who never develop into shut down corners while the Steelers keep the linebacker corps stocked with picks. Quick on the last 2 Steeler superbowl teams how many number 1 pick corners did they have? Since 2000 the Steelers have never taken a CB with a first rounder and have only spent 2 second rounders on corners.

[ny33]

GOTTA SAY i think our first rd is either going to wind up as teeo or jarvis jones,, but i agree get a dc that knows how to use them,, my question is if gailey goes does the new hc and dc keep the 4-3?

 

Do you know anything about Jarvis Jones? A) he'll probably be drafted by a 3-4 team, and B) he has a degenerative spinal condition that will probably drop him to a team that can afford to take risks in the draft.

[3rdand12]

There has been much chatter on TBD about who to cut, who to sign and so on. A lot of it I seem to agree with. However, some people in certain cases rely too heavily on productivity, statistics and results. Tackles, points and rankings are good assessments for a defense, yes. But it is difficult to judge an individual player on this alone. This being said, I would like to argue that our biggest need, by far, is Outside linebacker. Positional roles in a 4-3 scheme are crucial to overall success. Frankly, many players on our defense do not play how scheme intends them to...Positionally, lets look at responsibilities of the front seven in run defense based on our 4-3 scheme.

 

-Defensive Tackles: Must penetrate LOS and keep guards/center off our linebackers leaving them free to scrape

 

-Defensive ends: Must compress and contain the football, forcing it inside to our scraping backers

 

-Mike: Usually responsible for B to B gaps, should scrape closed doors and fill open windows

 

-Sam: Meet lead blockers @ LOS, head on, keeping the flow dead in its tracks.

 

-Will: Fill, fill, fill, often unblocked in run game. Must make plays!!! **In football, the Will is the hardest player to block...he is often removed by formation, or left unaccounted for to get lost in traffic.

 

Buffalo's problem? There is no outside linebackers who can properly fill these roles. Too often is Sheppard (Mike) filling holes and eating guards. When this happens, we rely on guys like Bryan Scott and Nick Barnett to make plays. You think this is an accident? This is strategy. Teams feed off of this. i think if we acquire an outside backer who has a nose for the ball and is not afraid to blow up a 300 lb guard, our defense will greatly improve. I would love to see Kelvin Sheppard roam free in the middle. He makes good reads, is a reliable tackler and a defensive leader. Not a 3 down guy, but don't count this guy out. He does a lot more than make tackles.

 

I am not spit balling here. But I will not pretend to know it all. This is merely my take. After 4 years of a collegiate career in football, I know a fair share of the x's and o's. I'd love to hear everyone's take on this. So do we really need a MLB? or is lack of execution in our scheme camouflaging our problems...

Well you said you would and you did.

Thanks for the post.

I mentioned it earlier and i will again here. Wannstadt was the linebackers coach last year and was not succesful at getting the players in the correct position. Then we saw it first half of this year. It was appaling actually.

Agreed about stats. dont care for them much myself. Watching the games and players tells the story well enough.

Appreciate your re clarifying the players roles in a 4-3. Now could you CC Dave and his crew !

[NewEra]

 

 

Do you know anything about Jarvis Jones? A) he'll probably be drafted by a 3-4 team, and B) he has a degenerative spinal condition that will probably drop him to a team that can afford to take risks in the draft.

 

This. While I love his talent, he doesn't fit in as a 4-3 OLB IMO. Pass

[TakeYouToTasker]

Good assessment. I agree wholeheartedly with your review of our outside linebacker play. Barnett is beginning to show his age, and Scott just isn't big enough, strong enough, or physical enough to play linebacker in this league; not even in hybrid personnel fronts. Bradham represent nice depth, and plays with great physicality, but is still too raw to get as many snaps as he does. However, I do think he'll develop into a solid starter given time.

 

I disagree with your take on Shep. I don't think he is very instinctual or plays downhill enough. He does a poor job fighting through blocks, and doesn't seem to move latterally well. Again, I think he represents a nice depth option, but I don't feel as though he's a reliable starter.

 

My strongest point of agreement is your stance on our line play. As bad as our linebackers have been, the inability our defensive tackle to penetrate and soak up blockers, and the lack of a bookend for Mario to set the weak side edge has made our linebackers jobs nearly impossible.

Edited December 24, 2012 by TakeYouToTasker

[Buffalo Barbarian]

There has been much chatter on TBD about who to cut, who to sign and so on. A lot of it I seem to agree with. However, some people in certain cases rely too heavily on productivity, statistics and results. Tackles, points and rankings are good assessments for a defense, yes. But it is difficult to judge an individual player on this alone. This being said, I would like to argue that our biggest need, by far, is Outside linebacker. Positional roles in a 4-3 scheme are crucial to overall success. Frankly, many players on our defense do not play how scheme intends them to...Positionally, lets look at responsibilities of the front seven in run defense based on our 4-3 scheme.

 

-Defensive Tackles: Must penetrate LOS and keep guards/center off our linebackers leaving them free to scrape

 

-Defensive ends: Must compress and contain the football, forcing it inside to our scraping backers

 

-Mike: Usually responsible for B to B gaps, should scrape closed doors and fill open windows

 

-Sam: Meet lead blockers @ LOS, head on, keeping the flow dead in its tracks.

 

-Will: Fill, fill, fill, often unblocked in run game. Must make plays!!! **In football, the Will is the hardest player to block...he is often removed by formation, or left unaccounted for to get lost in traffic.

 

Buffalo's problem? There is no outside linebackers who can properly fill these roles. Too often is Sheppard (Mike) filling holes and eating guards. When this happens, we rely on guys like Bryan Scott and Nick Barnett to make plays. You think this is an accident? This is strategy. Teams feed off of this. i think if we acquire an outside backer who has a nose for the ball and is not afraid to blow up a 300 lb guard, our defense will greatly improve. I would love to see Kelvin Sheppard roam free in the middle. He makes good reads, is a reliable tackler and a defensive leader. Not a 3 down guy, but don't count this guy out. He does a lot more than make tackles.

 

I am not spit balling here. But I will not pretend to know it all. This is merely my take. After 4 years of a collegiate career in football, I know a fair share of the x's and o's. I'd love to hear everyone's take on this. So do we really need a MLB? or is lack of execution in our scheme camouflaging our problems...

 

right on point, that's why I didn't put a MLB in my sig

 

Fwiw. I listen to polian on one of the Sirius football shows and he said no line backers over rated secondary players.

 

A second strong effect d end would help a lot

 

I think you missed a few words in there and I'm not sure what you are saying.

[JPS]

As a fan living in Pennsylvania, I keep seeing the Bills draft corners who never develop into shut down corners while the Steelers keep the linebacker corps stocked with picks. Quick on the last 2 Steeler superbowl teams how many number 1 pick corners did they have? Since 2000 the Steelers have never taken a CB with a first rounder and have only spent 2 second rounders on corners.

 

A freakin Men

[EmotionallyUnstable]

Well you said you would and you did.

Thanks for the post.

I mentioned it earlier and i will again here. Wannstadt was the linebackers coach last year and was not succesful at getting the players in the correct position. Then we saw it first half of this year. It was appaling actually.

Agreed about stats. dont care for them much myself. Watching the games and players tells the story well enough.

Appreciate your re clarifying the players roles in a 4-3. Now could you CC Dave and his crew !

 

Glad to hear we share similar view points on statistics. Anyone can read a stat. It takes time and effort to truly know your players.

 

and I don't want to CC Dave. I wouldn't want to distract him from packing his bags...

[jjmac]

There has been much chatter on TBD about who to cut, who to sign and so on. A lot of it I seem to agree with. However, some people in certain cases rely too heavily on productivity, statistics and results. Tackles, points and rankings are good assessments for a defense, yes. But it is difficult to judge an individual player on this alone. This being said, I would like to argue that our biggest need, by far, is Outside linebacker. Positional roles in a 4-3 scheme are crucial to overall success. Frankly, many players on our defense do not play how scheme intends them to...Positionally, lets look at responsibilities of the front seven in run defense based on our 4-3 scheme.

 

-Defensive Tackles: Must penetrate LOS and keep guards/center off our linebackers leaving them free to scrape

 

-Defensive ends: Must compress and contain the football, forcing it inside to our scraping backers

 

-Mike: Usually responsible for B to B gaps, should scrape closed doors and fill open windows

 

-Sam: Meet lead blockers @ LOS, head on, keeping the flow dead in its tracks.

 

-Will: Fill, fill, fill, often unblocked in run game. Must make plays!!! **In football, the Will is the hardest player to block...he is often removed by formation, or left unaccounted for to get lost in traffic.

 

Buffalo's problem? There is no outside linebackers who can properly fill these roles. Too often is Sheppard (Mike) filling holes and eating guards. When this happens, we rely on guys like Bryan Scott and Nick Barnett to make plays. You think this is an accident? This is strategy. Teams feed off of this. i think if we acquire an outside backer who has a nose for the ball and is not afraid to blow up a 300 lb guard, our defense will greatly improve. I would love to see Kelvin Sheppard roam free in the middle. He makes good reads, is a reliable tackler and a defensive leader. Not a 3 down guy, but don't count this guy out. He does a lot more than make tackles.

 

I am not spit balling here. But I will not pretend to know it all. This is merely my take. After 4 years of a collegiate career in football, I know a fair share of the x's and o's. I'd love to hear everyone's take on this. So do we really need a MLB? or is lack of execution in our scheme camouflaging our problems...

 

I'll agree that these are all needs, but I want to see a scheme involved that utilizes more blitzes.

[Kiwi Bills fan]

It all starts with the coaching staff on this team.

The team is a rudderless ship with most of crew having lost interest.

We need coaches that will light a fire under these guys asses. (Well, it would also be nice if they had a clue in what they were doing.)

 

Go Bills

[Best Player Available]

The Bills defenses biggest need? How about a new defensive coordinator

 

Plus, assistant coaches that will actually teach proper techniques in tackling, positioning to intercept and strip the ball to make turnovers

I have read your post and agree. Everyone needs to go. D-line coach L-backer coach (do they have one?)and most importantly a secondary/D-Back coach. Pitiful, embarassing coaching through 15 games. That in hindsight looked EXACTLY like the 4 pre-season maulings they took. Save for one series against the Steelers. Powells 34 yard punt average (yesterday) should have that A-hole ST coach eat his jock in front of Ralph next week. Moorman was old, but a cornerstone on a team of pure trash for years. Hence, we now have the "Moorman curse." Expect that to be in place until year 7 of the new lease.

Also, wondering out loud what Kelsay's, Barnett's & Merriman's next extensions will be worth?