8-8 Forever? Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 He's Chan's friend. Who else would come to f ing buffalo? Chan was in a bad spot (Jauron had great assistants but they all get fired when the HC goes down) and asked a friend to help him out. Things could be worse. We could have last years defensive players (all sucked) and a DC who isnt even in the league anymore.
CodeMonkey Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 Professional athletes, more so than those who occasionally play for the love of a game, are probably in more dire need of coaches who can find new and unique ways to motivate them than most folks who are paid to do a job. Just like anyone else, pro athletes can go through the motions, say the right things, and collect a check. Heck, there are probably more than a few of us that do that at our own workplace. With the new CBA they don't even have to hang out together that much during the week with the severe restrictions on practice schedules. Leaders that can consistently inspire those they lead, and can instill in them a sense of unity&motivation towards a goal are rare. That is why I still believe that the talent level on NFL teams is relatively close, but how that talent is motivated and prepared (coaching) is the difference between a cellar-dweller defense and an upper-eschelon one. I do not get this mindset at all. They need to be motivated by coaches? How about winning. How about not being a laughing stock. How about pride in your performance. How about making the playoffs. How about a !@#$ing super bowl ring for Christs sake! NFL players needing to be motivated by their coaches is perhaps the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard about professional athletes.
BuffaloBaumer Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 I do not get this mindset at all. They need to be motivated by coaches? How about winning. How about not being a laughing stock. How about pride in your performance. How about making the playoffs. How about a !@#$ing super bowl ring for Christs sake! NFL players needing to be motivated by their coaches is perhaps the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard about professional athletes. here is where the problem lies. The Bills CLEARLY have players that DO need to be motivated for whatever reason. You have management that One, are not drafting the proper guys to get it done on heart alone and TWO, don't have the coaches to "coach them up" now that they are here.
CodeMonkey Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 here is where the problem lies. The Bills CLEARLY have players that DO need to be motivated for whatever reason. You have management that One, are not drafting the proper guys to get it done on heart alone and TWO, don't have the coaches to "coach them up" now that they are here. Or the DC is horrible, or the scheme is horrible, or the players are just not as talented as was thought. There are many possible reasons for why the defense sucks in such an epic scale. I personally just don't buy motivation being the main problem.
PromoTheRobot Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 And yet most folks here wanted a name coach like Wanstadt to replace Edwards. I mean we all heard if Wanny. PTR
abbottroadwarrior Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 And yet most folks here wanted a name coach like Wanstadt to replace Edwards. I mean we all heard if Wanny. PTR I will readily admit to being one of them. No question about it. I thought he'd lend some experience and creativity to a defense that, under Edwards, seemed uninspired and underachieving. It doesn't make me reconsider my opinion of Edwards as inadequate, but I certainly have loss faith in Wannstadt to field a competitive defense at this point.
Direhard Fan Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 10 1/2 point underdog sunday. 3 and 5 than. NE than- worse. 3 and 6 than. All we hear is we are not filling the gaps. If that is the only problem than fill them. Time for a change. Wannie can't fill the gaps let someone else try. We have no leader on "D". Try it - You'll like it.
Lofton80 Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 Article illustrates the lack of blitzing by Wanny's D. The following excerpts from an article on new Packers' coordinator Jim Bates offer valuable insights into Wannstedt's defensive philosophy since Bates worked for both Wannstedt and Johnson: The essence of Johnson's philosophy was speed, speed and more speed. He wanted waves of penetrating defensive linemen to fit a one-gap scheme and rotate constantly. He wanted fast linebackers regardless of size at linebacker. And he wanted smart defensive backs that wouldn't make mistakes in a "quarters" or Cover 2 coverage scheme. Those great Dallas front sevens were among the smallest in the NFL but they chased all over the field and gave great effort. Johnson's system started with a 4-3 "over" front in which the under, or three-technique, defensive tackle lined up to the tight-end side and all three linebackers were stacked off the ball. Cornerbacks Larry Brown and Issiac Holt lacked bump-and-run coverage ability in the early 1990s so Johnson had to play them off in "quarters" coverage. The Cowboys' safeties lined up at the same shallow depth of just eight to 10 yards, almost creating a nine-man front and positioning them to jump routes and make interceptions. When run showed, one safety would force and the other would rotate to the deep middle. "We never had corners in Dallas," Wannstedt said. "They weren't even close to Sam Madison and Patrick Surtain, who are as good as there is. Even in Chicago we were always on the conservative side with our corners only because of ability level." Generally speaking, the defenses that Bates was associated with over the last nine years were able to press with their cornerbacks within a "quarters" or Cover 2 zone coverage scheme. "You can't blitz without corners," Wannstedt said. "Everyone knows that. It's common sense. I don't know what Green Bay's situation is but I'm sure that will be one of the first things Jim will have to address. "Let's not make more of this than what it is. It depends on how good your players are that determines what you can do." Still, the objective is to limit blitzing to maybe 20%, stress third down and play smart. "Our mental mistakes were minimal," Wannstedt said. "That was always a focus. Our philosophy always was that we will execute our system better than your offense plays. People around the NFL always said that we did less than most teams but we'd always do it better." http://bluegraysky.blogspot.com/2005/07/know-thine-enemy-dave-wannstedt.html
HOUSE Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 Well, between Dareus playing poorly and Williams injury, add a poor defensive motivator I guess its easy to see why the Bills struggle.
Max997 Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 Totally agree, the "motivation" factor is way over-rated in the NFL .... however, the "unimaginative" and bland scheming, and being "out-coached"; is the Pope Catholic? That is so obvious its not funny anymore to all of us---just get rid of him now, and then at least it is fully on the players (which leads back to the motivation issue). Really? Wasn't that Marv Levy's best trait? Don't you think the 9ers feed off Harbaugh and want to play for him? Emotion is HUGE in sports and good coaches can get more out of their players
3rdand12 Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 Article illustrates the lack of blitzing by Wanny's D. The following excerpts from an article on new Packers' coordinator Jim Bates offer valuable insights into Wannstedt's defensive philosophy since Bates worked for both Wannstedt and Johnson: The essence of Johnson's philosophy was speed, speed and more speed. He wanted waves of penetrating defensive linemen to fit a one-gap scheme and rotate constantly. He wanted fast linebackers regardless of size at linebacker. And he wanted smart defensive backs that wouldn't make mistakes in a "quarters" or Cover 2 coverage scheme. Those great Dallas front sevens were among the smallest in the NFL but they chased all over the field and gave great effort. Johnson's system started with a 4-3 "over" front in which the under, or three-technique, defensive tackle lined up to the tight-end side and all three linebackers were stacked off the ball. Cornerbacks Larry Brown and Issiac Holt lacked bump-and-run coverage ability in the early 1990s so Johnson had to play them off in "quarters" coverage. The Cowboys' safeties lined up at the same shallow depth of just eight to 10 yards, almost creating a nine-man front and positioning them to jump routes and make interceptions. When run showed, one safety would force and the other would rotate to the deep middle. "We never had corners in Dallas," Wannstedt said. "They weren't even close to Sam Madison and Patrick Surtain, who are as good as there is. Even in Chicago we were always on the conservative side with our corners only because of ability level." Generally speaking, the defenses that Bates was associated with over the last nine years were able to press with their cornerbacks within a "quarters" or Cover 2 zone coverage scheme. "You can't blitz without corners," Wannstedt said. "Everyone knows that. It's common sense. I don't know what Green Bay's situation is but I'm sure that will be one of the first things Jim will have to address. "Let's not make more of this than what it is. It depends on how good your players are that determines what you can do." Still, the objective is to limit blitzing to maybe 20%, stress third down and play smart. "Our mental mistakes were minimal," Wannstedt said. "That was always a focus. Our philosophy always was that we will execute our system better than your offense plays. People around the NFL always said that we did less than most teams but we'd always do it better." http://bluegraysky.b...-wannstedt.html interesting article. very. Thanks !
Buffalo Barbarian Posted October 30, 2012 Author Posted October 30, 2012 somewhat explains all the letdown seasons at PITT. Always great classes, but way under preformed. I've never liked Wanny outside of Dallas now we know why. I cringed when he came here but as usual my delusion for the Bills took over and bought the kool-aid and thought even though he under achieved he would somehow do it this time. Now I'm at a point were I look at Bills logically so that I'm not disappointed every time I turn around.
Buffalo Barbarian Posted October 30, 2012 Author Posted October 30, 2012 I don't want to just harp on Wanny not being on the sideline during games, but can someone name one successful defense coordinator who is not on the sideline during games? Defense is about attitude, and about pumping up your players and showing them that you are as emotionally vested and "into" the game as you want them to be....I have a hard time believing that those things can happen from the sterile confines of a sky booth. Chan: Thanks for saving my job. Kevin Greene : No problem, I will get these slackers to play with their hair on fire. here is where the problem lies. The Bills CLEARLY have players that DO need to be motivated for whatever reason. You have management that One, are not drafting the proper guys to get it done on heart alone and TWO, don't have the coaches to "coach them up" now that they are here. Time to start drafting those "high motor" guys
Sisyphean Bills Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 Agreed. This is not college. This is a players league. Not a coaches league. We need a leader on the field. Just don't have one yet. <snippage> I can see that. The Saints don't miss Sean Payton at all, for example.
Buffalo 66 Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 Couldn't remember how to put them back in the trash can... That is freaking hilarious!
BuffaloFan68 Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 I respect Andy Reid for having the stones to fire his DC during the bye week. I just wish Chan would have done the same thing. The worst part is that Chan probably won't even fire Wanny after we get blown-out 3+ more times.
C.Biscuit97 Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 I respect Andy Reid for having the stones to fire his DC during the bye week. I just wish Chan would have done the same thing. The worst part is that Chan probably won't even fire Wanny after we get blown-out 3+ more times. Andy Reid scapegoated his DC and their defense was worse this week. Gailey believes in Wanny liek he believes in Fitz. As a result, it might cost him his job. But he's loyal.
eball Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 I respect Andy Reid for having the stones to fire his DC during the bye week. I just wish Chan would have done the same thing. The worst part is that Chan probably won't even fire Wanny after we get blown-out 3+ more times. How did you feel about Andy Reid's "stones" when he promoted a guy who had never coached defense to DC before the start of last season? Andy Reid is another of those overblown coaches who receive way too much credit and not enough blame for what goes on. There is no excuse for the Eagles not making LeSean McCoy the focal point of that offense. None. It's a joke.
Sisyphean Bills Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 Andy Reid scapegoated his DC and their defense was worse this week. Gailey believes in Wanny liek he believes in Fitz. As a result, it might cost him his job. But he's loyal. Is it loyalty to stick with your incompetent buddy no matter what rather than perhaps considering what's best for everyone else associated with the franchise?
C.Biscuit97 Posted October 30, 2012 Posted October 30, 2012 How did you feel about Andy Reid's "stones" when he promoted a guy who had never coached defense to DC before the start of last season? Andy Reid is another of those overblown coaches who receive way too much credit and not enough blame for what goes on. There is no excuse for the Eagles not making LeSean McCoy the focal point of that offense. None. It's a joke. Andy Reid would be the greatest OC in the NFL if that was all he had to do. He is a very good head coach but he makes costly decisions liek getting away from the run and clock management. Still, if he ever got fired, I'd hope the Bills would go after him. Eagles fans don't realize how good they had it.
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