Dean Cain Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 I'm not disagreeing, but without owners agreeing to open their books for inspection, how did you arrive at this number? GO BILLS!!! This was a widely disclosed number in the Buffalo News last week in regards to the stadium lease & Toronto deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 I like Chuck Pollock's columns, and he writes a good one about the lease today. But at the end, he throws in this line "He's in financial trouble and in desperation to keep the team in a town that's incredibly loyal with a fan-base second to none." That is the very first time I have heard that Did the Mario signing send him into a hole? If that is true, does it affect decisions on coaches, GM, FAs etc This is a big deal...this guy needs to follow up with info if he has it. I used to enjoy his columns, but I don't read them any longer. He seems out of touch to me. Regarding the quote that brought about this thread...did he back this up with more detail? If not, very irresponsible reporting IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 Plus, how much does Ralph receive annually for the Toronto series? Wasn't that a $10 million deal for the five years? $78m over the five years, up front, the day the deal was signed. Not sure of any new numbers after the first deal expired but I'd bet it's not nearly as much. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 I doubt Ralph has leveraged the team. It's not like he lives extravagantly. And with the new CBA, he's making out far better than under that POS 2006 one. As for the $400M penalty for breaking the lease in the first 7 years, that's a hefty price for a new owner to pay. Especially since there is an equal or greater relocation fee from the NFL, and likely no potential city will build a $1B stadium without a major contribution from the owner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Daddy Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 $78m over the five years, up front, the day the deal was signed. Not sure of any new numbers after the first deal expired but I'd bet it's not nearly as much. GO BILLS!!! Yikes, I was way off. That's a lot of scratch for a miserable product/event. Why wouild Toronto even want to re-up...there's no way they profited from the arrangement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 His net worth is over $900 million according to Forbes. If that includes the team which it most likely does, he's not worth much more than the team. This is a bit hard to believe to say the least. Agree with the OP. To offhandedly mention that Ralph's in financial trouble, with no elaboration, is irresponsible on Pollock's part. So Chuck Pollock lobs a grenade with no attribution? Nice journalism there, bucko. Let's deconstruct that statement, shall we? Ralph's in trouble so he's "desperate" to keep the team in WNY??? Desperate, when he could have sold the Bills for over $1 billion before he signed the lease?? (Is it even signed yet??) PTR I used to enjoy his columns, but I don't read them any longer. He seems out of touch to me. Regarding the quote that brought about this thread...did he back this up with more detail? If not, very irresponsible reporting IMO. Amazing isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartacus Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 (edited) Good point. Others have mentioned this as well around here over the years and the theory is that RW has already borrowed against his equity. I don't for a second believe RW is in financial trouble or that the Bills have cash flow problems. GO BILLS!!! People are financially illiterate Borrowing money by itself does nothing to change his net worth or reduce his estate tax, unless he took the borrowed money and threw it out of a helicopter. While his debt goes up, so does the assets he gets cash for the debt In fact, if the assets he bought with the borrowed cash produce more than the debt service on the debt, his total net worth will increase However, the big money deals he gave to Mario Williams and Fitz have generated no return, so I guess those go down as estate planning moves. Edited December 25, 2012 by spartacus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitchmurraydowntown Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 He needs to live on his allowance, which is ample. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjmac Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 His net worth is over $900 million according to Forbes. Yeah, I'd like to be in that kind of financial trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 As others have said, Pollack made a statement with no facts to back it up. I seriously doubt the Bills or Ralph are in financial trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 I doubt Ralph has leveraged the team. It's not like he lives extravagantly. And with the new CBA, he's making out far better than under that POS 2006 one. As for the $400M penalty for breaking the lease in the first 7 years, that's a hefty price for a new owner to pay. Especially since there is an equal or greater relocation fee from the NFL, and likely no potential city will build a $1B stadium without a major contribution from the owner. Nice try doc. Ralph made a ton of money during that CBA. You know this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 I like Chuck Pollock's columns, and he writes a good one about the lease today. But at the end, he throws in this line "He's in financial trouble and in desperation to keep the team in a town that's incredibly loyal with a fan-base second to none." That is the very first time I have heard that Did the Mario signing send him into a hole? If that is true, does it affect decisions on coaches, GM, FAs etc This is a big deal...this guy needs to follow up with info if he has it. sounds like Ralph needs to sell the team. There is no way in hell RW is in financial trouble unless Littman and the boys have been embezzling funds all these years. And I don't think RW is "desperate" to keep the team in Buffalo one way or the other. I simply take him at his word when he said that as long as he's alive the Bills would remain. After that, all bets are off. Pollack should also consider the new TV revenues that will kick in in a couple years. Even with the dept service a new owner would incur, those new revenues will make it a LOT easier for a new owner to cope even in a market like Buffalo. GO BILLS!!! even better reason for team to stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 If that includes the team which it most likely does, he's not worth much more than the team. This is a bit hard to believe to say the least. Why is it hard to believe? Have you seen anything that Ralph Wilson Indusies Inc has produced? All I know is that people keep saying that Wilson is a successful businessman outside the NFL, yet where is the proof? It wouldn't be beyond a doubt that Wilson has a cash flow problem, because I'm guessing if he's running his other businesses like his football team, he is in trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shoto Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 The Bills made $27 Million last year, they are fiscally sound, unless Ralph is making it rain at 93 at the Clubs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 Nice try doc. Ralph made a ton of money during that CBA. You know this. He made money, but not as much as before or after. But nice try attempting to defend that POS 2006 CBA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 That's BS speculation on Pollack's part. Nothing would suggest outside a drive by comment like his that Ralph Wilson or the Bills for that matter are having money issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corp000085 Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 Why is it hard to believe? Have you seen anything that Ralph Wilson Indusies Inc has produced? All I know is that people keep saying that Wilson is a successful businessman outside the NFL, yet where is the proof? Maybe I defend ralph because my own grandfather is In a similar situation as ralph is in right now... He's really old and he's lived a good life so far... I will defend ralph now though. The man took a financial gamble on a team. No, buffalo was not his first choice, but he gambled on buffalo. He gambled on the afl and he won. He put down $25000 and turned it into $900000000. Count those zeros... Even in his old age, when by all accounts, he was a ticking time bomb in front of a microphone due to his old age senility. In 2006, he stood up and said that the CBA shouldn't have been ratified because it was not understood by the owners yet. He was lambasted but he was right. It was a bad deal. Ralph Wilson and his legacy doesn't need to prove anything to anyone. 52 years of business in buffalo ny proves this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 Maybe I defend ralph because my own grandfather is In a similar situation as ralph is in right now... He's really old and he's lived a good life so far... I will defend ralph now though. The man took a financial gamble on a team. No, buffalo was not his first choice, but he gambled on buffalo. He gambled on the afl and he won. He put down $25000 and turned it into $900000000. Count those zeros... Even in his old age, when by all accounts, he was a ticking time bomb in front of a microphone due to his old age senility. In 2006, he stood up and said that the CBA shouldn't have been ratified because it was not understood by the owners yet. He was lambasted but he was right. It was a bad deal. Ralph Wilson and his legacy doesn't need to prove anything to anyone. 52 years of business in buffalo ny proves this. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mead107 Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 He made his money from insurance and mining industry.he gives away a lot of money every year. Bailed out several owners when the league started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corp000085 Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 PTR Thanks bro. See you in the nc state fairground parking lot soon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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