bbb Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 Sounds like they were on their way off the football team, but it's astounding to me how many college football players die in a year. Mostly by shooting: http://abcnews.go.com/US/auburn-football-player-dead-alabama-apartment-shooting/story?id=16535642#.T9TNvZj4L1A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 Sounds like they were on their way off the football team, but it's astounding to me how many college football players die in a year. Mostly by shooting: http://abcnews.go.com/US/auburn-football-player-dead-alabama-apartment-shooting/story?id=16535642#.T9TNvZj4L1A Tragic. I just don't understand these things...I'm the exact same age and the thought of gun violence over a woman is just absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefenseWinzChampionshipz Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 (edited) My apologies to any women on this board but, I'm sure even women would agree that many women who are intoxicated can create a violent situation between men... I've seen it way too many times where women put their boyfriends in harms way because they decide to argue with a stranger and the boyfriend has to defend his girl. I'm not saying that was the case here nor am I saying that men can hold their liquor any better. But fighting for your girlfriend's honor is a common brawl at parties... Tragic either way... My prayers go out to the victim's families... Edited June 10, 2012 by DefenseWinzChampionshipz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoretalk Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 First prayers for the families .. What an incredible tragedy and reflection of the world we have created. #1 - The guy being interviewed said he hit one of the two strangers in the face because there was an argument? Over a woman? Guess that striking out is the first natural reaction when you disagree with someone. #2. Then his friend hits the other guy over the head with a bottle! What were they thinking that these were the breakaway bottles used in movies?? Coming out of the movies yesterday my wife, 27 year old daughter and I reflected that once again the level of violence in films is increasing and with computer enhancement the images are more powerful. Is it any wonder that naive young men (And, women) do not hesitate to use violence to resolve their problems. And, finally ... #3. It is way too easy to get a gun and once you have a gun the trigger is just a moment of anger away from being pulled. No 19 or 20 year old who cannot drink legally should be allowed to own any gun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 Tragedy, indeed. Dark sides of humanity can be so sad. #3. It is way too easy to get a gun and once you have a gun the trigger is just a moment of anger away from being pulled. No 19 or 20 year old who cannot drink legally should be allowed to own any gun! Guns do not kill people. Chuck Norris kills people. If it would not have been a gun it would have been a knife or something else. I was not there but shirely, they would have got in to an altercation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 (edited) First prayers for the families .. What an incredible tragedy and reflection of the world we have created. #1 - The guy being interviewed said he hit one of the two strangers in the face because there was an argument? Over a woman? Guess that striking out is the first natural reaction when you disagree with someone. #2. Then his friend hits the other guy over the head with a bottle! What were they thinking that these were the breakaway bottles used in movies?? Coming out of the movies yesterday my wife, 27 year old daughter and I reflected that once again the level of violence in films is increasing and with computer enhancement the images are more powerful. Is it any wonder that naive young men (And, women) do not hesitate to use violence to resolve their problems. And, finally ... #3. It is way too easy to get a gun and once you have a gun the trigger is just a moment of anger away from being pulled. No 19 or 20 year old who cannot drink legally should be allowed to own any gun! I'll try to find a specific study, but I'm almost positive that violent crime is down across the board in America. EDIT: Well, that was easy - http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/45723701/ns/us_news/t/fbi-us-violent-crime-down-fewer-murders-rapes/#.T9ToKbD2KuI Edited June 10, 2012 by SageAgainstTheMachine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 My apologies to any women on this board but, I'm sure even women would agree that many women who are intoxicated can create a violent situation between men... I've seen it way too many times where women put their boyfriends in harms way because they decide to argue with a stranger and the boyfriend has to defend his girl. I'm not saying that was the case here nor am I saying that men can hold their liquor any better. But fighting for your girlfriend's honor is a common brawl at parties... Tragic either way... My prayers go out to the victim's families... Don't tell me, let me guess. Your apologies to any women anywhere and you're sure even women would agree that many women just create a violent situation where they should expect to get raped because they dress provocatively (you know, in clothes from the Jr department at Kohls) and then get intoxicated. Or maybe just walk down the street. This is a tragedy, let's not make it a farce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefenseWinzChampionshipz Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 Don't tell me, let me guess. Your apologies to any women anywhere and you're sure even women would agree that many women just create a violent situation where they should expect to get raped because they dress provocatively (you know, in clothes from the Jr department at Kohls) and then get intoxicated. Or maybe just walk down the street. This is a tragedy, let's not make it a farce. I won't even go there. I WILL say that it IS a tragedy. Nothing farce or humorous about the situation. My opinion is my opinion and to fight or even "die" over a girl is not something I live by. Plain and simple. I love many things in this world. Women being on the top of the list (especially the one's who wear clothing from the Jr department at Kohl's). At the end of the day we don't know exactly what the altercation was about. But what we DO know is that it was over a woman. Due to that fact, I call it a "tragedy". It's something that should have never happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meathead Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 its that accursed gangsta culture thats so embedded in the minds of young black males. it teaches them that you demonstrate your value by responding with swift and extreme violence whenever challenged regardless of the danger to yourself or others. aaron mcgruder coined it the 'ni99a moment' and based on my work in inner cities it is a very accurate portrayal. we gotta get that ѕhit the hell out of our young brothers minds cuz it is the reason the black on black murder statistics are so tragically bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 I won't even go there. I WILL say that it IS a tragedy. Nothing farce or humorous about the situation. My opinion is my opinion and to fight or even "die" over a girl is not something I live by. Plain and simple. The point I think you are missing, is that it could have been a fight over a perceived insult, or a drink spilled on clothes, or a dented bumper as easily as a woman. You probably wouldn't consider it appropriate or relevant to fight or die over any of those things, either. And the woman may or may not have done anything in particular to incite a fight. Meathead, whose posts are rapidly growing on me despite his bizzarely clever avatar, has it right: the root problem is a "gangsta" culture which responds with rapidly escalating violence to any "dis'ing of person or property. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeviF Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 I'll try to find a specific study, but I'm almost positive that violent crime is down across the board in America. EDIT: Well, that was easy - http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/45723701/ns/us_news/t/fbi-us-violent-crime-down-fewer-murders-rapes/#.T9ToKbD2KuI It's been decreasing pretty steadily since the early 90's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UConn James Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 If it would not have been a gun it would have been a knife or something else. I was not there but shirely, they would have got in to an altercation. A UConn football player, Jasper Howard, was stabbed to death outside of the student union a couple-few years ago. Also a comment about a woman... one that neither group knew. It seems as if the killer took more offense to a comment that was made than the girl did / he wanted to prove how dedicated to this girl he was so maybe she'd $)&@ him or something... whatever...he and his friends went to their car to get the knives and such, and a few minutes later a star CB was dying in the arms of the place kicker. All because people can't just let anything go these days. Gotta escalate everything. The black-on-black violence doesn't magically stop when these kids set foot on a campus. This stabbing happened about 200 yards from the UConn PD. People can fool themselves into thinking that more cops is the answer, but until we have teleporters, police are still going to be minutes away when every second counts. Just because some people are idiots and criminals doesn't mean law-abiding gun owners should have to concede one iota of their Second Amendment rights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juice_32 Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Violence has and will always exist. The delivery of news and information like this is just so much more efficient and readily available than in the past. It's not happening more, we just hear about it EVERY time it does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 (edited) This from the article: "Vines punched one of the strangers and his friend hit them over the head with a bottle. That was when the strangers -- either one or both of them -- began shooting." Not trying to be a wiseass... But maybe the stranger feared for his life? Unloading and connecting on 6 is crazy though... This is the "escalation" I was talking about in other threads. Again, I am not trying to get a heated debate going. I am making the point about how everybody has their own sense of self-defense. That shouldn't be. No doubt, a punch was thrown FIRST and a gun was used LAST. Sound similar? Edited June 11, 2012 by ExiledInIllinois Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefenseWinzChampionshipz Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 The point I think you are missing, is that it could have been a fight over a perceived insult, or a drink spilled on clothes, or a dented bumper as easily as a woman. You probably wouldn't consider it appropriate or relevant to fight or die over any of those things, either. And the woman may or may not have done anything in particular to incite a fight. Meathead, whose posts are rapidly growing on me despite his bizzarely clever avatar, has it right: the root problem is a "gangsta" culture which responds with rapidly escalating violence to any "dis'ing of person or property. You're not teaching me anything I haven't lived on the street my whole life... I'm born in Brooklyn and raised in queens ny... I've unfortunately seen someone get shot, stabbed, been stabbed myself, fought many fights in my life... I've fought over some of the dumbest things in my younger days so I understand why these youngsters at the party had an altercation... Never have I resolved my issues with a weapon... Never carried a knife on me except a box cutter and that was only on my way to work as a stockboy in a supermarket at around the age of 15... I've had my share of girlfriends/girls that I dated and never once have I had to fight over any of them... Maybe I'm lucky... But I've seen PLENTY of fights over or because of a girl in my lifetime and all I can do is shake my head... Unfortunately THIS one is a tragedy because it ended with people losing their lives... I guess you got stuck at the women comment I made and I understand why you would because that IS all I said... Maybe cuz I wanted to keep the message short since I was posting from my phone. But the real reason why I'm upset is because of the use of weapons. I don't mind people fighting one on one at all... Back in the day you would have a fist fight and in some cases end up being best friends with the guy you fought a year or two later... Weapons change the whole game... Not everybody can just talk their problems away which is why I'm not against violence. Sometimes you just have to fight... But weapons is where I draw the line... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geno Smith's Arm Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 (edited) Tragedy, indeed. Dark sides of humanity can be so sad. Guns do not kill people. Chuck Norris kills people. If it would not have been a gun it would have been a knife or something else. I was not there but shirely, they would have got in to an altercation. Really? Five people (3 dead) would have been injured if the attacker had been wielding a knife instead? I'm not necessarily a gun control advocate, but it's pretty obvious that a gun in this situation would cause more damage. PS. Don't call me surely... Edited June 11, 2012 by Matthews' Bag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meathead Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 yes i grow on people like the onychomycosis fungus grows under your toenails, slowly and insidiously combining deep insight with dry juvenile jocularity until your core becomes brittle and splits open. whos up for some ice cream Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 yes i grow on people like the onychomycosis fungus grows under your toenails, slowly and insidiously combining deep insight with dry juvenile jocularity until your core becomes brittle and splits open. whos up for some ice cream ..... I think I need a shower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCinBuffalo Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 My apologies to any women on this board but, I'm sure even women would agree that many women who are intoxicated can create a violent situation between men... I've seen it way too many times where women put their boyfriends in harms way because they decide to argue with a stranger and the boyfriend has to defend his girl. I'm not saying that was the case here nor am I saying that men can hold their liquor any better. But fighting for your girlfriend's honor is a common brawl at parties... Tragic either way... My prayers go out to the victim's families... People, be they women or men, that instigate so much nonsense that a fight becomes necessary...have no honor. So, there's nothing to defend. For every woman that I've seen do what you are saying, and yeah, I've seen it a lot, I've seen a man do it too. Being a douchebag, whose mouth is writing checks their ass can't cash, is = opportunity. Especially when the douchebag knows they have fierce people who will back them up without having all the information first. IF it was me, and IF your scenario is how it is, then I let the woman twist in the wind....for a least a little while. How else are they going to learn? If you reinforce their bad behavior, by fighting, all you are doing is bringing their dishonor onto yourself, and they will do it next time. Or, IF some dude is so insecure, and so lame, that he is looking for fights as a way to prove himself to the woman...because he hasn't found any other ways of doing it.... Then, he's weak. Sooner or later, the weak always "suffer what they must". Now, on the flip side, I've been and seen the stranger, who walks into the bar, isn't looking for trouble, get approached by a woman who has a boyfriend, but she never says a word about it/lies when asked. Then, 20 minutes later, all hell breaks loose. The slut has no honor, so, again, what is there to defend? IF she had honor, she would be honest with both herself and her boyfriend, and break up with him. But, instead, many of these women are weak, don't have the guts to do what is right, and want to play horse trader. What they don't know, is sooner or later they are going to make a bad trade, and the consequences of that are much worse than a bar fight. If anyone is going to get angry, get angry at these kind of women, and ignore the guy. Nothing says "you don't matter"...like ignore. Better still, dump their asses now, teach them the lesson now, and free yourself from all of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanC883 Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 (edited) First prayers for the families .. What an incredible tragedy and reflection of the world we have created. #1 - The guy being interviewed said he hit one of the two strangers in the face because there was an argument? Over a woman? Guess that striking out is the first natural reaction when you disagree with someone. #2. Then his friend hits the other guy over the head with a bottle! What were they thinking that these were the breakaway bottles used in movies?? Coming out of the movies yesterday my wife, 27 year old daughter and I reflected that once again the level of violence in films is increasing and with computer enhancement the images are more powerful. Is it any wonder that naive young men (And, women) do not hesitate to use violence to resolve their problems. And, finally ... #3. It is way too easy to get a gun and once you have a gun the trigger is just a moment of anger away from being pulled. No 19 or 20 year old who cannot drink legally should be allowed to own any gun! Yeah, esp. those 19 and 20 year olds in the military or in police forces. We should ban them from having guns. Do you think these punks had the guns legally?? If they didn't have a gun, they would have had a knife, etc. Or, used a beer bottle as a weapon as one of them did. Don't turn this tragedy into an anti-gun crusade. Movies, guns, etc. have nothing to do with what happened here. Want to bet that all the kids involved in starting the brawl had terrible parents, friends, and no common sense themselves? The point I think you are missing, is that it could have been a fight over a perceived insult, or a drink spilled on clothes, or a dented bumper as easily as a woman. You probably wouldn't consider it appropriate or relevant to fight or die over any of those things, either. And the woman may or may not have done anything in particular to incite a fight. Meathead, whose posts are rapidly growing on me despite his bizzarely clever avatar, has it right: the root problem is a "gangsta" culture which responds with rapidly escalating violence to any "dis'ing of person or property. That is the root problem indeed. Edited June 11, 2012 by RyanC883 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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