PromoTheRobot Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 (edited) Actually, it's currently inconsistent with accepted scientific theories. Sagan's statement is no longer valid. I'm not sure what you mean by Sagan's statements. He was referring to frames of time in the billions of years, which I think are still valid. One of the newer theories of the universe is referred to as"brane theory" and it does postulate an endless cycling universe, which is consstant with the idea of the Bramhan dream epoch, that describes the universe as alternating dreaming and sleeping states of God. As for AJzepp, how do you explain the shared DNA of species? PTR Edited June 3, 2012 by PromoTheRobot
Cynical Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 As opposed to people who want schools to prohibit the teaching of Creationism? I say teach them both and let the kids decide People who push for Creationism to be taught in schools are not doing it in order to present a different scientific theory, they are doing it to promote a religious belief. You think the same people would be comfortable with the other religions being taught in the school? If they want to teach Creationism in school, than teach ALL variations, not just the "Christian" one. Yes, that includes the Flying Spaghetti Monster version. I'm not a religious person. I don't go to church and have serious issues with organized religion. I know faithful Christians and Jews as well as die hard atheists. In my experience I've found the atheists to be more bitter and zealous in their beliefs As an Atheist/Agnostic, I am bitter and zealous in my belief. That's because I am sick and tired of having Christians trying to jam their belief down my throat every time I turn around. I have stopped counting the number of times I have been told "Freedom of Religion does not mean Freedom from Religion".
Fan in San Diego Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 (edited) I never understood why people hate on other people that believe in the Judeo-Christian story of creation. Why does it bother some people so much? Because most people see the flaws and lunacy of believing in creation so its irritating that a person can be so thick headed to actually believe it as fact. I believe in the theory of Evolution. I also believe in God. They're not mutually exclusive. I believe in a God as well. My own theory is that God assisted the evolutionary process. Giving it a special boost when needed from time to time. Edited June 3, 2012 by Fan in San Diego
Fingon Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 People who push for Creationism to be taught in schools are not doing it in order to present a different scientific theory, they are doing it to promote a religious belief. You think the same people would be comfortable with the other religions being taught in the school? If they want to teach Creationism in school, than teach ALL variations, not just the "Christian" one. Yes, that includes the Flying Spaghetti Monster version. As an Atheist/Agnostic, I am bitter and zealous in my belief. That's because I am sick and tired of having Christians trying to jam their belief down my throat every time I turn around. I have stopped counting the number of times I have been told "Freedom of Religion does not mean Freedom from Religion". I just remind them that a good portion of the most important founding fathers were either deistic or held strongly deistic beliefs.
PromoTheRobot Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 I just remind them that a good portion of the most important founding fathers were either deistic or held strongly deistic beliefs. And to a man they believed religion should be seperate from secular matters. Even Jesus said render unto Caeser that which is Caeser's. PTR
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted June 3, 2012 Author Posted June 3, 2012 People who push for Creationism to be taught in schools are not doing it in order to present a different scientific theory, they are doing it to promote a religious belief. You think the same people would be comfortable with the other religions being taught in the school? If they want to teach Creationism in school, than teach ALL variations, not just the "Christian" one. Yes, that includes the Flying Spaghetti Monster version. May his noodly appendage bless you always.
Cynical Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 I just remind them that a good portion of the most important founding fathers were either deistic or held strongly deistic beliefs. Would not matter (at least here in GA). They just spin it into something like "That's why they were Christians, and this country was founded on Christian beliefs (just look at US currency if you don't believe me!), and there is nothing in the Constitution stating you have the right to Freedom from religion".
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted June 3, 2012 Author Posted June 3, 2012 Would not matter (at least here in GA). They just spin it into something like "That's why they were Christians, and this country was founded on Christian beliefs (just look at US currency if you don't believe me!), and there is nothing in the Constitution stating you have the right to Freedom from religion". My favorite: "But isn't your life just so meaningless?"
DC Tom Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 I'm not sure what you mean by Sagan's statements. He was referring to frames of time in the billions of years, which I think are still valid. One of the newer theories of the universe is referred to as"brane theory" and it does postulate an endless cycling universe, which is consstant with the idea of the Bramhan dream epoch, that describes the universe as alternating dreaming and sleeping states of God. As for AJzepp, how do you explain the shared DNA of species? PTR Saw that on the Science Channel, did you? There's no empirical evidence of "brane theory" being at all applicable in reality - it's a mathematical theory, not a physical one. The most recent empirical evidence is that the universe will basically expand endlessly.
NoSaint Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 (edited) Common jboy...If we were in a primarily Hindu country we would be talking about teaching Hindu version of creation vs. evolution. This isn't a primarily Hindu country. Your comment if not made in jest is disingenuous at best. You teach what you believe. Can't say it any simpler than that and there is nothing to apologize for. Save your false jingoism for another time. Or do you believe what your taught? Perhaps a well rounded look might do many on both sides of the aisle well. In this case to argue we should teach it because it's what we believe is a bit of a circulat logic for me on unproven things like religion. I think if venturing into religious teachings a diverse look at them is the best approach. To exclude anything foreign has a bit of the 'mericas the best ring to it. I get what your saying, but personally don't believe it's the best approach, Edited June 3, 2012 by NoSaint
Jim in Anchorage Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 Actually, there is. Speciation has been observed - although it causes problems, not with evolutionary theory, but with the definition of the term "species". I thought that was cut and dryed-you can interbreed, or not.
PromoTheRobot Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 Saw that on the Science Channel, did you? There's no empirical evidence of "brane theory" being at all applicable in reality - it's a mathematical theory, not a physical one. The most recent empirical evidence is that the universe will basically expand endlessly. Well much of science is first inferred by math. PTR
DC Tom Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 Well much of science is first inferred by math. PTR And much of math has nothing to do with reality.
Fingon Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 And much of math has nothing to do with reality. The same can be said for religion.
uncle flap Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 I thought that was cut and dryed-you can interbreed, or not. In general, that is the case. Here's a quick overview on why it's not so simple: http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/VADefiningSpecies.shtml
PromoTheRobot Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 And much of math has nothing to do with reality. I would argue math is itself reality. PTR
Jim in Anchorage Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 In general, that is the case. Here's a quick overview on why it's not so simple: http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/VADefiningSpecies.shtml That's more race then species. I bear very little resemblance to a Forest pygmy, but we can interbreed.
DC Tom Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 I would argue math is itself reality. PTR And...you'd be wrong.
uncle flap Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 That's more race then species. I bear very little resemblance to a Forest pygmy, but we can interbreed. Well, you'll have to wine and dine me first. And who told you I have a thing for pygmies?
Jim in Anchorage Posted June 3, 2012 Posted June 3, 2012 Well, you'll have to wine and dine me first. And who told you I have a thing for pygmies? You silly tease. Do you really think people haven't noticed?
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