BillsBytheBay Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 My point is he doesn't need to show he is versatile, he needs to CONTINUE to be effective. At the end of last year who plays wide out for us? We had so many injuries, are third QB played WR. As much as people hate the wildcat, he did run that efficiently as well. You don't cut good football players, who can step in for injurys. Also, if last year's rookies get a learning curve for no training camp last year, how about brad? He played three positions without training camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 (edited) My point is he doesn't need to show he is versatile, he needs to CONTINUE to be effective. At the end of last year who plays wide out for us? We had so many injuries, are third QB played WR. As much as people hate the wildcat, he did run that efficiently as well. You don't cut good football players, who can step in for injurys. Also, if last year's rookies get a learning curve for no training camp last year, how about brad? He played three positions without training camp. It's semantics. Whatever you want to call it, it's about Smith justifying his compensation and place on the roster. And what you just described sounds more like versatility than effectiveness to me. Also, Smith is a veteran… a high-priced veteran… so I wouldn't lump him in the same group as a rookie… and it's already been pointed out that the repertoire of plays he was asked to execute was extremely limited. As for playing three positions, while he made one outstanding TD reception, other than that he only did one thing well which was run the ball in 3rd and short situations. Edited July 23, 2012 by San Jose Bills Fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 (edited) They converted 3 third downs with Smith. 3. He rendered the wildcat more useless than it naturally is becuse every team knew he was going to run. His whole career, he has ONLY had value as a kick returner--never as a WR or QB. With 3 actual QBs and a slew or WRs, there is no reason to keep him except as a KR. Edited July 23, 2012 by Mr. WEO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mabden Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 I believe that Chixley feel they have to justify his signing last year so they won't let him go. I think you have this backwards, it is Smith who has to justify his contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 I think you have this backwards, it is Smith who has to justify his contract. That's what I said here: It's semantics. Whatever you want to call it, it's about Smith justifying his compensation and place on the roster. Unless it's a really long thread, I try to read through it before posting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 They converted 3 third downs with Smith. 3. He rendered the wildcat more useless than it naturally is becuse every team knew he was going to run. His whole career, he has ONLY had value as a kick returner--never as a WR or QB. With 3 actual QBs and a slew or WRs, there is no reason to keep him except as a KR. Wow Weo!!! Thank you for that. I had no idea that number was so low. So to sum up: He was effective on 3 downs but effective should be a term used extremely loosely. He was outperformed by a rookie with the same amount of practice on KRs. He had 1 great TD against the Jers and that was really it at WR. He threw 2 horrendous passes out of the wildcat all year. He statistically had his 2nd best year of his career in not only rushing yards, but recieving yards and receptions as well and that's with him starting quite a bit in the 2nd half of the year. The only thing I was willing to acknowledge was that Brad Smith was versitle and could play multiple positions. Unfortunately hebdoesnt do any of them well. So the only thing I can agree with is the fact that he doesn't tale up a roster spot as a 3rd QB on Sundays. That's all we can give him here. And some of those same people that agree with that ate the people that think Fitz is horrible and that we should be grooming young late round picks every chance we get to have a chance to strike gold. We can't have both. For $4m a year I think he's the biggest waste of money this team has ever made. Not that it's my money being thrown out there so I guess it doesn't matter but still a waste. Like I said, not that I think he will have any bearing on the resigning of Byrd or Levitre, but if he does.....boy will a lot of people be pissed. This guys year last year made the worst Chris Kelsey year look like an all pro season. Of course I'm anti Smity and anti WC. But you really can't argue the fact that he was not really that effective last year. The WC is what it is, sure it picks up a few first downs but it's potentially no different than running your RB out of a normal formation on 3rd and 2. Why anyone still thinks it is effective is kiding themselves. It won 1 game in it's short lived career. When the Phins used it and completely confused the Pats. But it's different now because nobody actually thinks it's going to be a pass. Sure the team using it gets a 3rd and 2 but that's all they get. Nothing more. Dare I say that Any QB could fall forward 2 yards for a 1st. Or Any RB the same. When the world realizes this formation is a joke we can all focus on real football and football players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 You know what team has multiple guys play multiple positions and be versatile for the good of the team? The AFC representative last year. Having a guy that can play a lot of different positions for you frees up roster spots so you can keep an extra D-lineman or wide receiver or corner. It allows injuries to occur and have significant depth behind your starters. 3 mil a year or whatever were paying Smith is nothing in todays NFL.Especially for a guy that can do a variety of things in your offense and special teams. Backup receivers get that kind of money, how is that any more valuable than Smiths contribution? I've seen a few people say we should be using that third QB spot to develop a guy for the future. I really don't believe that's possible in today's NFL. In the win now culture (4 years max to get results) every spot on your roster should be to help the team win every game. If your trying to develop a guy to take over in 3 years all your doing is making it easier on your replacement. With the new rule to have 46 players dress, Teams would be dumb to dress a guy that isnt going to play at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 The more versatile you are as an offense, and the more competent looks you can throw at a defense, the more they have to prepare for when they play you. That, in a nutshell, is why the wildcat became popular. The key is "competent looks" -- if it's not successful, it won't stick around. Chan clearly has a plan for how he wants to use Smith in the wildcat. Last year was a throwaway because of the lockout and then the Bills' injury troubles at WR -- but early in the year the look was "successful" on a limited basis. It's a shame some folks can't "chill" and wait to see how Smith is utilized this year before jumping to conclusions based upon the level of productivity last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsMagic1 Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 Trade him back to Jets for a 4th rounder and all would be happy but don't see Jets doing it now that they have Tebow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hplarrm Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 I read this all the time and wonder why people don't realize that practicing the wildcat also takes valuable time away from the Bills' offensive gameplan. And how hard is it for another team to plan for the Bills' version of the wildcat? They know he's going to run 95% of the time. I can understand the posts above about Smith keeping a roster spot because he can back up so many positions. That's legitimate. The wildcat is not. I think it is simply a mistake on your part to assume some type of equivalency between time lost by the Bills each week as they practice the wildcat and time an opponent has to spend practicing in the week before the Bills game for our version of thw Wildcat. 1. The Bills will install heir version of the Wildcat once in pre-season, use a bit in the relative luxury of training camp and potentially run it a few times in pre-season games to the extent it makes sense in the vanilla O packages we display to opponents. In regular season, practice time for the wildcat for a particular team is likely far less time consuming than for an oppenent must devote for the particulars of the Bills O. There is simply not likely to be any equivalency between what is demanded of the Bills team to run their Wildcat they have already basically installed and what an opponent must do to prepare for a much different look than they see most of the season (the Wildcat is a potent set because most teams still do not use it because they do not have the versatility of players to employ it. The Bills doubled down on this as we force opponents to not only prepare for this odd set-up but they also mist prepare for two possible versions of it depending upon whether we are running it with VY or running it with BS and their differing skill sets. Gailey now has the potential (which opponents must prepare for each week as they attempt to prepare for the potential pecularities of the Bills different O line-ups and play calls) variations not only in basic O but of the players who might run them. The Bills advantage comes in that they will have the initiation advantage on what O scheme they will choose so they really practice one approach from the many they installed, while the opponent must prepare for several possibilities. The assumption you make of equivalency in terms of the practice time equivalency is simply wrong. 2. My guess is that the notable thing about the Bills will be that they actully show a lot of sets once in pre-season as this forces the opposing DC to prepare for many options while the Bills each week prepare to run one and a back-up chsnge of psce. 3. My GUESS is that Gailey shows looks where VY runs the wildcat and shows the willingness to pass, that BS runs the wildcat which we establish that he will throw more Iin fact we are advertising him as our #3 QB. However, we run player options where all three QBs are on the field at the same time and we then using motion decide whether the opponent is lining up to stop the pass (if they use the nickel or a third safety then we run, or alternately if they put in more LBs and line up a lot of guys in the box then we pass. I think the versatility we have with BS will likely be a hallmark of the '12 offense. We may not atually use him but we will present the threat and simply take what they give us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 3. My GUESS is that Gailey shows looks where VY runs the wildcat and shows the willingness to pass, that BS runs the wildcat which we establish that he will throw more Iin fact we are advertising him as our #3 QB. However, we run player options where all three QBs are on the field at the same time and we then using motion decide whether the opponent is lining up to stop the pass (if they use the nickel or a third safety then we run, or alternately if they put in more LBs and line up a lot of guys in the box then we pass. I think the versatility we have with BS will likely be a hallmark of the '12 offense. We may not atually use him but we will present the threat and simply take what they give us. I think your thinking about it too much. This isn't Madden 2013. This isn't sandlot football. This is the NFL. You maybe see some kind of crazy play like that 1 time the entire year and that's from all 32 teams combined. It won't happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsBytheBay Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 It's semantics. Whatever you want to call it, it's about Smith justifying his compensation and place on the roster. And what you just described sounds more like versatility than effectiveness to me. Also, Smith is a veteran… a high-priced veteran… so I wouldn't lump him in the same group as a rookie… and it's already been pointed out that the repertoire of plays he was asked to execute was extremely limited. As for playing three positions, while he made one outstanding TD reception, other than that he only did one thing well which was run the ball in 3rd and short situations. It's not my money to throw around, and who am I to question the job they are doing right now. I think we have a roster full of guys who won't make another squad when cut; WHY are we woried about Smith? Do we want ruvall martin on the field more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Offside Number 76 Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 I think your thinking about it too much. This isn't Madden 2013. This isn't sandlot football. This is the NFL. You maybe see some kind of crazy play like that 1 time the entire year and that's from all 32 teams combined. It won't happen. Correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsBytheBay Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 They converted 3 third downs with Smith. 3. He rendered the wildcat more useless than it naturally is becuse every team knew he was going to run. His whole career, he has ONLY had value as a kick returner--never as a WR or QB. With 3 actual QBs and a slew or WRs, there is no reason to keep him except as a KR. I agree, but we stoped the wildcat because Smith moved out to reciver to cover injuries. And your right, he is not a great WR talent, buy neither is any other WR on our roster. The fact is, who else has a emergency QB who can cover so many injuries. I'm not saying he is a hall of famer, but he has a place. If we can sign our core guys, why dose it matter what his pay is? IMHO you keep the guys that help the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fansince88 Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 They can't direct-snap to Freddy or CJ? If you think he was automatic on third down because he has some special third-down mojo, then I don't know what to think. My thoughts exactly about CJ or Fred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 I agree, but we stoped the wildcat because Smith moved out to reciver to cover injuries. And your right, he is not a great WR talent, buy neither is any other WR on our roster. The fact is, who else has a emergency QB who can cover so many injuries. I'm not saying he is a hall of famer, but he has a place. If we can sign our core guys, why dose it matter what his pay is? IMHO you keep the guys that help the team. We would be far better off with a WR bench player who can play special teams very well. We will never need Smith as a QB, unless there is some freak bus accident or something. He doesn't help at that position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 They converted 3 third downs with Smith. 3. He rendered the wildcat more useless than it naturally is becuse every team knew he was going to run. His whole career, he has ONLY had value as a kick returner--never as a WR or QB. With 3 actual QBs and a slew or WRs, there is no reason to keep him except as a KR. I cannot remember a single kick off Smith tried running out of the end zone last year? The wildcat sucks why do we need to justify 4 mil for a guy that got 3 first downs with it? A receiver? He better hope Ruvell Martin does come on strong in camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in San Diego Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 The wildcat was a mixed success last year and didn't really scare anyone. I would be OK with cutting Smith and keeping another WR on the roster and keeping Thigpen for QB depth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 because the bills do not want him to go back to the jets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollars 2 donuts Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 Although VY can scramble he's not a wldcat back. Smith with limited off season work showed continued progress throughout the year, with the particular nice surprise as a WR at the end. WR still a very unsettled group on this team, makes him that much more valuable. ... Agreed. I am not going to say that the guy is Slash, but he can run, pass and catch which is pretty nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts