3rdnlng Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Here's Andrew Branca's link to the Murder2 & Manslaughter question: http://lawofselfdefense.com/zimmerman-trial-if-state-cant-get-murder-2-can-they-get-manslaughter-yes-and-no/ And since TM was a minor, a manslaughter conviction could carry up to 30 years jail time. But the jury would not be told about that part. It doesn't matter how long of a sentence he gets, if GZ is convicted of even f'n jaywalking and has to spend any time in the general population of a prison, he gets capital punishment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Here's Andrew Branca's link to the Murder2 & Manslaughter question: http://lawofselfdefe...ter-yes-and-no/ It doesn't matter how long of a sentence he gets, if GZ is convicted of even f'n jaywalking and has to spend any time in the general population of a prison, he gets capital punishment. He would get PC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Here's Andrew Branca's link to the Murder2 & Manslaughter question: http://lawofselfdefe...ter-yes-and-no/ It doesn't matter how long of a sentence he gets, if GZ is convicted of even f'n jaywalking and has to spend any time in the general population of a prison, he gets capital punishment. Hell, if he's acquitted he gets capital punishment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 It doesn't matter how long of a sentence he gets, if GZ is convicted of even f'n jaywalking and has to spend any time in the general population of a prison, he gets capital punishment. He won't be put in gen pop. Hell, if he's acquitted he gets capital punishment. That's why I opined he takes the stand. Not that that will prevent him from being killed anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Hell, if he's acquitted he gets capital punishment. His best bet is to get put on that "Celebrities Who Got Bad Plastic Surgery" list, change his name to Aaron Hernandez and move to Belize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 If I were GZ, I'd tell the wife to start shopping for houses in another country and be ready to move there as soon as the trial ended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Jack Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Another point, re: the inconsistencies in Zimmerman's and everyone else's testimony. Yeah...eyewitnesses are notoriously inconsistent. A two minute discrepancy in testimony and phone records, for example, means jack **** - no one's checking their watch at the time. And having been in similar situations to Zimmerman's (actually, more similar to Martin's)...it is very difficult to keep track of exactly what's going on, when, and how when the adrenalin kicks in, and then relate it back after the fact. Not quite the same situation for me, but this past winter I had to give a deposition about the drunk driver I came across at 3am with his car up on top of a 3-4 foot snowbank. The Trooper was impressed with how much I remembered (this was about a week after the incident). I told him when I was in college, I took an elective on how to take depositions, so as soon as I pulled over, I started making mental notes on what I saw, time, etc, knowing I may have to give a statement. If I were GZ, I'd tell the wife to start shopping for houses in another country and be ready to move there as soon as the trial ended. What countries do white hispanics come from that he could move to and blend in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 What countries do white hispanics come from that he could move to and blend in? I doubt anyone would bother him in another country so there would be no need to go somewhere where he'd blend in. But I'd say Costa Rica would be a good place to settle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Another point, re: the inconsistencies in Zimmerman's and everyone else's testimony. Yeah...eyewitnesses are notoriously inconsistent. A two minute discrepancy in testimony and phone records, for example, means jack **** - no one's checking their watch at the time. And having been in similar situations to Zimmerman's (actually, more similar to Martin's)...it is very difficult to keep track of exactly what's going on, when, and how when the adrenalin kicks in, and then relate it back after the fact. I see your point and agree. That's why I don't make a huge deal out of GZ forgetting the street name or saying TM jumped out of the bushes when there are no bushes. Not a big deal. But, as far as the 2 minutes between when he hung up the phone and TM hung up his phone, leaves 2 minutes unaccounted for. What happened in those 2 minutes. They are real minutes as verified by the 911 records and TM's phone records. Was GZ following TM? Did he confront TM? The only witness to all of this is GZ and he has every reason to exaggerate and leave stuff out and out and out lie. His life is at stake as you pointed out. I came into this with and open mind and watched most of the testimony for two days including Doris Singleton, Chirs' first day, the doctor who treated GZ the next day, and the Medical Examiner and part of the DNA stuff. At first I thought GZ would get off for sure. His story sounded plausible at first. But the more I thought about it and the evidence I've seen tells me the struggle was not as GZ describes it. If his head got slammed into the sidewalk 20 - 25 times as he maintains, I would expect much more significant injury than 2 cuts to the head that didn't even require stitches. Maybe a concussion as well. With all the slamming and punching and nose holding GZ describes, I'd expect TM to have cuts on his hands too. He doesn't. At least a little GZ DNA under his nails. He has ZERO. I did read the article in your link too. Not very objective I don't think. Sure he makes some good points, but I don't see it as the railroad job he does. I still think GZ has a good chance to get off because the way the goofy FL law is, all he has to do is say he was afraid for his life or significant bodily harm. The "you're going to die tonight" comment pretty much gets him that if the jury believes his story. Sorry, I'm not buying it and wonder if the jury will as well. They can discard that if they think GZ is lying. Does the fact that a person violated his own neighborhood watch guidelines, the request of the 911 operator, and doing something just plain dumb (following a guy he thinks may have a gun, is up to no good, and "on drugs") into a dark place factor in at all? GZ put himself in that position. Does he then get to shoot someone? Probably so in the FL State law, but maybe he shouldn't. I'm wondering if the jury will think so too? Jury nullification. It happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 I see your point and agree. That's why I don't make a huge deal out of GZ forgetting the street name or saying TM jumped out of the bushes when there are no bushes. Not a big deal. But, as far as the 2 minutes between when he hung up the phone and TM hung up his phone, leaves 2 minutes unaccounted for. What happened in those 2 minutes. They are real minutes as verified by the 911 records and TM's phone records. Was GZ following TM? Did he confront TM? The only witness to all of this is GZ and he has every reason to exaggerate and leave stuff out and out and out lie. His life is at stake as you pointed out. I came into this with and open mind and watched most of the testimony for two days including Doris Singleton, Chirs' first day, the doctor who treated GZ the next day, and the Medical Examiner and part of the DNA stuff. At first I thought GZ would get off for sure. His story sounded plausible at first. But the more I thought about it and the evidence I've seen tells me the struggle was not as GZ describes it. If his head got slammed into the sidewalk 20 - 25 times as he maintains, I would expect much more significant injury than 2 cuts to the head that didn't even require stitches. Maybe a concussion as well. With all the slamming and punching and nose holding GZ describes, I'd expect TM to have cuts on his hands too. He doesn't. At least a little GZ DNA under his nails. He has ZERO. I did read the article in your link too. Not very objective I don't think. Sure he makes some good points, but I don't see it as the railroad job he does. I still think GZ has a good chance to get off because the way the goofy FL law is, all he has to do is say he was afraid for his life or significant bodily harm. The "you're going to die tonight" comment pretty much gets him that if the jury believes his story. Sorry, I'm not buying it and wonder if the jury will as well. They can discard that if they think GZ is lying. Does the fact that a person violated his own neighborhood watch guidelines, the request of the 911 operator, and doing something just plain dumb (following a guy he thinks may have a gun, is up to no good, and "on drugs") into a dark place factor in at all? GZ put himself in that position. Does he then get to shoot someone? Probably so in the FL State law, but maybe he shouldn't. I'm wondering if the jury will think so too? Jury nullification. It happens. I agree that "coming out of the bushes" statement could be just an expression, but if you look at pictures, there are bushes at every patio. Where does the statement from GZ that his head was slammed unto the cement 20-25 times come from? I can find only a CNN guest/talking head stating that he was struck that many times. I'm not saying that it isn't true, just would like confirmation. You do know that there were cuts to TM's knuckles, samples were handled improperly and that it was raining too, right? As far as time frames go, you do know that the prosecutions "star witness" placed TM outside his father's residence sometime before the altercation took place a few hundred feet from that residence and much closer to GZ's vehicle? If GZ was returning to his vehicle, where was this evil intent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 The defense gets up for cross on Sabrina Fulton and apologizes for the loss of her son. BDLR "I object." Stay classy, Florida. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Sabrina Fulton came off well. Though, for one question she was silly in my opinion, saying her one son is at FAU and the other is in heaven. It is very difficult, because they cannot bring in the information on her that she sent him to be with his father because she could not control him. Also, Andrew Branca, LOSD @LawSelfDefense #zimmermantrial : Rumored: State frantically polling Martin/Fulton family tree for more relatives who are uncertain if screamer was Trayvon. I find that hilarious. A locksmith is furiously trying to break in to the evidence locker, court is recessed until further notice. I find that more hilarious. Though, the door is now open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Sabrina Fulton came off well. Though, for one question she was silly in my opinion, saying her one son is at FAU and the other is in heaven. It is very difficult, because they cannot bring in the information on her that she sent him to be with his father because she could not control him. Also, Andrew Branca, LOSD @LawSelfDefense #zimmermantrial : Rumored: State frantically polling Martin/Fulton family tree for more relatives who are uncertain if screamer was Trayvon. I find that hilarious. A locksmith is furiously trying to break in to the evidence locker, court is recessed until further notice. I find that more hilarious. Though, the door is now open. Huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) Huh? im only half following today and thats third hand sources but it sounds like the state was trying to have evidence retrieved and couldnt get past the lock... it would be a fitting way to end their case. Edited July 5, 2013 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Huh? The state has been trying to find someone who could testify to voices on the tape that do not have mud in their water is the way I understood it. So many in the Fulton/Zimmerman family have made statements publicly that nearly anything they say can be contested and possibly impeached. The state must not have realized Trayvon's half brother gave an interview where he said he was unsure of the voice. They also realize that Tracy Martin can be called to the stand and have to testify that at many points he said the screaming voice was not his son. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald Duck Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) Bullet trajectory being straight through the heart seems odd considering Zimmermans account of what happened. Zimmermans blood ending up on the front of martins sweatshirt without Zimmerman being on top of Martin with Martin facing him seems odd. Martin reaching for Zimmermans weapon would have martin reaching in between his own legs with very little room to maneuver which also seems odd. Again, why lie about having been taught/instructed on stand your ground... Edited July 5, 2013 by dog14787 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Huh? That's Andrew Branca's sarcasm. If you see him call something a rumor he's definately just making fun of one party or the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 That's Andrew Branca's sarcasm. If you see him call something a rumor he's definately just making fun of one party or the other. Ohh. I thought he already understood it was a joke. I am looking at twitter streaming #Zimmerman. I cannot believe what I am reading. If Zimmerman does not get convicted of anything then I really worry what this country will do. Of course, we can only hope a Kardashian makes a sex tape, Bieber drives drunk, or anything that breaks the 60 second attention span of this country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 I am looking at twitter streaming #Zimmerman. I cannot believe what I am reading. I saw it a couple of days ago, and I have to admit it's pretty scary. This isn't your usual collection of progressive nutbags planning to boycott Chick-Fil-A. There are countless people in that stream ready to hunt down and kill ZImmerman while simultaneously planning to burn down the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meazza Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Ohh. I thought he already understood it was a joke. I am looking at twitter streaming #Zimmerman. I cannot believe what I am reading. If Zimmerman does not get convicted of anything then I really worry what this country will do. Of course, we can only hope a Kardashian makes a sex tape, Bieber drives drunk, or anything that breaks the 60 second attention span of this country. It's twitter. Who gives a !@#$? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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