looks like we have to cut kelsey

[Captain Hindsight]

Well Kelsay did nothing wrong here so I don't see how that applies.

Don't feed the troll

[dogma+]

What makes you think he won't start if he makes the team? Weirdly enough, if he isn't a salary cap casualty, he'll be a starter over Anderson I would guess.

 

Or I should ask, given your expertise in watching game film, what about Mark Anderson makes him that much more of a viable option than Kelsay to be a 3-down DE?

 

There's a logjam at RDE and it isn't in Kelsay's favor. We have Kelsay, Merriman, and Anderson competing for one spot. My guess would be that Kelsay (if he makes the team) will be on the field for only obvious running downs. If Anderson has a liability, it's in the run game but even that is much improved. Kelsay will be switching from LDE to RDE and we will be asking him to go against many team's best offensive linemen (their left tackle). Mark finished 2nd in voting for Defensive Rookie of the Year. He has been on 2 Championship teams. The guy knows what it's like to win. In comparing Mark's game to Chris, the first thing you notice is the speed. Anderson is worlds faster than Kelsay. He was the fastest DE in the 2006 draft. On paper, he's 2/10th's faster in the 40 than Kelsay but on the field it looks as if he's half a second faster. His lateral movement can not be compared to Kelsay because Kelsay is so flat flooted that he often looks as if he will fall over if needed to change direction on the fly. This is one of the reasons why he is so poor at reverses. The other reason is play recognition. Anderson gets to the QB not only with his upper body strength and speed, but also by reading the linemen and the backfield. That is key. Kelsay is often hesitant off the line, so as to not put all his chips into either the run or the pass. He plays it safe.

 

And that's not even delving into the role that Merriman will play.

 

I'll talk more about this when I release my Training Camp videocast. I go to Training Camp, video tape the practices and then analyze the film and draw out the plays so others who haven't done this before can see what we look at. It will be posted to YouTube a couple days after each practice.

 

Well Kelsay did nothing wrong here so I don't see how that applies.

 

In my opinion, the right thing to do would have been to give Mario the number. What is the opposite of "right"? (and I dont mean left )

 

Don't feed the troll

 

I'm a troll because my opinion differs from yours?

[Captain Hindsight]

There's a logjam at RDE and it isn't in Kelsay's favor. We have Kelsay, Merriman, and Anderson competing for one spot. My guess would be that Kelsay (if he makes the team) will be on the field for only obvious running downs. If Anderson has a liability, it's in the run game but even that is much improved. Kelsay will be switching from LDE to RDE and we will be asking him to go against many team's best offensive linemen (their left tackle). Mark finished 2nd in voting for Defensive Rookie of the Year. He has been on 2 Championship teams. The guy knows what it's like to win. In comparing Mark's game to Chris, the first thing you notice is the speed. Anderson is worlds faster than Kelsay. He was the fastest DE in the 2006 draft. On paper, he's 2/10th's faster in the 40 than Kelsay but on the field it looks as if he's half a second faster. His lateral movement can not be compared to Kelsay because Kelsay is so flat flooted that he often looks as if he will fall over if needed to change direction on the fly. This is one of the reasons why he is so poor at reverses. The other reason is play recognition. Anderson gets to the QB not only with his upper body strength and speed, but also by reading the linemen and the backfield. That is key. Kelsay is often hesitant off the line, so as to not put all his chips into either the run or the pass. He plays it safe.

 

And that's not even delving into the role that Merriman will play.

 

I'll talk more about this when I release my Training Camp videocast. I go to Training Camp, video tape the practices and then analyze the film and draw out the plays so others who haven't done this before can see what we look at. It will be posted to YouTube a couple days after each practice.

 

 

 

In my opinion, the right thing to do would have been to give Mario the number. What is the opposite of "right"? (and I dont mean left )

 

 

 

I'm a troll because my opinion differs from yours?

Crusade=troll

[valle7878]

About time that someone agrees with me mand does he need to retire or be cut.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

So a month ago we are praising Kelsay for helping get Mario in here now we think he should be cut because he wants to keep his number? Unreal!

What part did Kelsay play in the acquisition of Williams?

 

Is it possible you're pulling a Young/Vick mistake here?

 

Mark Anderson hasn't picked a new # either Maddog, but yeah, I too am wondering why all this has not been figured out by now....

It's coming to a head for sure. I'm sure NFL Properties and all parties would like to capitalize on the Williams signing by selling lots of his jerseys. Certainly we all expected to be able to purchase one by now.

 

I think that now that offseason workouts have begun and players are around the facility again that you'll see a decision soon.

 

I have an issue with the headline for the article: "Kelsay won't yield No. 90 to Mario".

 

The connotation of "yield" is the traffic meaning - someone else has the right of way and you have to wait for them. So "won't yield", to me, gives the image of someone taking something that belongs to someone else in an obvious disregard for the rules. According to the article, Kelsay hasn't been asked by Mario or anyone else to give his number up. The more accurate headline would have been "Kelsay to keep No. 90".

 

No, I don't think Kelsay is a better player than Williams. But the headline to me casts Kelsay in a very negative light that should not be there.

Thanks as usual Jay.

 

Language is an art… a concept often lost on those who use it in their profession.

 

give mario #78!

Sacrilege!

 

He bites on pump fakes and reverses worse than any DE that I can remember in the last decade of Buffalo Bills football.

I've often characterized this enduring trait as Kelsay playing the part of the buffoon cop in the silent movies. Everyone sees what's going on except him.

 

That's the first time I've ever seen the word "Clutch" used in the same sentence as "Kelsay".

 

How about "The Patriots RB who broke the clutch of Bills defensive end Chris Kelsay?"

I think I remember a writer saying that "Kelsay has a high motor and a good transmission but his clutch is always slipping."

 

free #90...

LOL!

 

If it's "just a number" why wouldn't the veteran leader of a team be willing to hand it over to make the new guy feel more welcomed?

 

It's clearly more than just a number... especially to Kelsay.

 

Maybe i'm wrong on the leadership aspect of this. But I feel that if I were Kelsay, a supposed leader on the team, I would gleefully give up my number for Mario.

I wouldn't use the term "leader" in this discussion. I would use the term "team-first guy." I could be wrong but there was a thread about this right when we signed Mario and I thought there were a few people who thought Kelsay would give Williams the number because he's a team-first guy." I thought that Kelsay might do this for reasons which seem reasonable to me.

 

 

 

[Tcali]

Kelsey is usually out of camera range during the rush--so he really shouldn't mind.

 

""I think I remember a writer saying that "Kelsay has a high motor and a good transmission but his clutch is always slipping."

 

hehe

[DefenseWinzChampionshipz]

Obama hasn't offered me anything yet, neither did either Bush or Clinton or any of em. Can I ask him to send me his desk?

 

Only if there was a RPresident and a LPresident.

[Webster Guy]

There's some real mean spirited posts on here. Chris Kelsay is going to make the team. He may start, he may not, he probably will. The guy has played for the Bills for ten years and loves it here. I met his Dad at Midway on the way home for the Raiders game last year and had a beer with him. Hell of a nice guy. While I was talking to him, he picked up the phone, called Chris and asked him if it was cool if I came to hang out with him, Kyle Williams, Lindell (his closest homies on the team apparently) after the game at some bar they always go to in OP after every home game. I'm 33, so I'm too old to go gawk at professional football players, but if I was ten years younger, it probably would have been awesome. My point is twofold: #1- you come off like real a**holes and #2- you really don't know football that well at all. The guy has been voted captain by his peers several times, he's proud to be a member of this franchise, he is valuable to this team. Did you not watch the game against the Broncos last season? He was the best player on the football field on either team. He's not a great talent, but he's certainly deserving of making the 53-man roster. What, you think they should keep Robert Eddins in his place or something? As a 4-3 run defender, Kelsay is actually a pretty effective football player.

He's streaky but I agree he can be productive out there. Not sure if I agree with you on being the starting DE in our 4 front, he'll have to add some weight but he has the frame and he goes all out every play. I think he loses the starting end spot to Dwan Edwards and will be the backup DE (non situational) but will still spell Mario or Edwards on 1st and 2nd downs.

 

The only way he gets cut is if its money related, but he's good enough to make 43 DE for depth.

[rstencel]

Couldn't you say that about almost every player on the team the last decade perhaps with the exception of Schobel???

I would add Fred Jackson to the exception list as well.

[QB Bills]

I think some of you are too used to crappy football if you actually think Kelsay adds any value to this defense that any scrub off the practice squad couldn't provide. It's human nature to be somewhat contrarian and that's what I feel some of you are doing here.

 

But sometimes a spade really just is a spade. And if you watch the games, its pretty obvious that Kelsay just is not a good football player. There's no need to bring in stats to make a case for either side if you watch every snap of every game like many of us here do.

 

As for the number, I think he should give it up. Mario Williams is a star player and he's indentified with #90. It sounds like it shouldn't matter with all that 'its a team game' rhetoric, but it does when it comes to the elite athletes. The gulf between the two players is so vast that Kelsay just comes across as looking petty.

[Tcali]

I think some of you are too used to crappy football if you actually think Kelsay adds any value to this defense that any scrub off the practice squad couldn't provide. It's human nature to be somewhat contrarian and that's what I feel some of you are doing here.

 

But sometimes a spade really just is a spade. And if you watch the games, its pretty obvious that Kelsay just is not a good football player. There's no need to bring in stats to make a case for either side if you watch every snap of every game like many of us here do.

 

As for the number, I think he should give it up. Mario Williams is a star player and he's indentified with #90. It sounds like it shouldn't matter with all that 'its a team game' rhetoric, but it does when it comes to the elite athletes. The gulf between the two players is so vast that Kelsay just comes across as looking petty.

OK---I'll give the disclaimer--Kelsay is a good guy/hard worker blah blah blah.

I will give credit to Kelsay---any football player that bad--that got someone to pay him

multi-millions of dollars to play football at that low of a level for so many years ...welll Heres to you kelsay!! You are a better man than I!!

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Anyone remember the CB Triple from McDonalds?

 

Best burger they ever made, locally (Buffalo) speaking of course.

 

 

And while I agree Kelsay hasn't been as good as most would like, he HAS been in the league longer and does not have to give the number up. Unfortunately for him, he's committing fandome suicide by not doing so.

 

I would LOVE Mario in #97.

lost me for a minute but right on.

 

but Lionel Dotson really likes his number 97.....and he has about as much claim to his number as kelsay.

 

i would cut Kelsay....i have never liked his play on the field and now he is replaceable....besides, he is very overpaid (9/29/2010: Signed a five-year, $28.2 million contract. The deal contains $11 million in bonus money. 2012: $3.5 million, 2013: $3.725 million, 2014: $3.745 million, 2015: Free Agent).

 

i'm not starting off the "mario" era by not giving him the number he wants....of course mario prefers to not make a fuss....but you know he wants it.

Who?

[Chandler#81]

1335962406[/url]' post='2455713']

Sorry but #97 was Leif Larsen's number. It's not available

 

Biscuit wanted that number from the Hallowween we whisked him away on. Scott Radecic had it for a couple years so Bennett wore #55. Until the Bills cut Scott...Just sayin'..

[BuckeyeBill]

Kelsey... Hi Mario, this is Chris kelsey

Mario... Who?

 

LOL

[section122]

For those arguing Kelsay should give up the number I ask you this:

Have you ever played sports, even on a high school level, for an extended period of time? You start to identify with a number. It becomes part of your identity especially in the sport you are playing (and sometimes across multiple sports). These sentiments were echoed by Kelsay. He has been on the Bills longer and been in the league longer. Mario could have had 90 if he stayed with the Texans. On the Bills he has no claim to it.

As an aside, why do people hate Kelsay? I can understand thinking he isn't very good, and I can understand thinking there are better options, but I don't get hating someone who has played for our favorite team for as long as he has. As an olb he is terrible but as a de he is an acceptable player. One who will be (and should have/would have) a depth player on a better team.

Stop hatin' on Kelsay!

[dogma+]

Crusade=troll

 

This is a Chris Kelsay thread and I'm voicing my opinion on Chris Kelsay. Other posters respond, ask me questions, and I answer them. In what is that a crusade?

 

 

For those arguing Kelsay should give up the number I ask you this:

Have you ever played sports, even on a high school level, for an extended period of time? You start to identify with a number. It becomes part of your identity especially in the sport you are playing (and sometimes across multiple sports). These sentiments were echoed by Kelsay. He has been on the Bills longer and been in the league longer. Mario could have had 90 if he stayed with the Texans. On the Bills he has no claim to it.

As an aside, why do people hate Kelsay? I can understand thinking he isn't very good, and I can understand thinking there are better options, but I don't get hating someone who has played for our favorite team for as long as he has. As an olb he is terrible but as a de he is an acceptable player. One who will be (and should have/would have) a depth player on a better team.

Stop hatin' on Kelsay!

 

I don't think anyone is arguing that he has to give it up. My opinion is that it would be have a nice thing for a leader of the team to do to welcome the new player on the team. It's stressful to leave your team, city, and home to come play for a different town. Mario could have chosen any team he wanted to, but he chose Buffalo. In my opinion, a leader of a team should be willing to sacrifice himself once in a while for the betterment of the team and to welcome a new player. As you said, players start to identify with their number. That means Mario identified with his number. And he's not only leaving his team, town, and home but he's also leaving his number. It would have been nice for Kelsay to do.

 

That's just my opinion. Others disagree. But I think Mario may just get his number back anyway, as Kelsay may not make it through training camp.

 

I think some of you are too used to crappy football if you actually think Kelsay adds any value to this defense

 

Bingo.

[section122]

 

I don't think anyone is arguing that he has to give it up. My opinion is that it would be have a nice thing for a leader of the team to do to welcome the new player on the team. It's stressful to leave your team, city, and home to come play for a different town. Mario could have chosen any team he wanted to, but he chose Buffalo. In my opinion, a leader of a team should be willing to sacrifice himself once in a while for the betterment of the team and to welcome a new player. As you said, players start to identify with their number. That means Mario identified with his number. And he's not only leaving his team, town, and home but he's also leaving his number. It would have been nice for Kelsay to do.

 

That's just my opinion. Others disagree. But I think Mario may just get his number back anyway, as Kelsay may not make it through training camp.

 

for 100 million I'll deal with that stress

I'm having a hard time following your post though. In one breath you say Kelsay is a leader on the team and the next say he will get cut in tc. Add on to the fact that Mario can't change his number without buying all of the leftover stock with all the fans who would have the wrong number on their jersey and it ain't happening (if Kelsay were to get cut which I would be shocked by). Mario did leave his team, town, home and I'm sure that is stressful. Not sure how it compares to leaving his number (although I would imagine it is much less stressful) but he never even asked Kelsay about it. If it was that important I would think he would have already had the conversation.

[dogma+]

for 100 million I'll deal with that stress

I'm having a hard time following your post though. In one breath you say Kelsay is a leader on the team and the next say he will get cut in tc. on their jersey and it ain't happening (if Kelsay were to get cut which I would be shocked by). Mario did leave his team, town, home and I'm sure that is stressful. Not sure how it compares to leaving his number (although I would imagine it is much less stressful) but he never even asked Kelsay about it. If it was that important I would think he would have already had the conversation.

 

I say "leader" in jest, because that's what many people on here seem to think of him. But either way, leaders get cut all the time. The NFL is about winning games, not being popular in the locker room.

 

Add on to the fact that Mario can't change his number without buying all of the leftover stock with all the fans who would have the wrong number

 

People keep spouting that because they JUST learned about this fact even though that fact has been around forever. Hundreds of players have changed their number. They all buy the remaining jerseys. It's not difficult. It's not time consuming. It's a very simple process. By the way, Mario does not have a Bills jersey yet. Technically, his number right now is 00. I don't think there are many fans running around with 00 on it. In fact, i'm not even sure if it is for sale.

Edited May 3, 2012 by dogma+

[section122]

I say "leader" in jest, because that's what many people on here seem to think of him. But either way, leaders get cut all the time. The NFL is about winning games, not being popular in the locker room.

 

I think we'll agree to disagree on this one. The contract they gave Kelsay seems to point towards the fo thinking he is a leader and I don't see many (or really any that I can think of off the top of my head) of them getting cut.

 

People keep spouting that because they JUST learned about this fact even though that fact has been around forever. Hundreds of players have changed their number. They all buy the remaining jerseys. It's not difficult. It's not time consuming. It's a very simple process. By the way, Mario does not have a Bills jersey yet. Technically, his number right now is 00. I don't think there are many fans running around with 00 on it. In fact, i'm not even sure if it is for sale.

If it is after tc Mario most certainly will have a number, and all of the people who pre-ordered his jersey will have that number on their jersey. The stock would be huge. The cost would go beyond financial though bc many (rightfully so) would be up in arms about their brand new jersey being obsolete.

[gus2378]

I think some of you are too used to crappy football if you actually think Kelsay adds any value to this defense that any scrub off the practice squad couldn't provide. It's human nature to be somewhat contrarian and that's what I feel some of you are doing here.

 

But sometimes a spade really just is a spade. And if you watch the games, its pretty obvious that Kelsay just is not a good football player. There's no need to bring in stats to make a case for either side if you watch every snap of every game like many of us here do.

 

As for the number, I think he should give it up. Mario Williams is a star player and he's indentified with #90. It sounds like it shouldn't matter with all that 'its a team game' rhetoric, but it does when it comes to the elite athletes. The gulf between the two players is so vast that Kelsay just comes across as looking petty.

 

Doesn't matter if Kelsay sucks, that's completely beside the point. He's on the team, he's been on the team, Williams is the new guy. If the team truly comes first, that applies to everyone. As others have mentioned, if Biscuit can wait for #97 because a Redecic had it, Williams can defer to Kelsay. And he hardly is identified with #90 ... he's a very good player, I am pumped that the Bills have him, but the average NFL fan would have been guessing a year ago if you asked them who #90 on the Houston Texas was. (and don't tell me everyone on this board would have known, if you are on this board you are an above-average fan, IMO. To say someone "is identified" with a number, casual fans better know you, like everyone knows Peyton Manning wears 18)