VirginiaMike Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 In talking about Vince Young, here's a quote from the News on back-up QBs currently available: "The list of veteran free-agent quarterbacks still on the market is thin. Some of the QBs available beside Young include: ex-Steeler Dennis Dixon, 27; ex-Redskin John Beck, 31; ex-Charger Billy Volek, 36; ex-Ram A.J. Feeley, 35; and ex-Jaguar Luke McCown, 31". Given that group, I understand why we worked out Vince Young when I at first did not see it. This group is really sad. Tyler Thigpen, who is well down any list of QBs, fits right in with this group. We need to find a back-up and I don't see anyone in this group providing a solid choice. We may need to wait until training camp cuts to find someone.
Cash Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 Like a bunch of people here, I'd rather see Dixon brought in for a workout than Young. Young's attitude has been so toxic the last few years, and it doesn't seem to me like he's ready to turn it around yet. I don't think Andy Reid helped matters any by telling Young that he wasn't being brought back because Young is a starting-caliber QB and should be starting somewhere. I also can't believe Young bought that line. That's like breaking up with someone because they're too good in bed. Anyway, Dixon looked fairly decent in the few emergency starts he got for the Steelers a couple years ago, and I like the fact that he's coming from one of the best and most stable organizations/environments. Plus, a move from third string to second is a step up for him, so it's less likely he'd pout as the backup than some of the other candidates. And at 27, Dixon's best football should be ahead of him.
apuszczalowski Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 Like a bunch of people here, I'd rather see Dixon brought in for a workout than Young. Young's attitude has been so toxic the last few years, and it doesn't seem to me like he's ready to turn it around yet. I don't think Andy Reid helped matters any by telling Young that he wasn't being brought back because Young is a starting-caliber QB and should be starting somewhere. I also can't believe Young bought that line. That's like breaking up with someone because they're too good in bed. Anyway, Dixon looked fairly decent in the few emergency starts he got for the Steelers a couple years ago, and I like the fact that he's coming from one of the best and most stable organizations/environments. Plus, a move from third string to second is a step up for him, so it's less likely he'd pout as the backup than some of the other candidates. And at 27, Dixon's best football should be ahead of him. And maybe the reason why he hasn't been picked up by anyone yet is because he has let teams know he wants a chance to start? He is 27 and was never given a chance to be a starter in Pittsburgh, going somewhere else with the chance to only be the backup is a lateral move for him. He could always go to Cleveland where he would be the youngster behind their new rookie QB
Cash Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 And maybe the reason why he hasn't been picked up by anyone yet is because he has let teams know he wants a chance to start? He is 27 and was never given a chance to be a starter in Pittsburgh, going somewhere else with the chance to only be the backup is a lateral move for him. He could always go to Cleveland where he would be the youngster behind their new rookie QB Certainly his agent may have let teams know that he wants an opportunity to compete for a starting job, but if he can't get that opportunity, being the #2 guy somewhere else is definitely a step up, not a lateral move. As the #2 guy, you're 1 hit away from playing, and if you play well enough, you'll wind up starting one way or another. As the #3 guy, which he's been for most of his career, you're not even really active on game days (until last year, when he was probably outright inactive on most game days), and if the starter goes down, there's a chance the team signs another QB with starting experience who leapfrogs you on the depth chart. There's a reason Drew Stanton got upset and requested a trade after the Jets brought in Tebow. The #2 job is a lot better than the #3 job.
apuszczalowski Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 Certainly his agent may have let teams know that he wants an opportunity to compete for a starting job, but if he can't get that opportunity, being the #2 guy somewhere else is definitely a step up, not a lateral move. As the #2 guy, you're 1 hit away from playing, and if you play well enough, you'll wind up starting one way or another. As the #3 guy, which he's been for most of his career, you're not even really active on game days (until last year, when he was probably outright inactive on most game days), and if the starter goes down, there's a chance the team signs another QB with starting experience who leapfrogs you on the depth chart. There's a reason Drew Stanton got upset and requested a trade after the Jets brought in Tebow. The #2 job is a lot better than the #3 job. Drew Stanton signed knowing he would be the #2 and then right after they traded for Tebow and bumped him down to the #3. He wa upset because he may have had a chance to be a #2 somewhere else and thats why he came to the Jets. Theres still plenty of offseason left, and Dixon may still sign on as a backup, but if he believes he can be a starter, it will probably be with a team thats still looking for their #1 guy, or an older vet starting and the team will give him a chance to try out for the #1 job in training camp. He is less likely to sign on somewhere where a team has already said they are only looking for a backup QB and that QB will be competing for the backup job only.
Billsrhody Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 Vince Young has the most upside of everyone on that list... unfortunately he has the most downside as well
Turbosrrgood Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 (edited) In talking about Vince Young, here's a quote from the News on back-up QBs currently available: "The list of veteran free-agent quarterbacks still on the market is thin. Some of the QBs available beside Young include: ex-Steeler Dennis Dixon, 27; ex-Redskin John Beck, 31; ex-Charger Billy Volek, 36; ex-Ram A.J. Feeley, 35; and ex-Jaguar Luke McCown, 31". Given that group, I understand why we worked out Vince Young when I at first did not see it. This group is really sad. Tyler Thigpen, who is well down any list of QBs, fits right in with this group. We need to find a back-up and I don't see anyone in this group providing a solid choice. We may need to wait until training camp cuts to find someone. I'd take Dixon over Young...You know what you are getting in young, an athletic head case who almost certainly can't handle starting in the NFL . Dixon showed some potential in limited time, obviously he is more of an unknown. Hopefully Corp surprises in training camp, although that's wishful thinking... Personally I have always thought that the NFL "backup" QB is a futile position...For most teams, if your starter goes down you are screwed. What you really want out of a "backup" is a guy that can challenge for the starting job in the future, if your starter craps out or gets old (like Brady, and Rogers did). Of the guy's on that list I'm not sure any fit that role. I'm sure someone will bring up Reich getting the Bills to the SB, among others. Sure, backups will win on occasion, but it's hard enough to win with "starters", most often backups will have no chance to "save a season". Edited May 3, 2012 by Turbosrrgood
billsfan89 Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 I actually don't mind Thigpen as our backup. In all honesty your backup isn't suppose to be good, he is suppose to be a guy who can be good enough for a 2-4 game stretch to keep your team afloat. Thigpen is also a guy who had success under Gaily and his system in KC. He is also a guy that won't challenge Fitz for his job at all. Young might seem better on paper but he seems like a bad fit for our locker room.
RyanC883 Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 (edited) Like a bunch of people here, I'd rather see Dixon brought in for a workout than Young. Young's attitude has been so toxic the last few years, and it doesn't seem to me like he's ready to turn it around yet. I don't think Andy Reid helped matters any by telling Young that he wasn't being brought back because Young is a starting-caliber QB and should be starting somewhere. I also can't believe Young bought that line. That's like breaking up with someone because they're too good in bed. Anyway, Dixon looked fairly decent in the few emergency starts he got for the Steelers a couple years ago, and I like the fact that he's coming from one of the best and most stable organizations/environments. Plus, a move from third string to second is a step up for him, so it's less likely he'd pout as the backup than some of the other candidates. And at 27, Dixon's best football should be ahead of him. I would agree 100%. I'd take Dixon over Young...You know what you are getting in young, an athletic head case who almost certainly can't handle starting in the NFL . Dixon showed some potential in limited time, obviously he is more of an unknown. Hopefully Corp surprises in training camp, although that's wishful thinking... Personally I have always thought that the NFL "backup" QB is a futile position...For most teams, if your starter goes down you are screwed. What you really want out of a "backup" is a guy that can challenge for the starting job in the future, if your starter craps out or gets old (like Brady, and Rogers did). Of the guy's on that list I'm not sure any fit that role. I'm sure someone will bring up Reich getting the Bills to the SB, among others. Sure, backups will win on occasion, but it's hard enough to win with "starters", most often backups will have no chance to "save a season". I believe we lost to a "backup" QB in Super Bowl 25! Backups should be able to step in and take over. The Steelers have 2 good backups. They should not cost you the game and allow you to run your offense at nearly the same pace as before (aka: be good "game managers"). Thigpen would cost us games. There is also the chance that we get Grossman or Colt McCoy or another QB who requests a trade given what happened in the draft. Heck, if I were Cousins I'd already be requesting a trade. Edited May 3, 2012 by RyanC883
reddogblitz Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 I'm sure someone will bring up Reich getting the Bills to the SB, among others. Sure, backups will win on occasion, but it's hard enough to win with "starters", most often backups will have no chance to "save a season". The others that come to mind for me are Earl Morrall, Jeff Hostettler, and Kurt Warner.
ALLEN1QB Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 Vince Young has the most upside of everyone on that list... unfortunately he has the most downside as well +1
Dragonborn10 Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 Vince Young has the most upside of everyone on that list... unfortunately he has the most downside as well Well said...maybe in this smaller environment where the locker room atmosphere seems to be good he could flourish. Guys like SuperMario and Barnett could be good mentors for him.
VirginiaMike Posted May 3, 2012 Author Posted May 3, 2012 I actually don't mind Thigpen as our backup. In all honesty your backup isn't suppose to be good, he is suppose to be a guy who can be good enough for a 2-4 game stretch to keep your team afloat. Thigpen is also a guy who had success under Gaily and his system in KC. He is also a guy that won't challenge Fitz for his job at all. Young might seem better on paper but he seems like a bad fit for our locker room. I'm not sure I understand "success under Gailey" comment. If I have the details right, Thigpen was 1-10 as a starter at KC -- does not sound very successful to me.
Solomon Grundy Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 Here we go with the "toxic" in the locker room excuse. T.O. was another problem child according to reports but ended up being a model teammate. VY is a winning QB in the league and it would behoove the Bills not to consider him.
Never NEVER Give-up Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 Like a bunch of people here, I'd rather see Dixon brought in for a workout than Young. Young's attitude has been so toxic the last few years, and it doesn't seem to me like he's ready to turn it around yet. I don't think Andy Reid helped matters any by telling Young that he wasn't being brought back because Young is a starting-caliber QB and should be starting somewhere. I also can't believe Young bought that line. That's like breaking up with someone because they're too good in bed. Anyway, Dixon looked fairly decent in the few emergency starts he got for the Steelers a couple years ago, and I like the fact that he's coming from one of the best and most stable organizations/environments. Plus, a move from third string to second is a step up for him, so it's less likely he'd pout as the backup than some of the other candidates. And at 27, Dixon's best football should be ahead of him. Agree - they should bring Dixon for a look see - he's more coachable than VY; and if VY could benefit from Chan's coaching (if he would listen), then Dixon would most certainly benefit from the experience.
Cash Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 Here we go with the "toxic" in the locker room excuse. T.O. was another problem child according to reports but ended up being a model teammate. VY is a winning QB in the league and it would behoove the Bills not to consider him. Disagree. I liked the TO move at the time and still in hindsight because 1.) T.O. had never been a problem in year 1 with any franchise. 2.) A lot of clowns like Skip Bayless blew T.O.'s look-at-me stuff way out of proportion because they are clowns. I didn't have a problem with TD celebrations then and I don't now. 3.) Even T.O.'s legit attitude problems weren't/aren't *that* bad. They basically stem from over-competitiveness (a good thing in the NFL) and overconfidence (sometimes a good thing in the NFL -- you have to be insanely confident to make it). Usually his sideline tantrums would boil down to T.O. being pissed that the offense stunk, and believing that if he got the ball more, they'd be able to move the ball and score some points. Which was probably true in most cases, but that doesn't mean he handled it well. 4.) On a 1-year deal for an incredibly boring team that stinks, there's no downside to signing T.O. The worst-case scenario is that you continue to stink, but in a less boring fashion, and part ways with him after the year. I don't think the 2012 Bills will stink OR be boring, and Vince Young provides little to no entertainment value. He's had some success in the NFL, but hasn't really gotten better since he was a rookie. That suggests that like T.O., he's very full of himself, but unlike T.O., his self-esteem doesn't correlate with reality. Now, if he "gets it," Vince Young could totally turn his career back around, because he certainly has the physical ability to be a good NFL starter. I doubt he will, but what do I know?
FreakPop Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 (edited) Vince Young has the most upside of everyone on that list... unfortunately he has the most downside as well I personally don't think VY has any upside left. Not to mention he has burned a lot of NFL bridges already. What you see is what your gonna get, and that isn't good enough for the Bills IMO. Where this team wants to go, it would not be a good idea to bring VY on board. Edited May 3, 2012 by FreakPop
Reed83HOF Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 Real quick before I read anymore; Hostettler and Reich were backups before FA and don't count - they had no way to leave. Once FA hit both of these players left to start for other teams...
Captain Hindsight Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 I dont understand everyones fascination with Dennis Dixon. He has one career start, One.
Best Player Available Posted May 3, 2012 Posted May 3, 2012 I'm not sure I understand "success under Gailey" comment. If I have the details right, Thigpen was 1-10 as a starter at KC -- does not sound very successful to me. The "success under Gailey" quote is something that is constantly regurgitated because some ESPN bozo said so 2 years ago, right before a commercial break. Thigpens career record of 1-11 as a starter and his pre-season Bills "performances" sure don't bring any support from anyone I'm aware of. Including the Bills. If success is gauged as being still able to walk upright in KC after going 1-10. Then yea he's a superstar.
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