A Few Thoughts About The Game, in no partIcular order.....

[BuffBill]

Huh? He single handedly brought us back into this blow out. Spiller is no where near the problem. Fitz killed us just like he killed our season last year. Spiller has kept us in games last year and this week while Fitz was busy giving them away. Get over it already, he was the 9th pick in the draft...so what. He is proving to be worthy of that pick but you cant get over he was picked 9th when you wanted someone else. Stop hating him, he is the real deal and the future and the ONLY dynamic player on this offense

I don't think he ever had possession for it to be a fumble, but I watching him expect him to fumble every time he as the ball because of the way he holds it. He didn't singlehandedly bring us back into this blowout, because Fitz made sure the game was over way before that.

[CFLstyle]

Don't agree at all about Spiller. What I saw from him today was rare for a running back. Glimpses of an elite runner.

 

Every time he touched the ball, he hit the hole so quickly. When there was no space, he was patient. He waited for his blocks, he waited for the holes to open up.

 

He accelerates so fast from a stand still, there were three or four times I thought he was done and they'd cut him off at the corner, just to see him burn the defender and get up the sideline.

 

I'm left to wonder what he could've done had he gotten the ball more.

[Alphadawg7]

We can agree to disagee. Or, you can cite the football games Spiller has won us. Either way, is this all that you have to say? What did you think of our corners? Or the coaching? I'm with you 100% that Fitz sucked, and he was SO bad that he should have been pulled.

 

Come on, you know too much about football to even ask me that stupid question..."how many games has he won us". Clearly, he has played good enough to win us games, except our QB and defense last year played so bad that not even Walter Payton and Barry Sanders in our same back field at the same time would have won us games. Not to mention a coach who refuses to accept our QB sucks and our running game is what needs to be featured not a limp arm, bad decision making, late read, and inaccurate QB.

 

Anyway, on to your other questions...Coaching sucked...the refusal to feature the run game is getting absurd. Look at how many yards Spiller had...but only on a limited amount of carries. Just like last year, the most effective part of this team is our rushing attack. Sure you need to pass to keep them honest, but I am so tired of 3rd and 9, 3rd and 14, 3rd and 11...etc. I have been a Gailey supporter, and in fact I like is style of offense. The problem is he does NOT have the talent to run this type of offense at QB nor WR. He is trying to force a system on to a team not equipped to handle it. If he doesnt figure that out quick, I think this team will again miss the post season and it will be hard to see him keeping his job. And the defensive coaching was just as bad yesterday.

 

As far as the corners go...about what I expected. I think Ron Brooks and Gilmore should be our starters, said that even on draft night. I love the Ron Brooks pick then, and still do now. Unfortunately he was hurt. I expected growing pains, but I am not worried about Gilmore. I think the biggest problem with our D yesterday was the play calling. They had our guys playing way off the WR's despite the fact Sanchez was making quick reads and throws. We did not bring enough pressure because we did not blitz nearly as much as we should have. Our LB's are still suspect at best too. But back to the corners...I am concerned about Williams lack of ability to stay with his man. I don't know if its inexperience or lack of speed, but he seems to struggle with coverage out there and I am starting to wonder if is better suited as the nickel back.

[CFLstyle]

Really? You're not? Just exactly how bad does he have to play before you pull the plug? This is professional football. He wasn't fighting through anything. He was just plain terrible. And unfortunately that appears to be the "real" Fitz. He has played too many games like yesterday and not enough good ones to warrant any kind of confidence. If he can't play, then sit his rear end down. They lost the game by 20 points largely because of Fitzpatrick mistakes. Any QB could throw three picks and miss open receivers. I for one am no fan of Thigpen either, but in reality he couldn't have hurt our cause yesterday. The QB play was so bad, that it could not possibly have hurt to sit him down.

Fitz is the kind of guy who's on one game and off the next, and the outcome of the game will usually depend on whether he's on or off. Yesterday he was obviously off, so the hope is he'll be on for the next one. Is that how you win a Super Bowl in this league, or even make the playoffs? No, obviously not - it's more likely a ticket to a .500 record, give or take a game or two.

 

But I'm certain he's the best option we have right now, so until we have a better quarterback or a young guy ready to play, there's no reason Fitz isn't our guy.

Edited September 10, 2012 by CFLstyle

[Coach Tuesday]

Here are my quick thoughts - I'd post them to my own thread, but no one would read it, so I'll try hijacking Bill's thread. Some of these are obvious but here goes:

 

1) Fitz lead the league in INTs last year, but for some reason, Chan's gameplan called for attacking the league's best secondary by the air. On the road, in week 1. The result is not too surprising.

 

2) The Bills jettisoned three defensive veteran leaders this offseason (Edwards, Florence, and Merriman). All were let go for financial reasons and I can't really argue that any of them in particular was worth keeping, but the Bills have a habit of cutting vets for financial reasons on the eve of seasons, without regard to locker room chemistry or leadership. This is a defense without enough vocal veteran leaders. Speaking of which,

 

3) Wanny needs to get out of the coaches' box and onto the sideline - now. This is a young defense that needs active gameday leadership. Think about yesterday - if you were coaching that defense, wouldn't you want to look into McKelvin's eyes on the sideline and find out where the f- his head was, while the game was going on? Putting Wanny in the coaches box is a huge mistake.

 

4) I'll beat this dead horse again: the Bills had 6 starters yesterday out of about 25 Nix draft picks (Moats, Glenn, Dareus, Shep, A. Williams, S. Gilmore). They'll add a sixth next week in Spiller (no I don't count Potter). That's just not good enough. None of those starters plays WR, QB, or DE - perhaps the three most important positions in today's NFL other than LT. Two of those starters play LB - the team's weakest position aside from WR; two of them play CB, the team's worst position yesterday.

 

5) The Jets have a fast, tall young WR who is extremely raw. They let him play yesterday but didn't overthink it - they just gave him the ball in space and let him try to make plays. The Bills have one of those, Easley - they cut him and put him on the PS. Speaking of which,

 

6) I'll beat another dead horse: TJ Graham inexplicably was inactive yesterday, despite WR being the weakest position on the team, and despite the Bills insisting on picking him in the 3rd round (well higher than anyone projected him) in order to pass up on Russell Wilson. Wilson had a rough outing yesterday but still managed to look 100x better than Fitzpatrick. Speaking of which,

 

7) Gailey's insistence on the spread formation and his loyalty to Fitzpatrick may get him fired.

 

8) Nix's failure to draft or develop a competent QB may get him fired.

 

9) These LBs need to learn their drops.

 

10) Gailey's record as coach of the Buffalo Bills: 10 wins, 23 losses.

 

11) The Bills in my opinion may have the best OL in football. They need to use it to control the game. They have two great backs. Come on, Chan. Your job is on the line - ADJUST.

 

12) It's hard for Bills fans to know who to get angry with anymore. George Edwards was blamed for the poor defenses of the last two years - yesterday looked worse than when he was in charge. Nix is appropriately maligned for his poor drafts, often by me, and especially for 2010 - yet Spiller was the best player on the field for either team yesterday (sorry Bill - you had me until that). Ralph used to be railed on for refusing to spend money to upgrade the roster, yet he went "all in" last offseason and has seen no ROI yet. And who do you get angry with for injuries? People start to mentally break down when they keep getting screwed over and they can't figure out why - as a fanbase, we're close to needing a straightjacket.

 

Despite all of the above, I still feel pretty good about the season. Let's hope they right the ship next week and give the fans a home opener worth remembering.

Edited September 10, 2012 by Coach Tuesday

[Orton's Arm]

Bill is a good poster but there are certain players he will never like because he wanted an OL picked instead. If Spiller rushes for 2,000 yards this year, he will find a fault in his game.

 

And I know Bill will bash me for supporting Whitner (started for the #1 defense last year) and Jauron (top 10 defense in Cleveland) but there's no comparison between them & Spiller. He has top 5 rb skills.

Over the last 40 years, the Bills have used 10 of their first picks of the draft on RBs, another 10 on DBs, only two on OTs, and none on QBs. As for QBs: the Bills did trade away their first round pick for Rob Johnson, so if you want to you can count that. In 1983, the Bills took a TE at 14th overall, and Jim Kelly at 16th overall. Kelly may not have been the Bills' first pick of that draft, but you could say he was (sort of) tied for first. But even if you give the Bills Rob Johnson and half of Kelly, that's still 1.5 first picks of the draft on QBs, compared to 10 each for DBs and RBs.

 

In the post-Polian era, it's been common for Bills' first round DBs to go first-contract-and-out. For a well-run team, this would make them less likely to take a first round DB in the first place. Why use a first round pick on a guy who's only going to give you team five years before he's out the door? For the Bills, the short duration of DBs' stays here made them more likely to take DBs in the first round. First round picks were used to replace other DBs going first-contract-and-out. That same logic was also why the Bills used so many early picks on RBs. RBs typically have short careers, so why not use early picks on them all the time?

 

In part as a result of squandering their early draft picks on DBs and RBs, the Bills have failed to find a successor to Kelly, and have failed to build a nucleus of very good players here for the long run. That doesn't mean that a first round DB or RB is always a mistake. If you are 100% convinced that you'll extend the DB beyond his first contract (assuming he's not a bust), or if you believe the RB will have a long, very good career, and if there are no QBs worthy of the pick, then you could justify taking a DB or RB.

 

Such justification was particularly absent during Marv's tenure as GM. Picking 8th overall, Marv had a choice. Option A was to take a very good QB in the form of Cutler. Option B was to take a very good DL in Ngata. Option C was to reach for an overrated, overhyped SS whom many (including Vic Carucci) felt was not a first round talent.

 

Some have argued that back in 2006, the Bills hadn't give up on Losman. So why take a QB? But part of Marv's job was to look at Losman's film from college and the NFL to determine whether TD's confidence in him was justified. If that confidence was not, then you take the QB. Sure, you give Losman his chance anyway, and maybe he succeeds. If both he and Cutler proved to be successful QBs, the Bills could have traded one of them away. Much like the Broncos traded Cutler away for two first round picks, plus Kyle Orton, plus some other stuff. That's a lot better than the Bills' practice of trading away their former first rounders, in the primes of their careers, for third and fourth round draft picks.

 

Taking Whitner 8th overall cost us a chance to have a long term answer at the QB position for the first time since Kelly hung up his cleats. Instead of fixing the QB position, the Bills obtained a SS who did not offer a significant improvement over George Wilson or Bryan Scott. If the Whitner pick is the single most egregious example of Marv falling into the DBs/RBs trap, the second-most egregious is Marshawn Lynch. Taken 12th overall, Lynch failed to obtain the same rushing averages as did Fred Jackson. With his new team, the Seahawks, Lynch is averaging nearly a full yard per carry less than the Seahawks' other main RB. Lynch was probably not worth much more than the fourth + sixth round picks the Bills obtained for him in a trade. Clearly, the Bills should have used the 12th overall pick on another position instead. As for the argument that they had to take a first round RB after trading away McGahee: no they didn't! Nowhere does it say the Bills have to have a first round pick as their starting RB!

 

Lest some of the above be construed as 20/20 hindsight: there were those on these boards (including Bill from NYC and me) who felt the Whitner pick was a mistake, and announced as much within 24 hours of it having been made. That's not 20/20 hindsight. That's avoiding the boneheadedness of what had been a very inept front office.

 

The Spiller pick is in a different category than the Whitner or Lynch picks. When the Bills' pick came up at 9th overall, there was no college player available who a) was at or near Spiller's talent level, and who b) had been anything more than a one year wonder at the college level. The alternatives to Spiller were much less appealing (based on the data available at the time) than were the alternatives to Whitner. Also, Spiller is a much better football player than Whitner or Lynch. Those are reasons why I was much more open to Spiller being a good pick than I'd been to the idea that Whitner or Lynch may have been good picks.

 

To make a long story short, Bill from NYC's antipathy toward first round RBs and DBs has been richly justified time and time again. Thus far, it appears as though Spiller may be one of the very rare cases in which his instinctive reaction to first round RBs is not justified.

 

When Spiller was picked, I said that for him to justify his draft postion, he needed to do more than just run the ball well. I wrote that he needed to become another Thurman Thomas: a guy who could be a good receiving threat out of the backfield, as well as someone upon whom you could rely for blitz pickup. I'd like to hear people's opinions about how far along they feel Spiller is WRT running the ball, being a good receiver, and being a good blocker/blitz pickup guy.

[BuffBill]

We can agree to disagee. Or, you can cite the football games Spiller has won us. Either way, is this all that you have to say? What did you think of our corners? Or the coaching? I'm with you 100% that Fitz sucked, and he was SO bad that he should have been pulled.

 

I think we have only won one game with Spiller starting or playing a significant amount of the game? Not disputing he had a great game, but don't really think he was won all that many games for us, if any? The only game we have won in what seems like forever was against Denver last year and Tebow and our defense won that game.

[C.Biscuit97]

Over the last 40 years, the Bills have used 10 of their first picks of the draft on RBs, another 10 on DBs, only two on OTs, and none on QBs. As for QBs: the Bills did trade away their first round pick for Rob Johnson, so if you want to you can count that. In 1983, the Bills took a TE at 14th overall, and Jim Kelly at 16th overall. Kelly may not have been the Bills' first pick of that draft, but you could say he was (sort of) tied for first. But even if you give the Bills Rob Johnson and half of Kelly, that's still 1.5 first picks of the draft on QBs, compared to 10 each for DBs and RBs.

 

In the post-Polian era, it's been common for Bills' first round DBs to go first-contract-and-out. For a well-run team, this would make them less likely to take a first round DB in the first place. Why use a first round pick on a guy who's only going to give you team five years before he's out the door? For the Bills, the short duration of DBs' stays here made them more likely to take DBs in the first round. First round picks were used to replace other DBs going first-contract-and-out. That same logic was also why the Bills used so many early picks on RBs. RBs typically have short careers, so why not use early picks on them all the time?

 

In part as a result of squandering their early draft picks on DBs and RBs, the Bills have failed to find a successor to Kelly, and have failed to build a nucleus of very good players here for the long run. That doesn't mean that a first round DB or RB is always a mistake. If you are 100% convinced that you'll extend the DB beyond his first contract (assuming he's not a bust), or if you believe the RB will have a long, very good career, and if there are no QBs worthy of the pick, then you could justify taking a DB or RB.

 

Such justification was particularly absent during Marv's tenure as GM. Picking 8th overall, Marv had a choice. Option A was to take a very good QB in the form of Cutler. Option B was to take a very good DL in Ngata. Option C was to reach for an overrated, overhyped SS whom many (including Vic Carucci) felt was not a first round talent.

 

Some have argued that back in 2006, the Bills hadn't give up on Losman. So why take a QB? But part of Marv's job was to look at Losman's film from college and the NFL to determine whether TD's confidence in him was justified. If that confidence was not, then you take the QB. Sure, you give Losman his chance anyway, and maybe he succeeds. If both he and Cutler proved to be successful QBs, the Bills could have traded one of them away. Much like the Broncos traded Cutler away for two first round picks, plus Kyle Orton, plus some other stuff. That's a lot better than the Bills' practice of trading away their former first rounders, in the primes of their careers, for third and fourth round draft picks.

 

Taking Whitner 8th overall cost us a chance to have a long term answer at the QB position for the first time since Kelly hung up his cleats. Instead of fixing the QB position, the Bills obtained a SS who did not offer a significant improvement over George Wilson or Bryan Scott. If the Whitner pick is the single most egregious example of Marv falling into the DBs/RBs trap, the second-most egregious is Marshawn Lynch. Taken 12th overall, Lynch failed to obtain the same rushing averages as did Fred Jackson. With his new team, the Seahawks, Lynch is averaging nearly a full yard per carry less than the Seahawks' other main RB. Lynch was probably not worth much more than the fourth + sixth round picks the Bills obtained for him in a trade. Clearly, the Bills should have used the 12th overall pick on another position instead. As for the argument that they had to take a first round RB after trading away McGahee: no they didn't! Nowhere does it say the Bills have to have a first round pick as their starting RB!

 

Lest some of the above be construed as 20/20 hindsight: there were those on these boards (including Bill from NYC and me) who felt the Whitner pick was a mistake, and announced as much within 24 hours of it having been made. That's not 20/20 hindsight. That's avoiding the boneheadedness of what had been a very inept front office.

 

The Spiller pick is in a different category than the Whitner or Lynch picks. When the Bills' pick came up at 9th overall, there was no college player available who a) was at or near Spiller's talent level, and who b) had been anything more than a one year wonder at the college level. The alternatives to Spiller were much less appealing (based on the data available at the time) than were the alternatives to Whitner. Also, Spiller is a much better football player than Whitner or Lynch. Those are reasons why I was much more open to Spiller being a good pick than I'd been to the idea that Whitner or Lynch may have been good picks.

 

To make a long story short, Bill from NYC's antipathy toward first round RBs and DBs has been richly justified time and time again. Thus far, it appears as though Spiller may be one of the very rare cases in which his instinctive reaction to first round RBs is not justified.

 

When Spiller was picked, I said that for him to justify his draft postion, he needed to do more than just run the ball well. I wrote that he needed to become another Thurman Thomas: a guy who could be a good receiving threat out of the backfield, as well as someone upon whom you could rely for blitz pickup. I'd like to hear people's opinions about how far along they feel Spiller is WRT running the ball, being a good receiver, and being a good blocker/blitz pickup guy.

 

This has been argued a million times but it's the end of the day and I have some time to kill.

 

1) Yes, Ngata should have been the pick but you gloss over several facts. We just signed Tripplet, who was solid player for the Colts and then drafted McCargo. To act like they didn't address the position is short sighted.

 

2) Bill has the old school football mentality that is completely outdated now. DBs are more important than ever. The reason the Jets can play defense with very average pass rushers is because they have excellent corners. Also, Pittsburgh is a llowed to play the way the do because of Troy P.

 

Whitner was a reach at #8, but if he did become the player they hoped he would be, it would be more than justified in today's NFL. Safties are getting picked higher than ever. Also, the guy starts on the best defense in the NFL. He can't be that terrible.

 

3) Cutler has been to the playoffs once in his career. Let's not act like he's some special Qb. Perhaps, this is the year for him to finally mature but the Bills thought they can fix Losman. and one of the worst things you can do is give up too early on a QB. Obviously, Losman busted.

 

I do agree the Bills need to address the position in the draft but I hate the idea of reaching for a guy. I was praying they didn't reach for guys like Gabbert and Tannehill. But I 100% agree they need to get a truly talented guy for once. I love Fitz' attitude but there's little doubt he's limited. If the Bills have a chance to make a RG3 type deal for a guy like Barkley this offseason, I'd support it 100%.

 

I think we have only won one game with Spiller starting or playing a significant amount of the game? Not disputing he had a great game, but don't really think he was won all that many games for us, if any? The only game we have won in what seems like forever was against Denver last year and Tebow and our defense won that game.

 

Football is still a team game. Doesn't that mean Barry Sanders wasn't a good player because his team rarely won? Or that Antowain Smith was a good rb because he won with the Pats?

[YOOOOOO]

Fred Jackons 2010 253 touches 5 fumbles

CJ Spiller career 260 touches 5 fumbles....

 

 

just stop it....

 

the kid was the only bright spot yesterday

[C.Biscuit97]

Fred Jackons 2010 253 touches 5 fumbles

CJ Spiller career 260 touches 5 fumbles....

 

 

just stop it....

 

the kid was the only bright spot yesterday

 

Almost every other fanbase would laugh at us for putting down Spiller after yesterday's game. It's like saying Kate Upton isn't hot because of her mole.

[Mango]

I like Spiller a lot, but he has to be much more consistent. He fumble balls at crucial moments. Imagine if he doesn't pick that ball up last year in the endzone vs the Pats. Not the greatest route runner. With decent hands. He gets stopped at the line 3 out of 4 times, then breaks 1 for 20 yards here and there. His average turns out to be padded because of it. I think he did a lot of great things for us yesterday, but when it is 27-7 at the half, some of those rushing yards are inflated with a softer defense. We are fine with Spiller at the helm if we need him, he is nowhere near elite or game changing at this point in his career.

[C.Biscuit97]

I like Spiller a lot, but he has to be much more consistent. He fumble balls at crucial moments. Imagine if he doesn't pick that ball up last year in the endzone vs the Pats. Not the greatest route runner. With decent hands. He gets stopped at the line 3 out of 4 times, then breaks 1 for 20 yards here and there. His average turns out to be padded because of it. I think he did a lot of great things for us yesterday, but when it is 27-7 at the half, some of those rushing yards are inflated with a softer defense. We are fine with Spiller at the helm if we need him, he is nowhere near elite or game changing at this point in his career.

 

Barry Sanders used to led the league in negative rushes. I'd love to see the stats on rbs who's team loses when they rush for over 160+ yards. Spiller did his job.

[CodeMonkey]

Barry Sanders used to led the league in negative rushes. I'd love to see the stats on rbs who's team loses when they rush for over 160+ yards. Spiller did his job.

i agree with you that Spiller did his job yesterday. Best game I've seen him play so far.

But during Barry Sanders tenure with the Lions, they had a sub .500 record.

[JohnC]

i agree with you that Spiller did his job yesterday. Best game I've seen him play so far.

But during Barry Sanders tenure with the Lions, they had a sub .500 record.

 

Maybe if they had a good qb and team in general their record would have been better. The same reasoning applies to the Bills.

 

When Spiller got full time playing time last year after Jackson got hurt he averaged in the range of 5 yds. per carry for half a season of play. For those people who are critical of Spiller (not saying you are) it makes little sense. He was drafted in the first round because he had the potential to make big plays for a team lacking playmakers on offense. He is meeting that expectation. The chorus of repeated criticism from a few deadenders is inexplicable. Having a preconceived opinion is sometimes understandable. But when the body of work demonstrates an alternative position then a fair-minded person should at least acknowledge the evidence to the contrary.

[CodeMonkey]

Maybe if they had a good qb and team in general their record would have been better. The same reasoning applies to the Bills.

And maybe if he had made positive yardage on nearly every touch instead of how Spiller was last season ... lots of negative or no gain followed by a 20+ ... their record would have been better too.

 

A 20 yard run for a first down followed by 3 no gains means your team punts. A 5 yards per carry average for the RB but not much good for the team.

 

That was Spiller last season. The Spiller of yesterday was much much improved in my opinion. I hope we see this Spiller 2.0 the rest of his career.

[Bill from NYC]

Maybe if they had a good qb and team in general their record would have been better. The same reasoning applies to the Bills.

 

When Spiller got full time playing time last year after Jackson got hurt he averaged in the range of 5 yds. per carry for half a season of play. For those people who are critical of Spiller (not saying you are) it makes little sense. He was drafted in the first round because he had the potential to make big plays for a team lacking playmakers on offense. He is meeting that expectation. The chorus of repeated criticism from a few deadenders is inexplicable. Having a preconceived opinion is sometimes understandable. But when the body of work demonstrates an alternative position then a fair-minded person should at least acknowledge the evidence to the contrary.

 

John, this will be my final post wrt Spiller on this thread, and for the week. Next week, I will comment on his body of work, OK?

 

I don't play fantasy football. I don't knock it mind you, But from my point of view, I see the possibility that it could alter my view of the game, and make me look at stats more than I should. For instance, if Fitz throws zero picks next week and a td or 2, his overall stats will not look so bad. I think that we can agree on this. But, will this make him a legit QB? You tell me, my friend.

In this thread, a poster shared a stat that Spiller, in virtually the same amount of carries as FJ, had the same amount of fumbles. I thank said poster for this info, but does it make you wonder why FJ was clearly viewed as the starter coming into the season? Dropped passes, picking up blitzes, passes off of his hand for ints might enter into the equation, no? But these things don't always show uo in fantasy stats.

I want wins just like you John, and every other fan on this board. The Bills are 1-6 in games in which Spiller started. Do I blame him exclusively? Absolutely NOT!!! But I DO want him to improve on the things that he needs work on. I want him to take over a game and win it for us, and he has the actual talent to do so.

 

Now, am I a bit shell shocked from the way this team has been managed? Of course. Our secondary alone boasts 2 early second round picks, and 2 early firsts. Who had our only interception? Yes, this is frustrating. The OL, which I have bitched about for years on end, looks pretty good. And we are STILLL losing. As Edward's Arm said, we have devoted untold resources to RBs and DBs, and it has only resulted in losses.

 

In any event, if I was a bit rough on Spiller, do see where it was coming from. I want this team to win!!! I want wins from those to whom we devoted major resources, and who are very well paid. The exception would be McKelvin. He, imo, should be traded or tossed.

 

Thanks, as always, for the dialogue.

Edited September 10, 2012 by Bill from NYC

[bobshaw81]

Same old ****ty Bills. So much for the high expectations. Chan should have taken the preseason more seriously and got the starters more reps against opponents second string for confidence. They need every rep they can get at this point. Its absolutely pathetic all around. The Jets own us.

 

Offensively I blame Chan/Fitz. He's just as bad as Tebow throwing the ball. Has no deep ball whatsoever. The damn spread offense with its timing routes will never ever ever work with Fitz because he is too inaccurate. Gailey sucks and can't run a real NFL offense or adapt. And with our receiving core its an absolute joke to be in a spread. I would understand running it if you had Haywood Jeffries, Ernest Givins, Curtis Duncan, Drew Hill and Lorenzo White with a mobile, accurate QB like WM. When it gets cold, rainy, windy, snowy our receivers will most likely drop the ball or already be injured. Welcome to Buffalo. Get your asses under center and run run run with some playaction Chan you moron. So sick of seeing the shotgun and pistol every play. It will never work with the current roster, qb and receivers mostly. Spiller was the only bright spot I saw. Resign Vince Young, get Tavaris ready, do something to prepare and have a backup plan. Fitz is not the guy(VY wins games bottom line, 30+ Ws or around there, 17 losses, as a starter I'll take that Qb anyday). Tavaris would take much better care of the ball then Fitz.

 

Defensively I blame Wannastache. He sucked when he was the head coach of Miami, and Chicago and guess what? He's still a crappy/losing coach and always will be. We tried to play the bend but don't break D but instead we played bend and break D. Great!! It seemed our philosophy was get pressure with 4 Dline men and for the secondary and Lbs to have solid coverage but that didn't work. Their gameplan was to have Sanchez get the ball out fast and take our D line outta the picture and play conservatiave. Wannastache had no answer or adjustments. They marched our D all around the field. No one made and plays. Leodis is still the same old bust 1st round pick. He's always tight in coverage but never turns his head around in time to find the ball. He was god awful, you think he would learn. Jermey Kearly, really man?!?! And of course its not a Bills game without there tightend(back-up) beating our LBs.

 

Bruce DeHaven is garbage.

 

Nix put together a decent roster on paper. That's all it is though until our coaches do something. Totally unprepared to play a NFL game and it showed. 0-4 in the preaseason was taken way too lightly. Hit the panic button, we are a crap team.

 

And now the Bills want NY taxpayer funding for upgrades to the stadium. With all the money NFL makes you think they could front the cost. They can leave for all I care at this point. They have made me numb over the last 10 years+. Atleast our taxes would go down. Seriuosly how can people support garbage for this long of a time. Get real people with your high expectations. No wonder forbes ranked Buffalo in the bottom. We deserve it so

 

 

 

Go ahead and bash me. I welcome it. Actually, I'll enjoy it.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

You are wrong about Spiller...your stubbornness to want to hate him is doing you in...he is the real deal and out played the entire roster today.

 

You know, if we want to bag on the DL for not getting after it and Fitz for throwing 3 picks (both cases highly deserved), I don't quite see how Spiller can "outplay the entire roster" when he gives up that costly fumble

[JohnC]

And maybe if he had made positive yardage on nearly every touch instead of how Spiller was last season ... lots of negative or no gain followed by a 20+ ... their record would have been better too.

 

A 20 yard run for a first down followed by 3 no gains means your team punts. A 5 yards per carry average for the RB but not much good for the team.

 

That was Spiller last season. The Spiller of yesterday was much much improved in my opinion. I hope we see this Spiller 2.0 the rest of his career.

 

Barry Sanders is in the HOF. He was an elusive styled runner and not a power styled runner. In one season he had a 2000 yd season. If the Lions had talent issues it certainly wasn't because of Sanders on the roster.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Sanders

[dave mcbride]

Over the last 40 years, the Bills have used 10 of their first picks of the draft on RBs, another 10 on DBs, only two on OTs, and none on QBs. As for QBs: the Bills did trade away their first round pick for Rob Johnson, so if you want to you can count that. In 1983, the Bills took a TE at 14th overall, and Jim Kelly at 16th overall. Kelly may not have been the Bills' first pick of that draft, but you could say he was (sort of) tied for first. But even if you give the Bills Rob Johnson and half of Kelly, that's still 1.5 first picks of the draft on QBs, compared to 10 each for DBs and RBs.

 

In the post-Polian era, it's been common for Bills' first round DBs to go first-contract-and-out. For a well-run team, this would make them less likely to take a first round DB in the first place. Why use a first round pick on a guy who's only going to give you team five years before he's out the door? For the Bills, the short duration of DBs' stays here made them more likely to take DBs in the first round. First round picks were used to replace other DBs going first-contract-and-out. That same logic was also why the Bills used so many early picks on RBs. RBs typically have short careers, so why not use early picks on them all the time?

 

In part as a result of squandering their early draft picks on DBs and RBs, the Bills have failed to find a successor to Kelly, and have failed to build a nucleus of very good players here for the long run. That doesn't mean that a first round DB or RB is always a mistake. If you are 100% convinced that you'll extend the DB beyond his first contract (assuming he's not a bust), or if you believe the RB will have a long, very good career, and if there are no QBs worthy of the pick, then you could justify taking a DB or RB.

 

Such justification was particularly absent during Marv's tenure as GM. Picking 8th overall, Marv had a choice. Option A was to take a very good QB in the form of Cutler. Option B was to take a very good DL in Ngata. Option C was to reach for an overrated, overhyped SS whom many (including Vic Carucci) felt was not a first round talent.

 

Some have argued that back in 2006, the Bills hadn't give up on Losman. So why take a QB? But part of Marv's job was to look at Losman's film from college and the NFL to determine whether TD's confidence in him was justified. If that confidence was not, then you take the QB. Sure, you give Losman his chance anyway, and maybe he succeeds. If both he and Cutler proved to be successful QBs, the Bills could have traded one of them away. Much like the Broncos traded Cutler away for two first round picks, plus Kyle Orton, plus some other stuff. That's a lot better than the Bills' practice of trading away their former first rounders, in the primes of their careers, for third and fourth round draft picks.

 

Taking Whitner 8th overall cost us a chance to have a long term answer at the QB position for the first time since Kelly hung up his cleats. Instead of fixing the QB position, the Bills obtained a SS who did not offer a significant improvement over George Wilson or Bryan Scott. If the Whitner pick is the single most egregious example of Marv falling into the DBs/RBs trap, the second-most egregious is Marshawn Lynch. Taken 12th overall, Lynch failed to obtain the same rushing averages as did Fred Jackson. With his new team, the Seahawks, Lynch is averaging nearly a full yard per carry less than the Seahawks' other main RB. Lynch was probably not worth much more than the fourth + sixth round picks the Bills obtained for him in a trade. Clearly, the Bills should have used the 12th overall pick on another position instead. As for the argument that they had to take a first round RB after trading away McGahee: no they didn't! Nowhere does it say the Bills have to have a first round pick as their starting RB!

 

Lest some of the above be construed as 20/20 hindsight: there were those on these boards (including Bill from NYC and me) who felt the Whitner pick was a mistake, and announced as much within 24 hours of it having been made. That's not 20/20 hindsight. That's avoiding the boneheadedness of what had been a very inept front office.

 

The Spiller pick is in a different category than the Whitner or Lynch picks. When the Bills' pick came up at 9th overall, there was no college player available who a) was at or near Spiller's talent level, and who b) had been anything more than a one year wonder at the college level. The alternatives to Spiller were much less appealing (based on the data available at the time) than were the alternatives to Whitner. Also, Spiller is a much better football player than Whitner or Lynch. Those are reasons why I was much more open to Spiller being a good pick than I'd been to the idea that Whitner or Lynch may have been good picks.

 

To make a long story short, Bill from NYC's antipathy toward first round RBs and DBs has been richly justified time and time again. Thus far, it appears as though Spiller may be one of the very rare cases in which his instinctive reaction to first round RBs is not justified.

 

When Spiller was picked, I said that for him to justify his draft postion, he needed to do more than just run the ball well. I wrote that he needed to become another Thurman Thomas: a guy who could be a good receiving threat out of the backfield, as well as someone upon whom you could rely for blitz pickup. I'd like to hear people's opinions about how far along they feel Spiller is WRT running the ball, being a good receiver, and being a good blocker/blitz pickup guy.

 

Wtf re: Lynch?? He had a great year last year, as anyone who actually watched the Seahawks play can tell you. The only guy who had a higher ypc was Leon Washington (4.7 to 4.2), and he ran it 53 times to Lynch's 285. In his final season with the Bills, he led the league in ypc after the first hit. Sure, his numbers weren't good, but a lot of that wasn't him. I'm not trying to justify the Lynch pick - after all, McGahee remained a good player and has a pretty decent chance to get 10,000 yards. But let's not miss the fact that Lynch is actually quite good. Also, be careful about twisting stats when your eyes can see that he's a guy who always gets the safety up in the box.