EVERY FITZPATRICK HATER

[PDaDdy]

It doesn't matter if he was throwing to the same guys or not. It's the scheme that they defended. Short pass after short pass. Press the WRs and bring some heat. If we get some better wrs, ones that can get off the line and get deep quick, maybe things will change. Hopefully Fitz will be able to connect.

 

We lost all our speed by trading Lee Evans and Donald Jones, Marcus Easley and Roscoe Parrish going down. Those were all of our guys that could run faster than a 4.5. How do you throw deep when he got rid of the ball on average in less than 2.36 seconds and nobody had the speed to get open? With the revolving door of WRs with no timing and chemistry developed I wonder how he connected on any of them sometimes.

 

I find it funny that the people that make up any and every excuse as to why fitz regressed (any other than his arm) in the 2nd half always point to to our wrs getting hurt. Stevie's injury I can understand, but he was playing. The only other significant injuries that occurred after 5-2 record was jones and chandler. Did fitz really miss DONALD JONES, that much? Were the guys that replaced him THAT much worse than Donald jones? The injury to chandler hurt him some, but it's not like the guy was catching a bunch of balls each game. He only had one game, after week three in which he caught a td. Losing Fred and the OL hurt fitz more than the injuries to the wrs. We replaced backup Wr with another backup.

 

I find it funny that people ignore all of the injuries and crap this team had to go through by the mid point of the season. Did he miss Donald Jones? YES! Was Donald Jones great? HELL NO...but he was fast. Speed ALWAYS draws attention. We didn't have any and defenses squatted on the short to intermediate routes on our slow WRs. Throw in the rib injury which probably affected his deep ball the most and you gets what we got.

 

I'm going to fitz the benefit of the doubt and hope that it was his rib injury that was the primary cause for his poor play. The injuries played a part, but he had several terrible throws that had nothing to do with the guys blocking or running routes. They were just awful passes. Until he leads us to the playoffs, I'll be campaigning for acquiring a more talented QB. So should you.

 

I'll not only give Fitz the benefit of the doubt I will do this optimistic thing of supporting him. You should try it. Our guys usually play better when people are cheering not bitching and moaning. The list is long of all the things that went wrong with this team including Fitz's own injury which he was a tough guy about and hid until his WRs brought it up and blew him in. Instead of trying to be a manly man he should have just been open about it, put himself on the injury report and then maybe people would have seen things in a different light. He did make some awful passes and his WRs had some awful drops too but nobody is hating on them.

Edited March 8, 2012 by PDaDdy

[ETD66SS]

"Whats funny is when we were 5-2 i dont remember hearing anyone talking crap about our qb

 

I was...

 

He is, and always will be too inaccurate to take any NFL team to a SB victory.

 

I don't hate him, he seems like a really cool guy. He's just not very good.

[CosmicBills]

What does 2008 have anything to do with 2011 and beyond?

 

The subject in my post was whether or not accuracy could be taught. There are some that believe it can. But the majority of coaches, players and QBs think it can't.

 

Fitz has played in 10+ games for 4 seasons in a row. His accuracy has gone up each year. But despite that, his completion percentage over that stretch is still a paltry 58%. That factors in his 62% completion this year. If 58% is his baseline accuracy, then it's unrealistic to expect him to go much higher than 5 or 6 percentage points over this average.

 

Is it possible? Certainly. Nothing is impossible. But is it likely?

 

Injury or not, Fitz dropped off last year after an absolute beastly start to the season. The injury played a role but the law of averages suggests that that drop off was inevitable because Fitz is a career 58% passer. Chances are, injuries or not, that 68% start to the season he had would have leveled off on its own.

 

The truth is you can look at the stats last season to make any argument you want. But looking at one season in a vacuum -- especially a season that was so unique with Fitz's injury and the lock out -- is not very enlightening. With SO many variables at play (the injuries to the OL / WR corps / Fitz etc) you can't draw any real conclusions about Fitzpatrick in 2010. Well, other than he's a tough mo' fo.

 

But if you look at the man's career (and he's had THREE seasons now as as starting QB in this league -- 52 starts, 58 games played) he has a history of hovering under 60%. And, if you agree with guys like Steve Young, Mike Holmgren, Bill Walsh, etc etc and think accuracy is an innate trait, then expecting Fitz to end up throwing CONSISTENTLY near the 65-70% range is just ... well, foolish.

 

Now, if you believe accuracy can be taught, then that's cool. You're just up against a lot of statistical data that seems to say otherwise.

 

 

 

I know the haters love to attempt to judge Fitz in a vacuum and blame him for all the ills of the world but it is foolish to ignore all of the real world factors that made this a 6 - 10 TEAM!!! Let me know when Aaron Rogers, Drew Brees or Tom Brady become available and then we can talk. Until then try actually supporting your team and it's QB instead of bemoaning the fact that he isn't one of the best ever.

 

It's like your girlfriend whining because you proposed with a 1 carat diamond ring not a 2 carat diamond ring. Those types of QBs are RARE. Accept what we have and try supporting them to make them the best they can be instead of biatching.

 

This is the type of post that makes me cringe when they read you. I hope you understand that. This is like the people saying if you didn't support the war you didn't support the troops. The two are not mutually exclusive. I know Fitz is the starting QB of the Buffalo Bills. I understand that there is very little chance that the Bills make any kind of move to replace him before the season begins. I also like Fitz, I root for him, I cheer when he throws TDs. But I love the Buffalo Bills more than I love Fitz. I believe that Fitz is an average at best NFL QB. And I also believe that NO TEAM can win a Super Bowl without an elite QB on its roster in today's NFL.

 

We as fans have a right to B word about what we perceive as weaknesses on our team just as you have the right to blindly defend your team or choose to ignore reality. It doesn't make either one of us a "better" fan. It just makes us different people. I'm the sort of person who doesn't think unconditional love of a team means having to pretend that team is flawless. I'm the sort of person who thinks that it's the fans' job to point out the flaws -- not out of malice or "hater-ism" -- but out of a sense of responsibility. I want nothing more than to see the Bills win the Super Bowl. Multiple Super Bowls if I had my way.

 

I know that might sound crazy because after all I'm just a guy on a message board. I live in reality and understand that owners, GMs and coaches don't run their teams based on the whims of its fans. To paraphrase Marv, if they did that they'd all be out of a job. But that doesn't mean that the fans have no impact on the direction their franchises take. Fans, as a whole, are what drives the sport. And as such, fans have always had the ability to incite change within their favorite teams. You see it happen all the time in every sport -- coaches go on the hot seat, players get traded -- sometimes in large part due to trying to keep the fans happy. Now, thanks to the internet and social media, fans have more access to players, coaches and GMs than ever before. And I believe that fans have the responsibility to talk openly about the flaws on their teams in hopes of improving their team's chances of winning a championship.

 

I believe that the Buffalo Bills are not being managed well. I believe that Ralph Wilson does not possess either the ability or the desire to build a winning team. I believe that Nix is a backroom hire and has done just enough to get by but not enough to build a winner. I also believe that Fitz is not capable of leading a team to a Super Bowl.

 

But I'm still a fan of the Buffalo Bills.

 

To me it's far better to voice your concerns than it is to hide your head in the sand and wish for things to improve on their own. I'm too much of a control freak to think that way -- even though I realize that thinking my opinion will somehow influence change is kinda ... nuts. But it makes me feel more connected to the team I cheer for. It makes me care more if I believe I can actually have an impact on the fortunes of my team.

 

Hell, isn't that why we all love going to the games in person? We want to be there and cheer as loudly as we can to impact the game and help the Bills win. If you're like me, you have superstitions -- like wearing a lucky jersey, watching the game from a certain spot. As a rational person I know these superstitions aren't really going to impact the game ... but it's more fun to believe.

 

And that's my way of supporting my team. Doesn't make it better than yours. Doesn't make it worse. But it's not bitching just to B word.

 

Regarding Fitz's accuracy, last year he had a career best of 62%. So he's trending upward for his career.

 

But the difference between the first seven games of last season (through the Redskins game when he was injured)and the nine games after is stark:

 

1st 7 games: 68%

Last nine: 57%

 

That is more a reflection of injuries to him and those around him than anything else, including the idea that defenses simply caught up with him (he still had five games of 63% or better in those last nine, which isn't too shabby).

 

While an improvement in mechanics may result in some improved accuracy, the biggest factor for Fitz is running an offense that won't ask him to throw a ton of low percentage passes. And that's exactly what Gailey designed for him, his receivers and, perhaps most importantly, the offensive line.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

I don't disagree that the 11 point drop had to do with injuries. I think anyone with any desire to look at the situation rationally would agree with that.

 

But.

 

I would argue that the 11 point drop isn't the oddity. Instead I think the 11 point rise is the real number to examine.

 

Fitz finished 2010 with a 57% completion percentage. Then he jumped up to 68% during the first 7 games. That's a BIG jump. The optimistic way to look at it is to see it as Fitz finally becoming the "man" and that 68% is the real Fitzpatrcik. The skeptics look at that 68% as a statistical oddity that would have evened out over the course of the season even without the injury. They see that number as being the result of a new offensive scheme that caught teams off guard coupled with the fallout of the lockout.

 

We'll find out who's right in 2012.

[K-9]

The subject in my post was whether or not accuracy could be taught. There are some that believe it can. But the majority of coaches, players and QBs think it can't.

 

Fitz has played in 10+ games for 4 seasons in a row. His accuracy has gone up each year. But despite that, his completion percentage over that stretch is still a paltry 58%. That factors in his 62% completion this year. If 58% is his baseline accuracy, then it's unrealistic to expect him to go much higher than 5 or 6 percentage points over this average.

 

Is it possible? Certainly. Nothing is impossible. But is it likely?

 

Injury or not, Fitz dropped off last year after an absolute beastly start to the season. The injury played a role but the law of averages suggests that that drop off was inevitable because Fitz is a career 58% passer. Chances are, injuries or not, that 68% start to the season he had would have leveled off on its own.

 

The truth is you can look at the stats last season to make any argument you want. But looking at one season in a vacuum -- especially a season that was so unique with Fitz's injury and the lock out -- is not very enlightening. With SO many variables at play (the injuries to the OL / WR corps / Fitz etc) you can't draw any real conclusions about Fitzpatrick in 2010. Well, other than he's a tough mo' fo.

 

But if you look at the man's career (and he's had THREE seasons now as as starting QB in this league -- 52 starts, 58 games played) he has a history of hovering under 60%. And, if you agree with guys like Steve Young, Mike Holmgren, Bill Walsh, etc etc and think accuracy is an innate trait, then expecting Fitz to end up throwing CONSISTENTLY near the 65-70% range is just ... well, foolish.

 

Now, if you believe accuracy can be taught, then that's cool. You're just up against a lot of statistical data that seems to say otherwise.

 

 

 

 

This is the type of post that makes me cringe when they read you. I hope you understand that. This is like the people saying if you didn't support the war you didn't support the troops. The two are not mutually exclusive. I know Fitz is the starting QB of the Buffalo Bills. I understand that there is very little chance that the Bills make any kind of move to replace him before the season begins. I also like Fitz, I root for him, I cheer when he throws TDs. But I love the Buffalo Bills more than I love Fitz. I believe that Fitz is an average at best NFL QB. And I also believe that NO TEAM can win a Super Bowl without an elite QB on its roster in today's NFL.

 

We as fans have a right to B word about what we perceive as weaknesses on our team just as you have the right to blindly defend your team or choose to ignore reality. It doesn't make either one of us a "better" fan. It just makes us different people. I'm the sort of person who doesn't think unconditional love of a team means having to pretend that team is flawless. I'm the sort of person who thinks that it's the fans' job to point out the flaws -- not out of malice or "hater-ism" -- but out of a sense of responsibility. I want nothing more than to see the Bills win the Super Bowl. Multiple Super Bowls if I had my way.

 

I know that might sound crazy because after all I'm just a guy on a message board. I live in reality and understand that owners, GMs and coaches don't run their teams based on the whims of its fans. To paraphrase Marv, if they did that they'd all be out of a job. But that doesn't mean that the fans have no impact on the direction their franchises take. Fans, as a whole, are what drives the sport. And as such, fans have always had the ability to incite change within their favorite teams. You see it happen all the time in every sport -- coaches go on the hot seat, players get traded -- sometimes in large part due to trying to keep the fans happy. Now, thanks to the internet and social media, fans have more access to players, coaches and GMs than ever before. And I believe that fans have the responsibility to talk openly about the flaws on their teams in hopes of improving their team's chances of winning a championship.

 

I believe that the Buffalo Bills are not being managed well. I believe that Ralph Wilson does not possess either the ability or the desire to build a winning team. I believe that Nix is a backroom hire and has done just enough to get by but not enough to build a winner. I also believe that Fitz is not capable of leading a team to a Super Bowl.

 

But I'm still a fan of the Buffalo Bills.

 

To me it's far better to voice your concerns than it is to hide your head in the sand and wish for things to improve on their own. I'm too much of a control freak to think that way -- even though I realize that thinking my opinion will somehow influence change is kinda ... nuts. But it makes me feel more connected to the team I cheer for. It makes me care more if I believe I can actually have an impact on the fortunes of my team.

 

Hell, isn't that why we all love going to the games in person? We want to be there and cheer as loudly as we can to impact the game and help the Bills win. If you're like me, you have superstitions -- like wearing a lucky jersey, watching the game from a certain spot. As a rational person I know these superstitions aren't really going to impact the game ... but it's more fun to believe.

 

And that's my way of supporting my team. Doesn't make it better than yours. Doesn't make it worse. But it's not bitching just to B word.

 

 

 

I don't disagree that the 11 point drop had to do with injuries. I think anyone with any desire to look at the situation rationally would agree with that.

 

But.

 

I would argue that the 11 point drop isn't the oddity. Instead I think the 11 point rise is the real number to examine.

 

Fitz finished 2010 with a 57% completion percentage. Then he jumped up to 68% during the first 7 games. That's a BIG jump. The optimistic way to look at it is to see it as Fitz finally becoming the "man" and that 68% is the real Fitzpatrcik. The skeptics look at that 68% as a statistical oddity that would have evened out over the course of the season even without the injury. They see that number as being the result of a new offensive scheme that caught teams off guard coupled with the fallout of the lockout.

 

We'll find out who's right in 2012.

 

I don't think there is any mystery as to the 11% rise or the low number of sacks and pressure given up by the OLine for that matter. They are both directly related to Gailey's design of an offense built to minimize deficiencies. First time in Fitz's career that's been the case.

 

I agree 2012 will be very telling as he will now have a second season in the system along with an entire offseason in which to prepare.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[D2K]

What does 2008 have anything to do with 2011 and beyond?

 

 

 

As it is always said defenses take less time to get up to speed and offenses need time to develop chemistry and rhythm. I would say the exact opposite is true. Our defense got worse as the year went on. Our offense got worse as well due to an overwhelming number of injuries at key spots like WR and O-line. By mid season we had a wild cat QB and a RB starting at WR. Add that to a banged up injured groin SJ and that is piss poor talent to work with as a QB.

 

The lockout was more disruptive to defenses than offenses, and for obvious reasons this effect was strongest earlier in the season.

[Bronc24]

Downfield accuracy is tough with broken ribs when you can't even call a whole play with one breath in the huddle

 

 

Those ribs were broken AFTER he underthrew Stevie for 2 picks in the Giants game.

 

Fitz played well at the beginning of the year because of the lockouts effect on defenses in this league. Here is one of many examples to back this point:

 

I feel that this year the teams that prospered were able to exploit defensive misalignments and coverage breakdowns that were endemic early in the season as a result of the reduced practice time caused by the lockout. I'd suggest that this was partly responsible for the explosion of passing across the league.

 

Now to my example.

 

Wes Welker - After five games Welker had 740 yards, an average of 148 yards per game, in the remaining eleven weeks he averaged 75 yards per game, which extrapolates to about 1200 yards, which is close to the sort of numbers he normally puts up.

 

You can NOT deny the effect that the lockout had. Defenses got better, teams got better, the Bills have Ryan Fitzpatrick and went 1-8 down the stretch

 

Smart reply.

[12Kachy]

Whats funny is when we were 5-2 i dont remember hearing anyone talking crap about our qb. 8 injuries later our team was weakened. This fall Nix will have the pieces in place to compete and win our division!!!!!!!!!! Then we will see how many people want another qb. Cause i wont!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I hated F$tzmoney when they first signed him from the Bengals. He is a backup getting paid starter money. You'll hate him too by mid way of the next season.

 

Of course, I hope I'm wrong and he does become a franchise QB. But his history says other wise.

 

Those ribs were broken AFTER he underthrew Stevie for 2 picks in the Giants game.

 

 

 

Smart reply.

 

 

Yeah. His ribs have nothing to do with him being the most accurate passer from -5 to 3 yards. Other then that, he is a interception machine. I want to believe, but being good for 8 games out of 7 seasons is just terrible. Everyone wants to talk injuries. What happened when he took over from Palmer in Cini. They had Ochocinco, Hous and two good receivers. He stunk it up. He has thrown more picks then ints in all but one season. The only guys looking to the future and not his past are the Buffalo Bills. Everyone else knew he is a backup and probably a third stringer besides the team looking for "that guy" for a entire decade since Kelly retired.

[NewEra]

1331250004[/url]' post='2399183']

We lost all our speed by trading Lee Evans and Donald Jones, Marcus Easley and Roscoe Parrish going down. Those were all of our guys that could run faster than a 4.5. How do you throw deep when he got rid of the ball on average in less than 2.36 seconds and nobody had the speed to get open? With the revolving door of WRs with no timing and chemistry developed I wonder how he connected on any of them sometimes.

 

 

 

I find it funny that people ignore all of the injuries and crap this team had to go through by the mid point of the season. Did he miss Donald Jones? YES! Was Donald Jones great? HELL NO...but he was fast. Speed ALWAYS draws attention. We didn't have any and defenses squatted on the short to intermediate routes on our slow WRs. Throw in the rib injury which probably affected his deep ball the most and you gets what we got.

 

 

 

I'll not only give Fitz the benefit of the doubt I will do this optimistic thing of supporting him. You should try it. Our guys usually play better when people are cheering not bitching and moaning. The list is long of all the things that went wrong with this team including Fitz's own injury which he was a tough guy about and hid until his WRs brought it up and blew him in. Instead of trying to be a manly man he should have just been open about it, put himself on the injury report and then maybe people would have seen things in a different light. He did make some awful passes and his WRs had some awful drops too but nobody is hating on them.

 

- Evans, Parrish and Easley we're a big part of our 5-2 start. When they got hurt, it got ugly. Oh wait, they weren't on the team when we went 5-2 (unless you count Parrish's 10 plays). Them not being on the team during the collapse meant nothing. I'm not sure why it's discussed. Yes, we had little to no talent at Wr. During the collapse. We had little to no talent during our 5-2 start. It's not like all of a sudden our Wr unit was out. We only lost one guy from the start of the season. He never had any targets throw to.

 

 

--I can't see how losing Donald jones would really alter a DCs gameplay against us. Teams did not have to respect donalds jones speed. Why would they? He's Donald jones. He had Ryan Fitzpatrick throwing him the ball. 2 guys that haven't done anything to warrant a dc to worry about them. Pretty simple equation to me if I was the DC. Take away the short easy passes and make the qb and wrs make some plays. No one ignored the injuries. You're making stuff up. I said in my previous post that the injuries had a part in the collapse.

 

 

---clueless. I support Fitz. He's the Bills starting qb. I root like heck for the guy. Just because I support him doesn't mean I can't say we could do much better if we had a more talented qb. I support Chris Kelsey too, but we could've done a heck of a lot better of we had someone else playing OLB the last 2 years. Qb is the most important position and if I don't think fitz is a great qb, I would hope our GM would try and upgrade it. I like him. We'd be better with a better qb. Simple as that. ---you don't think tsw ever hates on our wrs? Lol

 

[NewEra]

1331253407[/url]' post='2399217']

The subject in my post was whether or not accuracy could be taught. There are some that believe it can. But the majority of coaches, players and QBs think it can't.

 

Fitz has played in 10+ games for 4 seasons in a row. His accuracy has gone up each year. But despite that, his completion percentage over that stretch is still a paltry 58%. That factors in his 62% completion this year. If 58% is his baseline accuracy, then it's unrealistic to expect him to go much higher than 5 or 6 percentage points over this average.

 

Is it possible? Certainly. Nothing is impossible. But is it likely?

 

Injury or not, Fitz dropped off last year after an absolute beastly start to the season. The injury played a role but the law of averages suggests that that drop off was inevitable because Fitz is a career 58% passer. Chances are, injuries or not, that 68% start to the season he had would have leveled off on its own.

 

The truth is you can look at the stats last season to make any argument you want. But looking at one season in a vacuum -- especially a season that was so unique with Fitz's injury and the lock out -- is not very enlightening. With SO many variables at play (the injuries to the OL / WR corps / Fitz etc) you can't draw any real conclusions about Fitzpatrick in 2010. Well, other than he's a tough mo' fo.

 

But if you look at the man's career (and he's had THREE seasons now as as starting QB in this league -- 52 starts, 58 games played) he has a history of hovering under 60%. And, if you agree with guys like Steve Young, Mike Holmgren, Bill Walsh, etc etc and think accuracy is an innate trait, then expecting Fitz to end up throwing CONSISTENTLY near the 65-70% range is just ... well, foolish.

 

Now, if you believe accuracy can be taught, then that's cool. You're just up against a lot of statistical data that seems to say otherwise.

 

 

 

 

This is the type of post that makes me cringe when they read you. I hope you understand that. This is like the people saying if you didn't support the war you didn't support the troops. The two are not mutually exclusive. I know Fitz is the starting QB of the Buffalo Bills. I understand that there is very little chance that the Bills make any kind of move to replace him before the season begins. I also like Fitz, I root for him, I cheer when he throws TDs. But I love the Buffalo Bills more than I love Fitz. I believe that Fitz is an average at best NFL QB. And I also believe that NO TEAM can win a Super Bowl without an elite QB on its roster in today's NFL.

 

We as fans have a right to B word about what we perceive as weaknesses on our team just as you have the right to blindly defend your team or choose to ignore reality. It doesn't make either one of us a "better" fan. It just makes us different people. I'm the sort of person who doesn't think unconditional love of a team means having to pretend that team is flawless. I'm the sort of person who thinks that it's the fans' job to point out the flaws -- not out of malice or "hater-ism" -- but out of a sense of responsibility. I want nothing more than to see the Bills win the Super Bowl. Multiple Super Bowls if I had my way.

 

I know that might sound crazy because after all I'm just a guy on a message board. I live in reality and understand that owners, GMs and coaches don't run their teams based on the whims of its fans. To paraphrase Marv, if they did that they'd all be out of a job. But that doesn't mean that the fans have no impact on the direction their franchises take. Fans, as a whole, are what drives the sport. And as such, fans have always had the ability to incite change within their favorite teams. You see it happen all the time in every sport -- coaches go on the hot seat, players get traded -- sometimes in large part due to trying to keep the fans happy. Now, thanks to the internet and social media, fans have more access to players, coaches and GMs than ever before. And I believe that fans have the responsibility to talk openly about the flaws on their teams in hopes of improving their team's chances of winning a championship.

 

I believe that the Buffalo Bills are not being managed well. I believe that Ralph Wilson does not possess either the ability or the desire to build a winning team. I believe that Nix is a backroom hire and has done just enough to get by but not enough to build a winner. I also believe that Fitz is not capable of leading a team to a Super Bowl.

 

But I'm still a fan of the Buffalo Bills.

 

To me it's far better to voice your concerns than it is to hide your head in the sand and wish for things to improve on their own. I'm too much of a control freak to think that way -- even though I realize that thinking my opinion will somehow influence change is kinda ... nuts. But it makes me feel more connected to the team I cheer for. It makes me care more if I believe I can actually have an impact on the fortunes of my team.

 

Hell, isn't that why we all love going to the games in person? We want to be there and cheer as loudly as we can to impact the game and help the Bills win. If you're like me, you have superstitions -- like wearing a lucky jersey, watching the game from a certain spot. As a rational person I know these superstitions aren't really going to impact the game ... but it's more fun to believe.

 

And that's my way of supporting my team. Doesn't make it better than yours. Doesn't make it worse. But it's not bitching just to B word.

 

 

 

I don't disagree that the 11 point drop had to do with injuries. I think anyone with any desire to look at the situation rationally would agree with that.

 

But.

 

I would argue that the 11 point drop isn't the oddity. Instead I think the 11 point rise is the real number to examine.

 

Fitz finished 2010 with a 57% completion percentage. Then he jumped up to 68% during the first 7 games. That's a BIG jump. The optimistic way to look at it is to see it as Fitz finally becoming the "man" and that 68% is the real Fitzpatrcik. The skeptics look at that 68% as a statistical oddity that would have evened out over the course of the season even without the injury. They see that number as being the result of a new offensive scheme that caught teams off guard coupled with the fallout of the lockout.

 

We'll find out who's right in 2012.

 

Well put together post. I feel the same in every respect minus the part where you said that no team can win the SB without an elite QB. If Kyle Williams (49ers) didn't completely breakdown, I believe Alex smith would've had a ring. Well, Kyle Williams did breakdown so smith didn't win one, but I definitely believe a non elite qb CAN win a SB in today's game. The odds are against it, but I feel it's definitely possible with a great defense and good coaching.

 

 

 

[Hater]

I don't hate Fitzpatrick He not just a starting QB I said it before, during & after the season I said it when we where 3-0, I am not knock him he did a good job but he is a guy that will win 4 or 5 games & thats it, if he was the teams back up now you could be secure at QB but as a starter for a full season No

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

Fitz is NOT great. He's good enough to get the job done.

 

If that makes me a hater what does it the Fitz Fanatics?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

The subject in my post was whether or not accuracy could be taught. There are some that believe it can. But the majority of coaches, players and QBs think it can't.

 

This is the point where I guess I'd like to see some evidence. I read this assertion a lot, and I've never seen coaches players and QBs on the record stating this, actually. If you have, point me there please.

 

Gailey states that Fitz has accuracy. Based on what we all see, I can't disagree. We all see there are times when he threads the needle in tight coverage, right?

Lee (new QB coach) states that Fitz is very accurate when he's making funny body throws, and sometimes inaccurate when he has time to plant and throw. He's watched more film than we have, and seems to feel it's an issue of mechanics that can be corrected.

 

Fitz has played in 10+ games for 4 seasons in a row. His accuracy has gone up each year. But despite that, his completion percentage over that stretch is still a paltry 58%. That factors in his 62% completion this year. If 58% is his baseline accuracy, then it's unrealistic to expect him to go much higher than 5 or 6 percentage points over this average.

 

Is it possible? Certainly. Nothing is impossible. But is it likely?

 

I hesitate to respond here because it's axiomatic that if one mentions other QBs, some maroon will conclude one is stating Fitz is comparable to said QB - let me put it up front that's not the point, 'kay guys?

The point is to give examples of QBs whose completion percentage has improved considerably during their career.

 

Two points here. One, 5 or 6 percentage points over 58% completion or a steady 63-64% completion, would put Fitz into the top 10 QB in the league the last 3 years.

Two, there are a bunch of QB in the record book who have improved 5-6% in completion between their first years in the league, and their later years.

It's not uncommon at all, and is to some degree a function of the system. Rich Gannon would perhaps be the best known example - 56% completion in 6 years with Minn, 62% completion in 6 years with Oak.

Michael Vick, whom I loathe, would be another well-known example - 54% in 6 years with Atl, 61% in 3 years with Philly. There are plenty of other examples. Drew Brees is one - his average completions went up significantly between his first 3 years in the league and later, and between SD vs NO. Matt Schaub would perhaps be a more comparable QB example - 52% ave in 3 years with Atl, 65% in 5 years with Houston. StL certainly hopes this stuff can improve, given their Franchise boy, Mr Bradford, is running 58% his first two years in the league.

 

Exhaustive analysis? No, but enough examples that I think it's reasonable to question the premise improvement is "not likely" absent some exhaustive analysis supporting that point.

 

But if you look at the man's career (and he's had THREE seasons now as as starting QB in this league -- 52 starts, 58 games played) he has a history of hovering under 60%. And, if you agree with guys like Steve Young, Mike Holmgren, Bill Walsh, etc etc and think accuracy is an innate trait, then expecting Fitz to end up throwing CONSISTENTLY near the 65-70% range is just ... well, foolish.

 

Now, if you believe accuracy can be taught, then that's cool. You're just up against a lot of statistical data that seems to say otherwise.

 

This is an interesting collection of names to cite, because Steve Young is the Poster Child of a QB whose completion percentage improved dramatically after 4 years in the league - 53% in his first two years with Tampa, similar during his first two seasons in SF, then soaring to 65% during the rest of his SF life. Either his career refutes his own claim, or perhaps completion percentage is not a good measure of accuracy - having a lot to do with the system, the receivers, experience with the system/receivers and other factors?

 

I'd be happy to be educated, so please, lead me to that statistical data that seems to say otherwise, 'cuz I seem to find a lot of statistical data that says it happens quite a bit to see a QB improve 5-6% in completion percentage.

 

I don't disagree that the 11 point drop had to do with injuries. I think anyone with any desire to look at the situation rationally would agree with that.

 

But.

 

I would argue that the 11 point drop isn't the oddity. Instead I think the 11 point rise is the real number to examine.

 

Fitz finished 2010 with a 57% completion percentage. Then he jumped up to 68% during the first 7 games. That's a BIG jump. The optimistic way to look at it is to see it as Fitz finally becoming the "man" and that 68% is the real Fitzpatrcik. The skeptics look at that 68% as a statistical oddity that would have evened out over the course of the season even without the injury. They see that number as being the result of a new offensive scheme that caught teams off guard coupled with the fallout of the lockout.

 

We'll find out who's right in 2012.

 

I think we all can agree on that last point. We'll see in 2012.

[xsoldier54]

So using the Matt Cassel example. He LEAD the Patriots to a 11-5 record in relief of Brady having not taken a snap since High School in a game that mattered. He goes to the Chiefs who gave up a poop load to get him and he LEAD his team to 4 -12(2008), 10-6(2009) and a 4-5(2011). What happened? He is a leader! He is a great QB! Didn't he PROVE he could do it?

 

Maybe, just maybe KC wasn't as good of a TEAM as New England and he isn't as good of a fit in their system? Maybe just MAYBE TEAMS win and lose games. Isn't it just possible?

One season on a very good team does not prove that Cassel was a good QB. Yes, I agree that a QB has a better chance of winning games when the talent around him is better. Good QB's manage to make their team mates more successful and can LEAD their team to wins in close games however. I contend that it doesn't matter who you put around Fitz. He will make mistakes that will cost his team games. He has proven that he will do that. It's okay if you don't agree with that premise, but I am basing it on watching him perform in games and his actual record as a starter. From what I can gather, he is a good guy and the team enjoys playing with him. I just believe he has some fatal flaws in his game and they will continue to surface. And by the way it's spelled LED when using it in the past tense.