CardinalScotts Posted October 26, 2012 Posted October 26, 2012 boring to talk about the MIK Linebacker we give up 50 points a game and we are talking about the qb- kinda points out we don't know where to turn
Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 Why is it so hard for people to understand that Fitz is not a good QB, regardless of what the defense is doing? The defense has lots of issues that need to be address; coaching, bad linebackers, inexperienced CBs and WTF is wrong with everyone on the DL. We get it. Meanwhile, at quarterback we have a guy who threw 23 picks and had 7 fumbles last year. 9 + 3 so far this year. That might be excusable if he could throw the ball like a Manning, but he can't. He is one of the worst medium-to-deep ball QB in the league and that means other teams don't need to respect the Bills passing game and that means they can key on stopping the RBs and short routes. Just because the Bills score 30+ a couple times a year against horrible defenses doesn't change the fact that the current QB is not capable of taking this team to contender status. And yet the Texans went to the playoffs last year with TJ Yates. The 49ers went to the playoffs last year with a QB who had >60% completions (barely) once in his 6 year career and had actually been benched for a year. The Bengals went to the playoffs last year with a QB who has more picks than Fitz does at this point in the season. Why is this, Grasshopper? To the OP: in my opinion, Fitz gets all the blame around here in part because most people don't watch enough games with mediocre QB to understand what the bottom half of the NFL looks like. They see he's not elite (and he's not) and jump from there to saying he's garbage and worse than anyone. The truth is he's a middle-of-the-pack QB who can't carry a team or carry off a last minute comeback with the frequency of the elite QB in the league, but who can win games with the right team around him. He's been playing poorly and deserves to take some smack - and the D still gets the largest share.
benderbender Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 This thread seems familiar. Like we've been trolled before by an OP who can't figure out why the QB gets blamed when we score less than the other team.
1B4IDie Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 Fitz is not a good QB that is why. Also, dif you really need to start this thread? http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/151720-cant-put-this-one-on-fitz/page__st__160#entry2614094
Orton's Arm Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 Clearly the 32nd ranked defense is to blame for the Bills losses... I am NOT suggesting Fitz and the offense doesn't have its share of problems.... but the offense is NOT the main problem and changing QB's is not going to make ANY difference. The problem is 80-85% defensive with this team! I just can't see how anyone can throw this season's mediocrity on Fitz and the Offense. I can even accept that there has been tons of change on defense and our players are not perfect fits for a Wanny Defense.... We did change from the 3-4 to 4-3 and for the two previous years we were drafting defensive player that fit the "new" system.... we did change defensive coordinators... we do have a young and inexperienced secodary... we do lack quality starting linebackers for the 4-3 (Barnett is great but not ideal in the 4-3) and we all knew this going into the season.... somehow this year everyone expected it all to just "work smoothly" and we'd be a playoff team.... the cold hard truth is here... the players have not adapted quickly and inexperience has shown itself regularly.... Our LB's are slow to the action and one a RB or TE make a catch underneath they are not stopped until the secondary (15-20 yds down field) Meanwhile, despite some bad passes and bad luck (injuries) we have seen our offense consistently put up enough to pts win in 6 out of 7 weeks.... Keep blaming Fitz and the Offense... we'll never make the playoffs if the DEFENSE continues to let the offense down! the sad truth of the matter is that very few teams increase thier win totals from one year to the next by more than 2-3 games... we were 6-10 last season and being better than a 8-8 or 9-7 team is unrealistic to hope for (as many did) Except for the Niners game, the Bills would have two more wins IF the defense only stops the opponent on 4th down situations once in each game.... it could easily be argued they would have won 3 more if special teams was just a little more special.... I agree that, for the most part, the offense has been reasonably productive. But let's look at the facts: 1) When healthy, the Bills' offensive line is good enough that even Bill from NYC is pleased with it. Quite pleased, in fact. 2) Last year, many here felt that Fred Jackson was among the best RBs in the league. This year Spiller has clearly surpassed him. 3) The Bills' #1 WR--Stevie Johnson--is able to consistently get open against the best CBs in the league, such as Revis. Johnson is also usually good about not dropping passes. (With some notable exceptions, of course.) 4) Graham is quietly becoming a good WR as well. 5) The Bills have a good pass catching TE in the form of Chandler Given 1 - 5, you'd expect the offense to be productive. During the first two games of the season, Spiller averaged over 10 yards a carry. I remember a recent game in which he averaged 7 yards a carry. Running backs aren't supposed to put up numbers that good--but no one seems to have told Spiller that. The Bills have almost all the pieces in place to put together a truly frightening offense--a Greatest Show on Turf type offense. The most important missing piece is the quarterback. The second-most important missing piece is one additional receiver--a guy like A.J. Green. With this current combination of mediocre quarterback + great supporting cast, the offense as a whole will be productive. Not nearly as productive as it could have been with Kurt Warner at quarterback, but productive. The defense's problems are a separate issue. An offense can still be dominant even when the team doesn't have a defense; as Tom Brady showed us last year. I agree the defense's problems need to be fixed. But our problems at quarterback need to be fixed also. What's the good of Graham's ability to burn people deep, if we have among the very worst quarterbacks at throwing the deep ball? What's the good of Stevie Johnson's ability to get open, if many of the passes which come his way are either uncatchable or badly thrown enough it would take a truly heroic effort to catch them? What's the good of the offensive line's ability to provide really good pass protection, if that pass protection doesn't result in accurate passes?
reddogblitz Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 Fitz gets all the blame because he's the QB. It's dumb, but that's what it's come to. In the NFL media all we hear about is "it's a passing league", "it's a Quarterback league", "franchise QB", "elite QB", "Tom Brady", blah, blah,blah. And, most lazy sheeple football fans buy it. It's easier. Just focus on one guy. If the team sucks, you don't have to think about why, obviously it's the QB. Never mind that a team's defense is horrid. Never mind if an Olineman held on a play that nullified a huge gain. Never mind that the punter can only punt 22 yards in the 4th quarter. Nevemind that the WR drops some passes. It's just easier to just blame the QB. It's his fault obviously. I have an NFL films music CD. On one of the cuts you can hear coaches talking to their team. One coach says "If we win, we win together. If we lose, we lose together". On TBD, if we win, the QB won it for us, if we lose, the QB sucks.
8-8 Forever? Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 It's the nature of the position. Simple as that. And it can't be denied that Fitz is the only thing holding this offense back. But he's the second coming of Joe Montana compared to how our defense is playing. GO BILLS!!! Fitz was very good against the Titans. Razor sharp in fact, other than the pick at the end. He does what he did against the Titans every week and we are in good shape.
Charles Romes Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 The beard or the 'stache. Six to one, half dozen to another.
UticaBill Posted October 27, 2012 Author Posted October 27, 2012 (edited) I guess my whole point is, maybe we could use a new QB, but we definitely have bigger needs elsewhere! I realize QB is the face of the franchise, but replacing Fitz isn't going to them putting on the winning track as surely as fixing the D will.... Until the D is good enough to STOP a team on 4th and long with 1:30 to go.... Fitz isn't much of a problem.... No if the D is playing Lights Out then sure the QB is the next biggest trouble spot. Edited October 27, 2012 by UticaBill
HOUSE Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 I don't blame Fitz. I blame Chan & Buddy for waiving Young.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 I don't blame Fitz. I blame Chan & Buddy for waiving Young. Who is obviously much in demand around the league due to QB injuries?
K-9 Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 boring to talk about the MIK Linebacker we give up 50 points a game and we are talking about the qb- kinda points out we don't know where to turn Sheppard is Irish? GO BILLS!!! Fitz was very good against the Titans. Razor sharp in fact, other than the pick at the end. He does what he did against the Titans every week and we are in good shape. I agree with all of this. GO BILLS!!!
Orton's Arm Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 I guess my whole point is, maybe we could use a new QB, but we definitely have bigger needs elsewhere! I realize QB is the face of the franchise, but replacing Fitz isn't going to them putting on the winning track as surely as fixing the D will.... Until the D is good enough to STOP a team on 4th and long with 1:30 to go.... Fitz isn't much of a problem.... No if the D is playing Lights Out then sure the QB is the next biggest trouble spot. Franchise QBs are very rare. About one new one is drafted each year, or perhaps slightly less. This means a typical NFL team will draft a franchise QB about once every 40 years. It's almost impossible to win the Super Bowl without a franchise QB. Nine of the last ten Super Bowl winners had franchise quarterbacks. Franchise quarterbacks are often drafted very early. If you wait until all your team's problems are fixed except for quarterback before trying to draft your franchise QB, you'll be picking later in the first round, in a draft in which the top QB talent will be gone very early. If you don't have a franchise QB, and if there's one available when you pick, you take him. Period. It does not matter what other needs your team may have, or what other players may be available when you pick. If you don't have a franchise QB, and if there's a chance to trade up for one, and if the price for the trade-up is reasonably sane, you do it. That kind of trade up is a no brainer. Yes, the defense needs a large scale infusion of talent. A much greater talent infusion than many (including me) had believed prior to the start of the season. But that's something which can be done little by little. A player here, a player there, a new defensive coordinator, and slowly the defense will start to look much more credible. But a franchise quarterback cannot be drafted piecemeal, or little by little. It's one big lump. There may not always be the opportunity to make that big, one lump improvement to your team. If or when that opportunity does arise, you have to take it!
Ozymandius Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 Just because you have cancer doesn't mean you ignore your AIDS
Max997 Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 (edited) I don't agree that the Bills spent the two previous years drafting defensive players that fit the "new" system. Nix's first draft after Spiller was awful but did seem forced to try n get players for the switch to a 3-4 but not the 2011 draft. Marcel was projected to be able to play in either the 3-4 or the 4-3 so outside of Sheppard I don't see how the 2011 draft could be thought of as a draft for players fitting the 3-4 The problem is this team just drafts players without a plan and continues to spend high picks on cornerbacks which isn't an impact position especially when you don't play an aggressive style of defense. It doesn't help the corners they draft can't freaking cover either This defensive scheme is a joke and is a big problem but lack of a quality QB and a clueless head coach are just as bad Edited October 27, 2012 by Max997
1B4IDie Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 (edited) I guess my whole point is, maybe we could use a new QB, but we definitely have bigger needs elsewhere! I realize QB is the face of the franchise, but replacing Fitz isn't going to them putting on the winning track as surely as fixing the D will.... Until the D is good enough to STOP a team on 4th and long with 1:30 to go.... Fitz isn't much of a problem.... No if the D is playing Lights Out then sure the QB is the next biggest trouble spot. Let me get this straight we couldn't draft a QB because we didn't have an O-line. NOW WE can't draft a QB because we don't have strong D-line. This is beyond stupid. This is the thought process of a loser that wants to stay 6-10 forever. Edited October 27, 2012 by Why So Serious?
Bill from NYC Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 I agree that, for the most part, the offense has been reasonably productive. But let's look at the facts: 1) When healthy, the Bills' offensive line is good enough that even Bill from NYC is pleased with it. Quite pleased, in fact. The defense's problems are a separate issue Quite pleased indeed. Even last week, missing 2 starters including the LT, the Bills were able to run well, and Fitz's stats made him appear, on paper, to be an accurate quarterback. Things have changed SO much that I have posted things defending Pears lol! Take away Peters when he played RT, and tell me the last RT we had who was even almost as good as Pears. And Hairston is already better than Bell ever was. As you know, I conceded the importance of the qb position, given the rule changes. Fitz isn't getting it done. We all know this. That said, the defense is a seperate issue, but it is a HUGE one. Kyle Williams and Kelsey in pass coverage tells you each and every thing you need to know about Wanny. He is literally horrible, and killing this team imo.
Cheetahz Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 He doesn't get all the blame but he should get quite a bit of it. Let me see if I can explain it so it makes sense. First let me say the defense is playing horribly, now with that being said, every time the offense goes 3 and out or there is a turnover the defense has to take the field. Defenses are not designed to be on the field for 8 minute drives. Fritzs INT's impact the defense and in a major way. Take the last int he threw in this past game... The defense had already gotten the ball back for the bills, then in theirs minds this simply drive will Ice the game... It did not, that plays big time mentally as a group when u can't rely on ur qb to give u time to rest it hampers your ability to be effective. Forget 15 Td's really, and stats don't tell the whole story, so using qb ratings and all don't always work. Just like shaykh Jackson is the same because he has a 77.9 qb rating, when in fact if u have watched any of his games you realize he CAN make every throw in the book and has for the most part in his career!! I have heard on more than 1 occasion game announcer mention a throw Jackson made as only about 5-6 qb's in the league could make that throw. That alone is why Jackson is better than fritz, and it would be the first time Jackson would be playing with receivers that get open on virtually every play.
Solomon Grundy Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 Clearly the 32nd ranked defense is to blame for the Bills losses... I am NOT suggesting Fitz and the offense doesn't have its share of problems.... but the offense is NOT the main problem and changing QB's is not going to make ANY difference. The problem is 80-85% defensive with this team! I just can't see how anyone can throw this season's mediocrity on Fitz and the Offense. I can even accept that there has been tons of change on defense and our players are not perfect fits for a Wanny Defense.... We did change from the 3-4 to 4-3 and for the two previous years we were drafting defensive player that fit the "new" system.... we did change defensive coordinators... we do have a young and inexperienced secodary... we do lack quality starting linebackers for the 4-3 (Barnett is great but not ideal in the 4-3) and we all knew this going into the season.... somehow this year everyone expected it all to just "work smoothly" and we'd be a playoff team.... the cold hard truth is here... the players have not adapted quickly and inexperience has shown itself regularly.... Our LB's are slow to the action and one a RB or TE make a catch underneath they are not stopped until the secondary (15-20 yds down field) Meanwhile, despite some bad passes and bad luck (injuries) we have seen our offense consistently put up enough to pts win in 6 out of 7 weeks.... Keep blaming Fitz and the Offense... we'll never make the playoffs if the DEFENSE continues to let the offense down! the sad truth of the matter is that very few teams increase thier win totals from one year to the next by more than 2-3 games... we were 6-10 last season and being better than a 8-8 or 9-7 team is unrealistic to hope for (as many did) Except for the Niners game, the Bills would have two more wins IF the defense only stops the opponent on 4th down situations once in each game.... it could easily be argued they would have won 3 more if special teams was just a little more special.... Yeah Utica, tell that to Tom Brady who had one of the worst defenses in the league last year and STILL made it to the Super Bowl. Not that Fitzputrid is Brady...just saying.
T master Posted October 27, 2012 Posted October 27, 2012 I agree the D has been the part of te team that has lost the games for us , we should be able to win games that we have 24 to 28 points in as long as the D is living up to it's part of the deal . I will say though i think that the lack of seriously looking at a QB of the future has been a great error on the Bills part ! Last year we passed on Dalton , this year we not only let R .Wilson go but others of which we could have had in later rounds & not had to pay out as much so we wouldn't have lost as much as we would if we would have invested in a first round pick . It was a knee jerk reaction to pay Fitz the kind of cash they did & this year they should definitely think real hard on a QB and do there home work !!! Last year there was a lot of talent & we just let it go by not to mention the other picks that we have just wasted on the likes of Carder , T Jack (if we weren't going to get him the reps he needs to compete for a job this year) & the O lineman kid from Oregon that we just let go .. Thats not how you build a team by letting 2 + draft picks just walk away each year !!! So let's draft a QB & prepare him for the future !! GO BILLS !!!!
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