POOF, And another 250 million of tax payer's money likely gone.

[DC Tom]

See, that's the thing...

 

It's not like we've stopped the production of F-22 Raptors, or even decreased our orders for them, because we've chosen to become a poorly run venture capital firm. We're paying for just as many Raptors, and were pissing away additional billions investing in poorly structued business models that private industry investors won't touch with a ten foot pole because they aren't viable.

 

Actually, the Raptor program was cut in half because of cost. So it's very much like that, in fact.

[TakeYouToTasker]

Actually, the Raptor program was cut in half because of cost. So it's very much like that, in fact.

I was attempting to speak to the larger, more general state of the military budget, using Raptor production as a loose synonym for general defense spending; but did a terrible job of it apparently.

[VABills]

I did not know that the Muppets ran on batteries!

Nothing to do with muppets. But this Administration has no issue with wasting .002% here and .003% there. Lot's of little !@#$ups and soon it become 10% very quickly of wasted CITIZENS money.

[TakeYouToTasker]

Nothing to do with muppets. But this Administration has no issue with wasting .002% here and .003% there. Lot's of little !@#$ups and soon it become 10% very quickly of wasted CITIZENS money.

In all fairness, this is in no way unique to this Administration.

[Gary M]

In all fairness, this is in no way unique to this Administration.

 

Right, but when arguing about taxes, I always point out waste and no matter who I am arguing with that as a typical answer, well it's only.....

 

And this it what the TEA party is all about. There should be no talk of tax increases until spending is frozen or decreased.

[erynthered]

The complete list of faltering or bankrupt green-energy companies:

 

Evergreen Solar ($24 million)*

SpectraWatt ($500,000)*

Solyndra ($535 million)*

Beacon Power ($69 million)*

AES’s subsidiary Eastern Energy ($17.1 million)

Nevada Geothermal ($98.5 million)

SunPower ($1.5 billion)

First Solar ($1.46 billion)

Babcock and Brown ($178 million)

EnerDel’s subsidiary Ener1 ($118.5 million)*

Amonix ($5.9 million)

National Renewable Energy Lab ($200 million)

Fisker Automotive ($528 million)

Abound Solar ($374 million)*

A123 Systems ($279 million)*

Willard and Kelsey Solar Group ($6 million)

Johnson Controls ($299 million)

Schneider Electric ($86 million)

Brightsource ($1.6 billion)

ECOtality ($126.2 million)

Raser Technologies ($33 million)*

Energy Conversion Devices ($13.3 million)*

Mountain Plaza, Inc. ($2 million)*

Olsen’s Crop Service and Olsen’s Mills Acquisition Company ($10 million)*

Range Fuels ($80 million)*

Thompson River Power ($6.4 million)*

Stirling Energy Systems ($7 million)*

LSP Energy ($2.1 billion)*

UniSolar ($100 million)*

Azure Dynamics ($120 million)*

GreenVolts ($500,000)

Vestas ($50 million)

LG Chem’s subsidiary Compact Power ($150 million)

Nordic Windpower ($16 million)*

Navistar ($10 million)

Satcon ($3 million)*

*Denotes companies that have filed for bankruptcy.

 

POOF!!

[TakeYouToTasker]

Any chance you've got a source for those numbers, or a definition of "faltering"?

 

Also, for the sake of comparison a list of green tech investments which have proved sound thus far?

[erynthered]

Any chance you've got a source for those numbers, or a definition of "faltering"?

 

Also, for the sake of comparison a list of green tech investments which have proved sound thus far?

!@#$, I thought I DID put the link in that post. Sorry fellas.

 

 

http://blog.heritage.org/2012/10/18/president-obamas-taxpayer-backed-green-energy-failures/

Edited October 19, 2012 by erynthered

[TakeYouToTasker]

!@#$, I thought I DID put the link in that post. Sorry fellas.

 

 

http://blog.heritage...nergy-failures/

No worries, and thanks for adding the link.

[/dev/null]

[

The complete list of faltering or bankrupt green-energy companies:

 

Evergreen Solar ($24 million)*

SpectraWatt ($500,000)*

Solyndra ($535 million)*

Beacon Power ($69 million)*

AES’s subsidiary Eastern Energy ($17.1 million)

Nevada Geothermal ($98.5 million)

SunPower ($1.5 billion)

First Solar ($1.46 billion)

Babcock and Brown ($178 million)

EnerDel’s subsidiary Ener1 ($118.5 million)*

Amonix ($5.9 million)

National Renewable Energy Lab ($200 million)

Fisker Automotive ($528 million)

Abound Solar ($374 million)*

A123 Systems ($279 million)*

Willard and Kelsey Solar Group ($6 million)

Johnson Controls ($299 million)

Schneider Electric ($86 million)

Brightsource ($1.6 billion)

ECOtality ($126.2 million)

Raser Technologies ($33 million)*

Energy Conversion Devices ($13.3 million)*

Mountain Plaza, Inc. ($2 million)*

Olsen’s Crop Service and Olsen’s Mills Acquisition Company ($10 million)*

Range Fuels ($80 million)*

Thompson River Power ($6.4 million)*

Stirling Energy Systems ($7 million)*

LSP Energy ($2.1 billion)*

UniSolar ($100 million)*

Azure Dynamics ($120 million)*

GreenVolts ($500,000)

Vestas ($50 million)

LG Chem’s subsidiary Compact Power ($150 million)

Nordic Windpower ($16 million)*

Navistar ($10 million)

Satcon ($3 million)*

*Denotes companies that have filed for bankruptcy.

 

POOF!!

 

Just some more drops in the bucket, right?

[Doc]

If that's an inclusive list, that's 36 companies and 19 who have filed for bankruptcy. Weren't those on the left claiming Romney lied when he said "about half" had gone under?

[Nanker]

The complete list of faltering or bankrupt green-energy companies:

 

Evergreen Solar ($24 million)*

SpectraWatt ($500,000)*

Solyndra ($535 million)*

Beacon Power ($69 million)*

AES’s subsidiary Eastern Energy ($17.1 million)

Nevada Geothermal ($98.5 million)

SunPower ($1.5 billion)

First Solar ($1.46 billion)

Babcock and Brown ($178 million)

EnerDel’s subsidiary Ener1 ($118.5 million)*

Amonix ($5.9 million)

National Renewable Energy Lab ($200 million)

Fisker Automotive ($528 million)

Abound Solar ($374 million)*

A123 Systems ($279 million)*

Willard and Kelsey Solar Group ($6 million)

Johnson Controls ($299 million)

Schneider Electric ($86 million)

Brightsource ($1.6 billion)

ECOtality ($126.2 million)

Raser Technologies ($33 million)*

Energy Conversion Devices ($13.3 million)*

Mountain Plaza, Inc. ($2 million)*

Olsen’s Crop Service and Olsen’s Mills Acquisition Company ($10 million)*

Range Fuels ($80 million)*

Thompson River Power ($6.4 million)*

Stirling Energy Systems ($7 million)*

LSP Energy ($2.1 billion)*

UniSolar ($100 million)*

Azure Dynamics ($120 million)*

GreenVolts ($500,000)

Vestas ($50 million)

LG Chem’s subsidiary Compact Power ($150 million)

Nordic Windpower ($16 million)*

Navistar ($10 million)

Satcon ($3 million)*

*Denotes companies that have filed for bankruptcy.

 

POOF!!

 

All right, all right. THOSE were mistakes. But, dag-nab-it, Big Bird's got to stay!

 

This message brought to you by Jim Lehrer.

Edited October 19, 2012 by Nanker

[DC Tom]

The complete list of faltering or bankrupt green-energy companies:

 

Evergreen Solar ($24 million)*

SpectraWatt ($500,000)*

Solyndra ($535 million)*

Beacon Power ($69 million)*

AES’s subsidiary Eastern Energy ($17.1 million)

Nevada Geothermal ($98.5 million)

SunPower ($1.5 billion)

First Solar ($1.46 billion)

Babcock and Brown ($178 million)

EnerDel’s subsidiary Ener1 ($118.5 million)*

Amonix ($5.9 million)

National Renewable Energy Lab ($200 million)

Fisker Automotive ($528 million)

Abound Solar ($374 million)*

A123 Systems ($279 million)*

Willard and Kelsey Solar Group ($6 million)

Johnson Controls ($299 million)

Schneider Electric ($86 million)

Brightsource ($1.6 billion)

ECOtality ($126.2 million)

Raser Technologies ($33 million)*

Energy Conversion Devices ($13.3 million)*

Mountain Plaza, Inc. ($2 million)*

Olsen’s Crop Service and Olsen’s Mills Acquisition Company ($10 million)*

Range Fuels ($80 million)*

Thompson River Power ($6.4 million)*

Stirling Energy Systems ($7 million)*

LSP Energy ($2.1 billion)*

UniSolar ($100 million)*

Azure Dynamics ($120 million)*

GreenVolts ($500,000)

Vestas ($50 million)

LG Chem’s subsidiary Compact Power ($150 million)

Nordic Windpower ($16 million)*

Navistar ($10 million)

Satcon ($3 million)*

*Denotes companies that have filed for bankruptcy.

 

POOF!!

 

And a VC firm would probably have no better a track record - that's the basic principle; you spread your funds around, knowing a lot will fail, hoping those that hit make up for it.

 

So that begs the question...how much has the government made off the 17 that haven't yet failed?

[3rdnlng]

 

 

And a VC firm would probably have no better a track record - that's the basic principle; you spread your funds around, knowing a lot will fail, hoping those that hit make up for it.

 

So that begs the question...how much has the government made off the 17 that haven't yet failed?

 

The 17 without an asterisk are "faltering". The real question would be how many other investments in green energy has the government made, and how profitable are they? What makes you think the government is going to make anything off of any of the companies?

[DC Tom]

What makes you think the government is going to make anything off of any of the companies?

 

Taxes, if they succeed.

 

But that wasn't my point, anyway. My point was that the government acting as a VC firm is a really stupid model.