Kelly the Dog Posted March 26, 2012 Posted March 26, 2012 I'm just going to respond to this, because everything else you typed seems to be some sort of bizarre strawman argument. Maybe you need to reread what I wrote, because I have no problem with any of our other offseason moves, and maybe not even this one if those $21M contract details are correct. Anderson was not going to get that money wherever he went, you're delusional if you think so. While it's nice to imagine that he wanted to come here to play on a line with Williams/Dareus/Williams, the simple truth is that he was going to go wherever they paid him the most. He's not trying to boost his stats and cash-in on his next contract when he's 33 (lol). This was his big contract payday, and we offered the most. And let's talk about that year with the Patriots, or should I say a year of situational play under the best defensive coach in the game on a team that often forced other teams into a desperation-passing mode. I hope the guy does do well - I hope he gets 20 sacks next year. But TBH, I think any average DE we put on the end of that line could get 8-9 sacks next year. If you take a level-headed look at the guy's entire career and the situation he was in last year - it's hard not to think we paid just a tad too much for him. He likely would have got 20-25 million (for four years) anywhere he went, especially if it were the kind of contract it appears to be with the Bills where they can easily just keep him for one or two years and not get killed. Look at the money the CB Routt got from the Bengals, or Laurent Robinson got, or Meachem, and several others. Sure it's not the same position but Anderson just turned 29, he is not old, and 12 sacks is a HOT commodity in this league, especially because of how he has changed his game and evolved as a player. Teams are clearly not looking at him as the guy that had two good years with four crappy ones in between. They see him as a player who has matured and coming into his own, even if he is strictly a pass rusher.
1B4IDie Posted March 26, 2012 Posted March 26, 2012 (edited) I'm just going to respond to this, because everything else you typed seems to be some sort of bizarre strawman argument. Maybe you need to reread what I wrote, because I have no problem with any of our other offseason moves, and maybe not even this one if those $21M contract details are correct. Anderson was not going to get that money wherever he went, you're delusional if you think so. While it's nice to imagine that he wanted to come here to play on a line with Williams/Dareus/Williams, the simple truth is that he was going to go wherever they paid him the most. He's not trying to boost his stats and cash-in on his next contract when he's 33 (lol). This was his big contract payday, and we offered the most. And let's talk about that year with the Patriots, or should I say a year of situational play under the best defensive coach in the game on a team that often forced other teams into a desperation-passing mode. I hope the guy does do well - I hope he gets 20 sacks next year. But TBH, I think any average DE we put on the end of that line could get 8-9 sacks next year. If you take a level-headed look at the guy's entire career and the situation he was in last year - it's hard not to think we paid just a tad too much for him. I just want to say that is a real pleasure to converse with a fan who knows exactly what the other teams were offering....kudos on that.... Your you complaint is that your afraid that the bills are overspending on players.......but you only want to talk about the ONE contract given out this offseason that even falls into that catagory? In past offseasons the very best we could have hoped for was a free agent LIKE Anderson and would probably watch key guys we drafted leave for greener pastures....this year the bills put their money where there mouth is....yet did it in a way that is still a managable cap number by the bills......but still you B word Some people are never happy +1 (There is not a cap issue or a shortage of cash for the Bills. What is the problem if the guy gets 6 or 8 mill. It's a front loaded contract there isn't a conflict or shortage or money. Its laughable that you think you know what contracts are being offered. Who would think Meachum a career 600 yard receiver that would dissapear for 12 games a year would get the piles of money that San Diego threw at him. Edited March 26, 2012 by Why So Serious?
Kelly the Dog Posted March 26, 2012 Posted March 26, 2012 +1 (There is not a cap issue or a shortage of cash for the Bills. What is the problem if the guy gets 6 or 8 mill. It's a front loaded contract there isn't a conflict or shortage or money. Its laughable that you think you know what contracts are being offered. Who would think Meachum a career 600 yard receiver that would dissapear for 12 games a year would get the piles of money that San Diego threw at him. Because we were offering him nearly that much --- and he was the best FA WR on the market --- and a lot of teams like first round draft picks with great size and great speed despite his marginal production on the Saints --- and a couple other FA WR with similar talent got similar money in FA.
John from Riverside Posted March 26, 2012 Posted March 26, 2012 And I have been short in my post with Q and apologize for that.....everyone has the right to their own opinion..... I am just tired of the same old crap...I am tired of being "average" I am tired of bing "mediocre" To be quite honest? This feels a lot like when we brought in that group of free agent defensive players (Ted Washington, Jim Jeffcoat, Chris Spielman) you know the last time this defense was actually GOOD - I am trying to figure out how many games we would have won last year if our defense was actually consistantly good.....not a "live and die by the turnover" type but a type of defense that gets offenses off the field on THIRD DOWN.....forcing PUNTS...... - Would we have ran the ball more? If we got up by 10 points would Chan have hunkered down and ran Freddie and CJ more? Would this have helped Fitz and his interceptions.....would Fitz have taken less HITS........Would the team have had a good enough supporting cast that we actually could play Thigpen and not get creamed? In some 4th quarter blowouts perhaps? We had some players last year that deserved to be pro bowlers....they were robbed....players like Stevie....players like Freddie Jackson who for weeks went head to head with that Minnosota RB that everyone fawned over....... Just give me a defense that gets offenses off the field....please....whatever it takes
TYSONKO1 Posted March 26, 2012 Posted March 26, 2012 And I have been short in my post with Q and apologize for that.....everyone has the right to their own opinion..... I am just tired of the same old crap...I am tired of being "average" I am tired of bing "mediocre" To be quite honest? This feels a lot like when we brought in that group of free agent defensive players (Ted Washington, Jim Jeffcoat, Chris Spielman) you know the last time this defense was actually GOOD - I am trying to figure out how many games we would have won last year if our defense was actually consistantly good.....not a "live and die by the turnover" type but a type of defense that gets offenses off the field on THIRD DOWN.....forcing PUNTS...... - Would we have ran the ball more? If we got up by 10 points would Chan have hunkered down and ran Freddie and CJ more? Would this have helped Fitz and his interceptions.....would Fitz have taken less HITS........Would the team have had a good enough supporting cast that we actually could play Thigpen and not get creamed? In some 4th quarter blowouts perhaps? We had some players last year that deserved to be pro bowlers....they were robbed....players like Stevie....players like Freddie Jackson who for weeks went head to head with that Minnosota RB that everyone fawned over....... Just give me a defense that gets offenses off the field....please....whatever it takes And I have been short in my post with Q and apologize for that.....everyone has the right to their own opinion..... I am just tired of the same old crap...I am tired of being "average" I am tired of bing "mediocre" To be quite honest? This feels a lot like when we brought in that group of free agent defensive players (Ted Washington, Jim Jeffcoat, Chris Spielman) you know the last time this defense was actually GOOD - I am trying to figure out how many games we would have won last year if our defense was actually consistantly good.....not a "live and die by the turnover" type but a type of defense that gets offenses off the field on THIRD DOWN.....forcing PUNTS...... - Would we have ran the ball more? If we got up by 10 points would Chan have hunkered down and ran Freddie and CJ more? Would this have helped Fitz and his interceptions.....would Fitz have taken less HITS........Would the team have had a good enough supporting cast that we actually could play Thigpen and not get creamed? In some 4th quarter blowouts perhaps? We had some players last year that deserved to be pro bowlers....they were robbed....players like Stevie....players like Freddie Jackson who for weeks went head to head with that Minnosota RB that everyone fawned over....... Just give me a defense that gets offenses off the field....please....whatever it takes I LOVE THIS POST !!!!!!!
3rdand12 Posted March 26, 2012 Posted March 26, 2012 I'm just going to respond to this, because everything else you typed seems to be some sort of bizarre strawman argument. Maybe you need to reread what I wrote, because I have no problem with any of our other offseason moves, and maybe not even this one if those $21M contract details are correct. Anderson was not going to get that money wherever he went, you're delusional if you think so. While it's nice to imagine that he wanted to come here to play on a line with Williams/Dareus/Williams, the simple truth is that he was going to go wherever they paid him the most. He's not trying to boost his stats and cash-in on his next contract when he's 33 (lol). This was his big contract payday, and we offered the most. And let's talk about that year with the Patriots, or should I say a year of situational play under the best defensive coach in the game on a team that often forced other teams into a desperation-passing mode. I hope the guy does do well - I hope he gets 20 sacks next year. But TBH, I think any average DE we put on the end of that line could get 8-9 sacks next year. If you take a level-headed look at the guy's entire career and the situation he was in last year - it's hard not to think we paid just a tad too much for him. I thought he was 29 and in his prime. His career was no way enough for me to buy into the guy. i think it's a real need for us and a good fit because we do have some decent rotation with Kelsay and one or two morein the corral. But i have read more than once from quotes of Chan and or Buddy that he will be playing more downs than his history suggests. These guys saw something we dont see at first glance and felt strongly enough to spend on him. I hope they picked the Right guy! I am not sure i agree at all about who pays the most. I think he still wants some glory too. Maybe a winning team and great young players around him that he can help. Yes i billieve all that koolaid crap to some degree and think we have a Strong chance to kick ass and take names with one or two more players on Deee. Anderson is a plus and if he doesnt get stats he will get respect right out of the box. lastly it aint my money. and they have been skimping for years. Hell yes if you are buying, i will have another!!! DE thats is.
QCity Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 I just want to say that is a real pleasure to converse with a fan who knows exactly what the other teams were offering....kudos on that.... Your you complaint is that your afraid that the bills are overspending on players.......but you only want to talk about the ONE contract given out this offseason that even falls into that catagory? In past offseasons the very best we could have hoped for was a free agent LIKE Anderson and would probably watch key guys we drafted leave for greener pastures....this year the bills put their money where there mouth is....yet did it in a way that is still a managable cap number by the bills......but still you B word Some people are never happy Well I wasn't ever complaining, nor was I bitching. And I am thrilled with the offseason moves. And the reason I "only want to talk about the one contract" is because this is a thread about that signing. Someone posted updated contract details. I commented that the deal looks better now. Someone else mentioned it doesn't matter what we paid him since we are under the cap. I replied that it does still matter and my opinion was $7M/yr is too much for a situational player. I even said that if he does become an every-down player the deal might be worth it. That's a big IF. I thought that was a very level-headed response. Anyways, it's clear you are more focused on attacking me and I've already said my peace, so I'm bowing out of this thread.
Kelly the Dog Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 I thought that was a very level-headed response. Anyways, it's clear you are more focused on attacking me and I've already said my peace, so I'm bowing out of this thread. Posting is a tough game for tough people.
QCity Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Posting is a tough game for tough people. Indeed. Indeed.
San Jose Bills Fan Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 (edited) I would change the word "tead" because I don't even know what that means. Any particular reason you chose to go after my spelling other then you have a crappy argument? It means that my finger got a little fat and hit the "E" by accident. Spelling police.....really? You also misspelled the word "build." Yeah I couldn't care less about the Anderson money. In the context of: 1) a salary cap that will increase 2) a mandate that teams spend increasing percentages of the increasing cap each year 3) the excellence of the contracts the Bills have entered into with several of their players this offseason 4) the numerous bad contracts which will be coming off the books in the next two years 5) the fact that the Tennessee, Baltimore, Miami, and New England were also in the hunt for Anderson 6) the fact that the Bills believe that Anderson is entering his prime It's quibbling at best to object to this contract, IMO. Check out Anderson's recent comments about the 2011 season: "You understand what moves are working and what moves work for you, what offensive tackles have problems with, a lot of hard work in the offseason, a lot of film study, a lot of getting with coaches doing the extra work. I was able to come up with counter moves and different moves like that that work for me." And Greg Gabriel's: Greg Gabriel, former college scouting chief for the Bears, drafted Anderson out of Alabama in the fifth round in '06. Gabriel sees a lot of growth in the 6-foot-4, 255-pound Anderson. "What you saw on tape (in 2011) was a different player," said Gabriel, now an analyst for the National Football Post. "Anderson played with the enthusiasm we saw in 2006. He showed a variety of pass rush moves and became a more complete player. This new deal with Buffalo gives Anderson the contractual security he has not had since his rookie year." "In Buffalo, Anderson should flourish," Gabriel said. "Playing opposite Mario Williams will help both him and Williams because the offense is going to have to pick their poison on passing downs. They won't be able to double team both." http://www.buffalone...e?twobillsdrive Edited March 27, 2012 by San Jose Bills Fan
1B4IDie Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Because we were offering him nearly that much --- and he was the best FA WR on the market --- and a lot of teams like first round draft picks with great size and great speed despite his marginal production on the Saints --- and a couple other FA WR with similar talent got similar money in FA. I understand that San Diego payed for potential and the 1st round pedigree. However the examples of an under performing WR drafted in the 1st 3 rounds hitting free agency and then blossoming into a player that has some great stats and contributes are pretty few. I can't think of any of the top of my head. Can we think of some examples? I don't think Meachum was the best Free Agent WR in a class with Vincent Jackson, but he wasn't the worst. Either way San Diego sure did drop a lot of money on Meachum and who knows what money was out there for Anderson. I'll tell you what wasn't out there for Anderson. Another team that has a line where 3/4 starters have to be double teamed on every play. Not to mention people keep forgetting that Anderson played a season with Mario Williams before. Its not even mentioned by most reports. They obviously know each other. Anderson already know what its like to line up with Mario Williams drawing double teams. Now throw in Marcel and Kyle . . .Not to mention Mario Williams mentioned how his D-Line coach was in Live Kyle WIlliams and talked about him in practice at Houston. Well Anderson was there as well. . . Lets not revert to our 2005 logic. It is possible that Anderson, low and behold, wanted to play in Buffalo. Shocker!!!
John from Riverside Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Posting is a tough game for tough people. I guess my apology to Q wasnt good enough....
Gordio Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Well I wasn't ever complaining, nor was I bitching. And I am thrilled with the offseason moves. And the reason I "only want to talk about the one contract" is because this is a thread about that signing. Someone posted updated contract details. I commented that the deal looks better now. Someone else mentioned it doesn't matter what we paid him since we are under the cap. I replied that it does still matter and my opinion was $7M/yr is too much for a situational player. I even said that if he does become an every-down player the deal might be worth it. That's a big IF. I thought that was a very level-headed response. Anyways, it's clear you are more focused on attacking me and I've already said my peace, so I'm bowing out of this thread. Honestly what do you care what the Bills pay him. It is not your money & the salary cap as stated before is not an issue. I like the signing because they are a better defense with Anderson in the D-line rotation then without him. As a fan, that is the only thing you should care about. Honestly, some Bills fans just can't be happy no matter what this team does.
San Jose Bills Fan Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Honestly what do you care what the Bills pay him. It is not your money & the salary cap as stated before is not an issue. I like the signing because they are a better defense with Anderson in the D-line rotation then without him. As a fan, that is the only thing you should care about. Honestly, some Bills fans just can't be happy no matter what this team does. HEY!!! Cheer up! Why can't you just be happy?
Doc Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Honestly what do you care what the Bills pay him. It is not your money & the salary cap as stated before is not an issue. I like the signing because they are a better defense with Anderson in the D-line rotation then without him. As a fan, that is the only thing you should care about. Honestly, some Bills fans just can't be happy no matter what this team does. Really. If they don't spend, it's "Ralph's cheap." If they do spend, it's "they overpaid."
DanInUticaTampa Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Really. If they don't spend, it's "Ralph's cheap." If they do spend, it's "they overpaid." Those are the only two reasonable options.
1B4IDie Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Those are the only two reasonable options. All leading to the same outcome: The Bills are dooooooooooooooomed!
Kelly the Dog Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 I don't necessarily think they overpaid, although we won't know that for awhile. But why is not possible for someone to think we overpaid and still be thrilled that we signed him? Just because the guy thought we overpaid, or anyone thinks that, doesnt mean they are unhappy with the signing or the player being on the Bills or the front office.
Wayne Cubed Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 (edited) All leading to the same outcome: The Bills are dooooooooooooooomed! http://youtu.be/6bbIBs0P2t0 Edited March 27, 2012 by Wayne Cubed
LynchMob23 Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 (edited) Deal really worth 19.5 4 years, 19.5 Million is not bad at all... Free-agent defensive end Mark Anderson played his way into a giant increase in pay and a big contract when he signed with the Buffalo Bills. It's worth $19.5 million over four years, according to a league document obtained by The News. That's less than what was attributed to sources in numerous media sites, including The News, last week. Anderson will get $8 million this year and $10.5 million over the first two years of his deal, as was widely reported. Initial reports had the deal totalling $27.5 million. Anderson, who had 10 sacks for the New England Patriots last season, played on a on-year deal worth $1.37 million in 2011. The four-year average of Anderson's new deal is $4.875 million. He got a $6 million signing bonus plus a guaranteed base salary this year of $1.9 million, and a $100,000 workout bonus. His base salaries in subsequent years are $2.5 million, $4 million and $5 million. The addition of Anderson is key for the Bills' defense. He gives the team a healthy speed rushing option opposite newly acquired free-agent prize Mario Williams. If veteran Shawne Merriman can recover from an Achilles tendon injury or the Bills add another young rush man in the draft, that will just add to their pass-rush arsenal. ---Mark Gaughan Edited March 27, 2012 by LynchMob23
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