San Jose Bills Fan Posted October 6, 2012 Posted October 6, 2012 anybody see the Rams / Cards game Thurs for 2 teams that have historically been doormats- their defenses played with an intensity not seen in Buffalo since Bruce left town. both teams swarmed the backfield and absolutely mauled the QBs in contrast, the Bills "best DL in the league" looks like they are doing the waltz with the OL and not getting a sniff of the QAB Wannstadt should be fired - and Chan should be as well for hiring him in the first place It's not a valid comparison though. That game was a low-scoring defensive battle where the defenses where beating the offenses almost from the very beginning… and featured two quarterbacks who are unproven. The defenses had the upper hand throughout that entire game. It's a far cry from the dynamic which existed in the Bills game. There is a lot less talent on this D than you think. I think that is open to debate. My more detailed observation/criticism of Wanny's personnel packages (I know, I'm still stuck on this) is that Sheppard has shown a knack for blitzing yet he barely played… that Moats has actually been one of our better pass rushers (sacked Brady last year to boot) and barely played, and that D'Norris Searcy had been seeing increased snaps in each game, seems to be improving each week… is an excellent tackler and hitter, and barely played… in a game where we insisted on playing 5 DBs (NOT including Bryan Scott). If you insist on playing 5-6 DBs, shouldn't you at least play your best tackling safety? Also you mentioned that "they keep moving the goalposts as to what they want from their linebackers" and this is true for the entire defense. I think it would be a good idea to run the base defense and figure out what you're identity is first before you start going into these bipolar schemes every week.
bananathumb Posted October 6, 2012 Posted October 6, 2012 Because they keep moving the goal posts on what they are looking for at the position. There is a lot less talent on this D than you think. First round draft picks and top shelf FAs should add up a decent pile of talent and we have bunches of both, If Wanny can't work with what Nix gave him this year, he is hopeless. I imagine LeBeau and others might do better.
Sisyphean Bills Posted October 6, 2012 Posted October 6, 2012 Because they keep moving the goal posts on what they are looking for at the position. Don't you need guys that can stop the run, get off blocks, and play a little pass coverage in ANY scheme?
3rdand12 Posted October 6, 2012 Posted October 6, 2012 i read the article and thanks for posting up. I hadn't seen it. Wannstache has his hands full. He knows. we know. the players know. and Chan and Buddy know. He f'd up. Now about the game and the players. I am concerned that there are deeper issues in the locker room. Unhappy people in there. I think the some of the guys are not ALL in with Dave. Lets sure hope we dont line up as wide as we were doing last week. hells bells Mario was rushing from the sidelne nearly. oN a Run play. Tighten the gaps up inside Dave. it's not that hard to see. when you have the little fellas in. spread em out with Sheppard.. and someone mentioned get Wanny on the field to yell and spit fire like he used to, you have a point. This week better look better. another... biggest game of the year. no pressure
spartacus Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 Maybe what this is telling us is that the Dallas Super Bowl defenses were actually in large part a product of great rosters. Football sure is easy when you have very good players. also a lot easier when Jimmy was really running the D
BuffaloFan68 Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 Wanny doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground at this point. It's painful to think that we have to wait until the bye week to fire his worthless ass. At least this might put us in the Gino Smith pool. Here's to giving up another 60+ points in the next 2 games.
spartacus Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 It's not a valid comparison though. That game was a low-scoring defensive battle where the defenses where beating the offenses almost from the very beginning… and featured two quarterbacks who are unproven. The defenses had the upper hand throughout that entire game. It's a far cry from the dynamic which existed in the Bills game. I think that is open to debate. My more detailed observation/criticism of Wanny's personnel packages (I know, I'm still stuck on this) is that Sheppard has shown a knack for blitzing yet he barely played… that Moats has actually been one of our better pass rushers (sacked Brady last year to boot) and barely played, and that D'Norris Searcy had been seeing increased snaps in each game, seems to be improving each week… is an excellent tackler and hitter, and barely played… in a game where we insisted on playing 5 DBs (NOT including Bryan Scott). If you insist on playing 5-6 DBs, shouldn't you at least play your best tackling safety? Also you mentioned that "they keep moving the goalposts as to what they want from their linebackers" and this is true for the entire defense. I think it would be a good idea to run the base defense and figure out what you're identity is first before you start going into these bipolar schemes every week. It's a far cry from the dynamic which existed in the Bills game. well - you can say that again those defenses attached the offense - notwithsatnding who the QB was The Bills let Weeden look like a Hall of Famer by being passive. Brady would not have scored on 6 consescutive possession against the Cards or Rams defense- which I guess is proven by the Cards totally stuffing Brady
vincec Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 Don't you need guys that can stop the run, get off blocks, and play a little pass coverage in ANY scheme? Guys that can play the run right at them, flow sideline to sideline, cover the TEs over the middle and backs in the flat are named Ray Lewis or Brian Urlacher. Few LBs can do everything well and be proficient in any scheme. The Bills had small fast guys. Then they went 3-4 and got rid of them to pick up bigger, slower guys. Now we're back to a 4-3 with the big, slow guys trying to play 4-3 LB positions and they're struggling. Frankly, I don't think the Bills have a single championship caliber 4-3 LB on their roster right now.
Bigfatbillsfan Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 Just another excuse like every lose week. Who will take ownership of thes excuses and man up? It's coaching man and thats it. Fire up the line. We need a bounty system. Where is Williams when you need him?? What we need is Brian Billick. I know the guy is kind of an A-hole. If there's coach that will light a fire under this defense it's him. I know this is more hind sight bias, but he would have been the better pick for head coach of the Bills than Gaily. Gaily is no slouch. He knows his stuff. But he just doesn't seem to be able to light the D on fire.
Mike in Syracuse Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 (edited) So apparently Dave missed the opening 90 yard drive? As I read this here's what I got: "I had the right scheme but the players didn't play it correctly. Rather than change, I stuck with the scheme and let us get shredded because I'm smarter." That works great Dave until the other team changes their gameplan. Yes the players still need to make plays but you can give them a little help. What an idiot...... Edited October 7, 2012 by Mike in Syracuse
pimp on da' net Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 There is something to be said for strategy, for game plans, for calling the right plays - for baffling opponents. This is an issue I'm having early on this year with the defense. I am a thinking man. I remember the early years of the Bellicheck NE Dynasty, when the defense was so unusual at times - I remember a game against Buffalo where New England's D-line spent a large part of the game standing up - it was like they were all linebackers. It was so unorthodox it took us by surprise. A good coach can set up a mediocre defense with original game plans and play calling. What bothers me is the belief that football is simple - only 3 gaps, for instance! - and that it comes down to players playing. Yes, players must play, make tackles, hustle, etc. But, if those things were the big part of it, then all the teams would be running similar systems. There just has to be more of an emphasis on game plans and play calls, at least to the point where it balances out the players play. It's worrisome that what it reminds me of most is Edward's defense of last year - it seemed so simple, so behind, so unprepared. Maybe Wannstedt had more input than we thought? I don't know - the season will tell us all we need to know, I guess. +1 I've said these very same words the past week...of course not verbatim,
sllib olaffub Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 I'm not passing total judgment on Wannstedt yet. I only know I've not been impressed by what he's shown us so far. Maybe I didn't do enough research into what his defenses of old looked like, but I thought we'd have a bigger (as opposed to smaller) 4-3 defense that attacked the QB, that was aggressive - something, in nature, like the old Philly or Chicago defenses. Even the Giants defenses of recent years. Will he turn it around? I hope so - because, I just don't want to see Nix invest another offseason in this unit at the expense of the offense. I thought we could look forward to the finishing touches being placed on the offense next offseason, and then be able to watch this team compete for half a decade or so with the nucleus he's put together. Worse case scenario, Wanny gets canned, another guy comes in and we're back yet again by 2 years (unless it were someone like Nolan, but why would he move laterally?). Here's to hoping Wanny gets it right. Even if he doesn't, though - I don't think he'll be gone. Nix seems like the kind of old-school guy who will give years to a coach before hastily letting him go. I might be wrong on that, but we'll see.
3rdand12 Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 I'm not passing total judgment on Wannstedt yet. I only know I've not been impressed by what he's shown us so far. Maybe I didn't do enough research into what his defenses of old looked like, but I thought we'd have a bigger (as opposed to smaller) 4-3 defense that attacked the QB, that was aggressive - something, in nature, like the old Philly or Chicago defenses. Even the Giants defenses of recent years. Will he turn it around? I hope so - because, I just don't want to see Nix invest another offseason in this unit at the expense of the offense. I thought we could look forward to the finishing touches being placed on the offense next offseason, and then be able to watch this team compete for half a decade or so with the nucleus he's put together. Worse case scenario, Wanny gets canned, another guy comes in and we're back yet again by 2 years (unless it were someone like Nolan, but why would he move laterally?). Here's to hoping Wanny gets it right. Even if he doesn't, though - I don't think he'll be gone. Nix seems like the kind of old-school guy who will give years to a coach before hastily letting him go. I might be wrong on that, but we'll see. all we can hope is Dave redeems himself with the players and the fans today.
Sisyphean Bills Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 Guys that can play the run right at them, flow sideline to sideline, cover the TEs over the middle and backs in the flat are named Ray Lewis or Brian Urlacher. Few LBs can do everything well and be proficient in any scheme. You are confusing what I wrote with Hall-of-Fame credentials. There are plenty of LBs across the NFL that can play the position well enough that they aren't benched in favor of defensive backs no matter what the offense is doing. Really, that's a far cry from the Hall-of-Fame. It's merely asking for competence. The Bills had small fast guys. Then they went 3-4 and got rid of them to pick up bigger, slower guys. Now we're back to a 4-3 with the big, slow guys trying to play 4-3 LB positions and they're struggling. Frankly, I don't think the Bills have a single championship caliber 4-3 LB on their roster right now. Thanks for underscoring my point. Yes, it's pretty clear that Dave Wannstedt doesn't believe in the LBs on this team either.
DrDawkinstein Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 You are confusing what I wrote with Hall-of-Fame credentials. There are plenty of LBs across the NFL that can play the position well enough that they aren't benched in favor of defensive backs no matter what the offense is doing. Really, that's a far cry from the Hall-of-Fame. It's merely asking for competence. Thanks for underscoring my point. Yes, it's pretty clear that Dave Wannstedt doesn't believe in the LBs on this team either. Which LBs in the NFL have been able to shut down Gronk and Welker? Who should be our prototype?
Sisyphean Bills Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 Which LBs in the NFL have been able to shut down Gronk and Welker? Who should be our prototype? This discussion centered around stopping the running game.
BillsVet Posted October 7, 2012 Posted October 7, 2012 The Bills had small fast guys. Then they went 3-4 and got rid of them to pick up bigger, slower guys. Now we're back to a 4-3 with the big, slow guys trying to play 4-3 LB positions and they're struggling. Frankly, I don't think the Bills have a single championship caliber 4-3 LB on their roster right now. A lot of people on this board underestimated the massive price a team pays for switching schemes as frequently as Buffalo has under Nix. And if a GM can't get that decision right, what does that say about his ability to build a football team? Nix has had 3 drafts, plenty of UFA dollars, and, of course, those waiver wire acquisitions.
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