My notes as I watched Cordy Glenn in last nights game

[shoretalk]

Thanks, John. Over the years I've grown to value your opinion on OL play as it comes from an informed perspective. I didn't have a chance to see Glenn last night other than a couple plays but I'm not surprised he got better as the game wore on. That's been his trajectory since Georgia stuck him at LT for the first time in his career last year. He was shaky to start and then settled in and played his best ball against the best competition as the year progressed. Culminating in a dominating performance against LSU. I like how Chan and Co. threw both Ts at the wolves last night by opening in an empty backfield and fast no-huddle pace. They're gonna be better for it.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

I finally had the chance to watch the game and using the infamous rewind ... I was VERY IMPRESSED with Glenn! John you are right on (As always) with your analysis but for his first action he seems to have the confidence of a veteran and even that first play, which people are faulting him on, he provided a good initial hit on his man and drove him before Fitz's holding on too long allowed his man to break off of Glenn.

 

His progress at LT allows Hairston to get some work at RT, which is the position he was drafted for, and gives us when everyone is healthy one of the best lines in the NFL with quality depth (Yes, I know the back-ups looked horrible but such is the reality for all teams.

[Vigorish13]

Thanks for the breakdowns everyone, seriously well done. I have only seen the game once and I found myself watching different players on D each play. Glenn looked impressive when I was watching him and I am glad that those who have analyzed each play cannot find much he was at fault for.

 

Lets hope he can keep this up and give Fitz some quality protection!

[rafter]

that is all good, but when did we have a shot at a QB that would be capable of surplanting Fitz ??

 

DO we trade away multiple picks and not have Dareus or Gilmore among others ??

 

No FA QB out there that would be better..

 

IMO when the opportunity to grab a QB that NIx is real confidnet about, or has great value and can be groomed becomes available to us he will jump all over it

 

I agree on that point. I think he liked a few QBs in the last couple drafts, they were already taken.

[DanInUticaTampa]

There were a couple times I wish we took a shot at a QB the past few years. I would have liked Dalton in the 2nd round last year and I would have liked Wilson in the 3rd round this year. I am not saying both or any of those guys will be better than fitz, but I was hoping we would have taken a shot at them when we had a shot. And if we were picking at like 10-12 last year, I would have gone with Locker, but I wouldn't have taken him with the 3rd overall pick, at least not at the time.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

that is all good, but when did we have a shot at a QB that would be capable of surplanting Fitz ??

 

DO we trade away multiple picks and not have Dareus or Gilmore among others ??

 

No FA QB out there that would be better..

 

IMO when the opportunity to grab a QB that NIx is real confidnet about, or has great value and can be groomed becomes available to us he will jump all over it

 

Actually we took cornerback Aaron Williams last year, one pick ahead of Andy Dalton.

 

I'm a bit worried about Williams and definitely didn't appreciate him whiffing on that tackle last night, turning what should have been a two-yard gain into a 9-yard gain.

 

I could actually see Ron Brooks supplanting Williams as a starting cornerback on this team in fairly short order… one month's time maybe. Brooks is a natural ball athlete which is one of the things you want from your corners.

 

Dalton meanwhile had an excellent rookies season and looked very sharp against the Jets tonight.

 

So there's one answer to your question… and it could be a draft decision that we grow to rue.

[BRAWNDO]

Good to hear he is not lost out there.

[DanInUticaTampa]

 

 

Actually we took cornerback Aaron Williams last year, one pick ahead of Andy Dalton.

 

I'm a bit worried about Williams and definitely didn't appreciate him whiffing on that tackle last night, turning what should have been a two-yard gain into a 9-yard gain.

 

I could actually see Ron Brooks supplanting Williams as a starting cornerback on this team in fairly short order… one month's time maybe. Brooks is a natural ball athlete which is one of the things you want from your corners.

 

Dalton meanwhile had an excellent rookies season and looked very sharp against the Jets tonight.

 

So there's one answer to your question… and it could be a draft decision that we grow to rue.

 

I didn't see the game, so this saddens me to hear it. I was hoping Williams would step into an above average starter, and this isn't saying he won't, but it is a cause for concern. Meanwhile, there is what looks like a franchise qb out there that we missed out on.

[Mike in Syracuse]

I didn't break down his play but I did notice one thing, the dude is freaking HUGE!

[San Jose Bills Fan]

I didn't see the game, so this saddens me to hear it. I was hoping Williams would step into an above average starter, and this isn't saying he won't, but it is a cause for concern. Meanwhile, there is what looks like a franchise qb out there that we missed out on.

The thing about Dalton is that he's like the Super Fitz. He's not an elite talent by any means but he is more talented than Fitz physically and he has many of the same mental attributes. He makes good decisions and does so quickly. He's very bright and he's a very accurate thrower.

 

Not bad for the 35th overall pick. And the Bills coaching staff actually coached Dalton in the Senior Bowl.

 

As for Cordy Glenn, I was one of the top 1-2 lobbyists for drafting him… in the first round. I was very high on Glenn when MANY guys were calling him a guard or a right tackle. It's early yet but I have zero doubts about Glenn.

[Hplarrm]

I didn't see the game, so this saddens me to hear it. I was hoping Williams would step into an above average starter, and this isn't saying he won't, but it is a cause for concern. Meanwhile, there is what looks like a franchise qb out there that we missed out on.

 

And this statement probably summarizes why it was probably intelligent strategy for us not to spend a significant draft pick 4th round or higher on a QB because the lust for what folks hope will be a franchise QB virtually guarantees that we will not take the time needed for a drafted QB to develop into the player we need.

 

Once we hit double digits in play off free years, the idea that fans would give more than a couple of years for a high draft pick to develop into a contributing player and starter was simply not gonna happen.

 

Even though we have examples right here of players like Eric Moulds who had a couple of zero production years before he developed into the perennial Pro Bowl candidate he was I really doubt a high draft pick is going to get more than a season before he better start or folks are gonna be disappointed in him.

Some of these folks like Maybin or Mike Willams were true busts (and the Bills braintrust from Mr. Ralph on down deserve our dismay for some bad choices).

 

However the reality remains that even in a strong draft class my research shows only a little over half of the first round picks were #1 on the team's depth chart at their position as their second year began.

 

This team has been so badly managed from Mr. Ralph on down (please tell me how the relationships with Polian, Butler, Wade, TD, whathisname who walked away several million $ when he resigned as HC, the vacuum that existed at GM pre Nix did not all end so badly that there is little question the problems start at the top) that particularly after the team mismanaged the cap situation at QB with the RJ/DF debacle that this team simply made it impossible to draft a franchise QB high and then develop him.

 

Do you seriously want to advocate that this team would have drafted a Dalton and then developed him even at the pace he is taking. We almost certainly declared him a disappointment as you are declaring Williams after 1 preseason game in his secomf year. If this team had traded up to draft the equivalent of a Peyton Manning this player would have been run out of town if like Manning he led the team from 3-13 when he was drafted to 3-13 after his first year.

 

We would have Brad Johnsoned him and likely have Johnsoned Dalton as well if we had picked him.

 

There simply is no logical way the Bills will rue he day they did not use any early pick on a alleged franchise QB since we likely woulf have developed him properly in our circumstances.

[Nanker]

At this point of the season - which is probably more like a round dot than a point, but I digress - the OLine does not appear to be the craptacular mosaic of slow, dimwitted, undersized, weak sisters that we've been saddled with for most of the past decade. It's refreshing to see our GM aggressively build a solid NFL line. For the first time in years we have some quality depth there. We probably have too much depth right now actually. Coach needs to find the starters and consistently play them as a unit. One BIG problem with that is Wood - the anchor - isn't up to the steady work. We've got 4-5 battles going on for the backup spots. Next year their might be 1-2. My point being - the first and second string aren't getting all the camp reps they need.

 

This is the year that the OLine stops being an excuse for a dismal offense, and next year will be better. The onus is on Fitz, all the Wideouts and the RBs. Out of the whole bunch, I have confidence in Fred.

[H2o]

Did I watch the same game as the rest of the people talking about Glenn on here? Orakpo man-handled Glenn on multiple occasions. He almost pushed him into Fitz a couple of times and used his speed to get around the outside once. This was in what, 4 series of action? It was a tough assignment for a rookie in his first NFL action as he was going against one of the best pass rushers in the league. Overall he did ok, but by no means did he "stonewall" Orakpo. It is good he faced a guy this talented though. He seems like a smart football player and did adjust to what he was facing after the first couple of series. He looked better anyway. It was also tough for him because there was no balance on offense. The first team ran the ball ZERO times which didn't leave the defense to guess in any way. It was just pin your ears back and go for the QB. That might have been Gailey's plan though, to see how the pass protection was going to hold up against the Redskins' excellent duo of Orakpo and Kerrigan. Glenn wasn't an All Pro out there in his first game, but he wasn't a "lookout" blocker either. He will get better as he sees more action and hopefully turn out to be our "Marcus McNeil", just without the injuries.

[Bill from NYC]

As for Cordy Glenn, I was one of the top 1-2 lobbyists for drafting him… in the first round. I was very high on Glenn when MANY guys were calling him a guard or a right tackle. It's early yet but I have zero doubts about Glenn.

 

Yes you were. As you might recall, I was more skeptical of Glenn because of the limited time he spent at LT in college. That said, he must have played quite well in camp for him to start over a more experienced Hairston. Many expect Hairston to be moved to starting RT. I would be surprised if this happens. The Bills seem to like Pears. They gave him a new contract, and Dareus said that Pears belonged in the probowl.

Glenn, at his size, will have an easier time with running plays than on passing downs early on. That said, I sure hope that FJ stays healthy.

[bigc14120]

Cordy Glenn

 

First series. Cordy Glenn did not get beaten one time. One one set of downs where Fitzpatrick was sacked Glenn rode his man around Fitzpatrick but the QB held onto the ball and protection broke down around him and was sacked. On the third down play Glenn beat his assignment but the skins sent an extra defender and Glenn had to make a decision on which one to take. The one that Glenn didn’t take got a shot on Fitpatrick and the ball was incomplete on 3^rd down.

 

2^nd Series

Glenn once again did not get beaten in this set of downs….it should be noted that Fitz was NOT hanging onto the ball but Glenn’s assignment did not get past him which included a delayed blitz by London Fletcher which Cordy very nicely stayed at home on even though he was in space for a few seconds waiting. This should have been a touchdown series were it not for a very stupid alignment penalty.

 

3^rd Series

Note: On the first down it looked like Cordy got turned sideways by the DE…..but maintained his balance and kept himself between the defender and Fitz. Did not get beat.

Glenn did not get beat on this series…..this is despite Orakpo trying to play with him moving around and not getting a stance…..also attempted a stunt which was picked up the the O line.

 

4^th Series

On the first down Glenn gets beat outside…..first legit getting beat of the game for Glenn….Glenn uses his arm length to keep the defender away from Fitz despite being beat….the defender trys to knock the ball out of Fitz hand from behind as he is trying to pass but misses.

2^nd down….gets called for the false start

 

5^th Series

We are starting to seriously get into backup players but Glenn stays in the game…..finally some running plays (speaking of which…..not one run play with the starters and anyone who knows anything about O line play will tell you that you NEED to run the football for the offensive linemen….it gives them a chance to pound on the defense rather then take a pounding and always being in “defend” mode…..gotta do it it Chan.

On the 2^nd down of the series the whistle is blown dead and Glenn relaxes…..had it been a live play a defender would have beaten Glenn to the inside and killed the QB. Other then that did not get beat on the series.

 

I am going to break this off at this point because its not really fair to evaluate Cordy Glenn without having Levitre next to him……having Asper there isn’t really fair atthat point. Basically…..I saw him get beat one time (which did not result in a negative play….and he took 1 play off due to a blown whistle that did not result in a negative play. Besides those 2 plays he held his assignments.

 

Man..were you at the same game I was at???? On the first play in the first series, Glenn was a statue as Orapko had a clean shot into Fitz......Glenn did not recognize he had to get over and get a piece of him.......

[San Jose Bills Fan]

Did I watch the same game as the rest of the people talking about Glenn on here? Orakpo man-handled Glenn on multiple occasions.

 

Apparently we watched different games because I just watched the first half for the 3rd time and Glenn did an excellent job on Orakpo. Twice did Orakpo completely sell out on an outside rush and both times Glenn used his long arms to push him past the pocket.

 

Yes you were. As you might recall, I was more skeptical of Glenn because of the limited time he spent at LT in college. That said, he must have played quite well in camp for him to start over a more experienced Hairston. Many expect Hairston to be moved to starting RT. I would be surprised if this happens. The Bills seem to like Pears. They gave him a new contract, and Dareus said that Pears belonged in the probowl.

Glenn, at his size, will have an easier time with running plays than on passing downs early on. That said, I sure hope that FJ stays healthy.

 

Pears' injury has kind of cleared the way for Glenn to win the LT job over Hairston. The coaching staff wants the rookie Glenn to concentrate on one spot only and while saying that Hairston is competing for the LT job, has somewhat earmarked Hairston for swing tackle duty as well. My observation is that Glenn has much better feet than does Hairston. Hairston still looks to have a hard time sinking his hips… watch him in his two-point stance… he's still a "waist bender." Glenn sits down in his stance much more easily.

 

Man..were you at the same game I was at???? On the first play in the first series, Glenn was a statue as Orapko had a clean shot into Fitz......Glenn did not recognize he had to get over and get a piece of him.......

 

What down are you talking about? The only play in which Orakpo even got close was first down when he looped outside, was pushed by the pocket, and Fitz stepped up to throw but Kerrigan pushed Rhinehart back into Fitz' face.

 

Orakpo NEVER had a "clean shot" at Fitz. Not once.

[billsfan89]

Ok so lets see, Nix DRAFTS really good players. too bad he didn't DRAFT his own QB, we might actually be on the road to a SB if he did. BTW I am really pleased at Glenn's performance last night. Yes he will struggle he is a rookie, but I think the kid is going to be a damn good one.

 

Nix's last two drafts were pretty good so far on paper. But the one draft that has had two full seasons to pan out (The 2010 draft) isn't looking like a very good draft. Even if Spiller pans out to be a very good running back (Which the jury is still out on) his 2nd round pick Troup isn't doing so well two years in, and the 3rd rounder Carrington hasn't panned out so far either, that means two years later his 2nd and 3rd round picks could both be cut. And the rest of his draft has either been cut or isn't looking too good.

 

As much as I like Nix I have to say that had that 2010 draft had a little more impact the team could maybe be that much closer to being in the playoffs.

[John from Riverside]

Apparently we watched different games because I just watched the first half for the 3rd time and Glenn did an excellent job on Orakpo. Twice did Orakpo completely sell out on an outside rush and both times Glenn used his long arms to push him past the pocket.

 

 

 

Pears' injury has kind of cleared the way for Glenn to win the LT job over Hairston. The coaching staff wants the rookie Glenn to concentrate on one spot only and while saying that Hairston is competing for the LT job, has somewhat earmarked Hairston for swing tackle duty as well. My observation is that Glenn has much better feet than does Hairston. Hairston still looks to have a hard time sinking his hips… watch him in his two-point stance… he's still a "waist bender." Glenn sits down in his stance much more easily.

 

 

 

What down are you talking about? The only play in which Orakpo even got close was first down when he looped outside, was pushed by the pocket, and Fitz stepped up to throw but Kerrigan pushed Rhinehart back into Fitz' face.

 

Orakpo NEVER had a "clean shot" at Fitz. Not once.

 

Agreed.....people are making stuff up or just seeing what they want to see.

 

I guess unless Cordy totally dominates someone then he didnt do a good job......guys.....THIS IS WHY YOU DRAFT AN OT WITH INCREDIBLE ARM LENGTH.......because even if the DE has good position they still are in NO position to touch the QB........

 

The pocket for Fitz was small....he didnt have tons of room......that much I will admit.....at no time did Orakpo EVER push Cordy back into Fitz in the series of downs I took notes on. On the first play of the drive the pocket broke down because defense went around then came up backside and Fitz had not yet released the ball.....

 

There was two plays I saw Cordy get beat......one was on a dead whistle.....maybe the interpretation "getting beat" is what is causing the problem here?

 

My definition of not getting beat is the DE does not touch the QB till after the ball is out.....period

[Wayne Cubed]

 

 

Agreed.....people are making stuff up or just seeing what they want to see.

 

I guess unless Cordy totally dominates someone then he didnt do a good job......guys.....THIS IS WHY YOU DRAFT AN OT WITH INCREDIBLE ARM LENGTH.......because even if the DE has good position they still are in NO position to touch the QB........

 

The pocket for Fitz was small....he didnt have tons of room......that much I will admit.....at no time did Orakpo EVER push Cordy back into Fitz in the series of downs I took notes on. On the first play of the drive the pocket broke down because defense went around then came up backside and Fitz had not yet released the ball.....

 

There was two plays I saw Cordy get beat......one was on a dead whistle.....maybe the interpretation "getting beat" is what is causing the problem here?

 

My definition of not getting beat is the DE does not touch the QB till after the ball is out.....period

Agreed.

 

I'm not sure what these other 2 posters saw, but what I saw, and I've watched the game 3 times now, was Cordy looked very comfortable out there at LT. Most of the breakdowns in the line, if you want to call it that, happened up the middle/right side, before the 2nds came on.

[K-9]

Agreed.....people are making stuff up or just seeing what they want to see.

 

I guess unless Cordy totally dominates someone then he didnt do a good job......guys.....THIS IS WHY YOU DRAFT AN OT WITH INCREDIBLE ARM LENGTH.......because even if the DE has good position they still are in NO position to touch the QB........

 

The pocket for Fitz was small....he didnt have tons of room......that much I will admit.....at no time did Orakpo EVER push Cordy back into Fitz in the series of downs I took notes on. On the first play of the drive the pocket broke down because defense went around then came up backside and Fitz had not yet released the ball.....

 

There was two plays I saw Cordy get beat......one was on a dead whistle.....maybe the interpretation "getting beat" is what is causing the problem here?

 

My definition of not getting beat is the DE does not touch the QB till after the ball is out.....period

 

Getting beat may be in the eye of the beholder, but for me, if an OLman keeps his guy out of the play, he didn't get beat. That's what I saw Glenn doing the few times I was able to see him play Thursday night. Those long arms are a great equalizer.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[eball]

I watched the replay again yesterday, and can confirm Glenn acquitted himself very well in his first live NFL action. If this is the worst we'll see, the kid has a bright future.