BillsVet Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 So with regard to RG3, the Redskins gave up three 1sts and a 2nd to move up from 6th to 2nd. What would the Bills have had to give up to move from 10th to 2nd? Would it be worth it to give up four 1sts and a 2nd? No matter how good the guy is, at some point, the price is too high. Not sure when that point is but four 1sts and a 2nd is getting close. One could argue the price was too high. But considering that Nix should have had the defense squared away after that spending spree and has had 3 off-seasons to rebuild, shouldn't they be expected to be in position to make a deal like that? I get that Nix goes ultra-conservative on draft day and feels most comfortable not trading picks. But it's a new era, and to quote a famous military slogan, "Who dares wins" should be the mantra. Teams simply don't get their franchise QB by sitting and waiting, unless you've completely tanked a season, which Buffalo won't do in 2012. How then, does a team acquire their guy when no less than 5 other teams will need a QB?
Dawgg Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) First the word is spelled "drought". "Draught" is pronounced "draft", as in draught beer. Thank you, I stand corrected. Second the Bills playoff drought is at 12 years. That is incorrect, I believe. The playoff drought is at 13 years. The last time the Bills made the playoffs was the 1998-1999 season. A rudimentary count from the season after indicates that the drought has reached an NFL-record 13 years. If by "underwhelming draft" you mean we don't trade all our picks for one hype, then I guess you're right. And yes exciting players enter the league every year. All are lauded, some perform, some fail. Absolutely not. I think the Redskins gave up an awful lot to move up in that draft. I wouldn't advocate the Bills doing the same. However, I am tired of the Bills' systemic failure in assigning proper value to their draft choices and missing on starting-caliber talent in favor of below-average talent. If you want to point out a reason for the drought, that's your primary reason. Edited November 23, 2012 by Dawgg
PromoTheRobot Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 That is incorrect, I believe. The playoff drought is at 13 years. The last time the Bills made the playoffs was the 1998-1999 season. A rudimentary count from the season after indicates that the drought has reached an NFL-record 13 years. Remember "Homerun Throwback?" That was in 2000. PTR
JohnC Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) So with regard to RG3, the Redskins gave up three 1sts and a 2nd to move up from 6th to 2nd. What would the Bills have had to give up to move from 10th to 2nd? Would it be worth it to give up four 1sts and a 2nd? No matter how good the guy is, at some point, the price is too high. Not sure when that point is but four 1sts and a 2nd is getting close. The Skins didn't give up three first round picks. They gave up two and changed positions in one in the draft to acquire RGIII. They now have a prospective elite qb who will be the foundation of their franchise. I live in the Md/DC area and have seen him quite a bit. He is more than going to be a good qb; he is already a dynamic player who is elevating his team. Let's be clear about the Skins or any other team trading a lot of picks to acquire such an exceptional prospect. You shouldn't give up a lot of precious draft picks for a Ponder-Dalton-Russell Wilson-Kaepernick-Tannehill type of prospects. They are legitimate franchise qb prospects. However, they will never have the potential to be a "special" player . RGIII is a unique talent that rarely comes along. Whatever Shanahan gave up to get him was a bargain. What would the Bills have had to give up to move from 10th to 2nd?Would it be worth it to give up four 1sts and a 2nd? Absolutely! You can make up for the short term draft losses with reasonable mid-level free agent acquisitions until you get your full complement of draft picks. Sometimes you have to be bold and creative to get a game changing player onto your roster. The Bills are a staid and unimaginative organization that is reflected in its losing record. There is no surprise why already there is a lot of talk about the next draft before the halfway point of the season. It's the same song being sung over and over. Edited November 23, 2012 by JohnC
papazoid Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) So with regard to RG3, the Redskins gave up three 1sts and a 2nd to move up from 6th to 2nd. What would the Bills have had to give up to move from 10th to 2nd? Would it be worth it to give up four 1sts and a 2nd? No matter how good the guy is, at some point, the price is too high. Not sure when that point is but four 1sts and a 2nd is getting close. make it 5 first round picks.....whitner, mccargo,lynch, mckelvin and maybin..... reminder....just because you traded away a future first round pick, doesn't mean you wound up with nothing.....you still have that salary cap space to spend on a proven free agent. Edited November 23, 2012 by papazoid
BillsVet Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 Remember "Homerun Throwback?" That was in 2000. PTR It is 12 seasons, but at this point what's the difference? The point remains that a NFL franchise should never go this long without a playoff appearance, and if they do, it's the result of completely inept ownership, front office, and coaching. Buffalo has had that in spades since 2000. Any Bills fan is entitled to advocating for the franchise. At this point though, most Bills fans are either still watching and numb to the losses or simply checked out.
papazoid Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 The Skins didn't give up three first round picks. They gave up two and changed positions in one in the draft to acquire RGIII. They now have a prospective elite qb who will be the foundation of their franchise. I live in the Md/DC area and have seen him quite a bit. He is more than going to be a good qb; he is already a dynamic player who is elevating his team. Let's be clear about the Skins or any other team trading a lot of picks to acquire such an exceptional prospect. You shouldn't give up a lot of precious draft picks for a Ponder-Dalton-Russell Wilson-Kaepernick-Tannehill type of prospects. They are legitimate franchise qb prospects. However, they will never have the potential to be a "special" player . RGIII is a unique talent that rarely comes along. Whatever Shanahan gave up to get him was a bargain. Absolutely! You can make up for the short term draft losses with reasonable mid-level free agent acquisitions until you get your full complement of draft picks. Sometimes you have to be bold and creative to get a game changing player onto your roster. The Bills are a staid and unimaginative organization that is reflected in its losing record. There is no surprise why already there is a lot of talk about the next draft before the halfway point of the season. It's the same song being sung over and over. 100% agree
dave mcbride Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) By this point, anyone who doesn't realize that it's wise to essentially trade an entire draft for a true blue chip qb doesn't really understand today's NFL. It really is all about the QB. Cleveland made a horrible, horrible deal. Fwiw, Nix came out recently and said something to this effect. This draft will therefore be quite interesting. The Bills did have a chance to draft Roethlisberger, btw. They were unwilling to trade the draft pick farm for him, though, which in retrospect was a terrible decision. It was terrible because it was clear then that they saw him as a truly elite player. Hell, they should have done more to trade back into the late first in 01 to get Brees. If you ID a guy as a potentiallly elite QB, you better throw caution to the winds. If you don't have one of those QBs all those Jairus Byrds, Josh Reeds, Gabr Northerns, Terrence McGees, Kyle Williams, and Andy Levitres ain't worth a plug nickel when it comes to the ol' win-loss column. You can accumulate some of those guys through the FA market anyway. Edited November 23, 2012 by dave mcbride
Bronc24 Posted November 23, 2012 Author Posted November 23, 2012 The Skins didn't give up three first round picks. They gave up two and changed positions in one in the draft to acquire RGIII. They now have a prospective elite qb who will be the foundation of their franchise. I live in the Md/DC area and have seen him quite a bit. He is more than going to be a good qb; he is already a dynamic player who is elevating his team. Let's be clear about the Skins or any other team trading a lot of picks to acquire such an exceptional prospect. You shouldn't give up a lot of precious draft picks for a Ponder-Dalton-Russell Wilson-Kaepernick-Tannehill type of prospects. They are legitimate franchise qb prospects. However, they will never have the potential to be a "special" player . RGIII is a unique talent that rarely comes along. Whatever Shanahan gave up to get him was a bargain. Absolutely! You can make up for the short term draft losses with reasonable mid-level free agent acquisitions until you get your full complement of draft picks. Sometimes you have to be bold and creative to get a game changing player onto your roster. The Bills are a staid and unimaginative organization that is reflected in its losing record. There is no surprise why already there is a lot of talk about the next draft before the halfway point of the season. It's the same song being sung over and over. Very well stated. I guess, to me, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. When we traded up to get Losman, I was hopeful, but not happy. To me, that was a panic move. However I think if you truly know a kid is a special talent at the QB position and is a special person (very important), you have to try and make the move. The universal belief about RGIII is that he was not only special on the field, but off the field as well. It is ludicrous to think this kid would not be a superstar for this franchise. However, once again, we will make silly comparisons to Cam Newton despite the fact they are two completely different players. Anybody who thinks I am jumping on the bandwagon because of a few good games (PTR) had best check my post history. I felt this kid was a special player in college and I think so now. I'd think Redskins nation would agree with me.
GG Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 By this point, anyone who doesn't realize that it's wise to essentially trade an entire draft for a true blue chip qb doesn't really understand today's NFL. It really is all about the QB. Cleveland made a horrible, horrible deal. Fwiw, Nix came out recently and said something to this effect. This draft will therefore be quite interesting. The Bills did have a chance to draft Roethlisberger, btw. They were unwilling to trade the draft pick farm for him, though, which in retrospect was a terrible decision. It was terrible because it was clear then that they saw him as a truly elite player. Hell, they should have done more to trade back into the late first in 01 to get Brees. If you ID a guy as a potentiallly elite QB, you better throw caution to the winds. If you don't have one of those QBs all those Jairus Byrds, Josh Reeds, Gabr Northerns, Terrence McGees, Kyle Williams, and Andy Levitres ain't worth a plug nickel when it comes to the ol' win-loss column. You can accumulate some of those guys through the FA market anyway. You sure about that? I thought the party line was that Donahoe wanted to trade, but Houston wanted no part of the trade. I guess it could have been the price? TD was certainly willing to deal picks to get the franchise QB, so I tend to believe that it was the other side of the trade that didn't budge.
auburnbillsbacker Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 I think the moral of the story is that trading 3 first round picks is a cheap price to pay for a franchise QB. I realize that no QB prospect is a lock to succeed, but Luck and RG III were as safe as it gets. If the bills are ever in position where they can trade 3 firsts for an elite QB prospect, I hope they do it.
HeHateMe Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 I think the moral of the story is that trading 3 first round picks is a cheap price to pay for a franchise QB. I realize that no QB prospect is a lock to succeed, but Luck and RG III were as safe as it gets. If the bills are ever in position where they can trade 3 firsts for an elite QB prospect, I hope they do it. This^^ With the way the Bills have drafted, those picks are not quite as important as people think. I was all for trading up for RGIII although the skins were in much better position to do so. Losing draft picks for 2-3 years is not the big a deal when you lock up your Franchise QB for 10-12 years.
ny33 Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 First the word is spelled "drought". "Draught" is pronounced "draft", as in draught beer. Second the Bills playoff drought is at 12 years. If by "underwhelming draft" you mean we don't trade all our picks for one hype, then I guess you're right. And yes exciting players enter the league every year. All are lauded, some perform, some fail. I disparage those who's opinions change based on what happens a minute ago. PTR This is ironic. By the way, periods and commas go inside of quotation marks.
PromoTheRobot Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) This is ironic. By the way, periods and commas go inside of quotation marks. Ooops, you got me. I should have wrote it "I disparage those WHO IS opinions change..." Ironic indeed. Who's vs Whose PTR Edited November 23, 2012 by PromoTheRobot
ny33 Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 Ooops, you got me. I should have wrote "I disparage those WHO IS opinions change based on what happens a minute ago." Ironic, indeed. http://www.elearneng.../whoswhose.html PTR You should have written "whose." You wrote "who's."
PromoTheRobot Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 You should have written "whose." You wrote "who's." DOH! I could blame my phone's auto-correct but I won't. Irony abounds. PTR
ny33 Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 DOH! I could blame my phone's auto-correct but I won't. Irony abounds. PTR Auto-correct is the devil.
Billy in 4C Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 Hall. Remind you of cam newton.... How was he last year? And this year? The biggest difference is between the ears. RG3's character was never a concern
C.Biscuit97 Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 I think this shows one of the problems in drafting a qb in the 1st round. I have never thought there was anything special about Bradford. I said before the draft if I was the Rams, I would draft RG3 & try to trade Bradford. But because of where Bradford was drafted, they couldn't give up on him too early.
ny33 Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 The biggest difference is between the ears. RG3's character was never a concern RG3 has also been far more efficient than Newton. The comparisons are foolish and, frankly, borderline racist.
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