Fitz was outstanding.. for all you haters

[KollegeStudnet]

Yeah, an outstanding loser

[Alphadawg7]

Yikes. I can tell this is a very sensitive subject for you. Yes we were at home. Our line was terrible yesterday. Why would it be hard to drive 60 yards in bad conditions behind a patchwork line in 50 seconds? Especially against a pass rush that had been getting to the qb all day? Jeez I have no idea.

 

As much as you pan people for thinking they are in love with Fitz (we aren't he just isn't the worst player in the league at qb) I have to say that you are no longer thinking rationally when it comes to Fitz. To you he is THE problem and EVERYTHING is his fault. I don't get how you can't see any of the other much larger problems with this team. Namely Chan's play calling and the line. Chan decided to not kick a fg and what was the point differential? He had a pass/run ratio that was way out of whack for a game that the Bills led the majority of. When healthy the o-line plays well with Snow and Young it was horrendous. The Rams had 5 sacks and 11 hits on the qb! Any qb will be shaky behind that line.

 

Actually you are wrong about me. All game long I was more upset at Chan for putting the ball in Fitz's hands more than I was with what Fitz was doing with it. Chan not going for a FG is inexcusable and should lead to his firing TODAY IMO. My level of frustration in this thread is based solely on the stupidity of calling Fitz outstanding yesterday, which any fool with at least one eye could see he wasn't.

 

But you want to know what really bothers me...its the constant excuses of things like making it seem impossible to drive down and give us a shot at a FG. That is pathetic, and that is straight out of the book "Things losers say" and the losing culture is not just in the locker room, but among the fan base who now actually try and validate losing.

 

If the situation was reversed and we were up 15-12 with a minute left, those same people trying to make excuses for Fitz would also have been expecting the opposing QB to tie or win the game. No one is saying its easy, but the same fans saying how impossible it was would have been saying its not only easy but expected that the opponent would have been able to do it if the situation was reversed ..just like those same people were saying all drive long during the St Louis drive to get the go ahead TD.

 

i am sorry, I just dont read the book "Things losers say" and then quote with things like it was too hard, or too difficult. We were AT HOME, against a FIVE win team, with our SEASON on the line...and yet his last drive was pathetic that ended in an INT. I can name 20 QB's without blinking an eye capable of leading their team to a FG or better there. Does it mean it was easy, no...means, its just not something Fitz does or has ever been able to do.

 

MOST IMPORTANTLY wasnt even the last drive...it was also the pathetic drive he had before we had to give the ball back to the Rams. The game was as much on the line there as it was on the last drive. THREE, just three times did we convert a third down and we threw on almost all of them that we didnt convert...actually I think all that didnt convert were passes.

 

The captialized words are not me yelling, just emphasizing key words is all...I respect your opinion, just sharing mine.

Edited December 10, 2012 by Alphadawg7

[section122]

Actually you are wrong about me. All game long I was more upset at Chan for putting the ball in Fitz's hands more than I was with what Fitz was doing with it. Chan not going for a FG is inexcusable and should lead to his firing TODAY IMO. My level of frustration in this thread is based solely on the stupidity of calling Fitz outstanding yesterday, which any fool with at least one eye could see he wasn't.

 

But you want to know what really bothers me...its the constant excuses of things like making it seem impossible to drive down and give us a shot at a FG. That is pathetic, and that is straight out of the book "Things losers say" and the losing culture is not just in the locker room, but among the fan base who now actually try and validate losing.

 

If the situation was reversed and we were up 15-12 with a minute left, those same people trying to make excuses for Fitz would also have been expecting the opposing QB to tie or win the game. No one is saying its easy, but the same fans saying how impossible it was would have been saying its not only easy but expected that the opponent would have been able to do it if the situation was reversed ..just like those same people were saying all drive long during the St Louis drive to get the go ahead TD.

 

i am sorry, I just dont read the book "Things losers say" and then quote with things like it was too hard, or too difficult. We were AT HOME, against a FIVE win team, with our SEASON on the line...and yet his last drive was pathetic that ended in an INT. I can name 20 QB's without blinking an eye capable of leading their team to a FG or better there. Does it mean it was easy, no...means, its just not something Fitz does or has ever been able to do.

 

MOST IMPORTANTLY wasnt even the last drive...it was also the pathetic drive he had before we had to give the ball back to the Rams. The game was as much on the line there as it was on the last drive. THREE, just three times did we convert a third down and we threw on almost all of them.

 

The captialized words are not me yelling, just emphasizing key words is all...I respect your opinion, just sharing mine.

I don't think it is impossible for him to drive down the field just improbable. With the limitations of the line and the ferociousness of the pass rush there was going to be no time for the long throws that were necessary for the drive. It isn't the drives Fitz had as you stated it was the play calling Chan had. In the 4th quarter before the lead change the Bills had 3 drives that should have gone run run run. They didn't 1) run, run, run (pass play called), pass 2) run, pass, pass 3) run, run, pass. 3 times Chan didn't do what he should have and that is his fault. Do you know why he couldn't do what he was supposed to? 1) he was dumb and kept running Freddy leaving CJ on the sideline - his fault and 2) the o-line got no push and those runs went for 14, -1, 1, 3, 1, -1, and 2 yards. This was the time to grind out the victory and the o-line couldn't do it.

 

The Bills should have won yesterday but the game should have never come down to a last second drive. There should have been urgency to score a td at the half, there should have been a fg attempt instead of a punt, and for the love of god the D needs a stop when it counts (not at all there fault - holding a team to 15 should get the w but still frustrating). There is so much that goes into losing it isn't just 1 drive.

[Wayne Cubed]

Wayne Cubed stopped defending him. It's time for everyone else to, too.

 

Exactly! Been off that ship since the bye week when the defense showed up for the season. But can you blame fans, this is the one position the Bills still haven't figured out and a lot of people, myself included thought it was finally figured out.

 

/thread

[Alphadawg7]

I don't think it is impossible for him to drive down the field just improbable. With the limitations of the line and the ferociousness of the pass rush there was going to be no time for the long throws that were necessary for the drive. It isn't the drives Fitz had as you stated it was the play calling Chan had. In the 4th quarter before the lead change the Bills had 3 drives that should have gone run run run. They didn't 1) run, run, run (pass play called), pass 2) run, pass, pass 3) run, run, pass. 3 times Chan didn't do what he should have and that is his fault. Do you know why he couldn't do what he was supposed to? 1) he was dumb and kept running Freddy leaving CJ on the sideline - his fault and 2) the o-line got no push and those runs went for 14, -1, 1, 3, 1, -1, and 2 yards. This was the time to grind out the victory and the o-line couldn't do it.

 

The Bills should have won yesterday but the game should have never come down to a last second drive. There should have been urgency to score a td at the half, there should have been a fg attempt instead of a punt, and for the love of god the D needs a stop when it counts (not at all there fault - holding a team to 15 should get the w but still frustrating). There is so much that goes into losing it isn't just 1 drive.

 

Listen, I agree with you 100% about the play calling and Chan's performance...no argument from me at all and I think Chan should be fired today because of it, and I was a Chan supporter coming into this season. However, this thread was about Fitz and him being outstanding, so my comments have been directed at that sole assessment and it just simply was undeniably not true.

 

I said in a previous post that I was more upset with Chan than Fitz because Chan is the one calling plays for Fitz when Fitz can not consistently execute. Not to mention the worst decision I have seen a coach make in years of not attempting a 52 yard FG with a pretty good FG kicker on this team who is capable of kicking it. He also refused to utilize out best weapon in CJ, also unbelievably stupid.

 

None of that changes the fact we are in a thread based on validating Fitz as outstanding which he absolutely was not. His drive prior to the final rams drive was atrocious and so was his game ending drive. Listen, if he had a history of coming through even some of the time, it would be different. But he rarely comes through at end of games, frequently ends them with turnovers, and plays his ball during that time span. This was not an abnormally of him coming up short, it is the norm and to see someone call his play outstanding yesterday is just ridiculous.

 

And just so we are clear Section...I respect your opinion and all is good. I know you are not claiming him to be outstanding, but others were and thats who everything was directed to.

Edited December 10, 2012 by Alphadawg7

[Buftex]

Food for thought from the ravens

 

Entering the 2012 regular season

 

Joe Flacco's record with 30 plus attempts 22-19

 

His record when under that number 23-0.

 

Coaching is the difference here, Fitz could manage games just fine for another year or two if handled correctly

 

While I agree with your overall point (ie: another coach could get many more wins with Fitz), the difference between Fitz and Flacco is that JF has one thing he does very well...throws the long ball. It is the intermediate stuff he struggles with at times. Fitzs' struggles can come from any where at any time...ironically, the Ravens (9-4) fired their OC today, after a two game losing streak. I don't love Flacco, but he is substantially better than our guy.

[section122]

Listen, I agree with you 100% about the play calling and Chan's performance...no argument from me at all and I think Chan should be fired today because of it, and I was a Chan supporter coming into this season. However, this thread was about Fitz and him being outstanding, so my comments have been directed at that sole assessment and it just simply was undeniably not true.

 

I said in a previous post that I was more upset with Chan than Fitz because Chan is the one calling plays for Fitz when Fitz can not consistently execute. Not to mention the worst decision I have seen a coach make in years of not attempting a 52 yard FG with a pretty good FG kicker on this team who is capable of kicking it. He also refused to utilize out best weapon in CJ, also unbelievably stupid.

 

None of that changes the fact we are in a thread based on validating Fitz as outstanding which he absolutely was not. His drive prior to the final rams drive was atrocious and so was his game ending drive. Listen, if he had a history of coming through even some of the time, it would be different. But he rarely comes through at end of games, frequently ends them with turnovers, and plays his ball during that time span. This was not an abnormally of him coming up short, it is the norm and to see someone call his play outstanding yesterday is just ridiculous.

 

And just so we are clear Section...I respect your opinion and all is good. I know you are not claiming him to be outstanding, but others were and thats who everything was directed to.

Fair enough. I'm so numb at this point. I don't really know wtf is going on I just know I don't like it. I feel like there is talent on this team but then games like yesterday happen and I'm at a loss. #$%king Bills! (they need a new emoticon so we can pass "it" on the left hand side )

[Alphadawg7]

Fair enough. I'm so numb at this point. I don't really know wtf is going on I just know I don't like it. I feel like there is talent on this team but then games like yesterday happen and I'm at a loss. #$%king Bills! (they need a new emoticon so we can pass "it" on the left hand side )

 

Here is the funny part...I actually would much prefer to lose now at this point in the season because we need help in the draft position to once again hope we can find more talent to turn this thing around. Yet, even with that being said, I just still cant get over the losing and how we lose as its gotten embarrassing. If we went out and played a good game and the other team also did and we lost, I am good with that. But to lose to bad teams the way we lose and get completely out classed against good teams is just too much.

[Captain Hindsight]

Freddys fumble killed us. Fitz threw two great passes and Fred fumbled again in the red zone. If that turns into at least a FG we go to overtime

[8-8 Forever?]

Your handle is 8and8forever and youre calling out other people as "haters?"

You all hate Fitz and want him cut tomorrow. The 8andForever handle reflects my belief that the franchise is saddled with structural handicaps that prevent it from ever being much worse of better than an 8 and 8 record. Good coaches will come (Knox, Levy, Gailey, Wanny) , but great ones will not, good players will come (Stroud, Barnett, etc etc) , but great ones reject the place and the franchise and either won't come or leave as soon at they can (watch what Byrd, Levitre do) . so the team just stays " competitive" never having had or if it had, lost whatever non-monetary attraction it might have had to truly great coaches and players. The franchise is a mirror reflection of the place, and attracts those kinds of actors; hard working, blue collar players, but not championship calibre. Win just enough to screw up the draft, lose too many to compete for the crown. Top FAs and players have to be bribed to come to the franchise.

 

So the theory behind 8and 8 is The Bills are what they are. They are the Kansas City Royals. The Sacramento Kings. Most of the posters here are yearning for something that is simply not possible given the franchise's market and competitive position relative to the other teams. Just the way it is.. they are fun and part of our childhoods and growing up (mine at least), but they are a minor league team trying to play in the rock star majors of the NFL. Competitive? Sure. Champions? Not possible. So you find the silver lining in everything. Hence, I thought Fitz was really good yesterday. Fumbles and penalties lost that game, like they do most NFL games.

[dogman]

Ah-the answer to our prayers. Fitz really is pretty good afterall.... So here's what we do. Trade this excellent, veteran quarterback to another team, and use all the picks we get for him to rebuild.

 

Hmmm. That would be what? A conditional fifth round draft pick?

[Maury Ballstein]

a 5th? haaaaaaaa

 

good one.

 

You all hate Fitz and want him cut tomorrow. The 8andForever handle reflects my belief that the franchise is saddled with structural handicaps that prevent it from ever being much worse of better than an 8 and 8 record. Good coaches will come (Knox, Levy, Gailey, Wanny) , but great ones will not, good players will come (Stroud, Barnett, etc etc) , but great ones reject the place and the franchise and either won't come or leave as soon at they can (watch what Byrd, Levitre do) . so the team just stays " competitive" never having had or if it had, lost whatever non-monetary attraction it might have had to truly great coaches and players. The franchise is a mirror reflection of the place, and attracts those kinds of actors; hard working, blue collar players, but not championship calibre. Win just enough to screw up the draft, lose too many to compete for the crown. Top FAs and players have to be bribed to come to the franchise.

 

So the theory behind 8and 8 is The Bills are what they are. They are the Kansas City Royals. The Sacramento Kings. Most of the posters here are yearning for something that is simply not possible given the franchise's market and competitive position relative to the other teams. Just the way it is.. they are fun and part of our childhoods and growing up (mine at least), but they are a minor league team trying to play in the rock star majors of the NFL. Competitive? Sure. Champions? Not possible. So you find the silver lining in everything. Hence, I thought Fitz was really good yesterday. Fumbles and penalties lost that game, like they do most NFL games.

 

Indianapolis Colts, Green Bay Packers? I am not buying this market stuff or this defeatist woe is me nonsense other posters come up with (Spiller can't wait to leave town, no good coach would ever come here)

 

get a qb, get a coach (was schiano too good for the bills?) nope win ballgames. KC royals ? No one thought that in the 90's

[8-8 Forever?]

a 5th? haaaaaaaa

 

good one.

 

 

 

Indianapolis Colts, Green Bay Packers? I am not buying this market stuff or this defeatist woe is me nonsense other posters come up with (Spiller can't wait to leave town, no good coach would ever come here)

 

get a qb, get a coach (was schiano too good for the bills?) nope win ballgames. KC royals ? No one thought that in the 90's

You need start buying it pal, because with one 7 year exception we have been living the reality of it for 40+ years.... No owner other than one who paid $25k for the team would keep a franchise in B Lo for all the reasons I stated and more. It's not defeatism, just looking at the facts and history. 8and8 forever baby. It is was it is. Mularky and G Williams were the Schianos of the last decade. They did just great with what they had to work with...... who ever heard of a head coach resigning? Only in a fundamentally flawed franchise will a HC actually resign an NFL head coaching job.....

[NewEra]

Fitz was outstanding......lol. Too funny what some people see when they watch a game. Maybe I need to watch it on a different TV.

[PromoTheRobot]

And yet you can set your watch to a fitz 4th Q interception. Awesome how low the bar has been set that we call his day "outstanding."

 

I knew people would glom onto that last interception. That interception was meaningless. The game ended on the sack where we had to burn our last time out. On that play Fitz would have had to complete a 40+ yard play then get everyone lined up to spike the ball. There were no time outs. Besides, Fitz was hit as he threw the ball.

 

Which reminds me how no one is harping on the O-line like that didn't matter.

 

PTR

[JPS]

Freddys fumble killed us. Fitz threw two great passes and Fred fumbled again in the red zone. If that turns into at least a FG we go to overtime

That happened in the 1st half. It doesn't work like that. Who knows, the next play could have been a TD...or a pick 6.

[PromoTheRobot]

Was anybody here actually at the game? I'm asking because I wonder how many realize what the weather was like when Gailey pulled Lindell. After a pretty decent 1st half for December, freezing rain started to fall in the 2nd. Maybe you recall the ball going through Powell's hand on the extra point?

 

That kick was going against the wind with freezing rain falling. You can blame Gailey for being indecisive. But he had reason to worry about that kick. And if you recall the Bills did pin the Rams at 3 yard line (which became the 1.5 yd line after the holding call.)

 

PTR

[JPS]

I knew people would glom onto that last interception. That interception was meaningless. The game ended on the sack where we had to burn our last time out. On that play Fitz would have had to complete a 40+ yard play then get everyone lined up to spike the ball. There were no time outs. Besides, Fitz was hit as he threw the ball.

 

Which reminds me how no one is harping on the O-line like that didn't matter.

 

PTR

 

C'mon PTR. Fitz bears no responsibility for failing to diagnose the blitz, no responsibility for adjusting his protection, no responsibility for finding some clean air against a 3 man rush and no responsibility for the throw? That's just ridiculous. Are you related? 'Cuz then I understand.

 

If the Bills were up 15-12 against the Patriots, Broncos, Steelers, Ravens, Colts, Bengals, Titans, SD, all of the NFC East and North, these teams would have attempted a field goal to tie the game. The Bills had to go another 30 yards and threw check downs. The coach bears some responsibility, but the QB is ultimately the captain of the the ship in the final 2 minutes. Fitz, again, shrank.

Edited December 10, 2012 by JPS

[PromoTheRobot]

C'mon PTR. Fitz bears no responsibility for failing to diagnose the blitz, no responsibility for adjusting his protection, no responsibility for finding some clean air against a 3 man rush and no responsibility for the throw? That's just ridiculous. Are you related? 'Cuz then I understand.

 

If the Bills were up 15-12 against the Patriots, Broncos, Steelers, Ravens, Colts, Bengals, Titans, SD, all of the NFC East and North, these teams would have attempted a field goal to tie the game. The Bills had to go another 30 yards and threw check downs. The coach bears some responsibility, but the QB is ultimately the captain of the the ship in the final 2 minutes. Fitz, again, shrank.

 

I know you want to piss on Fitz every chance. All I'm saying is the game was over before that pick. Can Fitz make a long throw? No. Was the Bills O-line a sieve yesterday? Yes.

 

PTR

[JPS]

I know you want to piss on Fitz every chance. All I'm saying is the game was over before that pick. Can Fitz make a long throw? No. Was the Bills O-line a sieve yesterday? Yes.

 

PTR

 

The bigger question is: Can Fitz lead this offense to a decisive score when needed. The answer is clearly NO. I'm not pissing on Fitz. I'm just sick of bad QB play. It's so bad that when he's mediocre, people call it "outstanding".