Bigfatbillsfan Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 wha...? they do good...plenty of good. just not enough. if ya'll didn't see that homage as a poke in the eye to the us healthcare system then you're as blind as the others who got poked. and i'm guessing that b-man surmises that danny boyle had unbridled authority to act as global spokesman for his country? no i'm refuting the contention that brits, in general, see the national health service as lesser than the us system. I've been working with a girl from Germany this summer and it's funny how they think we're all crazy for not switching to a more socialized system. Another coworker asked her how she could like it when you can't chose your own doc. She laughed and told him she can see any doc she wants pretty much any time she needs to see one as apposed to here where she is limited to who our insurance carrier is contracted with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 I've been working with a girl from Germany this summer and it's funny how they think we're all crazy for not switching to a more socialized system. Another coworker asked her how she could like it when you can't chose your own doc. She laughed and told him she can see any doc she wants pretty much any time she needs to see one as apposed to here where she is limited to who our insurance carrier is contracted with. the results of propaganda are pretty striking, huh? especially when you have acolytes spreading it on message boards. your commutation skills are very poor, or you are dodging my question. Do opening ceremony's reflect the majority opinion of the people of the country the games are in? Yes or no. i assume you're referring to the coexist comment and your lack of understanding? how bout this: brits have a robust and thriving 1% elite. socialized medicine didn't spell their doom and laws outlawing child labor and regulating pollution have long been in effect in the ik. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 birdog's point is some countries are proud of their system whether it would be ideal for us or not. Regardless of who you are you are a fool if you were proud of the old system and if you will be proud of the new one. I don't think the gov't needs to own most hospitals like in the UK, but a public payer is ideal either way. These are basically facts that cannot be argued against credibly. I've been working with a girl from Germany this summer and it's funny how they think we're all crazy for not switching to a more socialized system. Another coworker asked her how she could like it when you can't chose your own doc. She laughed and told him she can see any doc she wants pretty much any time she needs to see one as apposed to here where she is limited to who our insurance carrier is contracted with. I have no such limitation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 no i'm refuting the contention that brits, in general, see the national health service as lesser than the us system. Yeah...that's what I said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 I have no such limitation. Bully for you. Cuz, ya know, it'sall about what benefits you the most... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Bully for you. Cuz, ya know, it'sall about what benefits you the most... His point was that Germans can chose their doctors & we can't. I was pointing out that this hasn't been my experience. And I'm middle class & most jobs I've had can be obtained within a couple of years by anyone of at least average intelligence who's responsible enough to show up for work. I've been one of the people that your disconnected & out of touch theories are based on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 Yep. Everyone in the us has their choice of doctors and the finest medical care. And if they don't, it's their own fault cuz if you can do it anyone can. And if I cited a reference showing otherwise you'd answer that rare exceptions can always be found. So run along to the big rock candy mountain and grab a few bills off the money tree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Yep. Everyone in the us has their choice of doctors and the finest medical care. And if they don't, it's their own fault cuz if you can do it anyone can. And if I cited a reference showing otherwise you'd answer that rare exceptions can always be found. So run along to the big rock candy mountain and grab a few bills off the money tree. Everyone has their choice of doctors within what their coverage plan allows. Just like in Germany. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Yep. Everyone in the us has their choice of doctors and the finest medical care. And if they don't, it's their own fault cuz if you can do it anyone can. And if I cited a reference showing otherwise you'd answer that rare exceptions can always be found. So run along to the big rock candy mountain and grab a few bills off the money tree. Sorry to intrude into your happly liberal fantasy land with a little reality. I know in the world of the hippy everyone gets unlimited access to the finest doctors and the most advanced medical technology known to man, but in reality those resources are scarce and need to be allocated some way. A system based on a free market model (which we've not had in this country in decades) with governmental and charitable subsidies for those who can't afford basic care would undoubtedly be the most efficient model to give the best care to the most people. That offends your liberal sensitvities because it irks you that the person who produces health care (i.e. he who pays) gets first dibs, because hey, in matters of life and death that shouldn't matter, right? The problem is that in your alternate world an unaccountable bureaucrat gets to decide for the market. This disrupts the economic forces that would otherwise be in play which stifles efficiency and leads to greater costs for less service, ultimately leading to the middle class and above getting lesser care rather than the poor getting better care. But let's look at the Brits. Sure their public health service sucks ass and anyone who can afford it gets private care, but hey, the Brits had kids in hospital beds as part of the Olympic ceremony, so that settles it; socialized medicine is the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 You've made several far reaching conclusions there on free market and socialized medicine.might you have any gray poupon, um I mean data. Anything comparable in gravity to what I've provided to support my assertions would suffice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ieatcrayonz Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 You've made several far reaching conclusions there on free market and socialized medicine.might you have any gray poupon, um I mean data. Anything comparable in gravity to what I've provided to support my assertions would suffice So he needs to show an Olympic dance featuring Adam Jones? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 So he needs to show an Olympic dance featuring Adam Jones? I suppose it's too much to expect a reasonable debate from any of the Greek chorus here but especially from you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 You've made several far reaching conclusions there on free market and socialized medicine.might you have any gray poupon, um I mean data. Anything comparable in gravity to what I've provided to support my assertions would suffice If you're actually curious you can track the history of health care costs and how they react to government intrusion into the market, but somehow I don't think you're all that interested. I might recommend a book on basic economics as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ieatcrayonz Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I suppose it's too much to expect a reasonable debate from any of the Greek chorus here but especially from you You started the thread with a dance featuring national health care which is commie and then said others needed to show the same types of examples for their claims. I think a dance by the father of capitalism would be a similar example. P.S. I'm not Greek. Those people are greasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 If you're actually curious you can track the history of health care costs and how they react to government intrusion into the market, but somehow I don't think you're all that interested. I might recommend a book on basic economics as well. Actually did pretty well in economics. We studied a lit of the ideas of a fella named Keynes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicot Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I don't recall having a vote in any US opening ceremony. Did the British? Are opening ceremony's a accurate gauge of national opinion? No, opening ceremony's are not a gauge of national opinion but he is correct in his assertion that most Brit's would rather have the NHS than a US-style system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim in Anchorage Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 the results of propaganda are pretty striking, huh? especially when you have acolytes spreading it on message boards. i assume you're referring to the coexist comment and your lack of understanding? how bout this: brits have a robust and thriving 1% elite. socialized medicine didn't spell their doom and laws outlawing child labor and regulating pollution have long been in effect in the ik. You still refuse to answer my question. Do you feel opening ceremony's are a accurate gauge of the country's support on a given subject? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 No, opening ceremony's are not a gauge of national opinion but he is correct in his assertion that most Brit's would rather have the NHS than a US-style system. Well of course. Who doesn't like free ****? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicot Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Sorry to intrude into your happly liberal fantasy land with a little reality. I know in the world of the hippy everyone gets unlimited access to the finest doctors and the most advanced medical technology known to man, but in reality those resources are scarce and need to be allocated some way. A system based on a free market model (which we've not had in this country in decades) with governmental and charitable subsidies for those who can't afford basic care would undoubtedly be the most efficient model to give the best care to the most people. That offends your liberal sensitvities because it irks you that the person who produces health care (i.e. he who pays) gets first dibs, because hey, in matters of life and death that shouldn't matter, right? The problem is that in your alternate world an unaccountable bureaucrat gets to decide for the market. This disrupts the economic forces that would otherwise be in play which stifles efficiency and leads to greater costs for less service, ultimately leading to the middle class and above getting lesser care rather than the poor getting better care. But let's look at the Brits. Sure their public health service sucks ass and anyone who can afford it gets private care, but hey, the Brits had kids in hospital beds as part of the Olympic ceremony, so that settles it; socialized medicine is the way. Actually there are plenty of people who can afford private care who don't bother. I was offered private health insurance with my last job. Didn't need it, didn't want it and didn't take it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I suppose it's too much to expect a reasonable debate from any of the Greek chorus here but especially from you And there you have it, just like clockwork...the inevitable liberal end-game. It isn't possible that you started a moronic thread, so it clearly must be that no one here is as smart as you. Or maybe just haven't done a good job telling the story. Yeah. I'm sure that's it. Maybe if you call a joint session of Congress and explain it one more time it will finally make sense. Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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