Ramius Posted August 25, 2012 Posted August 25, 2012 (edited) I can't imagine you really believe that. What i was referring to is that Bill's been on a "ralph made the pick just to sell jerseys" rant since that draft. That's what he's delusional about. I'm actually agreeing with you in that the Spiller pick was made mainly by Gailey, who made it plain as day he wanted a "waterbug" back to boost the offense. It just so happened that the best player left on the board in round 1 matched with this perceived need. Hence the reason he was selected. Much like Cordy Glenn in round 2 of this past year. Edited August 25, 2012 by Ramius
spartacus Posted August 25, 2012 Posted August 25, 2012 These guys are all still young....and you guage successful drafts by how many starters you are able to put out on the field - There has been no indication that Aaron Williams is losing his job.....only that he might be getting pushed by even better draft selections. To take a 6' 200 pound plus corner is was rated as a 1st round pick int the 2nd is not a bad selection. To be faire to Willaims he started off bad but got better as training camp went on. - There has been no indication that Shep has lost his starting MLB job yet with the exception that Morrison is getting reps at MLB.....Morrison could frankly be on the bubble and they are trying to see if his versitility will allow him to stay on the team. Its way too early for this. - The ONLY reason way Searcy is not starting is because we have two of the best safeties in the league....PERIOD. The bills love this guy.....and keep in mind that your going to be seeing more then 2 safeties on the field at a time due to defensive packages. Searcy is gonna play a lot this year......we also have Byrd (who I hope we resign) coming up as a free agent. Searcy was an excellent pick. Once again going with a large player at his position who loves to hit just like Williams. - Jasper was a project....at that time in the draft your not going to find a lot of Demitrous Bell's.......and Stevie Johnson's......its no big deal. - Chris White and Johnny White....same same..... I will say this again......if you can get 3-4 starting players/Impact players out of a draft then you have had a successful draft. There is NO QUESTION that this roster from top to bottom is far more talented for Nix coming in then pre Nix. Anybody who says other then that is full of **** too bad all of the improved talent is not resulting in more wins than Dick was able to generate if the talent is there, it must be a regression in the coaching
Bill from NYC Posted August 25, 2012 Posted August 25, 2012 if the talent is there, it must be a regression in the coaching It cannot be. Jauron is bad in every single phase of being a head coach. He isn't even good as a defensive coordibator. Watch what happens to Cleveland this season. He uses the worst formations I have ever seen. His players run away from the line of scrimage, and he believes in building from the secondary. He used to send Schobel out on pass coverage. Offensively, he was probably worse. He had not one clue in terms of clock management. He made utterly bizzare calls in terms of when to kick field goals, and didn't bring an offensive formula into games. Gailey might not be one of the all time great coaches, but he is not to be denied in terms of offensive game plans. He is an intellectual, and it works well with a healthy Fitz. I think that the real difference between Gailey and Jauron is that wrt Gailey, given enough talen,t he could actually win. I hope to see this soon. Jauron couldn't win under any conditions. He employs a "play not to lose" philosophy that never has worked, nor will it ever.
SouthernMan Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 (edited) After Troup going on IR for the season I was just thinking back to how awful Nix's first draft was for this team... I mean it is really terrible. Spiller - hasn't produced enough at this point to justify the pick although a lot of upside here (best pick) Troup - IR for 2nd straight season Carrington - likely to be cut this year, never done anything as a Bill Easley - injured the entire time he has been on the team, likely to be cut Wang - trash Moats - should make the team (2nd best pick.. not saying much) Batten - likely to be cut Levi Brown - trash Calloway - trash After cuts we are likely to only have Spiller and Moats playing this year... what a disaster this was. Your thoughts? After Troup going on IR for the season I was just thinking back to how awful Nix's first draft was for this team... I mean it is really terrible. Spiller - hasn't produced enough at this point to justify the pick although a lot of upside here (best pick) Troup - IR for 2nd straight season Carrington - likely to be cut this year, never done anything as a Bill Easley - injured the entire time he has been on the team, likely to be cut Wang - trash Moats - should make the team (2nd best pick.. not saying much) Batten - likely to be cut Levi Brown - trash Calloway - trash After cuts we are likely to only have Spiller and Moats playing this year... what a disaster this was. Your thoughts? My thoughts are that I'm the guy that gets lambasted by the Stadium Wall mafia for daring to question the greatness of Nix & Co. Several weeks ago I originated a post questioning why Nix and Bills FO are being praised to high heaven in this forum by so many when they haven't produced on the field yet. Great, they signed some top flight FAs. Fck, I could do that! That's the easy part. How about making the most of the draft and taking a Gronkowski over achy breaky Troup. (BTW - I'm far from being a draft guru or college fan, but I watched some college stuff when Troup was a consideration. I knew from those couple games I watched that he's not an NFL player). A team can't be built around FAs. If the Bills fail to stock their roster with productive players through the draft and FA, they will fail, and Nix will be a failure. Show me the baby. Edited August 26, 2012 by SouthernMan
Ball'n Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 First...I appreciate that you actually gave an answer rather then ignore it like most do that are taking your position.....kudos on that - Brian Bulaga (if you have not noticed) does not fit the mold of offensive linemen that Nix drafts.....Buddy likes his tackles extremely big and extremly LONG LIMBED.....Bulaga is a T Rex. I would also make the arguement that Bulaga has faired no better then Chris Hairston has thus far......and Green Bay wouldnt have dreamed of playing him at Left Tackle while the bills entrusted the LT spot to Hairston in his first year. He wasnt worth the slot where we drafted. - Have you seen how much we use a Tight End in this offense? If Chan actually ran offenses that featured tight ends I could see that pick...but he doesnt. Even Chandler who is a Fitzpatrick favorite gives way to a blocking TE a lot of the time. I am a big believer in drafting talented players and Jermaine is that.....but how much would he actually be used here. MEANWHILE.....you have CJ spiller who was rated where he was picked.....is fast as hell......is an excellent receiver....and had excellent consistant production coming out of college. What the bills did not figure on is just how long it was going to take him to pick up pass protection concepts. He looks like he is coming around in that area. I agree with your post except for this, CJ is struggling as a receiver as he does not run good routes and lacks the awareness to find the open spot. He is good on quick routes that require nothing but him running to the spot, catching the ball and then showcasing his skills. I think that his speed led to him seeming like a better receiver in college than he really was. One would think CJ would be a better receiver than Fred but that is simply not the case.
spartacus Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 It cannot be. Jauron is bad in every single phase of being a head coach. He isn't even good as a defensive coordibator. Watch what happens to Cleveland this season. He uses the worst formations I have ever seen. His players run away from the line of scrimage, and he believes in building from the secondary. He used to send Schobel out on pass coverage. Offensively, he was probably worse. He had not one clue in terms of clock management. He made utterly bizzare calls in terms of when to kick field goals, and didn't bring an offensive formula into games. Gailey might not be one of the all time great coaches, but he is not to be denied in terms of offensive game plans. He is an intellectual, and it works well with a healthy Fitz. I think that the real difference between Gailey and Jauron is that wrt Gailey, given enough talen,t he could actually win. I hope to see this soon. Jauron couldn't win under any conditions. He employs a "play not to lose" philosophy that never has worked, nor will it ever. "Jauron couldn't win under any conditions" - yet Chan has yet to match even a mediocre 7 win season
Bill from NYC Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 "Jauron couldn't win under any conditions" - yet Chan has yet to match even a mediocre 7 win season Yes, this is a cause for alarm. I give Chan/Nix some room because as soon Levy/Jauron rolled into town, they started screwing up the team. Jauron had a huge say in the draft, and after Levy left, he might well have had final say (other than perhaps Ralph). They left the Bills a complete mess, and Jauron got a job as a defensive backs coach. Somehow, Cleveland was stupid enough to hire him as DC. Watch what happens. Jauron was unthinkably bad in every phase of his job.
Chandemonium Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 With the cuts today, 3 of 9 players from this class remain, excluding Troup. NIx is Batten .333 with the 2010 class.
thewildrabbit Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 (edited) On one hand...a single draft is a crapshoot....however, when you line up drafts one after the other....and a pattern of sucking emerges....then...you have to take action. See: Fire Modrak On the other had.... This doesn't take into account the fact that a draft chart....takes an entire year to build, involves the entire scouting department for that year, and involves the entire pro personnel people for that year, because drafting without thinking about FA is stupid. So...your assertion that Buddy could have some how come in, and immediately fired Modrak, and then have just "watched film" to replace the work product that Modrak had created...is absurd. It's not about one individual, Buddy, just watching college game tapes. If it were...then why do you need a 10-15 guy scouting department? No. They had to keep Modrak, and keep work product, for that first year. That's why they fired him...AFTER the draft. Your premise is false, therefore, the rest of the argument can't be right. Also, giving draft position the credit, rather than Buddy, for Buddy making good draft decisions? Also absurd. I don't see any Ryan Leafs in the last 2 drafts. Rather, I see nothing but starters/contributors. You can't take credit away...for doing what they are supposed to do....no more than you can give extra credit...for doing what they are supposed to do. .... As always, I don't mind fans being critical. I do mind when they are misguided/inaccurate. I don't know what planet you are from, but it certainly doesn't take an entire year to build a draft chart or plan free agent moves. That statement in itself is ridiculous! The real grading starts AFTER the college season, and NFL season ends. All Nix needed to do was to sit and watch past game film, it would take about a few days to evaluate and grade his current players. Then a few days to figure out what players to target in free agency. Then spend some time looking at film of the top 60-90 college players previous to the draft. He had more then enough time to do all those things IMO. Buddy Nix was hired Jan 3rd, 2010. The combine is Feb and the draft the end of April. Nix should have had plenty of time to do his job diligently, and correctly! The fact is that Nix failed badly in that first draft and free agency period and simply didn't do his job properly. Nix not only failed in the 2010 draft, he failed horrifically with his acquisition of free agent RT Cornell Green, 3 mill for that scrub. That one wrong move is a big reason for the 0-8 start of the 2010 season. Then Nix spent half the season trying to find decent replacement RT off the streets. Looking at Tom Modrak's history of a decade of bad drafts there should have been no way Nix relied on him for anything. If you understand there is a problem somewhere why not do some actual work yourself instead of letting a known moron keep doing the drafting. The Bills only turned over about 8 players total that first year. Probably because Nix stated he thought the team was "not that far away" I'd have to say 99% of all GM's are fired and hired at the end of the NFL season. I don't see the good GM's failing in their first year like Nix did. Case in point Thomas Dimitroff was hired by the Falcons on Jan 13th 2008, hired HC Mike Smith,and the Falcons went 11-5 that first year. They didn't get worse like the Buffalo Bills did after they hired Nix. The difference between the two is Nix only need concern himself with the football operations! The lengths that some fans will go to in making excuses for the current regime is absurd! Talk about misguided / inaccurate! edit: Nix was hired 12-31-09 Edited August 27, 2012 by Fear the Beard
Dragonborn10 Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 Easley is gone next week. Carrington as well if the insist he play DT. He is a DE just as Moats is an OLB. If I were Carrington I would ask for a trade to a 3-4 team.
thewildrabbit Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 Yes, this is a cause for alarm. I give Chan/Nix some room because as soon Levy/Jauron rolled into town, they started screwing up the team. Jauron had a huge say in the draft, and after Levy left, he might well have had final say (other than perhaps Ralph). They left the Bills a complete mess, and Jauron got a job as a defensive backs coach. Somehow, Cleveland was stupid enough to hire him as DC. Watch what happens. Jauron was unthinkably bad in every phase of his job. I give Chan / Nix no room because Nix stated he thought the team had enough talent to win, hence his monumentally foolish "we are not that far away" statement just after he was hired Giving Jauron autonomy after Levy retired was the worst move ever, by any franchise! I simply can't understand how Jauron could merit that kinda of trust from an owner. Jauron's biggest downfall was not hiring an experienced NFL OC to teach his young QB's. it was the blind leading the blind on offense http://www.huliq.com/3257/90070/buffalo-bills-choose-buddy-nix-new-gm
Sisyphean Bills Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 With the cuts today, 3 of 9 players from this class remain, excluding Troup. NIx is Batten .333 with the 2010 class. Aren't you setting the bar sort of low? I mean when gastropods are leaping it...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 (edited) I don't know what planet you are from, but it certainly doesn't take an entire year to build a draft chart or plan free agent moves. That statement in itself is ridiculous! The real grading starts AFTER the college season, and NFL season ends. All Nix needed to do was to sit and watch past game film, it would take about a few days to evaluate and grade his current players. Then a few days to figure out what players to target in free agency. Then spend some time looking at film of the top 60-90 college players previous to the draft. He had more then enough time to do all those things IMO. Buddy Nix was hired Jan 3rd, 2010. The combine is Feb and the draft the end of April. Nix should have had plenty of time to do his job diligently, and correctly! <....> The lengths that some fans will go to in making excuses for the current regime is absurd! Talk about misguided / inaccurate! edit: Nix was hired 12-31-09 Huh, I guess NFL teams keep the director of player development and a scouting staff of 10-15 guys on the job, year round, why? Just for shucks and yucks, since according to your great knowledge and acumen about football ops a new hire could walk in New Years eve, interview and hire a coaching staff, and single-handedly have plenty of time to evaluate all the current players, evaluate the draft and build a draft board - y'know, the work the coaches and staff were hired to spend the year doing - in 3 months. Thank you for setting us all straight. Edited August 26, 2012 by Hopeful
Chandemonium Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 Aren't you setting the bar sort of low? I mean when gastropods are leaping it... Look at who from 2010 was cut today and reread my post.
Sisyphean Bills Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 Look at who from 2010 was cut today and reread my post. You must not have seen what I bolded. In other words, big !@#$ing deal that 3 of them are still on the team. It hasn't even been 3 years and this class is looking dreadful. As the foundation of Nix's rebuild plan, the 2010 draft truly is panning out to be nothing but mud.
spartacus Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 (edited) Yes, this is a cause for alarm. I give Chan/Nix some room because as soon Levy/Jauron rolled into town, they started screwing up the team. Jauron had a huge say in the draft, and after Levy left, he might well have had final say (other than perhaps Ralph). They left the Bills a complete mess, and Jauron got a job as a defensive backs coach. Somehow, Cleveland was stupid enough to hire him as DC. Watch what happens. Jauron was unthinkably bad in every phase of his job. and he still won more games than Gailey - every year he was here Buddy may have a better idea no what makes a good football player - but Chan is sure not converting that better talent into wins really remains to be seen if the Bills do have better talent - none of Buddy's draft picks are pushing for the Pro Bowl Edited August 26, 2012 by spartacus
T master Posted August 26, 2012 Posted August 26, 2012 Keep in mind too that Carrington is not playing the position he played in college . I thought going back to a 4/3 D they might have him lose the weight he gained to change to a 3/4 lineman & go back to being a 4/3 end like he was but they didn't so seeing as we tried to change him that may be something to do with his lack of production !!!
Buffalo Barbarian Posted August 27, 2012 Posted August 27, 2012 (edited) After Troup going on IR for the season I was just thinking back to how awful Nix's first draft was for this team... I mean it is really terrible. Spiller - hasn't produced enough at this point to justify the pick although a lot of upside here (best pick) Troup - IR for 2nd straight season Carrington - likely to be cut this year, never done anything as a Bill Easley - injured the entire time he has been on the team, likely to be cut Wang - trash Moats - should make the team (2nd best pick.. not saying much) Batten - likely to be cut Levi Brown - trash Calloway - trash After cuts we are likely to only have Spiller and Moats playing this year... what a disaster this was. Your thoughts? ugh! Edited August 27, 2012 by Buffalo Barbarian
Chandemonium Posted August 27, 2012 Posted August 27, 2012 You must not have seen what I bolded. In other words, big !@#$ing deal that 3 of them are still on the team. It hasn't even been 3 years and this class is looking dreadful. As the foundation of Nix's rebuild plan, the 2010 draft truly is panning out to be nothing but mud. I saw what you bolded. You must not have seen that my post was intended to be an admittedly bad pun, and nothing more, which is why I said to reread it. The only reason I used players left on the team as the criteria is because it fit the joke while making the math easy (and looking back I still didn't even count right, there's actually 4 guys left ). If I were actually evaluating the draft class I agree that it was pretty bad, especially since I doubt Carrington or Easley will make it to the final 53 this when its all said and done. While i still have hope for Troup in 2013, he's got an uphill battle ahead of him to say the least.
thewildrabbit Posted August 27, 2012 Posted August 27, 2012 Huh, I guess NFL teams keep the director of player development and a scouting staff of 10-15 guys on the job, year round, why? Just for shucks and yucks, since according to your great knowledge and acumen about football ops a new hire could walk in New Years eve, interview and hire a coaching staff, and single-handedly have plenty of time to evaluate all the current players, evaluate the draft and build a draft board - y'know, the work the coaches and staff were hired to spend the year doing - in 3 months. Thank you for setting us all straight. You are welcome. Are teams supposed to fire or lay off their workforce during the off season or do they go by the evaluations in 2010 they made before the 2009 season? Like I pointed out, Thomas Dimitroff was hired in Atlanta in the exact same time frame. They hired a new HC, turned over the team along with a new coaching staff and then turned out an 11-5 season. ""I'd have to say 99% of all GM's are fired and hired at the end of the NFL season. I don't see the good GM's failing in their first year like Nix did. Case in point Thomas Dimitroff was hired by the Falcons on Jan 13th 2008, hired HC Mike Smith,and the Falcons went 11-5 that first year. They didn't get worse like the Buffalo Bills did after they hired Nix. The difference between the two is Nix only need concern himself with the football operations!"" Want more then one case in point? NY Jets GM Mike Tannenbaum was hired on Feb 19th 1997 after a 4-12 season. The Jets went 9-7 the very next year. The Dolphins did the same thing in 2007 with a new Pres / GM staff and HC they went from 1-15 to 11-5. Bills fans can keep blaming Modrak for that 2010 draft, IDC. Nix was the GM at that time and he takes 100% responsibility for a draft under his watch.
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