ExiledInIllinois Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 (edited) The federal gov't does not use seniority. Even in cases of RIF. True, vet status does give a person an advantage...And rightly so. I went to UB, graduated with a BA, 1990. Wife, 1989. For a lib... I do have a very conservative life... Does anybody else want me to dsipell myths about fed employees? An employee will pay about 30 some % towards their health care premium, the agency picks up the other 60 or so. Even when I was seasonal and furloughed, your premiums keep accuring and have to be paid back. They take 1.5% out of your pay, that goes towards your pension fund (FERS). 3 years to be vested. Again, union is open shop... Dues if you want to pay are 60% of your first hours wage every two weeks (pay period). Standard federal leave policy: 1-3 years, 4 hours sick, 4 hours annual leave a pay period. 3-15 years, 4 hours sick, 6 hours annual leave a pay period. 15 plus years, 4 hours sick, 8 hours annual leave a pay period. Annual leave can only have 240 carried over to the next year. Whatever you don't use over that, you lose without getting paid. Sick leave is unlimited. They just changed it so you lose everthing without getting paid for it when you retire... Before, they would give you service credit when retiring. Right now there is a 5 year freeze on any raise... No COLAs. Thift Savings Plan (TSP) is the "401k"... Agency automatically puts in 1%... Matches dollar for dollar up to 4% the employee saves, then 50% on the next 1% up to 5%... Anything over 5% is not matched... No limit on how much an emploee can save anymore (used to be around 15%) Probationary period is one year in my field... Wage grade employees (me) have their hourly wage (not GS scale) set to the home agency's local industries. FWIW, Chicago is lower than the Quad Cities. The Quad Cities area is set by business like John Deere (Moline). So hourly wage is determined by the industry in the area. Anything else? Edited June 11, 2012 by ExiledInIllinois Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim in Anchorage Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 (edited) Annual leave can only have 240 carried over to the next year. Whatever you don't use over that, you lose without getting paid. I assume by "only" 240 you mean hours. That's 6 weeks paid vacation. Great you cut a fat hog by chance, But why do you feel Someone who busted his ass, Studied day and night, went to med school on his own dime and made the cut as a MD should be working for wages? As far as I can tell from you're babble, that's what you what. Edited June 11, 2012 by Jim in Anchorage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Annual leave can only have 240 carried over to the next year. Whatever you don't use over that, you lose without getting paid. I assume by "only" 240 you mean hours. That's 6 weeks paid vacation. Great you cut a fat hog by chance, But why do you feel Someone who busted his ass, Studied day and night, went to med school on his own dime and made the cut as a MD should be working for wages? As far as I can tell from you're babble, that's what you what. Because doctors don't do real work, don't miss family events, paid too much for their education (suckers!), and should be giving their care away for free, because, well, goldarnit, that's what should be done. And mostly because they gouge patients by extorting $1000/month from working stiffs like him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Miner Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Because doctors don't do real work, don't miss family events, paid too much for their education (suckers!), and should be giving their care away for free, because, well, goldarnit, that's what should be done. And mostly because they gouge patients by extorting $1000/month from working stiffs like him. Don't forget you also play golf and drive a BMW. You son of a B word!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Annual leave can only have 240 carried over to the next year. Whatever you don't use over that, you lose without getting paid. I assume by "only" 240 you mean hours. That's 6 weeks paid vacation. Great you cut a fat hog by chance, But why do you feel Someone who busted his ass, Studied day and night, went to med school on his own dime and made the cut as a MD should be working for wages? As far as I can tell from you're babble, that's what you what. Yes... That is one of the nicer things I do say... But at 4 hours a pay period (every two weeks) in the first 3 years... And then 6 hours in th 3-15 year range... It does take so time to accue 240 before getting to "use or lose" for the next leave year... You have to basically not take any vacation the first 3-4 years and then when you do, stay under what you make. This is the standard leave for fed... Unless you go to Iraq and Afghanistan, then I think they let you carry more than the 240.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Don't forget you also play golf and drive a BMW. No, no, those are signs of my gluttony. What I truly forgot was that I get Tuesdays off. You son of a B word!!! I know. I should pay my patients for the privilege of taking care of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Miner Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 The federal gov't does not use seniority. Even in cases of RIF. True, vet status does give a person an advantage...And rightly so. I went to UB, graduated with a BA, 1990. Wife, 1989. For a lib... I do have a very conservative life... Does anybody else want me to dsipell myths about fed employees? An employee will pay about 30 some % towards their health care premium, the agency picks up the other 60 or so. Even when I was seasonal and furloughed, your premiums keep accuring and have to be paid back. They take 1.5% out of your pay, that goes towards your pension fund (FERS). 3 years to be vested. Again, union is open shop... Dues if you want to pay are 60% of your first hours wage every two weeks (pay period). Standard federal leave policy: 1-3 years, 4 hours sick, 4 hours annual leave a pay period. 3-15 years, 4 hours sick, 6 hours annual leave a pay period. 15 plus years, 4 hours sick, 8 hours annual leave a pay period. Annual leave can only have 240 carried over to the next year. Whatever you don't use over that, you lose without getting paid. Sick leave is unlimited. They just changed it so you lose everthing without getting paid for it when you retire... Before, they would give you service credit when retiring. Right now there is a 5 year freeze on any raise... No COLAs. Thift Savings Plan (TSP) is the "401k"... Agency automatically puts in 1%... Matches dollar for dollar up to 4% the employee saves, then 50% on the next 1% up to 5%... Anything over 5% is not matched... No limit on how much an emploee can save anymore (used to be around 15%) Probationary period is one year in my field... Wage grade employees (me) have their hourly wage (not GS scale) set to the home agency's local industries. FWIW, Chicago is lower than the Quad Cities. The Quad Cities area is set by business like John Deere (Moline). So hourly wage is determined by the industry in the area. Anything else? Nice job for a **** ton of people that don't/can't produce anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 (edited) Because doctors don't do real work, don't miss family events, paid too much for their education (suckers!), and should be giving their care away for free, because, well, goldarnit, that's what should be done. And mostly because they gouge patients by extorting $1000/month from working stiffs like him. For only 12 years! Then the docs hit the jackpot... Again, what I have heartbun with is the idea that they have to have a return on their investment... Maybe in the past... But now, just like in housing... That should take a hit. Nothing should be certain. I suppose why they can assure a return on their investment is because THEY CAN and THEY WILL... They got their customers over the barrel. Sinclair Lewis died in the early 1950's, at the middle part of the progressive movement... I wonder how he would have altered his writings to fit today's events... Are they really different when it comes to social standing and professional "prestige?" Probably not, we are cranking the clock back. I am sorry... No way should you get in debt for 115k just to go to Med school... And that is most likely on the very low end. I am sorry, there is gonna have to be a generation of med schoolers that are gonna have to eat it... For the sake of the patient and customer. Something will have to give. I am not crying poormouth as much as I am trying to keep the crisis in reality... Numbers can't keep on climbing like this... Last year alone my premium went up 80 bucks every two weeks... With the COLA and no raises for 5 years, things are going backwards. The healthcare situation is gonna bust. Myself, I will be fine... I have been giving it time (health premiums) the last 20 years watching them inch up and then skyrocket about 7 years ago. As a family, we are reaching a threshold... Starting to go backwards and health care is causing it... I am lucky, next open season I can start to shop for bargain basement plans (and save the difference) or drop all together and shop through the wife's employer... Right now she elects to take no healthcare there and is on what my employer offers. Edited June 11, 2012 by ExiledInIllinois Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 (edited) Nice job for a **** ton of people that don't/can't produce anything. What's that supposed to mean? Are you talking about what I do? There is production... Just not in the classic sense. What I do is constituionally mandated. Even the founding fathers realized this production going back 200 years of waterway legal precedent. You might want to be like 3rd and think it is just "toll collecting", fine... But it is not. Operating as an aide to navigation while producing the actual flow of the river/canal, there is "production". In survey, money was appropriated through the rivers and harbors act... How old is that... Going back over 100 years ago to some of the first acts. Survey was done to determine dredge operations and how much material would (or even should) be moved. At locks and dams, America is also kept competitive with the rest of the world through cheap transportation... The taxpayer is getting the ultimate return on their tax dollars with the inland waterways. Again, my field site alone was built for 6 million dollars back in 1960 tacked onto Seaway appropriation. Today a 60 day closure costs the regional and local economy 18 million dollars. The carp battle alone has appropriated a whopping 100 plus million dollars... Even in terms of today's dollars... Something is grossly wrong when you have a bought and paid for infrastructure stimulating the ecomomy robustly while people are crying about stopping a silly fish that will cost them in the 100's of miilions alone to MAYBE stop migrating... IMO, most likely NOT stop. You we have zebra mussels in lakes that are separated by the Rocky Mountains. This cost will even be in the multiple billions if they were to severe and replumb that region's waterways... So sorry for digressing... Lot to think about when it comes to American competitiveness Who's not producing? Sorry for the bad typing... Everything is coming off my Droid. No, no, those are signs of my gluttony. What I truly forgot was that I get Tuesdays off. I know. I should pay my patients for the privilege of taking care of them. Tuesdays are fine... What about weekends, Sunday's and Christmas... You get those off? And no, you shouldn't pay your patients... But just like everything else, prices should come down... Unless the market is cornered. It is not gonna be long before the health industries make the same mistakes as the auto industry. I am all for competing across state lines and regions, allowing RX to be bought in countries like Canada. Why is the America consumer caught in the crossfire. You said you are 42 and want to get out of the industry... Why? Edited June 11, 2012 by ExiledInIllinois Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 For only 12 years! Then the docs hit the jackpot... Again, what I have heartbun with is the idea that they have to have a return on their investment... Maybe in the past... But now, just like in housing... That should take a hit. Nothing should be certain. I suppose why they can assure a return on their investment is because THEY CAN and THEY WILL... They got their customers over the barrel. Sinclair Lewis died in the early 1950's, at the middle part of the progressive movement... I wonder how he would have altered his writings to fit today's events... Are they really different when it comes to social standing and professional "prestige?" Probably not, we are cranking the clock back. I am sorry... No way should you get in debt for 115k just to go to Med school... And that is most likely on the very low end. I am sorry, there is gonna have to be a generation of med schoolers that are gonna have to eat it... For the sake of the patient and customer. Something will have to give. I am not crying poormouth as much as I am trying to keep the crisis in reality... Numbers can't keep on climbing like this... Last year alone my premium went up 80 bucks every two weeks... With the COLA and no raises for 5 years, things are going backwards. The healthcare situation is gonna bust. Myself, I will be fine... I have been giving it time (health premiums) the last 20 years watching them inch up and then skyrocket about 7 years ago. As a family, we are reaching a threshold... Starting to go backwards and health care is causing it... I am lucky, next open season I can start to shop for bargain basement plans (and save the difference) or drop all together and shop through the wife's employer... Right now she elects to take no healthcare there and is on what my employer offers. We've been taking hits, thankyouverymuch. It's time for the other 90% to take theirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 (edited) We've been taking hits, thankyouverymuch. It's time for the other 90% to take theirs. LOL! Now you sound like a union guy... What are you a Teamster? I knew there was some kind of crazy movement to unionize doctors... Imagine how that would work! The double whammy reach around! And Doc, please no hard feelings... I take a lot of abuse here too (and rightly so). All this schit we talk about does take a bite out of our American competitiveness.... The American infighting that is. Edited June 11, 2012 by ExiledInIllinois Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Tuesdays are fine... What about weekends, Sunday's and Christmas... You get those off? And no, you shouldn't pay your patients... But just like everything else, prices should come down... Unless the market is cornered. It is not gonna be long before the health industries make the same mistakes as the auto industry. I am all for competing across state lines and regions, allowing RX to be bought in countries like Canada. Why is the America consumer caught in the crossfire. Good suggestions. Guess what? Obamacare doesn't implement them. There's also no tort reform. So costs will only increase, because you can only limit doctors' salaries so much. You said you are 42 and want to get out of the industry... Why? Why? Because I don't like the way things are going and figure I might as well go into business and not have to worry about people complaining about how much money I make, because it's okay to gouge people when you're a business person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Good suggestions. Guess what? Obamacare doesn't implement them. There's also no tort reform. So costs will only increase, because you can only limit doctors' salaries so much. Why? Because I don't like the way things are going and figure I might as well go into business and not have to worry about people complaining about how much money I make, because it's okay to gouge people when you're a business person. Fair enough... We can find common ground (I hope)... I am not keen on Obamacare or for that matter Romneycare in MA. I apologize for the ranting... This isn't about me, or how much money I am shelling (I do admit, it does get on me... But quickly passes when I think how blessed I have been) out. It really isn't about you (personally, you don't seem like you are blowing the system out of the water like others) or your lifestyle either, that was just caught in the crosshairs. The other tools that ride to the conservative argument's rescue does fuel my entrenchment. Maybe that is what they want... Unfortunately, I give them just that kinda of opening with this kinda debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 The federal gov't does not use seniority. Even in cases of RIF. True, vet status does give a person an advantage...And rightly so. I went to UB, graduated with a BA, 1990. Wife, 1989. For a lib... I do have a very conservative life... Does anybody else want me to dsipell myths about fed employees? An employee will pay about 30 some % towards their health care premium, the agency picks up the other 60 or so. Even when I was seasonal and furloughed, your premiums keep accuring and have to be paid back. They take 1.5% out of your pay, that goes towards your pension fund (FERS). 3 years to be vested. Again, union is open shop... Dues if you want to pay are 60% of your first hours wage every two weeks (pay period). Standard federal leave policy: 1-3 years, 4 hours sick, 4 hours annual leave a pay period. 3-15 years, 4 hours sick, 6 hours annual leave a pay period. 15 plus years, 4 hours sick, 8 hours annual leave a pay period. Annual leave can only have 240 carried over to the next year. Whatever you don't use over that, you lose without getting paid. Sick leave is unlimited. They just changed it so you lose everthing without getting paid for it when you retire... Before, they would give you service credit when retiring. Right now there is a 5 year freeze on any raise... No COLAs. Thift Savings Plan (TSP) is the "401k"... Agency automatically puts in 1%... Matches dollar for dollar up to 4% the employee saves, then 50% on the next 1% up to 5%... Anything over 5% is not matched... No limit on how much an emploee can save anymore (used to be around 15%) Probationary period is one year in my field... Wage grade employees (me) have their hourly wage (not GS scale) set to the home agency's local industries. FWIW, Chicago is lower than the Quad Cities. The Quad Cities area is set by business like John Deere (Moline). So hourly wage is determined by the industry in the area. Anything else? That's insanely generous compared to every job I've ever had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevbeau Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 That's insanely generous compared to every job I've ever had. The 4.5% Match stuck out to me. Not to mention according to my gov't employed relaitives, sick time = vacation time. So that's really generous in my eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 (edited) That's insanely generous compared to every job I've ever had. You a contractor for the gov't? Then those benefits were made up in what was charged to the gov't! You should have seen this one HVAC contractor last season... Bashing the gov't this and that... Then he goes on to take 100% more more from the gov't he is bad talking! Surely, that can't your type? The 4.5% Match stuck out to me. Not to mention according to my gov't employed relaitives, sick time = vacation time. So that's really generous in my eyes. No. Sick time is not vacation... Anything over 3 days has to have a doctor's note (joke in there somewhere). Where I work, gotta have two guys for safety... Sick leave is frowned upon because it means paying OT. OT is a no-no! They come down on you for that. Edited June 11, 2012 by ExiledInIllinois Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayman Posted June 11, 2012 Author Share Posted June 11, 2012 LOL this topic is destroyed. I don't mind of course it was predictable but I do which it warped into something more interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 LOL this topic is destroyed. I don't mind of course it was predictable but I do which it warped into something more interesting. Not really... I have been tieing it into American competitiveness... The waterway infrastructure and labor policy... Health... Working on Tuesdays and having long weekends off once a month (me)... This does have something to do with the original topic. The original title is pretty open ended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 You a contractor for the gov't? Then those benefits were made up in what was charged to the gov't! They're insanely generous even in comparison to that. Where I am right now has the most generous benefits I've ever seen (even from when I was self-employed), and they still pale in comparison to yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 The 4.5% Match stuck out to me. Plus the amount that's being dumped into their FERS by us is pretty nice. And the payout at the end is greater than any investment can generate especially with the life expectancies we have now. That is why many of our government agencies (Fed, State, Local) are in so much trouble. Whe they've done here in CA over the years is to take on more risk with the pension pool which has a higher historical ROR so it makes their future numbers look better. A recipe for disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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