What the film review shows from last night...not your delusional analy

[NickelCity]

Mentioning that the term "vanilla defense" is cliché, is rapidly becoming cliché.

[Kemp]

Realize that pre-season means nothing, but when you point out a bunch of horrific plays by the Bills, as a way of reassuring and admonishing us, it is hard to understand your point.

 

The Bills made a lot of bad plays. To draw the conclusion that they are meaningless tells us little of value and does not explain why these bad plays will disappear during the regular season.

 

Lose the anger and don't talk like we are in third grade gym class if you want to be taken more seriously.

Edited August 19, 2012 by Kemp

[Ramius]

 

The problem is that there seems to be no flow, or cohesion to what we're doing on either side of the ball.

 

There's no flow or cohesion because there's no gameplan in place. Coaches are calling plays designed to see how OUR guys handle particular situations, not plays designed specifically stop the opponent.

[Fan in San Diego]

i agree with you mike

 

 

1 i do think shepp sucks though

 

2. i do worry how fitz always throws 5 yard slants on third and long. Blitz or not, he needs throw past the D, not struggle to complete 5 yarders right where the db is standing and get 5 yards when we need 15. Stupid.

 

This has been a bug a boo for me for years now. If it's 3rd and 10, have a WR run a 11 or 12 yard route, get the first down. Don't throw a completion for 6 yards and have to punt.

[Sisyphean Bills]

This is a misnomer. It's not comparing the two teams. It's demonstration of a lack of correlation between pre-season and the regular season.

 

It's a poor argument for that point, a point that I did not neglect. "It is pre-season."

 

Here's an article that states the case without conflating Super Bowl pedigrees as a feel good chaser.

 

http://www.nfl.com/p...rseason-success

 

PS: This article is interesting.

 

http://www.madduxsports.com/blog/nfl-coaches-preseason-records-16939/

[Beerball]

There it is, completely irrelevant. I was wincing watching FreEx run the ball. Staying healthy is pretty much it. Coach knows what he wants and sees and makes his decisions and what changes that? Injuries. So I agree the only thing that matters is to stay healthy.

So, if the only thing that matters is staying healthy why do they play the games? Everyone must know this, every GM, player, coach. Is this a money grab by the league? That must be the only answer because the games are completely irrelevant. Maybe they play them so that the announcers can get in practice time? Hasn't helped Tasker yet so it's a failure there too.

[Sisyphean Bills]

So, if the only thing that matters is staying healthy why do they play the games? Everyone must know this, every GM, player, coach. Is this a money grab by the league? That must be the only answer because the games are completely irrelevant. Maybe they play them so that the announcers can get in practice time? Hasn't helped Tasker yet so it's a failure there too.

 

Good question. Obviously, staying healthy is not the only goal of these games. By the way, wasn't it the league that was pushing for an 18 game season?

[DrDawkinstein]

So, if the only thing that matters is staying healthy why do they play the games? Everyone must know this, every GM, player, coach. Is this a money grab by the league? That must be the only answer because the games are completely irrelevant. Maybe they play them so that the announcers can get in practice time? Hasn't helped Tasker yet so it's a failure there too.

 

Basically, yes. They are practice scrimmages which are hyped up so tickets can be sold and the owners/league can pull in some extra bucks. Beyond that, they are nothing more than a full speed practice against guys you dont mind hitting. Starting players can get back into game speed, but staying healthy is more important, and so coaches can determine which backups are making the team.

 

That. is. it. Nothing more.

[The Senator]

What the film review of Friday's preseason game shows me is...

 

 

19 and 0 baby!!!!

 

GO BILLSSS!!!!

[Beerball]

Basically, yes. They are practice scrimmages which are hyped up so tickets can be sold and the owners/league can pull in some extra bucks. Beyond that, they are nothing more than a full speed practice against guys you dont mind hitting. Starting players can get back into game speed, but staying healthy is more important, and so coaches can determine which backups are making the team.

 

That. is. it. Nothing more.

Ahhh, so it doesn't give a player like Fred Jackson or Delano Howell (to use a current example) an opportunity to show that they belong in the NFL? Those players would have shown enough in practice to make the team? Peyton Manning if full of crap; just toeing the company line when he talks about the importance of preseason games? Is Peyton's perfectionist attitude bad, or is it something that should be emulated?

 

So, these very same Bills fans wouldn't be crowing if the Bills were 2-0 and the first team offence had a 75% success rate and the first team defense hadn't allowed a first down?

 

To say that you shouldn't be concerned about what happens in preseason is idiocy. Reality is that the games do matter. Concerns that we have now may be multiplied when the games are 'real'. Are you not concerned about the back-up O-linemen? Are you not concerned about the LB play? I am, and to a lesser degree I'm concerned about Fitzpatrick's inability to get any consistency going. I've seen him do it, so the concern there isn't as great, but it's there.

 

You people are 'forcing' me to look like a HATER when nothing could be further from the truth; I'm a realist.

[Sisyphean Bills]

Ahhh, so it doesn't give a player like Fred Jackson or Delano Howell (to use a current example) an opportunity to show that they belong in the NFL? Those players would have shown enough in practice to make the team? Peyton Manning if full of crap; just toeing the company line when he talks about the importance of preseason games? Is Peyton's perfectionist attitude bad, or is it something that should be emulated?

 

So, these very same Bills fans wouldn't be crowing if the Bills were 2-0 and the first team offence had a 75% success rate and the first team defense hadn't allowed a first down?

 

To say that you shouldn't be concerned about what happens in preseason is idiocy. Reality is that the games do matter. Concerns that we have now may be multiplied when the games are 'real'. Are you not concerned about the back-up O-linemen? Are you not concerned about the LB play? I am, and to a lesser degree I'm concerned about Fitzpatrick's inability to get any consistency going. I've seen him do it, so the concern there isn't as great, but it's there.

 

You people are 'forcing' me to look like a HATER when nothing could be further from the truth; I'm a realist.

 

There is no such thing as "throwing the switch" and going from sloppy, mentally disengaged execution, 11 men on 11 different pages, one day to nearly perfect, well-timed execution the next. That and poor football fundamentals should be viewed with a realistic sense of concern. I know coaching staffs are concerned when they watch the tapes when they see that, as Peyton isn't the only one that likes to see players doing things right.

 

PS: I'm not saying the Bills were that bad and I fully realize opinions are all over the map.

 

PPS: I fully realize that this is a work in progress.

[Mike in Syracuse]

I disagree, I belielve there is very much a "throw the switch" ability, at least as it pertains to the physical nature of the game. I thank anyone that's played a sport at a higher level knows there's a massive difference between a practice, a scrimmage and a live game. NFL players are professional athletes and have the ability to dial up the physicality at will. I agree that mental mistakes and execution mistakes shouldn't happen in practice or scrimmages but the intensity with which they're carried out can vary greatly. Footbally players are used to 16 weeks of regular season game planning where they specifically plan for offensive and defensive plays and and formations. That's what they're conditioned to do and they do any of that during the preseason with maybe the exception of the third game. It's also the reason that the playoffs take on a whole different level of intensity and execution. I dont' think any veteran NFL players are going balls to the wall during these glorified practices.

 

As to the pre-season. Last year one of the negotiation points was a reduction in the number of pre-season games. If they were vitally important that conversation would never have taken place. Remember all the talk about an 18 games season? Unfortunately what the NFL lacks right now is a way to evaluate younger players and undrafted players. The pre-season allows the coaches, GM's and owners a way to see the rookies and young players in a game day type of format. All of the guys that got drafted were stars in high school, may have been stars in college but are now playing with essentially a college all-start team. Some can make the jump, others can't.

 

For veteran players, the pre-season is nothing more than a 3/4 speed warm up with no game plan or adjustments. Their biggest concern is avoiding injury.

Edited August 19, 2012 by Mike in Syracuse

[Beerball]

There is no such thing as "throwing the switch" and going from sloppy, mentally disengaged execution, 11 men on 11 different pages, one day to nearly perfect, well-timed execution the next. That and poor football fundamentals should be viewed with a realistic sense of concern. I know coaching staffs are concerned when they watch the tapes when they see that, as Peyton isn't the only one that likes to see players doing things right.

 

PS: I'm not saying the Bills were that bad and I fully realize opinions are all over the map.

 

PPS: I fully realize that this is a work in progress.

Are you saying that there may be a middle ground? That there could be valid points on both sides? That's crazy talk man!

[CodeMonkey]

So, these very same Bills fans wouldn't be crowing if the Bills were 2-0 and the first team offence had a 75% success rate and the first team defense hadn't allowed a first down?

Probably not so much for a 2-0 record as I think it is universally understood (even here ) that the win/loss record in preseason truly is meaningless. But if the offense was firing on all cylinders and Fitz completing 25 yard passes every other play you bet most of the "totally meaningless" posts would be replaced by how great the offense is posts.

 

If you watched Ponder and the Vikings starting offense at all, and if you have seen any of the other preseason games you will see where offenses should be by this time. The Bills aren't there in my opinion. This next game should really show where they are as the starters for both teams should play an extended period of time.

[Mr. WEO]

Ahhh, so it doesn't give a player like Fred Jackson or Delano Howell (to use a current example) an opportunity to show that they belong in the NFL? Those players would have shown enough in practice to make the team? Peyton Manning if full of crap; just toeing the company line when he talks about the importance of preseason games? Is Peyton's perfectionist attitude bad, or is it something that should be emulated?

 

So, these very same Bills fans wouldn't be crowing if the Bills were 2-0 and the first team offence had a 75% success rate and the first team defense hadn't allowed a first down?

 

To say that you shouldn't be concerned about what happens in preseason is idiocy. Reality is that the games do matter. Concerns that we have now may be multiplied when the games are 'real'. Are you not concerned about the back-up O-linemen? Are you not concerned about the LB play? I am, and to a lesser degree I'm concerned about Fitzpatrick's inability to get any consistency going. I've seen him do it, so the concern there isn't as great, but it's there.

 

You people are 'forcing' me to look like a HATER when nothing could be further from the truth; I'm a realist.

 

Oh MY!! If that was the case these guys would be in the throws of consecutive orgasms with no refractory period in between. We would never see the words "it's just preseason". It would be all about Nix as GM of the Year, Chan as COTY, they would be listing all of the likely Pro Bowlers Nix has found in this year's draft......well, you know how the script would go at that point.

 

Great post BB.

[DrDawkinstein]

Ahhh, so it doesn't give a player like Fred Jackson or Delano Howell (to use a current example) an opportunity to show that they belong in the NFL? Those players would have shown enough in practice to make the team? Peyton Manning if full of crap; just toeing the company line when he talks about the importance of preseason games? Is Peyton's perfectionist attitude bad, or is it something that should be emulated?

 

So, these very same Bills fans wouldn't be crowing if the Bills were 2-0 and the first team offence had a 75% success rate and the first team defense hadn't allowed a first down?

 

To say that you shouldn't be concerned about what happens in preseason is idiocy. Reality is that the games do matter. Concerns that we have now may be multiplied when the games are 'real'. Are you not concerned about the back-up O-linemen? Are you not concerned about the LB play? I am, and to a lesser degree I'm concerned about Fitzpatrick's inability to get any consistency going. I've seen him do it, so the concern there isn't as great, but it's there.

 

You people are 'forcing' me to look like a HATER when nothing could be further from the truth; I'm a realist.

 

You missed my line of "and so coaches can determine which backups are making the team." I'll give you that these "games" matter very much to those players. But you still cant get a good judgement of a team based on how the fringe players do in the 2nd half.

 

Also, please see my post from Simon's thread, I think we are on the same page:

 

Even as an eternal optimist, the best way I've heard that performance summed up has been "a minor cause for alarm".

 

I get that it doesnt matter. I get that we (hopefully) are running vanilla schemes. The only stat Im worried about at the end is shutting out the injury report.

 

That being said however, I would have liked to see them execute one drive, or even one play, crisply, cleanly, and in a dominating fashion. We looked slow and sloppy out there.

 

Is that a direct indication of what's to come this season? No. But we're going to have to go full speed at some point. Im hoping that comes before the preseason is over. We have two more games before it's for real. I'll hold off on worrying until then, the sky is not falling, but it would be nice to see them play like they are trying at least once.

 

The good news is, two preseason games down, and zero injuries. Right now, that's all that matters.

[K-9]

Probably not so much for a 2-0 record as I think it is universally understood (even here ) that the win/loss record in preseason truly is meaningless. But if the offense was firing on all cylinders and Fitz completing 25 yard passes every other play you bet most of the "totally meaningless" posts would be replaced by how great the offense is posts.

 

If you watched Ponder and the Vikings starting offense at all, and if you have seen any of the other preseason games you will see where offenses should be by this time. The Bills aren't there in my opinion. This next game should really show where they are as the starters for both teams should play an extended period of time.

 

Conversely, would the current posts about how bad the offense looks then turn into "it's only preseason?"

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Webster Guy]

I just re watched it. Kept my eyes on Cordy every play, as I think he is the key to this season for us. Thought he played better than Hairston over there, definitely good enough to start. Rex is going to stack his side and throw everything they have at the rook to confuse and frustrate him. The second penalty Cordy got was a mistake by the ref in my opinion, he didn't screw up the snap count anyway and that's good.

 

Agree about Shep being a concern, very interested in how he rebounds from a weak showing and plays a full first half with the ones next week. He's got the film on himself and it's not pretty, so here's hoping we get that straight in the next 21 days.

 

Brooks, Rogers, Williams and Gilmore. All young and talented corners. Not worried about that.

 

Moats is looking more comfortable over there. I know we've moved him around a lot already but has anyone considered moving him inside? He's the same size as Shep 6'2 250. He sheds blocks better. I don't know how hard that transition is but I wonder if that ever crossed Wanny's mind. Tank Carder is going to make this team, I wonder if he can push Shep for that spot.

 

C'mon Shep don't let us down man......

[stinky finger]

I disagree, I belielve there is very much a "throw the switch" ability, at least as it pertains to the physical nature of the game. I thank anyone that's played a sport at a higher level knows there's a massive difference between a practice, a scrimmage and a live game. NFL players are professional athletes and have the ability to dial up the physicality at will. I agree that mental mistakes and execution mistakes shouldn't happen in practice or scrimmages but the intensity with which they're carried out can vary greatly. Footbally players are used to 16 weeks of regular season game planning where they specifically plan for offensive and defensive plays and and formations. That's what they're conditioned to do and they do any of that during the preseason with maybe the exception of the third game. It's also the reason that the playoffs take on a whole different level of intensity and execution. I dont' think any veteran NFL players are going balls to the wall during these glorified practices.

 

As to the pre-season. Last year one of the negotiation points was a reduction in the number of pre-season games. If they were vitally important that conversation would never have taken place. Remember all the talk about an 18 games season? Unfortunately what the NFL lacks right now is a way to evaluate younger players and undrafted players. The pre-season allows the coaches, GM's and owners a way to see the rookies and young players in a game day type of format. All of the guys that got drafted were stars in high school, may have been stars in college but are now playing with essentially a college all-start team. Some can make the jump, others can't.

 

For veteran players, the pre-season is nothing more than a 3/4 speed warm up with no game plan or adjustments. Their biggest concern is avoiding injury.

 

Really? The "turn the switch" thingy works?

 

How many times has a team locked up a playoff spot, relax (use whatever terminology you wish) the last couple of weeks and never regain their momentum?

 

Ask the Colts, Broncos and Packers as most recent examples of this.

 

Compounding this.....we're the BILLS! This team hasn't won a freakin' thing in a generation. It would behoove them to compete/practice/play hard and with conviction whatever the stakes (job, preseason game, regular season game, playoff game) at thier highest level. Learn to win every battle you can.

 

Creating a culture of winning from the outset. When these players walk down the hall from the lockerroom to the field it should be with the idea that they're going to be the first one to the field.

 

Why? Because they could win that battle. Create a winning culture. Strive to be the best.

 

Turn the switch? WE don't have that switch. These games mean something. Not the result but the behavior is.

 

IMO, you couldn't be more wrong. This model makes me hater? I think not.

 

Create the culture that hasn't existed here in what seems like forever.

[CodeMonkey]

Conversely, would the current posts about how bad the offense looks then turn into "it's only preseason?"

 

GO BILLS!!!

More than likely.