birdog1960 Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 swiss wages Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I suggest you get packing. "The person must be well integrated, familiar with customs and traditions, law abiding, and pose no threat to internal or external security." Sounds like they want them to assimilate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 ok then. as masters of the universe lets compromise: $10/hour for minimum wage and we can keep our individuality, not to mention OUR evil bankers. Which gets back to the whole "you don't know what you're talking about" thing... What happens to the "living wage" when you raise wages and pass the cost on to the consumer? The cost of living goes up, and it's no longer a living wage. And if you respond "But the Swiss manage it," I'm going to kick you in the !@#$ing head. "The person must be well integrated, familiar with customs and traditions, law abiding, and pose no threat to internal or external security." Sounds like they want them to assimilate. Or else Jim in Anchorage shoots them in the head... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Which gets back to the whole "you don't know what you're talking about" thing... What happens to the "living wage" when you raise wages and pass the cost on to the consumer? The cost of living goes up, and it's no longer a living wage. it more closely approaches a living wage if costs go up less than wages. in the test tubes countries that have done this, i believe that's generally been the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 the swiss franc and dollar are almost at par. 10% of swiss make less than 4000 francs/month or about $48000/year. those are numbers even the most ardent american liberal would be content with. Your response shows just how little you actually know about Switzerland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Your response shows just how little you actually know about Switzerland. those numbers including the exchange rate come from the piece you linked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
....lybob Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Switzerland is among the world's most prosperous countries in terms of private income. In 2007 the gross median household income in Switzerland was an estimated 107,748 CHF, or USD 137,094 at purchasing power parity. The median income after social security, taxes and mandatory health insurance was 75,312 CHF, or USD 95,824 at purchasing power parity. Right now the Swiss Franc is worth $1.10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Switzerland is among the world's most prosperous countries in terms of private income. In 2007 the gross median household income in Switzerland was an estimated 107,748 CHF, or USD 137,094 at purchasing power parity. The median income after social security, taxes and mandatory health insurance was 75,312 CHF, or USD 95,824 at purchasing power parity. Right now the Swiss Franc is worth $1.10 Nice cut and paste. No credit to Wiki?? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Switzerland Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
....lybob Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Nice cut and paste. No credit to Wiki?? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Switzerland why? when you write something you don't give credit to your A$$ where you pull your facts from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Nice cut and paste. No credit to Wiki?? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Switzerland And I was just getting ready to call him Cliff Claven. http://lauriekendrick.wordpress.com/2008/08/20/cliff-claven-esque-crap-you-can-use-to-completely-bore-your-friends-and-enemies/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Switzerland is among the world's most prosperous countries in terms of private income. In 2007 the gross median household income in Switzerland was an estimated 107,748 CHF, or USD 137,094 at purchasing power parity. The median income after social security, taxes and mandatory health insurance was 75,312 CHF, or USD 95,824 at purchasing power parity. Right now the Swiss Franc is worth $1.10 I wonder if that's because they have among the highest proportion of financial services workers in the world, including others that cater to the superwealthy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 (edited) And there you have both crossed the line of civility and made and ass out of yourself. Thank you for the speculation on my girlfriends biological makeup and direction on how she and I should behave as well as the oversight of the fact that birth control is not merely contraceptive. Another douchebag that not only wants everything for free but wants everything to be first class and exactly the way he wants it to be -- for free. Edited March 8, 2012 by KD in CT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 those numbers including the exchange rate come from the piece you linked. Which has absolutely nothing to do with the point that I'm making, though I'm not surprised that it went over your head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I wonder if that's because they have among the highest proportion of financial services workers in the world, including others that cater to the superwealthy? there are plenty of everyday folk as well. bus drivers, secretaries, maintenance workers, food workers, nurses, doctors, plumbersl, cashiers, farmers and electricians...everyone it takes to make things work for those financial services big shots. now your gonna tell me that it's all trickle down from the real producers - the money guys, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 there are plenty of everyday folk as well. bus drivers, secretaries, maintenance workers, food workers, nurses, doctors, plumbersl, cashiers, farmers and electricians...everyone it takes to make things work for those financial services big shots. now your gonna tell me that it's all trickle down from the real producers - the money guys, right? You really, really don't get it. First, the S Africa reference was because they used it to keep blacks out of the work force. The rest of your theory (as well as the one TPS started to present last week) relies on the faulty premise that money has inherent value. You can't honestly think prosperity can be achieved by manipulating the currency. Further, to achieve your redistributive objective you would necessarily have to take significant wealth (through devaluation) out of the pockets of middle class families while eliminating a substantial portion of the lower level jobs that allow unskilled workers entry to the workforce where they can gain the skills that will make them more productive and therefore more valuable so they can both make a living wage while contributing to economic growth. The only benefit woul be a short term benefit to the select few workers making less than the living wage who retain their jobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 You really, really don't get it. First, the S Africa reference was because they used it to keep blacks out of the work force. The rest of your theory (as well as the one TPS started to present last week) relies on the faulty premise that money has inherent value. You can't honestly think prosperity can be achieved by manipulating the currency. Further, to achieve your redistributive objective you would necessarily have to take significant wealth (through devaluation) out of the pockets of middle class families while eliminating a substantial portion of the lower level jobs that allow unskilled workers entry to the workforce where they can gain the skills that will make them more productive and therefore more valuable so they can both make a living wage while contributing to economic growth. The only benefit woul be a short term benefit to the select few workers making less than the living wage who retain their jobs. no, you really don't get it. who's gonna wipe your grandpas butt in the nursing home? that function has value. is it worth the cost of food and shelter and basic healthcare? i say it is. you say that worker needs more skills to deserve that compensation. i disagree but even if he/she does, then who will do the task. you? your premise is based on the foundations of our current "free market" economy. mine isn't limited by those constraints. and who is arguing that money has inherent value? GG's the one that argues that all switzerland's success lays at the feet of money manipulators (financial services guys).. i fail to see much inherent value there. i'm arguing against that very principle. and it wouldn't be so very punitive to the middle class if it was funded by surcharges on the wealthy. perhaps a significant luxury tax to subsidize the minimum wage. i'm confident a mechanism could be engineered. it's not impossible to devise a system that results in a more equitable division of wealth without entering into what a majority of observers would call socialism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 no, you really don't get it. who's gonna wipe your grandpas butt in the nursing home? that function has value. is it worth the cost of food and shelter and basic healthcare? i say it is. you say that worker needs more skills to deserve that compensation. i disagree but even if he/she does, then who will do the task. you? your premise is based on the foundations of our current "free market" economy. mine isn't limited by those constraints. and who is arguing that money has inherent value? GG's the one that argues that all switzerland's success lays at the feet of money manipulators (financial services guys).. i fail to see much inherent value there. i'm arguing against that very principle. and it wouldn't be so very punitive to the middle class if it was funded by surcharges on the wealthy. perhaps a significant luxury tax to subsidize the minimum wage. i'm confident a mechanism could be engineered. it's not impossible to devise a system that results in a more equitable division of wealth without entering into what a majority of observers would call socialism. You want to finance a "living wage" using a luxury tax on the rich? So, say, for every hourly wage-earner at Mc'D's who currently earns $8/hr, you raise that to $12/hr, $4 of which is paid by the government, financed by a tax on the rich? Is that the Swiss model? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 no, you really don't get it. who's gonna wipe your grandpas butt in the nursing home? that function has value. is it worth the cost of food and shelter and basic healthcare? i say it is. you say that worker needs more skills to deserve that compensation. i disagree but even if he/she does, then who will do the task. you? your premise is based on the foundations of our current "free market" economy. mine isn't limited by those constraints. and who is arguing that money has inherent value? GG's the one that argues that all switzerland's success lays at the feet of money manipulators (financial services guys).. i fail to see much inherent value there. i'm arguing against that very principle. and it wouldn't be so very punitive to the middle class if it was funded by surcharges on the wealthy. perhaps a significant luxury tax to subsidize the minimum wage. i'm confident a mechanism could be engineered. it's not impossible to devise a system that results in a more equitable division of wealth without entering into what a majority of observers would call socialism. You just pretty much described socialism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 You want to finance a "living wage" using a luxury tax on the rich? So, say, for every hourly wage-earner at Mc'D's who currently earns $8/hr, you raise that to $12/hr, $4 of which is paid by the government, financed by a tax on the rich? Is that the Swiss model? no, it's obviously not. switzerland was, once again, used to illustrate a current example of a nation that has largely accomplished a living wage. as correctly pointed out, the us is in many ways dissimilar. what works for them won't necessarily work for us. that doesn't mean it can't be accomplished at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 no, you really don't get it. who's gonna wipe your grandpas butt in the nursing home? that function has value. is it worth the cost of food and shelter and basic healthcare? The average "nursing home" worker has a high school diploma and a few weeks of training. They make about $25k a year. The problem isn't the wage. The problem is the cost of things has continued to skyrocket because government continues to !@#$ things up by trying to control everything. They've driven up the cost of housing, food, cars, insurance, and medical care because they simply won't let the market work the way it should. Your solution is even more of the same ****! You'd have a better chance of success if you prayed to the God of Powdered Deer Penis. It's like ObamaCare. It fixes NOTHING but has THOUSANDS of pages of bull ****. You liberals trumpet it like it's the Arc of the !@#$ing Covanent but there's not a single provision in it that does anything to address the actual problems that cause health care to be expensive. My wife and I each made far less than $25k a year for the first few years we were married. We did without a second car, cable, long distance, and various other "luxuries" that the average American enjoyed. We were both military, so we at least had ok (not great) health care but we were so young we rarely used it. I worked an additional job the first SIX years I was in the military so we could save enough money to buy a house and so my wife could finish her Bachelor's while still on Active Duty. We were both putting in upwards of 70 hour weeks and living in the highest cost of living area in the United States. Sell your !@#$ing bull **** somewhere else. You !@#$ing liberals piss and moan when people give wildlife handouts because it teaches them to be dependent and eventually ends their lives but can't see the correlation to the welfare state that you've created with over a half century of the same abject !@#$ing stupidity. It's now so easy not to work that you've created a voting block that is perpetual and generational. AND IT STILL ISN'T ENOUGH. MORE, MORE, MORE. You're not going to get a different result but you still don't learn. i say it is. you say that worker needs more skills to deserve that compensation. i disagree but even if he/she does, then who will do the task. you? your premise is based on the foundations of our current "free market" economy. mine isn't limited by those constraints. No, yours is "sunshine and unicorns" and doesn't even come close to reality. You want to pay popcorn tub fillers and cashiers a "living wage", which is completely impossible everywhere but fantasy land. Your "solution" will ensure there are no more movie theaters or low end restaurants because no one is going to be willing to pay $12 for a !@#$ing Happy Meal or $30 for a bucket of corn. These are ZERO skill jobs and anyone worth their salt does them only as a bridge to something better. How you liberals doing at controlling public education costs? You freakin' OWN that venue and it's as bad as the ever-evil health care system. Why is that? Turn off your !@#$ing television and go outside. There's a whole world out there that you're not going to fix with liberal idealism, because that's what's actually broken it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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