truth on hold Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) Favre and manning were both hurt. In favres case the league admitted the shots were personal fouls. If it were anyone but favre and any game but the conference championship or super bowl odds are he would have come out. Guy was a limping bloody mess. And at least dungy believes the hit To manning was illegal and lead to manning's career threatening neck injury. What more do you want? A Darryl stingley incident, complete parallysis to meet your standard? Edited March 5, 2012 by Joe_the_6_pack
ICanSleepWhenI'mDead Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 . . . But the fact that you can total up about half the league in the last 5-10 years just from player admissions this weekend does imply it's not nearly the unspeakable offense that some here imply. Is it right? No. Is it the end of the world? Not really. . . . Orienting your moral compass based on the opinions or conduct of NFL players is a non-starter for me. The following three links, taken together, cover only the last 5 years: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/police-blotter/ http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/02/08/turd-watch-ii-final-police-blotter/ http://archive.profootballtalk.com/turdwatch.htm
NoSaint Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) Favre and manning were both hurt. In favres case the league admitted the shots were personal fouls. If it were anyone but favre and any game but the conference championship or super bowl odds are he would have come out. Guy was a limping bloody mess. And at least dungy believes the hit To manning was illegal and lead to manning's career threatening neck injury. What more do you want? A Darryl stingley incident, complete parallysis to meet your standard? For running the program over a decade - I'd expect more. Both frequency of injuries and type of hits. It's not like guys were getting regular head shots, late hits or anything else. In fact Bobby McCray lost money even if he collected the 10k, got chewed out by his coaches, and was cut after the season. For over a decade running this there's just not proof on the field of the intentions of dirty hits. Big hits yes. Dirty hits no. Orienting your moral compass based on the opinions or conduct of NFL players is a non-starter for me. The following three links, taken together, cover only the last 5 years: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/police-blotter/ http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/02/08/turd-watch-ii-final-police-blotter/ http://archive.profootballtalk.com/turdwatch.htm I'm not talking right or wrong here. It's wrong. I'm discussing extent of intention and how to correct it. There's clearly a big difference between kill shot meaning end his career whatever it takes don't let him walk again, and hit the guy so hard he doesn't want to finish the game. I think this goes towards the latter and the cash becomes more primary than the actual hits in a lot of ways. When most teams have history with it, it gets a bit tricky on docking draft picks and banning guys for life. Edited March 5, 2012 by NoSaint
NoSaint Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) I'm very curious to hear Bowen, Ross Tucker and Wiley speak this week. I know one didn't overlap and ones offense but these are three guys that seem to talk straight and have ties enough to address this accurately. Edited March 5, 2012 by NoSaint
JimBob2232 Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 i think Williams will get 1 Full yr suspension. And who would hire him after this? If anything, The league should hire him and force hm to be the guy in charge of policing the policy.
papazoid Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 And who would hire him after this? If anything, The league should hire him and force hm to be the guy in charge of policing the policy. wouldn't surprise me if he went back and finished his new contract in st louis.
truth on hold Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) One way or the other I think this is the end of him. Even If he comes back how's he going to lead the defense? He'll have no credibility and be completely neutered. Always thought he was an ass anyway. And way over rated. 9ers were shocked he kept calling blitz in the red zone leaving their pro bowl TE in man. Get lost, corrupt jerk. Edited March 5, 2012 by Joe_the_6_pack
papazoid Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 unless he gets a lifetime ban.....i would expect Fisher to show some loyalty.
dave mcbride Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 I guess Joe, I just don't get coming from you. The reward is where it crosses into a deep dark moral abyss? Weren't you advocating the giants going after the 9ers returner with concussion issues? I'm not saying this is a good situation but I am saying it's not all that surprising or rare. I'm also amazed given what I've read from several of the most outraged that there's this kind of objection. So it's ok to go into the game with the goal of hitting a guy with a history of brain injuries in the head, but not to say I'll drop a grand in pockets for the biggest hits of the day? Actually, neither are ok from an ethical standpoint. As for the saints, i have no stats, but their d always struck me as one of the dirtiest and chippiest around. Injuries may not have resulted, but the intent seemed to be there. I rememeber watching one game in which anthony hargrove did something illegal that could hurt someone on almost every play.
Doc Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Players hit hard because that's the name of the game. The only "scandal" regards intentionally illegal hits that led to injury. In which case ALL teams should be investigated.
NoSaint Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Mike golic and daren Woodson just finished an interesting talk about this. Both said player run happened in their locker rooms and injuries were bigger payments but big hits were the goal- essentially the 100 or 1000 was like a trophy or helmet sticker
Beerball Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 If anything, The league should hire him and force hm to be the guy in charge of policing the policy. Wouldn't that be like throwing the baby out after the barn door is closed?
Wayne Cubed Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Players hit hard because that's the name of the game. The only "scandal" regards intentionally illegal hits that led to injury. In which case ALL teams should be investigated. I think the only scandal is the $$, it violates the CBA. Whenever I was playing football, coaches always talked about hard hits and knocking guys out. Got you pumped up. You weren't out there trying to end someones life, but just hitting them hard enough so that they remembered not to come your way again.
8-8 Forever? Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 no big deal, imo. you want your Defense to want to knock out the opposing QB. it's a violent sport, not the ballet. as long as it was clean, and i have never seen the Saints play dirty, then it's whatever. i get that it's against the rules. and i get why the NFL has to have a rule against it. but i would bet this happens on almost every team in some form. Yep, plus the money involved is total chump change. It's less than a side bet, by NFL money standards. Just a bet against something they do anyway.. like an office super bowl pool. The money is meaningless. Try to put the guy out of the game. As long as it's within the rules, when was that not part of the approach to hitting? It's as old as the game itself. This is professional football, not the NBA, not baseball. These are not nice people, James Harrison, et al. TV has removed the fan too much from the actual violence of the game. This game is nasty... get close to the field some time -- these guys are really big and really fast and hit incredibly hard ... tremendously violent game. Get real people. This game will be touch football when the liberals get through with it.
K-9 Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Wouldn't that be like throwing the baby out after the barn door is closed? More like throwing the cats in the bath water after you opened the bag. GO BILLS!!! Mike golic and daren Woodson just finished an interesting talk about this. Both said player run happened in their locker rooms and injuries were bigger payments but big hits were the goal- essentially the 100 or 1000 was like a trophy or helmet sticker "Injuries were bigger payments." Let that sink in a minute or two. GO BILLS!!!
NoSaint Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 More like throwing the cats in the bath water after you opened the bag. GO BILLS!!! "Injuries were bigger payments." Let that sink in a minute or two. GO BILLS!!! Yes, sending a guy to the sideline on clean hits not paralyzing a guy on a dirty one - just to make sure were on the same page
Doc Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 I think the only scandal is the $$, it violates the CBA. Whenever I was playing football, coaches always talked about hard hits and knocking guys out. Got you pumped up. You weren't out there trying to end someones life, but just hitting them hard enough so that they remembered not to come your way again. I've heard that it was a pool of the players' money. Would that still be a violation?
K-9 Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Yes, sending a guy to the sideline on clean hits not paralyzing a guy on a dirty one - just to make sure were on the same page Yes, but Golic says they would get paid more for a hit that injures a guy. My question all along has been why have that kind of language associated with any part of the game at any time. And from the report on NFLN when the story broke last week, the Saints had a more refined grading scale; one amount for a "knockout" and another amount for a "cart off." We are reading from separate books entirely. Let alone being on the same page. GO BILLS!!!
ICanSleepWhenI'mDead Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Wouldn't that be like throwing the baby out after the barn door is closed? Goodell: "Gregg, did you pay the tough to get going?" Williams: "Yeah, and when the going got tough, two birds crapped in my hand"
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