Nix or Polian ?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Well I'll tell ya. Since both you and I are "fans".Also, since we have zero inside knowledge of the Colts organization (or any for that matter) other than interweb hearsay. I have told my assistant to get a hold of Isray and Polian I want to debrief them, and will get back to you pronto. I'm sure their explanations along with the coaches will share some light as opposed to a moron saying the GM (and the GM only) left a NFL powerhouse franchise rot after their HOF Q-back went down.

 

Wow, what kindly illumnination shared with a fellow "fan"! Why is the "fan" in quotes, by the way? Do you feel like a better man having crafted this groovy response? You really showed me! Calling me a moron really clinched the argument, too! I guess you were too busy clambering onto your high horse to have time to address the points raised. Maybe you could have your personal assistant give you a little personal lift next time.

 

The buck stops with the GM - he is the one charged with ensuring that the cupboard is not bare of talent. I don't think it takes insider knowledge. If the team is great, the GM gets the credit.

If the team lacks talent, who else but the GM gets the blame? He is the one hiring and firing the scouts and director of player personnel.

 

The point everyone in the NFL could see last year, isn't that the team rotted after the QB went down, the point is that the QB going down revealed the rot - the total lack of talent everywhere else on the team, from the backup QB to the running game to the D. The lack of "plan B" for an older QB returning from neck surgery simply iced the cake.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

He may not want it, especially at his age. He has absolutely nothing to prove.

 

But since you want to play speculation, let's say all the GM jobs suddenly become available, and both Bill & Buddy want to be a GM. IMO Buddy will have one opportunity, and that is here in Buffalo, while Bill would have several. That's not a Buddy slam either, it just is what it is, Polian has accomplished what Nix has not.

Actually I don't want to play speculation.

 

I said essentially that we'll know next year at this time how hot a property he is… provided as you say, he still wants to be an NFL GM.

 

If his goal is to continue to work in the media, we might never know how highly regarded he is… unless he is made an offer and refuses it.

 

 

 

edit: I'll be truthful and re-state my position on Polian as this seems a good time.

 

The fact that the Colts were left in shambles and that the only thing standing between them and being a horrible team was a Hall of Fame quarterback certainly takes some of the luster of his career as far as I'm concerned.

 

I think his performance over the last 5 years or so which coincided somewhat with his standing down from some duties and his son Chris assuming them, has tarnished his legacy.

 

JMO.

[thewildrabbit]

What utter BS about rot! ...the difference between the 2-14 Colts and the 10-6 Colts was entirely all on their QB, the team was built around Peyton Manning pure and simple. Without him they stunk because they had no adequate backup QB. The Colts with Manning behind center was a quick strike, high powered passing offense geared around one single player, they had no strong running game to support a back up or rookie QB. The Colt defense was designed to play with the lead. Once the Colts got the lead that smallish quick defense could pin their ears back and rush the heck outta opposing passer. (So that Colt defense could never stop the run very well or play well from behind). Which is the formula that kept them in 12+ years of winning seasons, 2x SB's and one SB win.

 

That 2011 Colt team had the same O line, WR's, same TE, same defense and basically the exact same players from 2010, the only real difference was the QB. So Manning injures his neck and the team fell apart. ...Manning wasn't just the QB, he called his own plays and ran that entire offense. The Colts longtime OC Tom Moore had just retired the previous year in 2010, and Manning was really the only QB who knew how to run that offense without Moore. I just can't emphasize enough how much that offense was dependent on Manning.

 

What the owner of that team realized is the entire offense was in one players hands, and decided to change things. Its probably why he let Manning leave the Colts and why the coaching staff was also fired and replaced, not just the GM and president.

 

 

 

So if Bill Polian is such a tool because he didn't have a viable backup QB. Then so is the current president of the Denver Broncos in John Elway. When asked if the Broncos had a plan B. Elway said there is no plan B, only Peyton Manning. Gailey went into last year with Tyler Thigpin as backup, then when Fitz got hurt he didn't use him.

 

 

Its OK Bills fans, to compare a legend at GM / president to a guy that still has never had a winning season as GM. Its that Buffalo Bills eternal optimism ...never lose it!

 

 

.

Edited May 17, 2012 by Fear the Beard

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Oh no! The Bills now have a budding "starting GM" controversy that threatens to rip the team apart!

 

(where's that sarcasm font?)

Well there is this

[bananathumb]

Leo Roth knows little about football.

[dpberr]

All things being equal, I'd take Nix over Polian. I think Nix's strategy can adapt to changing circumstances better and I believe he's superior in drafting players and setting the team up for long term success. I've always appreciated the logic behind his drafting. With Polian, his strategy, whether in Buffalo or Indianapolis, entirely revolved around having a blue chip quarterback, which you're not always going to have or get.

[DrDawkinstein]

I think a lot of folks are confusing two very different questions here.

 

The question from the OP and the article was along the lines of "Which would you rather have now, from this point forward?"

 

Not "Who has had the better career with the Bills/as an NFL GM?"

 

For those jumping at Polian, you're talking about starting over again with the FO and team. A whole new rebuild.

 

Lets not forget that the Bills went 4-12 and 7-8 in Polian's first 2 seasons with the Bills as well.

 

Polian did a great job here... 25 years ago. As for right here, right now, I'll keep Nix and Whaley. Especially Whaley, he is the future of this team. Im not about to throw that out so we can get the warm-fuzzies trying to relive the past.

[mrags]

He may not want it, especially at his age. He has absolutely nothing to prove.

 

But since you want to play speculation, let's say all the GM jobs suddenly become available, and both Bill & Buddy want to be a GM. IMO Buddy will have one opportunity, and that is here in Buffalo, while Bill would have several. That's not a Buddy slam either, it just is what it is, Polian has accomplished what Nix has not.

Well I agree that if all the GM positions were opened up that Polian would have more offers than Buddy, if you think Buddy would only have "one opportunity" you are fukkin high. Where do you get your weed?

[Fan in Chicago]

I just can't emphasize enough how much that offense was dependent on Manning.

 

What the owner of that team realized is the entire offense was in one players hands, and decided to change things. Its probably why he let Manning leave the Colts and why the coaching staff was also fired and replaced, not just the GM and president.

 

So if Bill Polian is such a tool because he didn't have a viable backup QB. Then so is the current president of the Denver Broncos in John Elway. When asked if the Broncos had a plan B. Elway said there is no plan B, only Peyton Manning. Gailey went into last year with Tyler Thigpin as backup, then when Fitz got hurt he didn't use him.

 

 

Its OK Bills fans, to compare a legend at GM / president to a guy that still has never had a winning season as GM. Its that Buffalo Bills eternal optimism ...never lose it!

 

 

.

 

Do you see the discrepancy of your own logic ? You correctly state that this team depended more on one player than probably any other team in the league. Putting all your eggs in one basket is not a strategy that teams or businesses do these days. The responsibility of team building was on Polian so he has to take the fall for it. I do not entirely absolve the Colts ownership either because they would have been too dumb to not see this roster deficiencies.

[Rico]

Well I agree that if all the GM positions were opened up that Polian would have more offers than Buddy, if you think Buddy would only have "one opportunity" you are fukkin high. Where do you get your weed?

Dude's OLD in a young man's league, and his teams for his first 2 seasons as GM have been bottom-line mediocre at best. It would take a very unique situation for him to be a GM, and that situation is here in Buffalo. As a scout, he would have a lot more offers.... it just is what it is.

[Fan in Chicago]

 

The question from the OP and the article was along the lines of "Which would you rather have now, from this point forward?"

 

Not "Who has had the better career with the Bills/as an NFL GM?"

 

Polian did a great job here... 25 years ago. As for right here, right now, I'll keep Nix and Whaley. Especially Whaley, he is the future of this team. Im not about to throw that out so we can get the warm-fuzzies trying to relive the past.

DrD - thanks for correctly interpreting my question. My goal was not to tarnish Polian's legacy with the Bills. Arguably he made the then sad sack franchise relevant again. But since his departure from the Bills, his record has been spotty overall save for one blockbuster pick. Perhaps he never changed his strategy as the league around him changed with FA and what not. Maybe he just got lazy. No way to know what happened, but his recent record has been less than stellar which is why my vote goes to Nix and Whaley

[Lurker]

I think a lot of folks are confusing two very different questions here.

Not surprising. That's par for the course around here...

[BuffBill]

Dude's OLD in a young man's league, and his teams for his first 2 seasons as GM have been bottom-line mediocre at best. It would take a very unique situation for him to be a GM, and that situation is here in Buffalo. As a scout, he would have a lot more offers.... it just is what it is.

Very true, while I like what Nix has done this off-season, his first couple here were mediocre at best. Polian seems like he has been around forever, yet he is still younger then Nix who just finally got his big break? This topic is all speculation spurred on by boredom, because I don't think the Bills would ask him to come back and even if they did I don't think he would come and work for Ralph again.

[DrDawkinstein]

What utter BS about rot! ...the difference between the 2-14 Colts and the 10-6 Colts was entirely all on their QB, the team was built around Peyton Manning pure and simple. Without him they stunk because they had no adequate backup QB.

 

How do you not see your own contradiction?!?

 

First you say the talk about rot is BS. But then go on to say that the entire team depended on ONE player, who has been on the roster for 14 years. The issue is that they did NOT build around him, they just counted on one player. THAT IS ROT.

 

It has nothing to do with whether there was a competent backup. It's about the fact that there was no other talent to step up and balance out the loss of 1 single player.

[mrags]

Dude's OLD in a young man's league, and his teams for his first 2 seasons as GM have been bottom-line mediocre at best. It would take a very unique situation for him to be a GM, and that situation is here in Buffalo. As a scout, he would have a lot more offers.... it just is what it is.

I don't dissagree with a thing you say but to think he would only have "one offer" is crazy. He has shown the league he can pick talent from college. Which is something you agree with. He would have more offers than just our is all I'm saying. Unfortunately there is no way to tell this so I guess since he's only the GM of the Buffalo Bills that must prove your point. Unfortunately for your argument, Bills Polian is out of the job right now so what does that say? Sure, he could say he didn't want anofher GM job or he wanted to take some time off, or maybe he really wants to be an anylist. Could all be true. Or, he didn't have any significant offers. I'd be willing to bet that if he was offered a Brinks truck full of cash he'd take it. But he wasn't now was he. We can always find out next year too. But fo say Nix is just too "old" and wouldn't get any offers, Polian is only 3 years behind and is coming off what is a miserable departure from his 2-14 team.

[DrDawkinstein]

Dude's OLD in a young man's league, and his teams for his first 2 seasons as GM have been bottom-line mediocre at best. It would take a very unique situation for him to be a GM, and that situation is here in Buffalo. As a scout, he would have a lot more offers.... it just is what it is.

 

Buddy Nix is 72. Bill Polian is 69. Your statement about age is invalid.

 

Polian would probably have more offers than Nix, I would not argue with that. But the thought that he would only have 1 offer is ridiculous. The entire league has noticed what he is doing here in Buffalo, regardless of the team's record. He has changed the culture and made the franchise relevant again, and looks like he has stockpiled talent.

[Rico]

Buddy Nix is 72. Bill Polian is 69. Your statement about age is invalid.

 

Polian would probably have more offers than Nix, I would not argue with that. But the thought that he would only have 1 offer is ridiculous. The entire league has noticed what he is doing here in Buffalo, regardless of the team's record. He has changed the culture and made the franchise relevant again, and looks like he has stockpiled talent.

Disagree about the age statement, as Polian would be up against the same thing, most teams would have no interest in hiring anyone over 65 for such a demanding position. The difference is in the resume: Nix's is commendable, while Polian's is HOF-worthy.

 

And the entire league may take notice of what he has done AFTER this upcoming season IF the Bills make the playoffs, but I highly doubt anyone other than Ralph would hire him, especially with him being 72, based on what he has done to-date. Until then, it's just an interesting story that may have a happy ending.

Edited May 17, 2012 by Rico

[Best Player Available]

Wow, what kindly illumnination shared with a fellow "fan"! Why is the "fan" in quotes, by the way? Do you feel like a better man having crafted this groovy response? You really showed me! Calling me a moron really clinched the argument, too! I guess you were too busy clambering onto your high horse to have time to address the points raised. Maybe you could have your personal assistant give you a little personal lift next time.

 

The buck stops with the GM - he is the one charged with ensuring that the cupboard is not bare of talent. I don't think it takes insider knowledge. If the team is great, the GM gets the credit.

If the team lacks talent, who else but the GM gets the blame? He is the one hiring and firing the scouts and director of player personnel.

 

The point everyone in the NFL could see last year, isn't that the team rotted after the QB went down, the point is that the QB going down revealed the rot - the total lack of talent everywhere else on the team, from the backup QB to the running game to the D. The lack of "plan B" for an older QB returning from neck surgery simply iced the cake.

Read the entire thread. I did not call you a moron! It was in regards to another post. Peace and stay groovy man.

[DrDawkinstein]

Disagree about the age statement, as Polian would be up against the same thing, most teams would have no interest in hiring anyone over 65 for such a demanding position. The difference is in the resume: Nix's is commendable, while Polian's is HOF-worthy.

 

Oh, I agree that it's a young man's league. I just meant that age would not be the difference between Nix and Polian. Yes, of course Polian has the better resume, no one is arguing with that. I would hope that someone with 26 years of experience would have a better resume than someone with 2 years in a position. That's not the point of the thread or article. It's like arguing that Jim Kelly is a better QB than Sam Bradford. No kidding.

 

The points Im arguing are:

1. We are better off keeping our current FO than blowing it up just to re-hire Polian.

2. If all 32 positions are open, Nix would get more than 1 call as you originally stated.

[thewildrabbit]

Do you see the discrepancy of your own logic ? You correctly state that this team depended more on one player than probably any other team in the league. Putting all your eggs in one basket is not a strategy that teams or businesses do these days. The responsibility of team building was on Polian so he has to take the fall for it. I do not entirely absolve the Colts ownership either because they would have been too dumb to not see this roster deficiencies.

I see no discrepancy! Polian is brilliant in my view, he set the team up to get that #1 overall pick now that Manning was injured an on his way out.

 

The owner of the Colts is a tweeting to all his fans idiot from what I read. 12+ years of winning and a Super bowl championship apparently isn't good enough for him. One bad season out of 12 and he crap cans the entire regime. OK so now he hires a new GM and that GM hires a new coaching staff.

 

Irsay is so full of himself he forgets what that team was like before Bill Polain, and how many losing seasons with bad GM's and bad coaches he went thru before he hired Polian. Hiring a new GM & HC doesn't necessarily mean he will build a winning team, even with that #1 overall QB.

 

You homers are so smitten by the Mario signing you can't see the forest for the trees. Bill Polian is a proven winner every darn place he has been the GM / president!!

 

4 trips to the SB with one of the historically worst franchises in the NFL....In TWO seasons he builds an expansion team from nothing into a team that goes to the NFC championship game....Takes the Colts to 12+ years of division wins, 2 SB appearances and one SB win.

 

 

And yet, most of you would rather have a man that has never had a single winning season as a GM. Like I said, that Buffalo Bills fans eternal optimism...never lose it

Edited May 18, 2012 by Fear the Beard