FredEx Delivers Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8076348/report-percy-harvin-requests-trade-minnesota-vikings He's a dynamic player who lives in the middle of the field. Lets try and get him for a 3rd rounder? Good luck trying to get Rick Spielman to give up his best player for a 3rd rounder. He'd be just about canned if he did that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 (edited) Yes he is 31. Yes he has had major knee surgery. But after that knee surgery: 2010: 86 rec, 848 yds, 7 tds (15 games) 2011: 122 rec, 1569 yds, 9 tds I think we can agree that the knee surgery is a very minor issue. I think we can agree that he will still be productive in his 30s. I agree that contract is outdated and probably isn't the best comparison. But doesn't the fact that the patriots are unwilling to pay him $8 a year this year tell you something about the value of small slot receivers? Do you really think Percy Harvin is going to get a 6 year, $50 million contract? I think he'll sign something more like 5 years, $30 million with $18 million guaranteed. I agree he has had off the field issues in the past. But since the combine he hasn't had any real issues. I don't think smoking pot is really that huge of deal for an NFL player. He's played 15, 14, and 16 games in his 3 seasons. He only missed 1 game due to the migraine issue so it really doesn't seem like a huge problem. He's proven to be pretty durable. Sometimes good players have some off the field problems in their past. It doesn't mean they can't change and it doesn't mean a team can't be successful. Im not arguing hes going to get a mega millions deal, but that i think you are off on some of the evaluations and the priorities of GMs making the decisions. Harvin likely sees a deal much like stevie, in my opinion. welker, though a very proven guy, does have big questions. yes he has come back from the injury but it is a strike against giving him a mad money deal in his 30s. hes already not a fast guy, how long til he loses a step and cant get the seperation just by being crafty? these are real concerns as much as you quickly discard them. a 5 or 6 year deal for welker takes him to 36-37. even a 3-4 year deal puts him among the oldest in the league when it finishes. Trade him to another team for a package of picks, like any other player teams take risks on. It *is* a risk. But it's also a move that could put us over the hump. It's a tough decision. I'm glad I'm not in control of a football team. easier said than done - or the jets would have shipped santonio by now. that said, ill agree that running a team is much easier on this board than in real life. id stay away from investing in harvin though, that much im positive of. Edited June 20, 2012 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rippedcity Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 Isn't it ironic that he has headache problems because he has been a headache for every team he has ever played on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luxy312 Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I think you're missing my point. When Welker was 24, he was a similar player to Harvin. He signed a 5 year, $18 million contract. If you can find a better comparison, by all means do it. The way you describe Welker's contract situation leads me to believe that you don't know whats going on with it. The patriots placed the franchise tag on Welker because they were unwilling to sign him to a long term contract that averages over $8 a year. They were unwilling to sign the best slot receiver in history to a contract of that size. What makes you think Harvin will make more than $8 a year? He is surely a slot receiver and surely not as good as Welker. It may be a pipe dream, but hey this is a message board isn't it? If we cant speculate trades here, then where can we? You ignore the fact that he's not just a slot receiver. He runs the ball and returns kicks. When has Welker had a 50 carry season? Never. Also, I will bet money today that Harvin will get more than $8 million. Steve Smith made more than that and he's 32 years old. Brandon Marshall will collect over $10 million in base salary alone from the Bears this year. You're fooling yourself big time if you think a dynamic player like Harvin is going to be happy just coming in and being a slot receiver for someone. Not happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I'm confident in the character of our coaches, staff and team that we could handle one or two problem children. BUT if we can't, then I agree with others, I wouldn't want him. I trump your confidence in the character of our coaches, staff and team that we could handle one or two problem children, and a raise you a coaching staff that has enough confidence in itself, and its' players to know, they have a good WR group, and they will get the most out of them....beware Donald Jones & Derek Hagan! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 let him stay home and rot.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefenseWinzChampionshipz Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 4 pages of Harvin talk... Definitely the offseason... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsrhody Posted June 20, 2012 Author Share Posted June 20, 2012 Good luck trying to get Rick Spielman to give up his best player for a 3rd rounder. He'd be just about canned if he did that. Adrian Peterson? Jared Allen? Harvin is definitely not the best player on that team.. You ignore the fact that he's not just a slot receiver. He runs the ball and returns kicks. When has Welker had a 50 carry season? Never. Also, I will bet money today that Harvin will get more than $8 million. Steve Smith made more than that and he's 32 years old. Brandon Marshall will collect over $10 million in base salary alone from the Bears this year. You're fooling yourself big time if you think a dynamic player like Harvin is going to be happy just coming in and being a slot receiver for someone. Not happening. You ignore the fact that Welker is better than Harvin. I'm sure if a GM had a choice between a 24 year old Welker and a 24 year old Harvin, they would take Welker 100% of the time. Even at their current ages, I'm sure some GMs would still rather have Welker. Once again.. if you don't like my comparison to Welker, find someone better. Steve Smith plays exclusively on the outside and has proven himself as one of the best WR in the league. Brandon Marshall is 6'4" and is a ridiculous comparison. If anything, you're arguing that Harvin is a gadget player. If thats what you're arguing.. start here: D. Sproles: 600 rush yards, 700 receiving yards, 1300 return yards, 10 total tds P. Harvin: 350 rush yards, 950 receiving yards, 500 return yards, 9 total tds Sproles has a 4 year, $14 million contract. FYI, you keep touting Harvin as a dynamic return guy, but he only returned 16 kicks last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luxy312 Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 Adrian Peterson? Jared Allen? Harvin is definitely not the best player on that team.. You ignore the fact that Welker is better than Harvin. I'm sure if a GM had a choice between a 24 year old Welker and a 24 year old Harvin, they would take Welker 100% of the time. Even at their current ages, I'm sure some GMs would still rather have Welker. Once again.. if you don't like my comparison to Welker, find someone better. Steve Smith plays exclusively on the outside and has proven himself as one of the best WR in the league. Brandon Marshall is 6'4" and is a ridiculous comparison. If anything, you're arguing that Harvin is a gadget player. If thats what you're arguing.. start here: D. Sproles: 600 rush yards, 700 receiving yards, 1300 return yards, 10 total tds P. Harvin: 350 rush yards, 950 receiving yards, 500 return yards, 9 total tds Sproles has a 4 year, $14 million contract. FYI, you keep touting Harvin as a dynamic return guy, but he only returned 16 kicks last year. If Welker was 24 years old, he wouldn't be accepting his franchise tag and $9+ million salary this year. Your pipe dream is still very much irrelevant. Harvin is going to work through his issues with the front office and will be business as usual. In terms of a "gadget" guy, how about Devin Hester? In 2008, he signed a 4 year $41 deal going through 2013 with $15 million guaranteed. Harvin has outperformed him in almost every way. Also, you can continue to make Harvin a one dimensional player, but he simply will not become one because of your opinion. Finally to put this matter to rest. Spielman (GM from the Vikings) today: "We have absolutely no interest in trading Percy Harvin". Dream over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsrhody Posted June 20, 2012 Author Share Posted June 20, 2012 If Welker was 24 years old, he wouldn't be accepting his franchise tag and $9+ million salary this year. Your pipe dream is still very much irrelevant. Harvin is going to work through his issues with the front office and will be business as usual. In terms of a "gadget" guy, how about Devin Hester? In 2008, he signed a 4 year $41 deal going through 2013 with $15 million guaranteed. Harvin has outperformed him in almost every way. Also, you can continue to make Harvin a one dimensional player, but he simply will not become one because of your opinion. Finally to put this matter to rest. Spielman (GM from the Vikings) today: "We have absolutely no interest in trading Percy Harvin". Dream over. Outperformed him in almost every way??? Hester is the best return man in the history of the NFL. Harvin had 16 attempts last year.. I'll take your bet on over under $8 million a year for Harvin's next contract.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 Per PFW he is on a plane... Per Luke Russerts momma he is near a hotel. And honestly; ESPN text says Vikings have no interest in trading him. Which means they probably do want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 Outperformed him in almost every way??? Hester is the best return man in the history of the NFL. Harvin had 16 attempts last year.. I'll take your bet on over under $8 million a year for Harvin's next contract.. I thought that was Roscoe Parrish! I'll take your bet on over under $8 million a year for Harvin's next contract.. But would you make the bet if you had to guarantee Harvin would not be disgruntled about that next contract until he performed at least 75% of it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsrhody Posted June 20, 2012 Author Share Posted June 20, 2012 But would you make the bet if you had to guarantee Harvin would not be disgruntled about that next contract until he performed at least 75% of it? No way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chandler#81 Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 Quite the crusade there Billsrhody. I, too, followed him throughout the Gator years and know of the Virginia issues. While that's enough for me to not want him near Buffalo, the biggest issue IMO is the migraines. He missed some Gator games for this as well. With the the now sue-happy NFL regarding head injuries, NO WAY do I want an already serious head case (pun) joining the team. He can't be counted on even when healthy and I agree with BUFTEX, I believe were fine at WR. Why? Cuz Chan and Buddy say so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 (edited) Quite the crusade there Billsrhody. I, too, followed him throughout the Gator years and know of the Virginia issues. While that's enough for me to not want him near Buffalo, the biggest issue IMO is the migraines. He missed some Gator games for this as well. With the the now sue-happy NFL regarding head injuries, NO WAY do I want an already serious head case (pun) joining the team. He can't be counted on even when healthy and I agree with BUFTEX, I believe were fine at WR. Why? Cuz Chan and Buddy say so. dear lord - for those not scared away by being kicked out of high school athletics, choke slamming a college coach (among other issues with authority), multiple drug offenses, the swine flu incident (wicked hangover bro), his current standoff and admission of being distracted from preparation..... what would it take for you to be scared away from a guy? or at a certain level of talent is it just roll with it and deal with whatever happens? Edited June 20, 2012 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsrhody Posted June 20, 2012 Author Share Posted June 20, 2012 dear lord - for those not scared away by being kicked out of high school athletics, choke slamming a college coach (among other issues with authority), multiple drug offenses, the swine flu incident (wicked hangover bro), his current standoff and admission of being distracted from preparation..... what would it take for you to be scared away from a guy? or at a certain level of talent is it just roll with it and deal with whatever happens? I just happen to believe that sometimes kids do stupid things. Doesn't mean he cant change. Besides.. the NFL is about winning football games. He hasn't broken any of the league's rules has he? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 (edited) I just happen to believe that sometimes kids do stupid things. Doesn't mean he cant change. Besides.. the NFL is about winning football games. He hasn't broken any of the league's rules has he? positive test at the combine has him in the drug program as a first strike, no? and i get dumb mistakes but this is continued issues spanning years and with violent outbursts that have effected his teams. id be shocked if we dont hear more about him when he leaves minnesota - is there a spot you would draw the line? Edited June 20, 2012 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billieve420 Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 Pass on Harvn the migraine issues would be enough to scare me off let alone all the off field issues. Guy is going to miss time and then you are stuck with the unknown trying to figure out when he can get back on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 The cost is more than the 3rd round pick you are proposing because you then have to sign him to the contract extension that he is holding out from Minnesota for. He's holding out? Reports say he's in minicamp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 He wants too much money for a guy who's never had a 1000yd season. Now...with that said, Percy Harvin is exactly the type of player Chan would turn into a 1000yd WR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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