tomato can Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 I know there have been a lot of debates on teachers and their union on the board. Below is a story about former QB Jon Kitna who is now a teacher. A lot of people don't argee with their union and often rip on the teachers for standing with the union but I believe that this story sheds some light on what they are up against all the time. Most of the teachers can not do what he has done on the financial side of things but I believe there are many that go above and beyond to help the kids. Any way I dont want to take away from the story because its really a great story. http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl--former-nfl-qb-jon-kitna-finds-‘gold-mine’-at-a-school-where-other-teachers-only-saw-problems-194739063.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keukasmallies Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Great story! I've always said that the key to being an excellent teacher is to love kids, rather than mastering books of subject matter. Excel at the former and the latter will take care of itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayman Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 “Keeetna! Keeetna! Keeetna!” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Large Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 that's inspiring. Inside of every bad kid is a good kid that wants to come out and shine.... Kitna has, like many other exceptional teachers are catalyst for this... The question is, is there a way to replicate this across the board in a way that is effective both resulst and cost wise? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 that's inspiring. Inside of every bad kid is a good kid that wants to come out and shine.... Kitna has, like many other exceptional teachers are catalyst for this... The question is, is there a way to replicate this across the board in a way that is effective both resulst and cost wise? This is quite a nice story, but remember, it is the exception. Not too many teachers would request all the bad apples for their class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keukasmallies Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Maybe the lesson is that groups of like students grow together when shown reasonable rules, support for their needs and rewards for their successes. For example, when I was a high school principal I had occasion to assign certain students to a small highly structured program outside of our school. Often, the students began to succeed nicely. Then the principal of the program would call me and tell me that the student was ready to return to the regular program. I always refused to permit the student to return--for this reason: We had finally found a program where the student was succeeding, why throw him/her back into the environment where he/she had failed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Maybe the lesson is that groups of like students grow together when shown reasonable rules, support for their needs and rewards for their successes. For example, when I was a high school principal I had occasion to assign certain students to a small highly structured program outside of our school. Often, the students began to succeed nicely. Then the principal of the program would call me and tell me that the student was ready to return to the regular program. I always refused to permit the student to return--for this reason: We had finally found a program where the student was succeeding, why throw him/her back into the environment where he/she had failed? Point well taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Large Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 This is quite a nice story, but remember, it is the exception. Not too many teachers would request all the bad apples for their class. Yeah, its a good point. As a teacher though, taking the !@#$ ups from the bottom of the barrel to achieving is a WAY better indicator of performance/results than skimming the cream..... Maybe we should pay the teachers who take the worst student and get them to perform handsomely...... Nah, we'll pay the under performers just the same.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomato can Posted December 21, 2012 Author Share Posted December 21, 2012 (edited) The question is, is there a way to replicate this across the board in a way that is effective both resulst and cost wise? I believe that this can be done. I wont say that I know exactly how to achieve this. The taxpayers are paying the bill and they should demand the best results. This is quite a nice story, but remember, it is the exception. Not too many teachers would request all the bad apples for their class. I believe that there is a lot of teachers out there that would take on the bad apples. Some teachers love their jobs and would embrace the challenge but we still have some teachers that show up and just teach the class that is given to them. I won't pretend that there isn't bad teachers out there, i'm sure there are plenty. That is one of the areas that I wish the teachers union would bend on. Its one thing if a teacher is trying really hard every day to get the students to learn but I don't like when a teachers just shows up and does the basics of the job and doesn't care what the results are. Maybe the lesson is that groups of like students grow together when shown reasonable rules, support for their needs and rewards for their successes. For example, when I was a high school principal I had occasion to assign certain students to a small highly structured program outside of our school. Often, the students began to succeed nicely. Then the principal of the program would call me and tell me that the student was ready to return to the regular program. I always refused to permit the student to return--for this reason: We had finally found a program where the student was succeeding, why throw him/her back into the environment where he/she had failed? I would say that was a great call on your part. Yeah, its a good point. As a teacher though, taking the !@#$ ups from the bottom of the barrel to achieving is a WAY better indicator of performance/results than skimming the cream..... Maybe we should pay the teachers who take the worst student and get them to perform handsomely...... Nah, we'll pay the under performers just the same.... Maybe there should be a different pay scale for teachers that take on the bad students and get them to perform at an acceptable level. It could create an incentive for other teachers that want to make more money to step up and take on big challenges. Edited December 21, 2012 by tomato can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 I believe that this can be done. I wont say that I know exactly how to achieve this. The taxpayers are paying the bill and they should demand the best results. I believe that there is a lot of teachers out there that would take on the bad apples. Some teachers love their jobs and would embrace the challenge but we still have some teachers that show up and just teach the class that is given to them. I won't pretend that there isn't bad teachers out there, i'm sure there are plenty. That is one of the areas that I wish the teachers union would bend on. Its one thing if a teacher is trying really hard every day to get the students to learn but I don't like when a teachers just shows up and does the basics of the job and doesn't care what the results are. I would say that was a great call on your part. Maybe there should be a different pay scale for teachers that take on the bad students and get them to perform at an acceptable level. It could create an incentive for other teachers that want to make more money to step up and take on big challenges. Are you kidding me? The teacher unions have fought merit pay tooth and nail for like forever. Tells ya something doesn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomato can Posted December 21, 2012 Author Share Posted December 21, 2012 Are you kidding me? The teacher unions have fought merit pay tooth and nail for like forever. Tells ya something doesn't it? 3rd I don't agree with everything that the teachers union does. I honestly don't have that big an issue with merit pay. While I do agree with teacher tenure I believe the teachers union should work with the board of education to make the process easier to weed out the bad teachers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 3rd I don't agree with everything that the teachers union does. I honestly don't have that big an issue with merit pay. While I do agree with teacher tenure I believe the teachers union should work with the board of education to make the process easier to weed out the bad teachers. But when it comes down to a vote like in Wisconsin to break the grip that the teachers unions had on the state, what was your position? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomato can Posted December 22, 2012 Author Share Posted December 22, 2012 (edited) But when it comes down to a vote like in Wisconsin to break the grip that the teachers unions had on the state, what was your position? 3rd, i'm sure you can tell for the most part I do support labor unions. In regards to the Wisconsin situation if Gov Walker has the votes to pass a law that limits or eliminates collective bargning then thats just the way it is. If the unions want to protest then so be it but do it peacefully and responsibily. Violent protest dont solve a thing and will not fix their problem. Pols feeling the state to resist a vote is just plain stupid and the pols that did that should have resigned. If they didn't like the results they should work harder to win the power and votes to change the result. Again unions are not perfect but they do a lot of good things for workers. Fighting for the best outcome in pay and benefits isn't a bad things but they have to remember they can also price themselves out of the market if they over reach. Nothing last forever and times appear to be changing. Unions are losing power and wages are on the way down for a lot of workers not just unions workers and more and more jobs are being eliminated or outsourced to a sweat shop in another country. Flip side of nothing last forever, the top earners have lived nicely off the Bush tax cuts. Those cuts cuts didn't really do much for middle income to lower income people but half of the voting populations appears to want the tax rates completely jacked up on those much higher earners. Those CEO and higher management people say they had no choice to outsource the jobs for the company or it wouldn't survive and did this while collecting a really handsome salary and lots of bonuses and benefits. Obviously they felt that they were entitled to those big salaries, bonuses, stock options, & benefits because they worked hard. The guy who got his job shipped overseas probably feels that a large portion of his salary went into the pockets of upper management, so come tax time those people that lost jobs want to see those upper management folks get it stuck to them. Again times are changing, the unions and middle class are losing there strong hold on good paying jobs and benefits and they are voting for pols that are willing to stick it to the top earners that are some what responsible for the loss of jobs and for the declining wages and benefits. I'm some where in the middle of all of this Edited December 22, 2012 by tomato can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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