Cynical Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 At this point, anyone of us would take Marty's playoff record, especially after how bad the Bills have sucked over the last 12 years. And I wonder how many of the same people would be screaming to run Marty out of town after about 3-4 years of watching Marty making the playoffs and choking it away in tyh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Jabber Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 Even if the Bills were to win the Superbowl, there would still be people complaining about something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pirate Angel Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 what is this playoff you speak of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canks Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 Umm where Overall, Cowher is (w/l) 149-90 in the regular season, 12-9 in the playoffs, 2 SB appearances, 1 SB win Chokenheimer is 200-126 in the regular season, 5 - 13 in the playoffs, 0 SB appearances. But you are right. Cowher did not win the SB until his 15th year. After 26 years, Marty never made it to the SB. As for longevity, Marty was the HC for the Browns 9 years and HC of the Chiefs for 10 years. His playoff record in Cleveland was 2-4, and in KC it was 3-7. Cowher made it to the SB in his 4th year. Umm where are you getting these numbers from? Curtis Martin wasn't in the league long enough to get anywhere close to that many games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillnutinHouston Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 You guys forget that Buddy Nix was in conversations with Marty S for the Buffalo Bills HCing job and when he approached the owner Mr Ralph Wilson about hiring Marty, Wilson stated he didn't (and I quote) "feel comfortable" with having Marty as his HC. Lets not also forget that Jauron let it be known that he was constantly on the phone to Ralph Wilson during the season, as much as 3 hours a day. Where does this stuff come from? Do you have a link for any of this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 And I wonder how many of the same people would be screaming to run Marty out of town after about 3-4 years of watching Marty making the playoffs and choking it away in tyh God... I would so much rather be having that discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cynical Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 http://www.thebiglea...mbles-and-fate/ Marty is the unluckiest coach ever. Yeah, 5-13. It's all about "luck". IIRC, even the Juron apologists stopped using the "luck" excuse as a reason for DJ's failures. When was the last time the Browns or Chiefs were good for more than one season btw? KC went 44-36 under Vermeil with at least 2 winning seasons. Besides, Marty resigned as HC of the Chiefs. Who's fault is it again Marty never made it to SB as the KC HC? As for the Browns ... seriously? After the 1988 season, Art Model fired Chokenheimer. Seven years later, Modell packed up his organization and moved the team to Baltimore. That team is now called the Ravens. Want to to take a guess how well the Ravens have done? Kudos to Cowher for Carson Palmer breaking his leg and the worst officiating in SB history though (never thought the Bills-Skins would be topped in that department but it was). Irrelevant. Cowher still made it to the SB twice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvermike Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 You know what would be a great playoff record for a Bills coach? 0-1. After 12 years of 0-0, it'd feel like a frakking super bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 http://www.thebiglea...mbles-and-fate/ Marty is the unluckiest coach ever. When was the last time the Browns or Chiefs were good for more than one season btw? Kudos to Cowher for Carson Palmer breaking his leg and the worst officiating in SB history though (never thought the Bills-Skins would be topped in that department but it was). For real. I hate this "marty can't win in the playoffs" garbage. He's been the victim so many outrageously fluke plays. My favorite was when SD beat the Pats* on a 4th down pick, but the DB then fumbled, NE recovered, and the Pats* went on to win the game. Oh, I forgot, that was bad playoff coaching. That said, I like Chan for this job. Marty is done coaching too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyHorseAteTheKid Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 Until the Bills owner situation is stabilized, I'm afraid we are tethered to Gailey and Wannstedt .. I do have faith, loyalty and perhaps false hope in the current regime... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffOrange Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 Yeah, 5-13. It's all about "luck". IIRC, even the Juron apologists stopped using the "luck" excuse as a reason for DJ's failures. KC went 44-36 under Vermeil with at least 2 winning seasons. Besides, Marty resigned as HC of the Chiefs. Who's fault is it again Marty never made it to SB as the KC HC? As for the Browns ... seriously? After the 1988 season, Art Model fired Chokenheimer. Seven years later, Modell packed up his organization and moved the team to Baltimore. That team is now called the Ravens. Want to to take a guess how well the Ravens have done? Irrelevant. Cowher still made it to the SB twice. [x] ignore facts in article. [x] compare 60-82 coach to 200-126 coach, as if they're comparable somehow? [x] flip-flop between reg. season & postseason as ways of measuring success, depending on when it's convenient for you (Vermeil won 0 playoff games in KC & that 1 SB trip the Ravens have in 23 years makes them a model franchise?). There's the trifecta of bad posting. Well done. For real. I hate this "marty can't win in the playoffs" garbage. He's been the victim so many outrageously fluke plays. My favorite was when SD beat the Pats* on a 4th down pick, but the DB then fumbled, NE recovered, and the Pats* went on to win the game. Oh, I forgot, that was bad playoff coaching. That said, I like Chan for this job. Marty is done coaching too. It's funny, living in Philly & listening to their hysterical fans, I always ask them why Coughlin is 0-2 vs Reid in playoff games if he is such a vastly superior "postseason coach". Have gotten exactly zero answers to date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 Where does this stuff come from? Do you have a link for any of this? ORCHARD PARK, N.Y. -- Contrary to the diplomatic comments he made on his radio show, Marty Schottenheimer actually did want the Buffalo Bills head-coaching job. BADLY Bills owner Ralph Wilson, however, wasn't interested, sources close to Schottenheimer informed me Tuesday after the club introduced Chan Gailey as their man. Schottenheimer had a strong desire to return to coaching after three years away from the sidelines and had an ally in former Bills general manager Buddy Nix. They became close while working together with the San Diego Chargers. Schottenheimer played linebacker four seasons with the Bills, winning an AFL title with them in 1965. But the Bills couldn't consider Schottenheimer a candidate because Wilson wasn't comfortable with him, the sources said. http://espn.go.com/blog/afceast/post/_/id/9487/marty-schottenheimer-wanted-bills-gig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDogg20 Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 He is like 70 years old for christ sake. He's not much older than Chan. Marty is 68, Chan is 60. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cynical Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 [x] ignore facts in article. Did not. 5-13 is "fact". Whether that record was achieved by bad "luck" is debatable and opinionated. Even the author referred to "perception". If Byner did NOT fumble that ball near the goal line, does that mean Byner was "lucky"? Instead of writing how "unlucky" Chokenheimer is, maybe the author should have tried to figure "why" MS is so unlucky. [x] compare 60-82 coach to 200-126 coach, as if they're comparable somehow? I did not compare coaches. I compared apologists. Juron apologists tried to reason the year he went 13-3 and won COTY was the basis or rule of Dick's coaching. All the losing years were the "exceptions". He lost because people were out to get him and bad luck. Juron apologists finally had to admit it wasn't luck or anything else causing Juron problems, Dick was just a crappy coach. Chokenheimer apologists speak of his playoff failures as bad luck and lack of longevity. At some point, I want to believe Marty apologists will someday figure out and admit Marty is just a lousy playoff coach. [x] flip-flop between reg. season & postseason as ways of measuring success, depending on when it's convenient for you (Vermeil won 0 playoff games in KC & that 1 SB trip the Ravens have in 23 years makes them a model franchise?). Convenient for me? More like you: "When was the last time the Browns or Chiefs were good for more than one season btw?" Your criteria. You set the requirements. I can't help it if Vermeill achieved a similar record in KC (great regular seasaon, sucked in the playoffs). Yes, the Ravens made 1 SB trip in 23 years (and won it, by the way). Remind me again how many trips to the SB as a HC Marty has? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffOrange Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 (edited) If Byner did NOT fumble that ball near the goal line, does that mean Byner was "lucky"? No, he was unlucky that Denver recovered every fumble in the game. Instead of writing how "unlucky" Chokenheimer is, maybe the author should have tried to figure "why" MS is so unlucky. He did. Lets try actually reading. Marty Schottenheimer is known for Marty Ball, hard-nosed defensive football, kicking field goals, and creating turnovers. That settling for field goals thing is what most would point to. You might be surprised to learn, then, that Coughlin’s teams have attempted slightly more field goals per game than Schottenheimer’s in the postseason. Schottenheimer’s opponents also had slightly more than him (36 to 35). The difference, of course, was the percentage of makes. Marty’s kickers missed 14 of their 35 playoff kicks, so that his opponents, despite basically the same number of attempts, made 8 more. Then there are the fumbles. Forcing fumbles (or not fumbling on offense) is a skill. Recovering a forced fumble and having it bounce the right way is not. Schottenheimer’s teams actually forced more fumbles in the postseason than their opponents. They recovered fewer. In three different playoff games–three different gut punch games that would qualify as the worst for most coaches–Schottenheimer’s opponents went a perfect 5 for 5 in recovering every fumble. Those are huge swings if the recovery luck is merely average, and all of them were decided late. I did not compare coaches. I compared apologists. Oh, so because people defend a crappy coach with a huge singular outlier winning season, that's proof that MS sucks. Makes perfect sense. Edited September 11, 2012 by BuffOrange Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T master Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 has marty ever been seriously interviewed for the bills job? i have said it a 1000 times, he would be perfect to turn this thing around. his playoff record is awful granted, but at least he would have the team prepared and competitive. run the ball. have fitz manage the game. play defense. just look at the 49ers. marty may not be the sexy pick, but he can build and manage a team. chan is running a junior varsity program. feels like the bills are at the kiddie table at thanksgiving dinner. I was hoping he would be a major player when Chan was hired . Especially seeing as he use to play for the Bills back in the 60's . It could be he pissed Ralph off , or it could have been he pissed off Nix while they were out in San Diego ? Which i think is probably more the case b/c Nix has been in charge since he's been here & that probably had a lot more to do with it than we will ever know !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajzepp Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 ORCHARD PARK, N.Y. -- Contrary to the diplomatic comments he made on his radio show, Marty Schottenheimer actually did want the Buffalo Bills head-coaching job. BADLY Bills owner Ralph Wilson, however, wasn't interested, sources close to Schottenheimer informed me Tuesday after the club introduced Chan Gailey as their man. Schottenheimer had a strong desire to return to coaching after three years away from the sidelines and had an ally in former Bills general manager Buddy Nix. They became close while working together with the San Diego Chargers. Schottenheimer played linebacker four seasons with the Bills, winning an AFL title with them in 1965. But the Bills couldn't consider Schottenheimer a candidate because Wilson wasn't comfortable with him, the sources said. http://espn.go.com/b...anted-bills-gig DAMMIT, Ralph....wtf?? If we had hired Marty we'd have a stable-but-unspectacular veteran QB, killer running game, stout D, and we'd be in the playoff hunt. As I've said before, Marty is the Larry Brown of the NFL...he may not be winning championships but he'll straighten up the franchise, make them competitive, and put them in position to take some shots. I thought we didn't hire Marty cause he was wanting to stay retired....this really pisses me off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cynical Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 No, he was unlucky that Denver recovered every fumble in the game. I see. The fumble itself means nothing. It's that Denver recovered it. Here's a concept. Denver cannot recover what wasn't fumbled to begin with. Byner fumbled the ball because Byner was carrying the ball away from his body, which made it easy for the Denver player to strip the ball. Bad luck or just bad ball protection? He did. Lets try actually reading. Yes, lets. Here is a piece you bolded: "Marty’s kickers missed 14 of their 35 playoff kicks, so that his opponents, despite basically the same number of attempts, made 8 more." Feel free to point out where the author attempts to explain why this happened. Show me something, anything from that article that shows or attempts to show why Marty's kickers missed 14 of their 35 playoff kicks. Oh, so because people defend a crappy coach with a huge singular outlier winning season, that's proof that MS sucks. Makes perfect sense. Your strawman arguments are becoming tiresome. Marty is a lousy playoff coach because his records says so: 5-13. That's lousy. Once again, I was comparing people like you, who are defending Martys 5-13 playoff record as being due to 'luck', to people who defended DJ's overall record. I'll make it more clear for you. It's called denial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 (edited) DAMMIT, Ralph....wtf?? If we had hired Marty we'd have a stable-but-unspectacular veteran QB, killer running game, stout D, and we'd be in the playoff hunt. As I've said before, Marty is the Larry Brown of the NFL...he may not be winning championships but he'll straighten up the franchise, make them competitive, and put them in position to take some shots. I thought we didn't hire Marty cause he was wanting to stay retired....this really pisses me off. Yea no shi...kidding! Freaking Ralph! Marty S...games over 500, 74. Division Championships 8, 327 games 200 wins, one tie, 126 losses .613 winning % Coaches that worked under Marty S, Marty's coaching tree, Bill Cowher Herm Edwards, Cam Cameron, Tony Dungy, Marvin lewis, Ken Wisenhunt, Lovie Smith, Rod Marinelli , Mike Tomlin The main point is everywhere Marty has gone he took a PoS team and built them into a contender. Something the Buffalo Bills have needed for a decade. What we have now, 10-23=.303% Edited September 11, 2012 by Fear the Beard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keukasmallies Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 Superbowl my @$$, I would settle for the first number being larger than the second number at the end of the season! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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