So Serious' 2012 Draft Compendium

[Bill from NYC]

All I know, is we need another good Cb to pair with Williams for the future. If they like Gilmore or Kirkpatrick, they should be the pick if they're available.

 

Fine, but why waste another first round pick? We need a LT and our LBs, other than Barnett, might be the worst in the league.

There is no reason at all to throw another first round pick in the garbage. Last winter was mild. This one might not be, and we do have those late season home games.

We need to use our best resources on getting stronger, instead of repeating the same mistakes that have kept us locked in the cellar.

[1B4IDie]

Good work. Your write-up of Blackmon in the elite category seems a bit like you think he'll suck though.

 

No worries, Im super excited especially not knowing who we'll be picking. Hopefully ESPN keeps their cameras off of our pick.

I think Michael Crabtree is a good WR. I think Blackmon will be a good WR.

 

May want to re-think that one.

 

GO BILLS!!!

No I think he is thinking straight.

[K-9]

I think Michael Crabtree is a good WR. I think Blackmon will be a good WR.

 

 

No I think he is thinking straight.

 

Well then, allow me to rethink that one.

 

OK. Got it.

 

But Buddy's quote was, "He's open even when he's not open." That's a bit different than "he's covered even when he's not."

But whatever.

 

GO BILLS!!!

Edited April 25, 2012 by K-9

[Reed83HOF]

Nice Post WSS!!

 

I honestly still think it is between Floyd, Gilmore and Kirkpatrick. As good as Kuechly looks on film, I just still can't justify an ILB @ 10 - You can find a 80%-90% clone later on. I wouldn't be upset if we draft him, but personally I would prefer one of the 3 I named. If Kalil falls you obviously pull the trigger and the same goes with Richardson. It is impossible to nail the pick this year because of the lack of sure fire talent at 7-9 and those teams needs.

 

Either they are smoke screening Floyd or they aren't interested (obviously). It is impossible to tell; although I think Whaley's smile makes me believe more in a smokescreen. If he is there and we pass on him I would be surprised. All of this talk of Barron all of a sudden, I am not sure what to make of it. I still think WR & CB are the top 2 positions. OL has moved on down to the later rounds. I really don't see us trading down for a 3rd or a 4th rounder; it isn't worth it. I am not even sure if a second rounder would be enough (especially a later one).

[1B4IDie]

Well then, allow me to rethink that one.

 

OK. Got it.

 

But Buddy's quote was, "He's open even when he's not open." That's a bit different than "he's covered even when he's not."

But whatever.

 

GO BILLS!!!

Disregard prior message.

 

You are correct rethinking is on order.

[billsfan89]

Unless Kalil or Blackmon drops to 10 I think you have to say its a toss up between Floyd and Kuechly. Floyd is a huge risk but from where we pick he is likely the only guy that can likely impact the perimeter of our offense from day one. But I look at Kuechly and I see a guy who fixes the biggest issue with our defense from day one as it really makes our LB core really credible and he would anchor the unit for a long time.

 

But I think you can find a very good LB in round 2 or 3 or trade back up into round 2 using that extra 4th. So If I had to make the pick I would go with Floyd pick one, take a OT in round 2 (As even if Hariston is our guy at LT we need an heir apparent for Pears at RT and the depth on the line is suspect).

[NewEra]

Fine, but why waste another first round pick? We need a LT and our LBs, other than Barnett, might be the worst in the league.

There is no reason at all to throw another first round pick in the garbage. Last winter was mild. This one might not be, and we do have those late season home games.

We need to use our best resources on getting stronger, instead of repeating the same mistakes that have kept us locked in the cellar.

Why would the first round pick be 'in the garbarge"? If he turned out to be mckelvin, it would be in the garbage. If he turns out to be a legit #1, it would be well worth it. The pick is "in the garbage" if we reach for a LT that isn't rated as a top 20 pick, like most of the LTs are (IMO anyway). Rieff, Glenn, Martin and Adams ALL have questions about them. Are they better than Hairston? Good question. There's a chance Kuechly isn't there at 10. He's my pick at 10. If he's not there, take the BPA at WR, CB or LT. None of the LTs are the bpa on my board. Floyd, Gilmore and Kirkpatrick fit that bill, as would fletcher cox (while DL isn't a 'need', he would contribute and really help out d for years to come).

 

 

It's seems as if the jauron era really scarred you to drafting DBs, and it's understandabe. For me, drafting for need, instead of BPA, has scarred me. I want players that can really help our team and if a cb is going to help our team more than another, by all means, take one. Florence, McGee and mckelvin will most likely not be on the bills in 2 years (McGee and mckelvin might be gone after this year), nix has stated that cb is a position that is needed and a potential #1 CB would be a welcome addition. The nfl is a passing league nowadays, if you don't have CBs that can cover, good luck (even with a good pass rush). Gilmore and Kirkpatrick are both solid in coverage and vs the run. To say that selecting one of them at 10 is like throwing the pick "in the garbage" is ludicrous, unless you think Florence McGee and mckelvin have a bright future on our team. I do not. Maybe a year or two max. I respect your opinion on many subjects, but completely disagree with your rationale on this one.

[OldTimer1960]

Me too.

 

 

Awww. You just ruined Jon Martin for me. When the Bills picked Fina, it is the ONLY time I punched a door because of a draft pick. I wanted Pickens.

 

Actually, Fina was not awful (IMHO). He had an OK career and was a decent starter for several years. I would just hope that the Bills could get a very good starter at #10.

[Bill from NYC]

It's seems as if the jauron era really scarred you to drafting DBs, and it's understandabe. For me, drafting for need, instead of BPA, has scarred me. I want players that can really help our team and if a cb is going to help our team more than another, by all means, take one. Florence, McGee and mckelvin will most likely not be on the bills in 2 years (McGee and mckelvin might be gone after this year), nix has stated that cb is a position that is needed and a potential #1 CB would be a welcome addition. The nfl is a passing league nowadays, if you don't have CBs that can cover, good luck (even with a good pass rush). Gilmore and Kirkpatrick are both solid in coverage and vs the run. To say that selecting one of them at 10 is like throwing the pick "in the garbage" is ludicrous, unless you think Florence McGee and mckelvin have a bright future on our team. I do not. Maybe a year or two max. I respect your opinion on many subjects, but completely disagree with your rationale on this one.

 

I really do understand this. And I think that soon, the cb position will not be valued as high as it is now. A "shutdown corner" is a good thing to have, but at what cost? The Raiders let theirs walk. The Eagles are shopping Samuels (and his huge contract) for a 4th or so.

And, let's talk about Revis. According to Sirius (I think it was Ross Tucker), Revis was paid 25 million last season, counting the bonus. Now, he is threatening to hold out. He makes SO much, they had to extend Sanchez (and give him more up front money) just to stay under the salary cap. So what should a team do, let corners walk after one contract? We tried that, and lost football games.

None of the above teams made the playoffs. It really isn't smart (imo) to pay huge bucks to a cb given the rule changes. If a team plays 4 wide sets, Revis can only "shut down" 25% of opposing wideouts. And in many sones, receivers are passed on to safties at designated spots.

We don't know how good or bad our corners are. Our leading sack artist played nose at least half the time, and after that Kelsay and Moats were our pass rush. And, teams even ran on us.

Once the team is stronger and deeper on the front 7 and OL (and maybe even QB), I would probably be OK with a first round corner. Until then, I simply view it as unwise to devote top resources to the secondary. And sadly, there is a body of poor work by Levy and Jauron to make my case.

[NewEra]

1335351540[/url]' post='2445145']

I really do understand this. And I think that soon, the cb position will not be valued as high as it is now. A "shutdown corner" is a good thing to have, but at what cost? The Raiders let theirs walk. The Eagles are shopping Samuels (and his huge contract) for a 4th or so.

And, let's talk about Revis. According to Sirius (I think it was Ross Tucker), Revis was paid 25 million last season, counting the bonus. Now, he is threatening to hold out. He makes SO much, they had to extend Sanchez (and give him more up front money) just to stay under the salary cap. So what should a team do, let corners walk after one contract? We tried that, and lost football games.

None of the above teams made the playoffs. It really isn't smart (imo) to pay huge bucks to a cb given the rule changes. If a team plays 4 wide sets, Revis can only "shut down" 25% of opposing wideouts. And in many sones, receivers are passed on to safties at designated spots.

We don't know how good or bad our corners are. Our leading sack artist played nose at least half the time, and after that Kelsay and Moats were our pass rush. And, teams even ran on us.

Once the team is stronger and deeper on the front 7 and OL (and maybe even QB), I would probably be OK with a first round corner. Until then, I simply view it as unwise to devote top resources to the secondary. And sadly, there is a body of poor work by Levy and Jauron to make my case.

 

I hear ya. Like I said before, kuechly would be my 1st pick. I don't think there's another front 7 guy, except cox, worth the 10th pick. If we drafted cox, I'd be ok with it because I think he's a helluva player and would give us the best DL in the league (if it's not already). The revis comment goes both ways. The jets, this year, didn't make the playoffs. The 2 prior years, they were in the AFC championship game and revis was the main reason. You can say that revis can only shutdown 25% of the field, but 25% of the field could constitute 50% of the offense if he shuts down calvin, andre, Fitzgerald, Aj green, Marshall, VJ, Bowe etc. I don't think cb is the most important position, but I think 2 really good young CBs, along with a great pass rush can result in a top 3 defense. A top 3 defense can = the playoffs, even of the qb is questionable (Sanchez, flacco, Alex smith). Asante Samuel isn't a #1 cb IMO. His cover skills are questionable. His claim to fame is creating turnovers, not coverage.

 

If chix thinks one of the OL is worth the 10th pick, I'm ok with that too. Personally, I don't think there's any OL except kalil worth the 10th pick. My philosophy is pick the bpa at a position that isn't completely loaded. We aren't loaded at CB, so of chix thinks Gilmore or Kirkpatrick is the bpa when we select, it makes a lot of sense.

 

Regarding paying the CB big bucks after five years, I'm not thinking 5 years down the road. We are close to completing a defense that's built to win now. I want to win now and if Gilmore or Kirkpatrick can come in play heavy productive minutes now, it's a good pick. Let's get a ring, then worry about paying people.

Edited April 25, 2012 by NewEra

[thewildrabbit]

I can't tell how overwhelmingly disappointed I'd be in this lackluster, irresponsible selection.

 

Though you could be right...... think he'll be there in the 2nd round. Still wouldn't like him there.

 

 

 

Matt Kalil will most likely be gone at #3 overall to the Vikings and if not he won't make it out of the top 8.

 

I can't tell you how overwhelmingly disappointed I'd be if the Bills didn't select the very best OT in this draft at #10

[thewildrabbit]

 

Michael Floyd Notre Dame WR - If he can keep his drinking in control, He is a sure thing imo. This guy's ceiling is through the roof. He is basically a bigger stronger Justin Blackmon. He did better at the combine than AJ Green did last year. The 2 alcohol related incidents and the DUI is a big deal though. Plus he wasn't on the list of college prospects that visited One Bills Drive so Nix may have black balled him completely. Don't be surprised if he ends up Rookie of the Year or ends up in jail with a few more DUIs.

 

Quinton Coples North Carolina DE43 - Before the Mario Williams and Anderson signings the draft @#10 was simple for the Bills. Whomever you rank higher Between Coples, Ingram and Mercilus thats who you take. I doubt that happens now but it could be an outside possibility.

 

The Bills are in a great position this year, outside of LT, there is no overwhelming hole on the team. Lots of holes but many of them are partially covered. This allows the Bills to take the best player that will have the most impact.

The great news is I don't see a complete bust in this year's possibilities at #10. Maybe Reiff can't play LT but he will still play RT and contribute. Maybe Floyd gets in to some off the field trouble, but he will likely shine when in uniform on Sundays.

T-Minus 50 hours or so and we will see what happens. I can't wait.

 

If its WR Michael Floyd, I just don't get the attraction.I honestly don't get the love for Floyd. The kid has some issues and baggage. Can he get off press? He gets moved and rerouted a lot off the line. Watching both Blackmon vs Floyd against Stanford. Floyd had 8 catches for 92 yards and one TD. Blackmon had 8 catches for 182 and 3 TD's. Floyd against top 25 teams this past year, one TD and 23 catches in 4 games is really abysmal.

 

Quinton Coples might be a bigger bust then Aaron Maybin. Mike Mayock says he wouldn't take the guy until the 3rd round. His 2010 tape makes him look like a top ten pick. His 2011 tape make him look like a bad pick in the first round.

 

 

 

I think there are still overwhelming holes at WR- O line- TE- LB.

 

Eric Wood at center, I love the guy. but will he last the season or end up on IR for the third straight year? Will the rookie LT make it thru a full season this year? No real back up at LT-C make this team extremely thin.

 

Stevie Johnson at WR is great, but one WR is easily covered. Two great WRs its much tougher and so on. 3-5 great targets make it almost imposable for any secondary to cover. Just ask the Packers, the Patriots, the Saints et al. The Bills need a dominate second wide out, a top slot WR now that Parrish is a Charger, moving Spiller to full time WR might be the answer there, or splitting time with Fred Jackson in the slot and at RB. a top TE that can stay healthy.

 

Will the Bills be able to stop the run this year? You need better LBers to do that. They didn't get much better at stopping the run last season with the players on the roster.

 

 

I just hope the Bills make a smart choice for a player that can make an impact this year on offense as Fitz needs some better players around him

[Matt in KC]

Good analysis, WSS?. I won't be surpassed if the Bills pick Gilmore either.

 

 

I really do understand this. And I think that soon, the cb position will not be valued as high as it is now. A "shutdown corner" is a good thing to have, but at what cost? The Raiders let theirs walk. The Eagles are shopping Samuels (and his huge contract) for a 4th or so.

And, let's talk about Revis. According to Sirius (I think it was Ross Tucker), Revis was paid 25 million last season, counting the bonus. Now, he is threatening to hold out. He makes SO much, they had to extend Sanchez (and give him more up front money) just to stay under the salary cap. So what should a team do, let corners walk after one contract? We tried that, and lost football games.

None of the above teams made the playoffs. It really isn't smart (imo) to pay huge bucks to a cb given the rule changes. If a team plays 4 wide sets, Revis can only "shut down" 25% of opposing wideouts. And in many sones, receivers are passed on to safties at designated spots.

We don't know how good or bad our corners are. Our leading sack artist played nose at least half the time, and after that Kelsay and Moats were our pass rush. And, teams even ran on us.

Once the team is stronger and deeper on the front 7 and OL (and maybe even QB), I would probably be OK with a first round corner. Until then, I simply view it as unwise to devote top resources to the secondary. And sadly, there is a body of poor work by Levy and Jauron to make my case.

Bill, I really wish you'd start a thread on "When is it okay to draft defensive backs early in the draft?" There's whole long debate to have there, I think.

 

I too think you are scarred. "We don't know how good or bad our corners are?" Really I think we know McGees at the end of the road now, or certainly after the next season or two at most. It looks like McKelvin has plateaued to me: he shows flashes of his physical skills, but lacks field awareness and is never going to be a physical player. Florence has been okay, with some very good plays, and some awful ones. Corner doesn't deserve to be on an NFL team and Rogers is developing nicely and is new/young enough we don't really know about him. I think a better pass rush will help our safeties look much better, but our CBs desperately need reinforcements. I don't think a pass rush is going to make them solid this year or prepare us for the future.

[1B4IDie]

If its WR Michael Floyd, I just don't get the attraction.I honestly don't get the love for Floyd. The kid has some issues and baggage. Can he get off press? He gets moved and rerouted a lot off the line. Watching both Blackmon vs Floyd against Stanford. Floyd had 8 catches for 92 yards and one TD. Blackmon had 8 catches for 182 and 3 TD's. Floyd against top 25 teams this past year, one TD and 23 catches in 4 games is really abysmal.

 

Quinton Coples might be a bigger bust then Aaron Maybin. Mike Mayock says he wouldn't take the guy until the 3rd round. His 2010 tape makes him look like a top ten pick. His 2011 tape make him look like a bad pick in the first round.

 

 

 

 

Floyd is a physical beast and performed well when he was the known focal point of the offense. Plus if you watch the ND offense last year, it is a slot of slants and very similar to the Bills offense last year. He looks plug and play for the Bills, or as close as possible coming from college.

 

I don't believe 6 catches a game against Top 25 is abysmal. They did keep him out of the end zone though.

 

That OSU Standford game was sick for Blackmon. but its not like 8 catches for 92 yards and a TD is a horrible especially with a lesser team around him.

 

Either way if you don't get by now, you won't get until you see him performing in the NFL.

 

I agree on Quinton Coples I was real worried about it, before the MArio Williams and Anderson signings when it looked like it was gonna be Coples, Ingram or even Mercilus. Now I'm not so worried.

[stony]

I think Michael Crabtree is a good WR. I think Blackmon will be a good WR.

 

 

No I think he is thinking straight.

 

Blackmon's YAC ability will make him a much better player IMO. He's not a huge douche like Crabtree was either.

[1B4IDie]

Blackmon's YAC ability will make him a much better player IMO. He's not a huge douche like Crabtree was either.

True True, I doubt Blackmon holds out for almost half the season.

 

I think Blackmon's floor is probably Crabtree, how about that?

 

I think his ceiling is more Anquan Boldin.

 

I wish him all the best (as long as he ain't drafted by the Fish)