thewildrabbit Posted August 30, 2012 Posted August 30, 2012 Teams that had more than one receiver in the top 20 in receptions: New England*, 3 (1 WR and 2 TEs) Detroit, 2 (1 WR and 1 TE) Atlanta, 2 (1 WR and 1 TE) New Orleans, 3 (1 WR, 1 TE and 1 RB) NYGiants, 2 (2 WRs) That's all. In yards: New England, 2 (1 WR and 1 TE) NYGiants, 2 (2 WRs) New Orleans, 2 (1 TE and 1 WR) Pittsburgh, 2 (2 WRs) That's it. It's not like every other team has all these guys in the top 20. Is it teams with good QBs? Some, but not all. Where's Green Bay? I hear their QB is OK. Is Stafford really all that good at this point in his career, or does he have really terrific receivers? Where's Rivers? Looks like it's not always the top QBs. Sometimes it's teams with good WRs and good systems. All those teams were in the playoffs and 2 were in the super bowl. Kinda helps make my point about needing at least 2 top receivers. The Patriots had one of the worst defense's but their offense was so potent it didn't matter up until the very last game. The thing about Aaron Rodgers is he has so many good receivers and spreads the ball around so much that they almost never have one guy in the top 10. Jordy Nelson was #9 in yards and Jennings was #26 Yea, Stafford is that good, and he has Megatron! Phillip Rivers was in almost the same boat as Fitz last year, with Vincent Jackson ranked #16 in yards and Malcom Floyd at #37, Gates at # 45. Both Gates and Floyd injured and missed games last season. Jackson held out and came in late If I'm not mistaken. Plus they had O line and RB problems, hence the Chargers 8-8 season Atlanta had Roddy White #8 in yards, Julio Jones #26 in yards (hamstring problems most of last season), Tony Gonzalaz #33 in yards. I'm not saying Fitz will magically transform into Tom Brady or Drew Brees if his receiver corps and O line was better, but it certinly would help give the Bills offense a better oppertunity to open up the playbook for the mid to deep passing plays instead of just the short / quick passes. Plus, with a better line QB's like Thigpen might stand a chance to make a throw.
thewildrabbit Posted August 30, 2012 Posted August 30, 2012 I'm sure someone somewhere can quantify it, but I just keep going back to what I see. Case in point, the Giants game last year. Two horribly under thrown balls to a wide open Stevie that were picked off. Winning QB's make that throw consistently. I no longer have that game TiVoed so i can't comment on whether the Giants pass rush caused Fitz to hurry those throws, but I suspect that was the reason. But then again, look at the game Tom Brady had against the Bills in Buffalo that year. Even the great QB's have bad games and make mistakes, its all part of throwing the ball up in the air. Words from Fitz on that game. "This is one of the hardest parts of playing quarterback, when you don't get the job done," Fitzpatrick said. "The two interceptions I threw, you couldn't ask for better coverage, you couldn't ask for a better play, couldn't ask for a better route. They were both basically the same thing, Stevie on a go route. I'd like to give credit to Corey Webster, he made plays on both of them. That said, I feel like Stevie beat him and I underthrew both of them." Fitz was 21 / 30 for 244 yards, 8.1 avg, 2 TD's, 2 INT's, 3 sacks -25 http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/recap?gameId=311016019 The defense, http://espn.go.com/blog/afceast/post/_/id/32748/bills-defense-not-holding-up-its-end
thebandit27 Posted August 30, 2012 Posted August 30, 2012 I think most fans just don't really grasp the difference between having only one good receiver in the top 20, and 2 or 3 in the top 30. The Patriots (ranked #2), WR Wes Welker 122 rec, 1569 yards- (Ranked #6) TE Rob Gronkowski 90 rec, 1327 yards (Ranked #31) TE Aaron Hernandez 79 rec, 910 yards- (Ranked # 51) Dion Branch 57 rec 702 yards. The Patriots 3rd best receiver had more receptions then (ranked at #19) Stevie Johnson , 76 rec, 1004 yards If Fitz had a better supporting cast around him, line, and receivers, then I wouldn't have an argument.The fact that Gailey has tried 6 other QB's in his scheme and they all fell on their face so badly its not even close. This tells me its all Fitz, and not the system. Fitz is a gunslinger, he is going to make some errant throws and try and force the ball sometimes. I've seen the alternative to taking risks in Trent Edwards... I'll take the gunslinger! Must be the receivers...none of those guys have a future HOF QB throwing to them. Seriously? You do know who is throwing the Ball to those Pats receivers do you not? What do you think David Nelson's stats would be if Brady was on the other end? Probably similar to the stats guys like Reche Caldwell, Jabar Gaffney, David Givens, Daniel Graham, Ben Watson, David Patten, Deion Branch, and a whole host of other guys that couldn't make a single play outside of New England put up. Must be the WRs. All those teams were in the playoffs and 2 were in the super bowl. Kinda helps make my point about needing at least 2 top receivers. The Patriots had one of the worst defense's but their offense was so potent it didn't matter up until the very last game. The thing about Aaron Rodgers is he has so many good receivers and spreads the ball around so much that they almost never have one guy in the top 10. Jordy Nelson was #9 in yards and Jennings was #26 Yea, Stafford is that good, and he has Megatron! Phillip Rivers was in almost the same boat as Fitz last year, with Vincent Jackson ranked #16 in yards and Malcom Floyd at #37, Gates at # 45. Both Gates and Floyd injured and missed games last season. Jackson held out and came in late If I'm not mistaken. Plus they had O line and RB problems, hence the Chargers 8-8 season Atlanta had Roddy White #8 in yards, Julio Jones #26 in yards (hamstring problems most of last season), Tony Gonzalaz #33 in yards. I'm not saying Fitz will magically transform into Tom Brady or Drew Brees if his receiver corps and O line was better, but it certinly would help give the Bills offense a better oppertunity to open up the playbook for the mid to deep passing plays instead of just the short / quick passes. Plus, with a better line QB's like Thigpen might stand a chance to make a throw. Brady - 3 Superbowl wins, future HOF Stafford - 1st overall pick Ryan - #3 overall pick, multiple playoff appearances Brees - Most accurate QB of all time, future HOF Manning - 2 Superbowl wins, likely future HOF Must be the WRs
NoSaint Posted August 30, 2012 Posted August 30, 2012 All those teams were in the playoffs and 2 were in the super bowl. Kinda helps make my point about needing at least 2 top receivers. The Patriots had one of the worst defense's but their offense was so potent it didn't matter up until the very last game. The thing about Aaron Rodgers is he has so many good receivers and spreads the ball around so much that they almost never have one guy in the top 10. Jordy Nelson was #9 in yards and Jennings was #26 Yea, Stafford is that good, and he has Megatron! Phillip Rivers was in almost the same boat as Fitz last year, with Vincent Jackson ranked #16 in yards and Malcom Floyd at #37, Gates at # 45. Both Gates and Floyd injured and missed games last season. Jackson held out and came in late If I'm not mistaken. Plus they had O line and RB problems, hence the Chargers 8-8 season Atlanta had Roddy White #8 in yards, Julio Jones #26 in yards (hamstring problems most of last season), Tony Gonzalaz #33 in yards. I'm not saying Fitz will magically transform into Tom Brady or Drew Brees if his receiver corps and O line was better, but it certinly would help give the Bills offense a better oppertunity to open up the playbook for the mid to deep passing plays instead of just the short / quick passes. Plus, with a better line QB's like Thigpen might stand a chance to make a throw. I also enjoyed his "that's all" sentiment after list half the top 20 receivers. Thats actually a huge number - 12 of the top 20 in catches being on 5 teams. Regardless of the original debate that's a huge percentage from a small group (if you use catches)
RunTheBall Posted August 30, 2012 Posted August 30, 2012 This has been one of the most informative, enjoyable threads I've read on here in years. So much has been said that I don't have much to add. I'd just say that given our apparent inability to get deep (or medium deep) consistently, and the tendancy for teams to blitz or crowd the box, a well timed, well executed screen play can be absolutely devastating. I'd love to see screens to Spiller or Freddy (not the wideouts) more often. That, and absolutely stick with the running game more consistently. RTB
HOUSE Posted August 30, 2012 Posted August 30, 2012 Limited skills means a limited game plan.It is what it is..........limited
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