MARCELL DAREUS POWER Posted July 4, 2012 Author Share Posted July 4, 2012 Apparently I'm the only one posting in this thread who thinks that salary might play a part in the roster decisions on the defensive line… and that's a good thing if the Bills have gotten past money being a factor in their roster decisions. However keep in mind that Spencer Johnson will make $3 million this year (the last of his contract) and that Dwan Edwards will be making $3.8 million this year. That's a LOT of money for reserve defensive linemen and I'm skeptical at best that these salaries won't factor into the final decisions. you think kyle moore beats out spencer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 you think kyle moore beats out spencer? Is that what I said? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARCELL DAREUS POWER Posted July 4, 2012 Author Share Posted July 4, 2012 Is that what I said? no, im sry. i didnt write it well. im just asking. do you think kyle will beat out johnson... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 Apparently I'm the only one posting in this thread who thinks that salary might play a part in the roster decisions on the defensive line… and that's a good thing if the Bills have gotten past money being a factor in their roster decisions. However keep in mind that Spencer Johnson will make $3 million this year (the last of his contract) and that Dwan Edwards will be making $3.8 million this year. That's a LOT of money for reserve defensive linemen and I'm skeptical at best that these salaries won't factor into the final decisions. I think other things being equal, money may factor in. I think other things are likely not equal. Look at it this way. The Bills are reportedly $7.38 Mil under the salary cap for 2012 as of 25 June, even after signing Williams, Anderson, Stevie, VY as backup and with only TJ Graham unsigned. That gives them some room to sign Graham and extend Levitre and Byrd as the cap hit is biggest this year due to signing bonuses for several players. They will likely free up an additional $3 million by cutting either Thigpen or VY. With Mario Williams (~$16 million) and Mark Anderson (reportedly $6.8 mil), as well as extending Kyle Williams ($5.5 mill) and signing Dareus rookie contract ($5 million), at $3 mill Spencer Johnson and Edwards are essentially making backup money for the DL on this team! Yep, that's right, I said $3 million was backup money. Chix and Nailey know the pressure's on them to win this year. Playoffs are the minimal expectation. Anything else is cause to question whether they're the right guys for the team. That being the case, if a guy making $3 million as a backup will give them a better chance to win, it makes sense to keep him - this year. I think it's very likely Edwards or Johnson may be cut, but if they are, IMO it will be because they are changing to a new position and someone is legitimately out playing them in this scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 (edited) Something we might consider. Do we actaully need the money this year? There was a pronouncement recently that clarified how much we had left till cap. Dont recall for sure but i think was about seven and a half. Now we need to get a jump on contracts for Levitre and Byrd. I would think we would favor up and coming youth over money and veteran experience at DT since we just got a couple vet DE's. Because i dont understand the cap rules, or practice suad eligibility yet i think we may not need to shed some salaries this year at least. I also consider Merriman a huge factor in how many DE's we keep by the end of training camp. If he is a go well great if he is a risk (another injury) at that point we cant keep him. We should move Scott back to Safety and keep six LBs though. Makes it like 6 1/2 linebackers actually. edit geebus you type fast!! Edited July 4, 2012 by 3rdand12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjmac Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 Pre-draft measureables Ht 6-5¼, Wt 288 lb, Arm 36 in, Hand 10 and a half, 40-yard dash 4.76 10-yd split 1.67, 20-yd split 2.70, 20 ss 4.40, 3-cone 7.59, Vert 37 in, Broad 10'07", BP 28, Wonderlic 29 Gilbert certainly has some good measurables A 289-lb DT? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
....lybob Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 A 289-lb DT? Darnell Dockett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjmac Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Darnell Dockett Listed as a DT but plays a 3-4 end role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
....lybob Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Listed as a DT but plays a 3-4 end role. Darnell Maurice Dockett (born May 27, 1981 in Atlanta, Georgia) is an American football defensive end who currently plays for the Arizona Cardinals of the NFL. Arizona picked him in the 3rd round of the 2004 NFL Draft. He played defensive tackle for the first five seasons of his career until the Cardinals switched to a 3-4 defense, leading him to switch to defensive end Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 A 289-lb DT? Kyle Williams is listed as 303, Alex Carrington 301. Do 11 lbs really make that much difference? Can a young guy who works hard at it add 5-10 lbs of muscle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjmac Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Darnell Maurice Dockett (born May 27, 1981 in Atlanta, Georgia) is an American football defensive end who currently plays for the Arizona Cardinals of the NFL. Arizona picked him in the 3rd round of the 2004 NFL Draft. He played defensive tackle for the first five seasons of his career until the Cardinals switched to a 3-4 defense, leading him to switch to defensive end He played DT, but how well? Kyle Williams is listed as 303, Alex Carrington 301. Do 11 lbs really make that much difference? Can a young guy who works hard at it add 5-10 lbs of muscle? That 11 lbs can make a difference if injuries force him to be an every-down player. Call me a dinosaur, fine, but I want some beef in the middle. BTW, Carrington is projected to be a backup at best. How about Marcell Dareus? When is the last time he saw south of 300? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 That 11 lbs can make a difference if injuries force him to be an every-down player. Call me a dinosaur, fine, but I want some beef in the middle. BTW, Carrington is projected to be a backup at best. How about Marcell Dareus? When is the last time he saw south of 300? Marcellosaurus? Heh. He's listed as 331 on the roster. Maybe, if someone is lifting him from the armpits on the scale. Whatever Wannstache wants....Wannstache gets.....nimble, attacking DTs....(tra la) I think there was a post here that called it very well. Pretty sure Kelsey, Anderson, Merriman (if healthy through preseason), M Williams, K. Williams, Dareus all stay. That leaves slots for 2-3 guys. I tend to think Kyle Heard is too big, Jarron Gilbert is too small, and Dwan Edwards (if he can make the transition) could be "just right". Same may be true for Spencer Johnson. I think Eddins and Ross can be stashed on the Practice Squad. But you never know. SJBF could be right, if they think a younger, cheaper guy can provide very similar quality in backup, they might keep him. I think, too many "ifs" on whether Merriman can stay healthy, Kyle Williams can play every down all season - I think they pay for quality depth this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjmac Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Marcellosaurus? Heh. He's listed as 331 on the roster. Maybe, if someone is lifting him from the armpits on the scale. Whatever Wannstache wants....Wannstache gets.....nimble, attacking DTs....(tra la) I think there was a post here that called it very well. Pretty sure Kelsey, Anderson, Merriman (if healthy through preseason), M Williams, K. Williams, Dareus all stay. That leaves slots for 2-3 guys. I tend to think Kyle Heard is too big, Jarron Gilbert is too small, and Dwan Edwards (if he can make the transition) could be "just right". Same may be true for Spencer Johnson. I think Eddins and Ross can be stashed on the Practice Squad. But you never know. SJBF could be right, if they think a younger, cheaper guy can provide very similar quality in backup, they might keep him. I think, too many "ifs" on whether Merriman can stay healthy, Kyle Williams can play every down all season - I think they pay for quality depth this year. Don't forget Troup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
....lybob Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 He played DT, but how well? 3× Pro Bowl selection (2008, 2009, 2010) one as a DT 2008 and two as a 3-4 DE but his best year was probably 2007 with 9 sacks as a DT. Gilbert is pretty lean at around 290 so like Carrington I don't think he'd have any trouble gaining 10-20lbs. The question is what does DW want his DTs to do - Dareus and K Williams are superior DTs who can anchor, bull rush and shoot a gap at a high level - but back-ups might only be able to do one of those things at a high level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsWatch Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Also amazing how no one has actually discussed how Jarron Gilbert has looked in mini-camp at all. Not at all amazing just normal on this board - posters will move conversation to same points they brought u[ a hundred times in other threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjmac Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 3× Pro Bowl selection (2008, 2009, 2010) one as a DT 2008 and two as a 3-4 DE but his best year was probably 2007 with 9 sacks as a DT. Gilbert is pretty lean at around 290 so like Carrington I don't think he'd have any trouble gaining 10-20lbs. The question is what does DW want his DTs to do - Dareus and K Williams are superior DTs who can anchor, bull rush and shoot a gap at a high level - but back-ups might only be able to do one of those things at a high level. I think he would need to gain that weight. If we suffer a rash of injuries again this year, I think he would wear down too easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiley Dear Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 I think he would need to gain that weight. If we suffer a rash of injuries again this year, I think he would wear down too easily. Do we know he hasn't yet ? Don't you think the coaches may have given the players some guidance and goals for their offseason workouts? I bet they do that every year but especially since they've changed to the 4-3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjmac Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Do we know he hasn't yet ? Don't you think the coaches may have given the players some guidance and goals for their offseason workouts? I bet they do that every year but especially since they've changed to the 4-3. I'm sure the coaches did exactly that, but even if he came at 301 lbs and <10% bodyfat, there's a reason we sitgned him as a free agent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zazie Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 if kelsay is on the team opening day, the Bills will go 8-8 or worse and deservedly so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 (edited) if kelsay is on the team opening day, the Bills will go 8-8 or worse and deservedly so. How's the weather out there on that limb, Boy? The Bills may go 8 and 8. I hope not. But if they do, it won't be because a servicable, NFL-quality starting DE is on the roster playing DE part-time as a situational player. Mind sharing what you're drinking (so's I can avoid it)? Don't forget Troup. I don't forget Troup. I'm skeptical that he can really recover from back surgery in time not only to go hard in training camp, but to last through a season. Just a few weeks ago he was tweeting about not going hiking lest he hurt his back. Hiking, man, like on a trail hiking. I go hiking. It's not that severe, not like taking a blow from the 300 lb gorilla lined up across from you 60x a game. I'm sure the coaches have the same concerns. In addition, like Heard, he was acquired to "block a lot of daylight" in a 3-4 NT role. Can he adjust to the more mobile, aggressive 4-3 DT Wannstache favors? Time will tell, but he's kind of a long shot in my view - two strikes against him. Edited July 5, 2012 by Hopeful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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