Troups Redemption

[....lybob]

Troup is in trouble, it's not like he is competing against air, Williams and Dareus are the starters and at most the Bills will keep 3 more DTs - Heard, Carrington, Gilbert, Spencer Johnson, Edwards, and Jay Ross are all also going to be competing for those 2-3 spots, I would be interested to know if DW has a type he likes when it comes to DTs - some of the words you seem to hear a lot coming out of the Bills lately are Length (tall with long arms), positional versatility, and getting younger if that applies to DTs then Carrington, Heard, and Gilbert might have the inside track.

[bowery4]

Troup maybe good, time will tell. He maybe on a different team at that point but I only wish him well (I liked the pick, can you tell?).

[Buffalos#1Fan]

I asked my dad who is a neurosurgeon (and got me into the bills) for this question and he said: The facts are sketchy: In one place it said he had a fracture and in the other it said he had a ruptured disk and two incisions in his back. The spinal column is composed of virtabrae, you can consider it a tripod with a vertebral body in the front and the facet joints in the back. They are stacked one above another, between them is the disk. A fracture can occur anywhere in the bone, in the front it is called a compression fracture (occurs from something like a hard landing in a helicopter). This would cause bone fragments to fragment into the nerves in the spinal canal, hence the compression causing nerve damage. This would cause loss of bladder and bowel movements, weakness in the legs and loss of sexual function... Apparently he was playing with it last year so it could not be the severe type, but a milder telescoping of the vetebral body without fragments. This could be treated conservatively or with a fusion (replacing entire bone and secure it with metal). This would take roughly six months for a average person to feel normal. This is usually accompanied by a posterior operation where they also put metal in the back. This is called a 360 degree fusion.If he has an associated disk rupture, then they would clean out the disk during the operation. The problem is that vertebrae fused to the one above and below it which can create limited movement. But not as much as you would think. The problem is the disk space above and below have to cause more of the motion and may be more prone to rupture. This is assuming he had this done. Once the fusion takes, he could play again but will always be susceptible to further injury.

 

Depending on the degree of the compression and how well the surgery went, he could play again after the offseason. This is assuming he had this done. If he just had a ruptured disk, he could come back in 3 months.

 

Not knowing all the facts, there is no way to be sure. But it is possible.

[Peter]

Well done. Thanks.

 

I asked my dad who is a neurosurgeon (and got me into the bills) for this question and he said: The facts are sketchy: In one place it said he had a fracture and in the other it said he had a ruptured disk and two incisions in his back. The spinal column is composed of virtabrae, you can consider it a tripod with a vertebral body in the front and the facet joints in the back. They are stacked one above another, between them is the disk. A fracture can occur anywhere in the bone, in the front it is called a compression fracture (occurs from something like a hard landing in a helicopter). This would cause bone fragments to fragment into the nerves in the spinal canal, hence the compression causing nerve damage. This would cause loss of bladder and bowel movements, weakness in the legs and loss of sexual function... Apparently he was playing with it last year so it could not be the severe type, but a milder telescoping of the vetebral body without fragments. This could be treated conservatively or with a fusion (replacing entire bone and secure it with metal). This would take roughly six months for a average person to feel normal. This is usually accompanied by a posterior operation where they also put metal in the back. This is called a 360 degree fusion.If he has an associated disk rupture, then they would clean out the disk during the operation. The problem is that vertebrae fused to the one above and below it which can create limited movement. But not as much as you would think. The problem is the disk space above and below have to cause more of the motion and may be more prone to rupture. This is assuming he had this done. Once the fusion takes, he could play again but will always be susceptible to further injury.

 

Depending on the degree of the compression and how well the surgery went, he could play again after the offseason. This is assuming he had this done. If he just had a ruptured disk, he could come back in 3 months.

 

Not knowing all the facts, there is no way to be sure. But it is possible.

 

 

 

[BRAWNDO]

I asked my dad who is a neurosurgeon (and got me into the bills) for this question and he said: The facts are sketchy: In one place it said he had a fracture and in the other it said he had a ruptured disk and two incisions in his back. The spinal column is composed of virtabrae, you can consider it a tripod with a vertebral body in the front and the facet joints in the back. They are stacked one above another, between them is the disk. A fracture can occur anywhere in the bone, in the front it is called a compression fracture (occurs from something like a hard landing in a helicopter). This would cause bone fragments to fragment into the nerves in the spinal canal, hence the compression causing nerve damage. This would cause loss of bladder and bowel movements, weakness in the legs and loss of sexual function... Apparently he was playing with it last year so it could not be the severe type, but a milder telescoping of the vetebral body without fragments. This could be treated conservatively or with a fusion (replacing entire bone and secure it with metal). This would take roughly six months for a average person to feel normal. This is usually accompanied by a posterior operation where they also put metal in the back. This is called a 360 degree fusion.If he has an associated disk rupture, then they would clean out the disk during the operation. The problem is that vertebrae fused to the one above and below it which can create limited movement. But not as much as you would think. The problem is the disk space above and below have to cause more of the motion and may be more prone to rupture. This is assuming he had this done. Once the fusion takes, he could play again but will always be susceptible to further injury.

 

Depending on the degree of the compression and how well the surgery went, he could play again after the offseason. This is assuming he had this done. If he just had a ruptured disk, he could come back in 3 months.

 

Not knowing all the facts, there is no way to be sure. But it is possible.

 

Your Dad is a smart man, a Bills Fan and a neurosurgeon.

[vincec]

I asked my dad who is a neurosurgeon (and got me into the bills) for this question and he said: The facts are sketchy: In one place it said he had a fracture and in the other it said he had a ruptured disk and two incisions in his back. The spinal column is composed of virtabrae, you can consider it a tripod with a vertebral body in the front and the facet joints in the back. They are stacked one above another, between them is the disk. A fracture can occur anywhere in the bone, in the front it is called a compression fracture (occurs from something like a hard landing in a helicopter). This would cause bone fragments to fragment into the nerves in the spinal canal, hence the compression causing nerve damage. This would cause loss of bladder and bowel movements, weakness in the legs and loss of sexual function... Apparently he was playing with it last year so it could not be the severe type, but a milder telescoping of the vetebral body without fragments. This could be treated conservatively or with a fusion (replacing entire bone and secure it with metal). This would take roughly six months for a average person to feel normal. This is usually accompanied by a posterior operation where they also put metal in the back. This is called a 360 degree fusion.If he has an associated disk rupture, then they would clean out the disk during the operation. The problem is that vertebrae fused to the one above and below it which can create limited movement. But not as much as you would think. The problem is the disk space above and below have to cause more of the motion and may be more prone to rupture. This is assuming he had this done. Once the fusion takes, he could play again but will always be susceptible to further injury.

 

Depending on the degree of the compression and how well the surgery went, he could play again after the offseason. This is assuming he had this done. If he just had a ruptured disk, he could come back in 3 months.

 

Not knowing all the facts, there is no way to be sure. But it is possible.

Here are some additional facts:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7346254/buffalo-bills-dl-torell-troup-surgery-minor-spine-fracture

 

 

"Buffalo Bills defensive lineman Torell Troup will have back surgery this week to repair what he called "a minor fracture" in his spine.

 

In revealing then nature of the injury for the first time since being placed on injured reserve two weeks ago, Troup told The Associated Press on Monday that he should be fully recovered in about three months. That's a timetable that will allow him to be ready for the start of spring minicamps.

 

The second-year player added the operation will also address a pre-existing back problem that's bothered him since the start of training camp."

 

I'm no neurosurgeon, but I don't know how many "minor" fractures there can be of your spine, especially when you are 300+ lbs and must slam into other 300+ lb men for a living.

Edited May 26, 2012 by vincec

[Buffalo Barbarian]

B-U-S-T...Probably Nix' worst high draft pick to date...Nix first draft was not very good IMO. Spiller was not a necessary pick and everyone knew Troup was a reach.

This guy is no different than John McCargo (who also had back problems) and who inexplicably stayed on the roster for years and years and never contributed anything.

This guy has become insignificant-The D-Line appears to have been effectively overhauled. Bills can dump this guy if he doesnt show anything during camp/pre-season and it wont matter.

He has a career grand total of 17 tackles, zero sacks.

+1

[Cheddar's Dad]

B-U-S-T...Probably Nix' worst high draft pick to date...Nix first draft was not very good IMO. Spiller was not a necessary pick and everyone knew Troup was a reach.

This guy is no different than John McCargo (who also had back problems) and who inexplicably stayed on the roster for years and years and never contributed anything.

This guy has become insignificant-The D-Line appears to have been effectively overhauled. Bills can dump this guy if he doesnt show anything during camp/pre-season and it wont matter.

He has a career grand total of 17 tackles, zero sacks.

 

Can someone explain why Troup gets all of the hate and Marcus Easley gets all the love? Both have been injured or have had health problems. Too many at this site jump too quickly into ill conceived judgments. Both of these players, if healthy, have a chance to show some eggheads here that they're eggheads. It's summer; a time for positive thinking.

[Rubes]

The problem with Troup is not "can they fix him," but rather, "can they fix him well enough to allow his back to continue enduring the extreme force and pressure that someone in the trenches will constantly face?"

 

I don't know for sure, of course, but I'd say the odds are squarely against it. Even if he does make it back (ahem), the question will always be, "okay, but for how long?"

 

It's a little bit like the Peyton Manning situation -- sure, his neck can be fixed to the point where he can throw a nice ball again, but how well and how long will it hold up to the equivalent of Marcell Dareus blindsiding him or falling on top of him a few times every week?

[CSBill]

Buddy Nix is the teflon man. The 2010 draft was the Bills worst in the last 5 years. Buddy was the GM, but it's not his fault? Let me guess, it's Ralph Wilson's fault.

 

That I agree with, there is still little contribution from this draft (spiller is more hope than production, yet) . . . he has done well elsewhere, but not in this draft. Nonetheless, I hope Troup gets back, he is hard worker, and I think, when healthy, he can contribute.

Edited May 26, 2012 by CSBill

[MDH]

I think Spiller was a good pick, and the right pick as he is a different type of back than we had, and we had 2 of the same on the roster.

 

Spiller was a horrible pick. Fred Jackson was the best player on the roster the year before Spiller was drafted. There was absolutely no need to use a top 10 pick on a running back when the best player on your team is a running back. Sure the Bills needed another back but you don't spend a top 10 pick to shore up depth.

 

Nix has done a good job since then but that was not a shining moment for him.

[DrDawkinstein]

Spiller was a horrible pick. Fred Jackson was the best player on the roster the year before Spiller was drafted. There was absolutely no need to use a top 10 pick on a running back when the best player on your team is a running back. Sure the Bills needed another back but you don't spend a top 10 pick to shore up depth.

 

Nix has done a good job since then but that was not a shining moment for him.

 

Even given the power of hindsight, there wasnt a better talent on the board. The only one people can make an argument for is Bulaga, but he would've been a risk and a reach at #9.

 

We had 2 bruiser backs (Jackson and Lynch), and no speed. Buddy and Chan were coming into a complete rebuild of a team that was lacking talent, so they went BPA with their first pick. No one besides some fans had any clue what Jackson was all about, and the fans have been wrong before in their hometown favorites.

 

If there was an obvious franchise LT, QB, or DE that we passed on, then I'd agree it was a bad pick. But we got the best guy on the board at the time.

 

I dont think our feelings are that far apart. Im just giving Nix the benefit of the doubt considering what he had just taken on. It definitely isnt a draft to put at the top of your resume, but Spiller was an understandable pick. It's on Gailey to get him more involved.

[BillsVet]

Can someone explain why Troup gets all of the hate and Marcus Easley gets all the love? Both have been injured or have had health problems. Too many at this site jump too quickly into ill conceived judgments. Both of these players, if healthy, have a chance to show some eggheads here that they're eggheads. It's summer; a time for positive thinking.

 

Because 2nd round picks aren't supposed to enter their third season in the NFL as backups. Easley is a 4th rounder and thus a lesser resource was used on the him, not to mention he's shiny and new not having taken a snap in a regular season game.

 

Even if Troup returns 100% in 2012, he'll be nothing more than a rotational player behind K. Williams and Dareus. And then there's Heard and a few others who'll be challenging him for time, which could put his roster spot in jeopardy.

[Cheddar's Dad]

Spiller was a horrible pick. Fred Jackson was the best player on the roster the year before Spiller was drafted. There was absolutely no need to use a top 10 pick on a running back when the best player on your team is a running back. Sure the Bills needed another back but you don't spend a top 10 pick to shore up depth.

 

Nix has done a good job since then but that was not a shining moment for him.

 

My guess is that, one year from now, all of these "Spiller was a horrible pick" guys will be hiding in a closet vowing to, never again, make a WAG in a public forum.

[mrags]

Spiller was a horrible pick. Fred Jackson was the best player on the roster the year before Spiller was drafted. There was absolutely no need to use a top 10 pick on a running back when the best player on your team is a running back. Sure the Bills needed another back but you don't spend a top 10 pick to shore up depth.

 

Nix has done a good job since then but that was not a shining moment for him.

The year before CJ was drafted we had Fred and Thug Lynch splitting time. Many here thought Fred was the real deal and I'm sure so did many of the Bills FO, Coaches and players but to think theyvwere anything but splitting time is just a rediculous statement. They drafted Spiller because they knew they would be getting rid of Lynch and because they needed another back. A back that is versitle and can twist defenders ankles on any given play. Not run them over. They knew that Freddy was old and the majority of RBs in rhe NFL never make it into thier 30s. Freddy is defying NFL standards. Regardless of how many people come out and say "well he's only got a few years of NFL wear and tear" it means nothing. Freddy wasn't relaxing in his couch for years before the Bills, he was fighting his way into the league. Hs was the MVP of his teams in NFL Europe and indoor leagues. You don't become a successful NFL running back being some pine rider in other leagues. You do more work than anyone else. You are involved more than anyone else. You probably get more mileage or just as much Mileage doing what he did. To think he has leas mileage is a joke. Besides all that, it doesn't matter. It's not a suprise that when people hit thier 30s their athletic games decline. How many 30+ year olds do you think are in the olympics every 4 years? Not many and the ones that are usually aren't running the 100m dash. There's a reason for that, your physical game isn't what it used to be. CJ is the RB of the future of this team. Starting this season or next he will be used more and more. The guy had Almost as many ypc as Freddy did last year and when he was in he did it with scrubs on the line and guys playing out of place. Levitre at C or LT, Backups at RG and LG.

 

I've come to the realization that anyone that thinks CJ wasn't the right pick must be one of 2 people.

1: they think RBs should NEVER, EVER be taken in the 1st round.

2: they are Lynch lovers and refuse to give up on a guy that was 1 traffic ticket away from being suspended for a single season.

[Cheddar's Dad]

1.Because 2nd round picks aren't supposed to enter their third season in the NFL as backups. Easley is a 4th rounder and thus a lesser resource was used on the him, not to mention he's shiny and new not having taken a snap in a regular season game.

 

2. Even if Troup returns 100% in 2012, he'll be nothing more than a rotational player behind K. Williams and Dareus. And then there's Heard and a few others who'll be challenging him for time, which could put his roster spot in jeopardy.

 

1. You're criticizing him for not starting due to injury? Failing as a starter due to lack of talent is a little different than not playing due to injury but you appear to view Troup as someone lacking talent.

 

2. He returns to the team as a backup behind two potential all pros and you think that's a bad thing. You just won't give this player a chance will you?

[DrDawkinstein]

I've come to the realization that anyone that thinks CJ wasn't the right pick must be one of 2 people.

1: they think RBs should NEVER, EVER be taken in the 1st round.

2: they are Lynch lovers and refuse to give up on a guy that was 1 traffic ticket away from being suspended for a single season.

 

You forgot:

 

2: they think everyone in the NFL but Buddy knew that Fred Jackson could be a starter who plays every down and will never get injured.

[mrags]

You forgot:

 

2: they think everyone in the NFL but Buddy knew that Fred Jackson could be a starter who plays every down and will never get injured.

Ya. I thought the age and wear and tear portion of my post covered that part but ya. There's of course many other thoughts as well. I just didn't think I needed to mention them all. Just my 2 big thoughts.

[Ramius]

WE'RE GOING TO MISS HIM!

 

Great phrase in leadership when someone just cannot get it done. I'm sure he's a nice guy, but we need someone to plug up the middle and create puch on the pocket.

 

I never thought he was a good fit. Given we could have had Gronkowski, or Clay Matthews, i'd say we missed on that one.

 

So the Bills should have taken Matthews at 41 and missed even though he was drafted at 26 by GB?

[San Jose Bills Fan]

WE'RE GOING TO MISS HIM!

 

Great phrase in leadership when someone just cannot get it done. I'm sure he's a nice guy, but we need someone to plug up the middle and create puch on the pocket.

 

I never thought he was a good fit. Given we could have had Gronkowski, or Clay Matthews, i'd say we missed on that one.

You have your players/years mixed up.

 

Not saying Troup was a good pick because he certainly was a head-scratcher at the time and has done nothing since being selected but again, some teams had Gronk off their boards due to (ironically) medical concerns about his back.

 

My guess is that, one year from now, all of these "Spiller was a horrible pick" guys will be hiding in a closet vowing to, never again, make a WAG in a public forum.

I agree. With what Spiller showed in the second half of last season (in a broken-down offense no less) it's obvious to me anyways that he's become the player the Bills thought he was… a player who easily justifies his selection.

 

The only first rounders taken after Spiller who are showing they are possibly better picks are JPP and Pouncey… but the Bills didn't need Pouncey and most teams didn't view JPP as a can't-miss prospect.

 

Critics of the Spiller pick have been evaporating over the last few months and I think will virtually vanish by the end of this season. In other words, I think he will shut up his critics.