Doc Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Is anyone arguing that Zimmerman isn't culpable? It seems to me that Rob is. I think the real question at this point is whether he's criminally liable, or civilly liable... At the least, he's civilly liable. But under Florida's laws, acting in self-defense absolves one of criminal liability. So while Zimmerman may have created the situation, Martin's actions allowed Zimmerman to use deadly force.
Just Jack Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 New details emerge from Facebook and Twitter accounts, witness testimony
Dave_In_Norfolk Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 It seems to me that Rob is. At the least, he's civilly liable. But under Florida's laws, acting in self-defense absolves one of criminal liability. So while Zimmerman may have created the situation, Martin's actions allowed Zimmerman to use deadly force. Was he defending himself when he confronted the kid? Maybe the kid was defending himself from some nut that was unjustly confronting him.
Doc Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 (edited) Was he defending himself when he confronted the kid? Maybe the kid was defending himself from some nut that was unjustly confronting him. Verbally confronting someone isn't a crime, nor it is a justification for responding with violence. The only eyewitness account was that Martin was on top of Zimmerman and slamming his head into the ground. What is unknown is if Zimmerman physically confronted him, although from what the eyewitness said, he didn't. Edited March 27, 2012 by Doc
Dave_In_Norfolk Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Witness named John said Zimmerman was calling for help so John bravely ran away to call police Verbally confronting someone isn't a crime, nor it is a justification for responding with violence. The only eyewitness account was that Martin was on top of Zimmerman and slamming his head into the ground. What is unknown is if Zimmerman physically confronted him, although from what the eyewitness said, he didn't. How big were these two guys?
Doc Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Witness named John said Zimmerman was calling for help so John bravely ran away to call police How big were these two guys? Considering one of them was shot and killed, a smart move on John's part. Martin was 6'3 140# and Zimmerman was 5'9" and 250#.
3rdnlng Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 http://www.thesmokinggun.com/buster/trayvon-martin/cracker-tshirt-759832
Dave_In_Norfolk Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Considering one of them was shot and killed, a smart move on John's part. Martin was 6'3 140# and Zimmerman was 5'9" and 250#. Hundred and ten pounds on the kid? Wow, if this fat guy wanted to confront people perhaps he should have been able to handle himself a little better http://www.thesmokinggun.com/buster/trayvon-martin/cracker-tshirt-759832 Well.....
3rdnlng Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Considering one of them was shot and killed, a smart move on John's part. Martin was 6'3 140# and Zimmerman was 5'9" and 250#. Supposedly Zimmerman was sucker punched. Once a person gets the advantage in a fight if he knows what he is doing he can keep that advantage. Slamming Zimmerman's head into the concrete would certainly help Martin keep the advantage. That's Zimmerman's story. Is it plausible? Yes. Is it what happened? Who the hell knows at this point. You know what is ironic? Ray Lewis getting involved on Martin's side.
Rob's House Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 It seems to me that Rob is. According to the article from the Orlando Sentinel which Jack linked to earlier today, the account provided by Zimmerman and supported by eye witness account, Zimmerman was returning to his car when Martin came up behind him and asked him if he had a problem. Zimmerman said no, Martin said "you do now" and punched him in the face, breaking his nose and knocking him down, then got on top of him and started slamming his head against the concrete. I don't know for sure if this is how it played out, but that's the story that's being reported, I haven't seen anything that contradicts it, and it's supported by an eye witness. If that's the case then I don't see how he did anything to foreclose his right to shoot the guy on top of him smashing his skull against the sidewalk. Supposedly Zimmerman was sucker punched. Once a person gets the advantage in a fight if he knows what he is doing he can keep that advantage. Slamming Zimmerman's head into the concrete would certainly help Martin keep the advantage. That's Zimmerman's story. Is it plausible? Yes. Is it what happened? Who the hell knows at this point. You know what is ironic? Ray Lewis getting involved on Martin's side. No ****, right.
bbb Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 That's what's been missing from my life. Your particular flavor of aimless retardedness. Now I feel validated. I might have to hang out in this dungeon more. That's funny ****.
3rdnlng Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 I might have to hang out in this dungeon more. That's funny ****. Don't stroke the biggest prick here at PPP dammit.
Jim in Anchorage Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 (edited) The grieving mother. Also Monday, an attorney for Martin's mother confirmed that she filed trademark applications for two slogans containing her son's name: "Justice for Trayvon" and "I Am Trayvon." The applications said the trademarks could be used for such things as DVDs and CDs. The trademark attorney, Kimra Major-Morris, said in an email that Fulton wants to protect intellectual property rights for "projects that will assist other families who experience similar tragedies." Asked if Fulton had any profit motive, the attorney replied: "None." Edited March 27, 2012 by Jim in Anchorage
GaryPinC Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Just started following this story in more depth, agree with others that the local law enforcement and jury need to sort this out. It is to me absolutely disgraceful that our president goes shooting his mouth off about a racially charged issue before he has any of the facts. This is not the first time he has done this, and people may die because of an overly inflamed racially-tense situation. I really hope the Republicans can get their candidate's sh*t together before the election because we need a better statesman in the oval office. I am one who generally dislikes the press and their sensationalism (with words and carefully selected photos) but let's also credit the Orlando Sentinel and Miami Herald for trying to round out this story for all of us.
DC Tom Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Don't stroke the biggest prick here at PPP dammit. You're just jealous because you're not my only fan.
ExiledInIllinois Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 This would not be an issue if the DA worked a little harder since the get go and didn't just throw their hands up in the air with regard to stand your ground... That is what bothers me since the start of this... If it was the other way around... I am confident that they would have pressed harder from the start. Yet really, some creepy dude tails you... What are you gonna do? Ask questions? Get passive? If you are young and AA, running is not an option.. Makes you look like you are doing something wrong. The only option besides being a victim is to go ghetto on the stalker. Trayvon's problem is the guy had a gun. Why the heck was he being followed? What was so suspicious that Trayvon was doing... Even if he appeared to be under the influence... Who made Zimmerman Capt Drug Tester!
3rdnlng Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Just started following this story in more depth, agree with others that the local law enforcement and jury need to sort this out. It is to me absolutely disgraceful that our president goes shooting his mouth off about a racially charged issue before he has any of the facts. This is not the first time he has done this, and people may die because of an overly inflamed racially-tense situation. I really hope the Republicans can get their candidate's sh*t together before the election because we need a better statesman in the oval office. I am one who generally dislikes the press and their sensationalism (with words and carefully selected photos) but let's also credit the Orlando Sentinel and Miami Herald for trying to round out this story for all of us. Gary, you need to join us here.
....lybob Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Just started following this story in more depth, agree with others that the local law enforcement and jury need to sort this out. It is to me absolutely disgraceful that our president goes shooting his mouth off about a racially charged issue before he has any of the facts. This is not the first time he has done this, and people may die because of an overly inflamed racially-tense situation. I really hope the Republicans can get their candidate's sh*t together before the election because we need a better statesman in the oval office. I am one who generally dislikes the press and their sensationalism (with words and carefully selected photos) but let's also credit the Orlando Sentinel and Miami Herald for trying to round out this story for all of us. I missed the part where Obama said kill whitey- which part did you find incendiary. Well, I'm the head of the executive branch, and the attorney general reports to me, so I've got to be careful about my statements to make sure that we're not impairing any investigation that's taking place right now. But obviously, this is a tragedy. I can only imagine what these parents are going through. And when I think about this boy, I think about my own kids. And I think every parent in America should be able to understand why it is absolutely imperative that we investigate every aspect of this, and that everybody pulls together — federal, state and local — to figure out exactly how this tragedy happened. So I'm glad that not only is the Justice Department looking into it, I understand now that the governor of the state of Florida has formed a task force to investigate what's taking place. I think all of us have to do some soul-searching to figure out how does something like this happen. And that means that examine the laws and the context for what happened, as well as the specifics of the incident. But my main message is to the parents of Trayvon Martin. If I had a son, he'd look like Trayvon. And I think they are right to expect that all of us as Americans are going to take this with the seriousness it deserves, and that we're going to get to the bottom of exactly what happened.
ExiledInIllinois Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 Anybody read what Geraldo Rivera said about the hoodie? Blame the hoodie!
GG Posted March 27, 2012 Posted March 27, 2012 I missed the part where Obama said kill whitey- which part did you find incendiary. I also think you missed the treatise on Obama's mastery of implied vs inferred. Exactly how did the media run the story following Obama's quotes? Did the WH press corps tell anyone to slow down on the sensationalism, like they come down on anyone who dares to say that Obama got a bad shave in the morning?
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