VanCity Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 Matt Flynn plays for the Bills? I believe he refers to Mr Tarvaris Jackson. But, he really didn't "beat him out" as much as he pushed him out as Tarvaris didn't see the field in preseason and was trade fodder from the get-go. The Hawks are the other team I follow and Wilson has looked like a rookie at times, but his poise has been surprisingly strong at others. I would reserve judgement on his future until you watch a few games. He shows a sizable amount of promise and looked much improved last Sunday.
BuffaloBillsSD Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 I believe he refers to Mr Tarvaris Jackson. But, he really didn't "beat him out" as much as he pushed him out as Tarvaris didn't see the field in preseason and was trade fodder from the get-go. The Hawks are the other team I follow and Wilson has looked like a rookie at times, but his poise has been surprisingly strong at others. I would reserve judgement on his future until you watch a few games. He shows a sizable amount of promise and looked much improved last Sunday. I know what he meant but it was a flawed statement since TJ was third string the moment Wilson was drafted.
Sisyphean Bills Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 I know what he meant but it was a flawed statement since TJ was third string the moment Wilson was drafted. The Seahawks split the reps 3 ways all through camp and into the pre-season. They gave all 3 QBs "a shot" to show what they could and could not do. In Tarvaris' case, he did not see action in the pre-season games because, according to Pete Carroll, they wanted to see what the other guys could do (and had already played Jackson in games). On the other hand, when they went after Flynn, they tipped their hand that they considered Jackson just a stop-gap plan at QB, one to which they weren't going to hitch their wagon. With the emergence of Wilson as a guy they could play even though he was a rookie, they could cut the string with Jackson without worrying about the backup depth too much.
K-9 Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 (edited) That Seattle defense is for real. We can only imagine what it's like to get that kind of pressure from a front four. They all EXPLODE of the ball in unison and get after it. ALL passion. Something our guys need a transfusion of. To the point of the thread, Wilson is in a good situation as a result because he won't be asked to win games very often with that defense performing like that. He is going to be challenged, anyway. As Jaworski alluded to last week, when a QB has to move around to find lanes so much, it kills the timing. I would add that once defenses get a handle on those movements, they will scheme to take that away by overloading those areas of the field, effectively taking away a large chunk of the field to operate in. That's why pocket passers are at a premium, they force a defense to defend the entire field. Flutie is the best example of what happens when a defense figures it out. And Flutie was a great QB. GO BILLS!!! Edited October 10, 2012 by K-9
C.Biscuit97 Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 I was upset we passed on Wilson, but I'm starting to think he's not all that and a six pack of Schlitz. But like the fella said, he's only 5 games into his career. Agreed but people were ready to put him in the HOF because of the preseason. Once again, preseason isn't worth a damn.
RyanC883 Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 Um...You may very well end up being right...But seriously...The Kid has played 5 NFL Games...There is no way anything is fairly evident just yet... Agreed. Drew Brees was a "bust" his first few years also given his "physical limitations" Still sucks....will prob never do anything... I will admit that I have been impressed with Graham though. He will be a good target for a QB that can throw over 5 yards. Seems to have an aggressive attitude on the field also. The draft is always a crap shoot. Edwards was a 3rd rounder Losman was a 1st Brady was a 6th Romo wasn't drafted V Young was a 1st Fitz was a 7th Ryan Leaf 2nd pick You never truly know what you are going to get, so for the ones clamoring to draft somebody, anybody to replace Fitz, there is no guarantee they will be better than Fitz. The only 2 I can think of that were absolute home runs were P Maning and A Luck, and would you know the Colts got both of them. I don't think Newton, or RG III are home runs and I do think Dalton will end up being better than both of them. Whatever though, draft is still no guarantee. We need to draft 2 QB's next year. One in first round that is an alleged "guarantee" and another in Rd. 4-5...I'm thinking Nassib from SU, because, as you said, you never know.
Billsrhody Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 While Wilson is starting at QB for Seattle, it's fairly evident that he will never be an elite QB. To those of you who keep complaining that we didn't draft him: Graham has been very solid with his targets, struggling mainly with balls thrown far out of his reach. I don't think Fitz will win us games, but Wilson's limitations due to his height, combined with other problems in his game, mean that he will be a bottom 10 QB in the league. Is it impressive that he is starting as a rookie over a big-budget free agent signing in Flynn? Yes, but that doesn't mean that Wilson has what it takes to lead a team in a deep playoff run. I do lament the fact that we picked Dalton over Williams, though, especially given the fact that we hadn't made such a commitment to Fitzpatrick at that time. "Wilson's limitations due to his height, combined with other problems in his game" Hah! People have been knocking this kid for his height for his entire football career.. hasnt stopped him from succeeding before. Other problems in his game? Quite the general statement there.. why dont you try to name some of them? The only thing thats fairly evident is that you dont know much about Russell Wilson and are judging him on an insufficient number of games.
Gordio Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 Again, I don't think the team will win with Fitz at QB. I just want to make a point for the people who were insisting that we draft Wilson. Will Wilson be an adequate starting QB? Possibly. It's also possible that he ends up better than Fitz, but I don't see him ever being above-average. Well here is the thing. Wilson may or may not get better, my guess given the kids charachter & work ethic he will get better. I mean he came into Wisconsin in his last year of eligability on a top 10 team & immediately learned the playbook, became a leader & was voted team captain. That is pretty impressive. He does have some physical limitations(height). But guys of his make often times overcome those limitations. The other side of the coin is I am pretty confidence Fitz is not going to get any better. He has been in the league for 7 years & he is still making the same boneheaded decisions & bad throws he was making with Cincy & with the Rams. He is what he is. A journeyman QB that is trying to be some kind of gun slinger.
K-9 Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 (edited) "Wilson's limitations due to his height, combined with other problems in his game" Hah! People have been knocking this kid for his height for his entire football career.. hasnt stopped him from succeeding before. Other problems in his game? Quite the general statement there.. why dont you try to name some of them? The only thing thats fairly evident is that you dont know much about Russell Wilson and are judging him on an insufficient number of games. The only thing we can say for certain about him at the moment is that even though his heart, intelligence, leadership, arm strength, and mobility are all off the charts, if he DOESN'T learn to become a pocket QB, his offensive options will become more limited over time as defenses start to scheme that aspect of his game. He simply MUST learn to operate from the pocket on a consistent basis. GO BILLS!!! Edited October 10, 2012 by K-9
Not at the table Karlos Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 Things can change, obviously, but when you have certain physical limitations, you're not going to be an elite quarterback in the NFL. drew brees.............................
K-9 Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 drew brees............................. Drew Brees has always been a drop back QB who can operate from the pocket and thus not have his timing with the receivers messed up. Russell Wilson hasn't developed into that yet and he has to in order to have a chance at a long career at the position. It's early, but history is against him here. GO BILLS!!!
RyanC883 Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 That has to win something just for creativity alone. One of the best fan costumes EVER. GO BILLS!!! this is the greatest fan costume ever. So great.
NewEra Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 Fail thread. I stopped reading after the first sentence. "It's fairly evident that he will never be an elite QB". I'll take him over our QB everyday of the week and 100 times on Sunday. I didn't like him in college. I didn't think he would be a starter in the NFL. I changed my mind. What I've seen from him so far in the nfl is that he has a chance to be a dam good QB. Elite? I could care less at this point. As long as fitz isn't our QB, I'd be happy.
T master Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 (edited) What we need to look at is where he was picked , what we needed as a team , & what draft picks that we may not have even had to start with . By that i mean , would either the picks that were used to draft Carder or the lineman kid from Oregon (b/c as we all know they were wasted picks) been better used on Wilson ? The kid was the most accurate , & threw for more yards & TD's in his college career than most any other college QB in a long time , OK Danny Wuerfal was a terrible NFL QB but no one knew that when he was drafted . I just think that with 5 games under his belt your passing judgement on this kid WAY to quick !! Not to mention that he for sure would be an upgrade to Thigpen & if they can't or won't give T Jack any reps what was the sense of wasting that future pick so theres 3 wasted picks in this one post . Plus Gailey likes those mobile QB's . And i don't know about you all but thats not a good way to go about running or building a team !!! Edited October 10, 2012 by T master
dr.fishopolis Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 If Wilson was starting for the Bills, the same people saying we should have drafted Wilson would be screaming for Fitz, or Vince Young, or whatever crazy thing people scream for. Wilson is simply not a good quarterback right now, nor has he shown that he's close to being one in the regular season. I live in Seattle, watch Seahawks games, and talk to Seahawks fans daily. The common belief of those I talk to is that if Flynn was the starter, they'd be 5-0 with that defense and running game, and that they should be 2-3 or 1-4 with Wilson except for a few lucky breaks (cam newton fumbling the game away last week, the refs giving them the game over Green Bay). Of course Wilson looked better last week, he was playing one of a few defenses that might actually be worse than the Bills! Carolina signed Dwan Edwards after the preseason and instantly gave him a starting job with no preseason reps. They're that bad. Wilson is still very skittish in the pocket, to the point where it's stretching things to even say he's ever in the pocket. He's averaging 6.5 yards per attempt, has 5 tds to 6 ints, has a 75 qb rating, and has topped 160 yards ONCE in 5 games. He's also rushed 27 times for a whopping 3.4 ypc, 0 tds, and 1 fumble. Every one of those stats is significantly worse than what Fitz is doing, and nobody is trying to coddle Fitz or set him up "not to fail". Come back in 8 weeks. If Wilson is still the starter, the Seahawks will have lost a great opportunity to have a playoff team. More likely, Flynn will be starting by then. I'm not saying Wilson will never be a good quarterback, I'm saying he's a bad quarterback right now and he's the weakest link on a very good team.
John from Riverside Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 im not here to knock Wilson who I liked coming out of college.... But im telling you.....I think TJ Graham is special.....and needs to be a much bigger part of this offense now. I thought he was all speed coming out of college but the fact is....the guy is 7 eleven......he is ALWAYS open. His route running and what he does AFTER he catches a ball making me really excited about the kid. He does not PLAY small.
K-9 Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 im not here to knock Wilson who I liked coming out of college.... But im telling you.....I think TJ Graham is special.....and needs to be a much bigger part of this offense now. I thought he was all speed coming out of college but the fact is....the guy is 7 eleven......he is ALWAYS open. His route running and what he does AFTER he catches a ball making me really excited about the kid. He does not PLAY small. All I know is, TJ Graham had his best year of college ball after Russell Wilson left NC State. GO BILLS!!!
Billsrhody Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 If Wilson was starting for the Bills, the same people saying we should have drafted Wilson would be screaming for Fitz, or Vince Young, or whatever crazy thing people scream for. Wilson is simply not a good quarterback right now, nor has he shown that he's close to being one in the regular season. I live in Seattle, watch Seahawks games, and talk to Seahawks fans daily. The common belief of those I talk to is that if Flynn was the starter, they'd be 5-0 with that defense and running game, and that they should be 2-3 or 1-4 with Wilson except for a few lucky breaks (cam newton fumbling the game away last week, the refs giving them the game over Green Bay). Of course Wilson looked better last week, he was playing one of a few defenses that might actually be worse than the Bills! Carolina signed Dwan Edwards after the preseason and instantly gave him a starting job with no preseason reps. They're that bad. Wilson is still very skittish in the pocket, to the point where it's stretching things to even say he's ever in the pocket. He's averaging 6.5 yards per attempt, has 5 tds to 6 ints, has a 75 qb rating, and has topped 160 yards ONCE in 5 games. He's also rushed 27 times for a whopping 3.4 ypc, 0 tds, and 1 fumble. Every one of those stats is significantly worse than what Fitz is doing, and nobody is trying to coddle Fitz or set him up "not to fail". Come back in 8 weeks. If Wilson is still the starter, the Seahawks will have lost a great opportunity to have a playoff team. More likely, Flynn will be starting by then. I'm not saying Wilson will never be a good quarterback, I'm saying he's a bad quarterback right now and he's the weakest link on a very good team. Why don't you ask your Seahawk friends if they would rather have Wilson or Fitz starting for their team? All bills fans want is a young QB with potential.. why wouldnt they want Wilson? I would love to hear what the rest of the league thinks about the Bills starting Fitz.. my bet is that they laughed at us when we gave him a big contract and look forward to playing against him.
dr.fishopolis Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 Why don't you ask your Seahawk friends if they would rather have Wilson or Fitz starting for their team? All bills fans want is a young QB with potential.. why wouldnt they want Wilson? I would love to hear what the rest of the league thinks about the Bills starting Fitz.. my bet is that they laughed at us when we gave him a big contract and look forward to playing against him. A few notes: - My Seahawk friends don't watch Bills games (you can't watch them out here unless you try) and have no idea how Fitz is outside of fantasy football - The simple fact is, right now, they're both poor options to be starting quarterbacks. So I'd rather not get into a false equivalency about which piece of crap is better, as that wasn't the point of my post or this thread. - Bills fans, at least this Bills fan, don't want a young QB with potential, they want to go to the playoffs this year. They wanted a young QB with potential 1-3 years ago, who would be ready to play now, and didn't get one. This year, they want both a qualified starting QB and a young QB with potential -- they have neither. My point in mentioning that they'd be complaining WITH Wilson is exactly that, Wilson wouldn't solve anything for *this* team, *this* year. We're not on a 6 year rebuilding plan, we're on a 3 year rebuilding plan, and this is year 3. There is no next year. - Fitz is one of the lowest paid non-rookie-contract starting QB's in the NFL. Can we drop this hogwash that he got a huge contract?
K-9 Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 Why don't you ask your Seahawk friends if they would rather have Wilson or Fitz starting for their team? All bills fans want is a young QB with potential.. why wouldnt they want Wilson? I would love to hear what the rest of the league thinks about the Bills starting Fitz.. my bet is that they laughed at us when we gave him a big contract and look forward to playing against him. Now there's a ringing endorsement for Russell Wilson: he's not as bad as Fitz. Think about that. GO BILLS!!!
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